Deni Avdija

[payitforward]

...If you want to consolidate the forwards the guy you move is Kuzma....

Kuzma has got a player option for next year and he's looking to get paid. The Wizards do not need to be the team holding the bag for a less mediocre forward.

100% -- as long as we don't get a problem in return for Kuzma it will be a good idea to trade him. But... I wish I thought it was likely to happen. I don't.

[prime1time]

...If you want to consolidate the forwards the guy you move is Kuzma....

Kuzma has got a player option for next year and he's looking to get paid. The Wizards do not need to be the team holding the bag for a less mediocre forward.

100% -- as long as we don't get a problem in return for Kuzma it will be a good idea to trade him. But... I wish I thought it was likely to happen. I don't.

I would point out that over his last 14 games Kuzma averaged 20/8/6 on 36% from 3. If I had my choice, I would start Rui and Kuzma at the 3 and the 4. Kispert would be the first wing off the bench. Avdija simply isn't a productive enough player to warrant minutes. When we talk about Avdija usually the conversation centers around some excuse. The Wizards have handled Avdija totally wrong fro day 1. His first year, we had an NBA roster that lacked actual NBA talent. So he came into the league starting. If we had a competent roster, he would have started in the G-League or barely getting minutes. That way his career could be a steady upward trend. Instead, because we have added more competent NBA players to the team, his career has been a steady downward trend. In year 1 he started 32 games. In year 2 he started 8 games.

SOmeone asked the question, if Rui starts slow would I advocate for taking him out of the rotation. To that, I would say it depends on what he struggles with and how much he struggles. If Rui can't make 3's we have better options. If he insists on attacking multiple defenders and making bad decisions we have better options. But Rui's potential struggles aren't going to necessarily benefit Avdija. Avdija needs to improve. If Rui struggles and Avdija doesn't improve, then I would just advocate for trading for a SF or signing one in free agency. I'm not asking for much from Avdija. I'm just asking for him to make open 3's. I guess we will see this season.

[badinage]

You’re ignoring — conveniently? — half the game/half the court.

And the kid made significant improvement last year; games started is an indication of nothing, really.

[prime1time]

You’re ignoring — conveniently? — half the game/half the court.

And the kid made significant improvement last year; games started is an indication of nothing, really.

Assuming you're talking about his defense, I've stated my point before and I'll state it again. His defense is irrelevant. One good defender in a team game doesn't mean much. He's not good enough to shut down elite guard or wing scorers. No one is. He's not going to lock up Steph, Morant or Young. He's not going to shut down Durant, Tatum or Leonard. The Doncic's, of the world are going to cut through him like swiss cheese. This is important because you want to bring up his defense. So in these scenarios, how precisely will the team benefit from his defense?

But that's just the first level. The second level, is this. Last year teams underestimated Avdija's defense. This year, they will be more prepared. Meaning what? They won't even go at him. If we play the Celtic's and Tatum has the ball guess what's going to happen. They are going to use a screen to get either Morris or Porzingis/Gafford onto Tatum. This is what good offenses do. This isn't 1996 or 2001 where teams are willing to play bang their head against the proverbial offensive wall. It's 2022 and they will attack the weakest link.

To put it another way, a defense is only as good as it's weakest link. So even if Avdija does play good defense, why should I care? We have major defensive liabilities on the floor. If both Morris and Porzingis are starting there's virtually no way for us to stop an offense that has an advanced level scorer (think Darius Garland) much less an elite scorer. So in these scenarios, we need shooting.

As far as your comment about games starting meaning nothing, I think misinterpreted what I was saying. Yes, in and of itself games started means nothing. What matters is the players' skill level, talent and ability. But when you hear about players who refuse to play if they have to come off the bench...
https://www.si.com/nba/lakers/news/lakers-russell-westbrook-laughs-off-idea-of-becoming-bench-player-ee21
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/285965-breaking-news-iverson-is-not-happy-coming-off-the-bench

You're kidding yourself if you don't think starting and then not starting affects a player's confidence level. All of this to say, I think it is no coincidence that Deni just posted a video of him shooting. He knows, just like Drew Hanlen knows just like everyone in the organization knows how important 3-point shooting is. You said he improved last year, fine. How did his improvement actually benefit the team? To put it another way, how did his improvement actually contribute to wins?

And herein lies the rub. The only way to talk about Deni Avdija is in a vacuum. Disconnected from what actually contributes to winning basketball for the Wizards. To a degree this is fine. It is not uncommon to see a team give a player significant playing time in the hopes that he will develop down the road. One of my frustrations with the Wizards, is Sheppard's insistence that we try to both - win in the present and build for the future. And nowhere is this contradiction more glaring than in Deni Avdija's short career.

But as with every young prospect, the question must be asked, how much rope should the Wizards give Avdija? How long before we stop talking about Avdija's progress in a vacuum and start to only talk about how he contributes to winning. Is Avdija's potential even great enough to warrant this investment? When a coach has a mandate to win, he puts the best players on the floor. I don't care how much he improves at other aspects. If Avdija comes out and shoots 31.7% from the field I do not expect him to end the season in the rotation and neither should he.

[prime1time]

Read on Twitter

Hopefully, he's spending an equal amount of time on the other side of the court because you know, defense is half the game...lol

[Runner300]

What is this?
He's supposed to work on his ball handling.

[Dolevi]

You’re ignoring — conveniently? — half the game/half the court.

And the kid made significant improvement last year; games started is an indication of nothing, really.

Assuming you're talking about his defense, I've stated my point before and I'll state it again. His defense is irrelevant. One good defender in a team game doesn't mean much. He's not good enough to shut down elite guard or wing scorers. No one is. He's not going to lock up Steph, Morant or Young. He's not going to shut down Durant, Tatum or Leonard. The Doncic's, of the world are going to cut through him like swiss cheese. This is important because you want to bring up his defense. So in these scenarios, how precisely will the team benefit from his defense?

But that's just the first level. The second level, is this. Last year teams underestimated Avdija's defense. This year, they will be more prepared. Meaning what? They won't even go at him. If we play the Celtic's and Tatum has the ball guess what's going to happen. They are going to use a screen to get either Morris or Porzingis/Gafford onto Tatum. This is what good offenses do. This isn't 1996 or 2001 where teams are willing to play bang their head against the proverbial offensive wall. It's 2022 and they will attack the weakest link.

To put it another way, a defense is only as good as it's weakest link. So even if Avdija does play good defense, why should I care? We have major defensive liabilities on the floor. If both Morris and Porzingis are starting there's virtually no way for us to stop an offense that has an advanced level scorer (think Darius Garland) much less an elite scorer. So in these scenarios, we need shooting.

As far as your comment about games starting meaning nothing, I think misinterpreted what I was saying. Yes, in and of itself games started means nothing. What matters is the players' skill level, talent and ability. But when you hear about players who refuse to play if they have to come off the bench...
https://www.si.com/nba/lakers/news/lakers-russell-westbrook-laughs-off-idea-of-becoming-bench-player-ee21
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/285965-breaking-news-iverson-is-not-happy-coming-off-the-bench

You're kidding yourself if you don't think starting and then not starting affects a player's confidence level. All of this to say, I think it is no coincidence that Deni just posted a video of him shooting. He knows, just like Drew Hanlen knows just like everyone in the organization knows how important 3-point shooting is. You said he improved last year, fine. How did his improvement actually benefit the team? To put it another way, how did his improvement actually contribute to wins?

And herein lies the rub. The only way to talk about Deni Avdija is in a vacuum. Disconnected from what actually contributes to winning basketball for the Wizards. To a degree this is fine. It is not uncommon to see a team give a player significant playing time in the hopes that he will develop down the road. One of my frustrations with the Wizards, is Sheppard's insistence that we try to both - win in the present and build for the future. And nowhere is this contradiction more glaring than in Deni Avdija's short career.

But as with every young prospect, the question must be asked, how much rope should the Wizards give Avdija? How long before we stop talking about Avdija's progress in a vacuum and start to only talk about how he contributes to winning. Is Avdija's potential even great enough to warrant this investment? When a coach has a mandate to win, he puts the best players on the floor. I don't care how much he improves at other aspects. If Avdija comes out and shoots 31.7% from the field I do not expect him to end the season in the rotation and neither should he.

But that's championships team's defense. Call it even small ball if you want, but nowdays everyone looking not just for shooting and scoring, something not less important is 5 players on the floor that have size and flexabillity, players who can switch easliy 1-5 while not causing any miss-matches for their team. Modern Basketball. That's winning basketball also. You just switch everything and break down your opponent's P&R game. GSW. If you'll have more guys like Avdija on the floor, you'll break your opponent's game.

[Dolevi]

What is this?
He's supposed to work on his ball handling.

He's working on that too. They uploaded another video of him learning something about ball security.

[payitforward]

As a matter of interest, prime, who would you say is the better NBA player right now, Deni or Rui?

& who would you say has shown more overall improvement since entering the league, Deni or Rui?

No particular reason to argue about this, but I am curious.

You’re ignoring — conveniently? — half the game/half the court.

And the kid made significant improvement last year; games started is an indication of nothing, really.

Assuming you're talking about his defense, I've stated my point before and I'll state it again. His defense is irrelevant. One good defender in a team game doesn't mean much. He's not good enough to shut down elite guard or wing scorers. No one is. He's not going to lock up Steph, Morant or Young. He's not going to shut down Durant, Tatum or Leonard. The Doncic's, of the world are going to cut through him like swiss cheese. This is important because you want to bring up his defense. So in these scenarios, how precisely will the team benefit from his defense?

But that's just the first level. The second level, is this. Last year teams underestimated Avdija's defense. This year, they will be more prepared. Meaning what? They won't even go at him. If we play the Celtic's and Tatum has the ball guess what's going to happen. They are going to use a screen to get either Morris or Porzingis/Gafford onto Tatum. This is what good offenses do. This isn't 1996 or 2001 where teams are willing to play bang their head against the proverbial offensive wall. It's 2022 and they will attack the weakest link.

To put it another way, a defense is only as good as it's weakest link. So even if Avdija does play good defense, why should I care? We have major defensive liabilities on the floor. If both Morris and Porzingis are starting there's virtually no way for us to stop an offense that has an advanced level scorer (think Darius Garland) much less an elite scorer. So in these scenarios, we need shooting.

As far as your comment about games starting meaning nothing, I think misinterpreted what I was saying. Yes, in and of itself games started means nothing. What matters is the players' skill level, talent and ability. But when you hear about players who refuse to play if they have to come off the bench...
https://www.si.com/nba/lakers/news/lakers-russell-westbrook-laughs-off-idea-of-becoming-bench-player-ee21
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/285965-breaking-news-iverson-is-not-happy-coming-off-the-bench

You're kidding yourself if you don't think starting and then not starting affects a player's confidence level. All of this to say, I think it is no coincidence that Deni just posted a video of him shooting. He knows, just like Drew Hanlen knows just like everyone in the organization knows how important 3-point shooting is. You said he improved last year, fine. How did his improvement actually benefit the team? To put it another way, how did his improvement actually contribute to wins?

And herein lies the rub. The only way to talk about Deni Avdija is in a vacuum. Disconnected from what actually contributes to winning basketball for the Wizards. To a degree this is fine. It is not uncommon to see a team give a player significant playing time in the hopes that he will develop down the road. One of my frustrations with the Wizards, is Sheppard's insistence that we try to both - win in the present and build for the future. And nowhere is this contradiction more glaring than in Deni Avdija's short career.

But as with every young prospect, the question must be asked, how much rope should the Wizards give Avdija? How long before we stop talking about Avdija's progress in a vacuum and start to only talk about how he contributes to winning. Is Avdija's potential even great enough to warrant this investment? When a coach has a mandate to win, he puts the best players on the floor. I don't care how much he improves at other aspects. If Avdija comes out and shoots 31.7% from the field I do not expect him to end the season in the rotation and neither should he.

[prime1time]

As a matter of interest, prime, who would you say is the better NBA player right now, Deni or Rui?

& who would you say has shown more overall improvement since entering the league, Deni or Rui?

No particular reason to argue about this, but I am curious.

You’re ignoring — conveniently? — half the game/half the court.

And the kid made significant improvement last year; games started is an indication of nothing, really.

Assuming you're talking about his defense, I've stated my point before and I'll state it again. His defense is irrelevant. One good defender in a team game doesn't mean much. He's not good enough to shut down elite guard or wing scorers. No one is. He's not going to lock up Steph, Morant or Young. He's not going to shut down Durant, Tatum or Leonard. The Doncic's, of the world are going to cut through him like swiss cheese. This is important because you want to bring up his defense. So in these scenarios, how precisely will the team benefit from his defense?

But that's just the first level. The second level, is this. Last year teams underestimated Avdija's defense. This year, they will be more prepared. Meaning what? They won't even go at him. If we play the Celtic's and Tatum has the ball guess what's going to happen. They are going to use a screen to get either Morris or Porzingis/Gafford onto Tatum. This is what good offenses do. This isn't 1996 or 2001 where teams are willing to play bang their head against the proverbial offensive wall. It's 2022 and they will attack the weakest link.

To put it another way, a defense is only as good as it's weakest link. So even if Avdija does play good defense, why should I care? We have major defensive liabilities on the floor. If both Morris and Porzingis are starting there's virtually no way for us to stop an offense that has an advanced level scorer (think Darius Garland) much less an elite scorer. So in these scenarios, we need shooting.

As far as your comment about games starting meaning nothing, I think misinterpreted what I was saying. Yes, in and of itself games started means nothing. What matters is the players' skill level, talent and ability. But when you hear about players who refuse to play if they have to come off the bench...
https://www.si.com/nba/lakers/news/lakers-russell-westbrook-laughs-off-idea-of-becoming-bench-player-ee21
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/285965-breaking-news-iverson-is-not-happy-coming-off-the-bench

You're kidding yourself if you don't think starting and then not starting affects a player's confidence level. All of this to say, I think it is no coincidence that Deni just posted a video of him shooting. He knows, just like Drew Hanlen knows just like everyone in the organization knows how important 3-point shooting is. You said he improved last year, fine. How did his improvement actually benefit the team? To put it another way, how did his improvement actually contribute to wins?

And herein lies the rub. The only way to talk about Deni Avdija is in a vacuum. Disconnected from what actually contributes to winning basketball for the Wizards. To a degree this is fine. It is not uncommon to see a team give a player significant playing time in the hopes that he will develop down the road. One of my frustrations with the Wizards, is Sheppard's insistence that we try to both - win in the present and build for the future. And nowhere is this contradiction more glaring than in Deni Avdija's short career.

But as with every young prospect, the question must be asked, how much rope should the Wizards give Avdija? How long before we stop talking about Avdija's progress in a vacuum and start to only talk about how he contributes to winning. Is Avdija's potential even great enough to warrant this investment? When a coach has a mandate to win, he puts the best players on the floor. I don't care how much he improves at other aspects. If Avdija comes out and shoots 31.7% from the field I do not expect him to end the season in the rotation and neither should he.

Neither of them are good enough to where that matters. What matters is how they fit into the overall team. The offense will be built around Beal and Porzingis. Beal and Porzingis need spacing. Our 3 and 4 will stand at the 3-point line and shoot 3's. Every now and then, they will do something else.

So, and it should not be any surprise, my opinion about both Deni and Rui from the moment we have drafted them has been the same. They need to develop into good 3-point shooters. That's the role they will have on this team. In an all around context, you can make the argument that Deni's better. But for the role that they will play on this team, it is clear that Rui is the much better player. Deni's 3-point shooting is not improving.

[Dolevi]

You can't compare like that between Deni and Hachi while the 2nd one was picked on 2019 and is 24 yo, and the 1st one was picked on 2020 and he's 21 yo. Different players on the floor, with different types of plays. If you want to compare between them, the upside and ceiling is what you can rely on - all the rest - doesn't matter in my opinion (Who is now better ect ect).

[doclinkin]

As a matter of interest, prime, who would you say is the better NBA player right now, Deni or Rui?

& who would you say has shown more overall improvement since entering the league, Deni or Rui?

No particular reason to argue about this, but I am curious.

Neither of them are good enough to where that matters. What matters is how they fit into the overall team. The offense will be built around Beal and Porzingis. Beal and Porzingis need spacing. Our 3 and 4 will stand at the 3-point line and shoot 3's. Every now and then, they will do something else.

That's not how it played out last year. Beal with no 3-ball needs spacing, but Porzingis _is_ spacing by himself. Porzingis started most possessions above the free throw line. He shot as many outside shots as shots in the paint.

Looked to me like Wes was running a derivative of the Princeton offense where player motion and dribble hand-offs are what spring a player for a shot. Euro squads commonly thrive off a motion offense. In that style making smart reads and cuts is more important than standstill 3's and 1-on-1 isolation specialists. It's what GSW thrives on with Draymond in the high post.

If so, it seems to me the players who are best suited for it are Monte, Wright, Beal, Kispert, Deni, Kuzma, Porzingis. And Johnny Davis I expect, once he gets up to speed. You want players who take decisive action and exploit the gaps the instant they show up. Yeah it helps to have outside shooting in any system, but the paint is open underneath since the big pretty much has to follow Porzingis outside. Otherwise he can simply shoot over the head of any smaller players. In this system Deni works well as the relay assist player. If you double Porzingis he hits Deni unguarded who fires the ball to Monte/Beal/Kispert/Wright/Davis/Kuzma crashing backdoor. You want instant communication between the players though.

I think the team is heavily invested in Rui. But I am not sure he is a great fit for what it looks like Wes wants to run. Still, his increased range looks good. Personally I would want to play him next to a true PG like Monte Morris, so that he gets the ball when he is open and his only job is to shoot when he touches it. A good floor general will be able to direct Rui where to go and when, then exploit his natural talent to best advantage without forcing him to think ahead of the action.

[daSwami]

Read on Twitter

Hopefully, he's spending an equal amount of time on the other side of the court because you know, defense is half the game...lol

I think the idea here is to put in EXTRA work where it's most needed. Deni is an excellent defender, but a very poor shooter. I recall seeing a Youtube micro-analysis of his shooting form before he was drafted. This guy's take was that Deni's shot was broken - yes, the knee-bend thing. In short, Deni learned to shoot from his father (a euro pro baller himself), and thus was taught to shoot like a "big," i.e., his shooting motion begins at the shoulders - with little thought given to his legs. His release is good, but he still needs about 10,000 hours worth of shooting reps with a good shooting coach to become a serviceable two-way wing.

[prime1time]

As a matter of interest, prime, who would you say is the better NBA player right now, Deni or Rui?

& who would you say has shown more overall improvement since entering the league, Deni or Rui?

No particular reason to argue about this, but I am curious.

Neither of them are good enough to where that matters. What matters is how they fit into the overall team. The offense will be built around Beal and Porzingis. Beal and Porzingis need spacing. Our 3 and 4 will stand at the 3-point line and shoot 3's. Every now and then, they will do something else.

That's not how it played out last year. Beal with no 3-ball needs spacing, but Porzingis _is_ spacing by himself. Porzingis started most possessions above the free throw line. He shot as many outside shots as shots in the paint.

Looked to me like Wes was running a derivative of the Princeton offense where player motion and dribble hand-offs are what spring a player for a shot. Euro squads commonly thrive off a motion offense. In that style making smart reads and cuts is more important than standstill 3's and 1-on-1 isolation specialists. It's what GSW thrives on with Draymond in the high post.

If so, it seems to me the players who are best suited for it are Monte, Wright, Beal, Kispert, Deni, Kuzma, Porzingis. And Johnny Davis I expect, once he gets up to speed. You want players who take decisive action and exploit the gaps the instant they show up. Yeah it helps to have outside shooting in any system, but the paint is open underneath since the big pretty much has to follow Porzingis outside. Otherwise he can simply shoot over the head of any smaller players. In this system Deni works well as the relay assist player. If you double Porzingis he hits Deni unguarded who fires the ball to Monte/Beal/Kispert/Wright/Davis/Kuzma crashing backdoor. You want instant communication between the players though.

I think the team is heavily invested in Rui. But I am not sure he is a great fit for what it looks like Wes wants to run. Still, his increased range looks good. Personally I would want to play him next to a true PG like Monte Morris, so that he gets the ball when he is open and his only job is to shoot when he touches it. A good floor general will be able to direct Rui where to go and when, then exploit his natural talent to best advantage without forcing him to think ahead of the action.

I get what you're saying but you're trying to pigeonhole me into something that I didn't argue. I said 3-point shooting is important, I didn't say it was the only thing. Look at a player like Duncan Robinson, he barely played in the Heat's last series. The truth is that more is needed than just 3-point shooting. If a player can do offensively is shoot wide open 3's then teams can press up on him and take him away. Good 3-point shooting is just the foundation of a good offense. With that being the base, everything else can be built up on top of it. So the way I see it, you're drawing a contradiction where one doesn't exist. 3-point shooting serves to amplify everything you said. That's why we went out and traded for Morris. That's why at every press conference for a draft pick 3-point shooting is mentioned.

Even the example of Golden State that you brought up doesn't really fit. Look at their roster. Steph and Klay are great 3-point shooters. So is Jordan Poole. Wiggins was 39% from 3 and he shot 5.5 3's a game. Otto Porter is a great 3-point shooter. In a motion-based offense, the ability to stretch the floor is paramount. It is 3-point shooting that keeps the defense from helping. One player Draymond Green, would work in the high post. We should also point out that when push comes to shove, they shelved the "democratic offense" in favor of the one I'm talking about.

https://theathletic.com/3350945/2022/06/06/warriors-steph-curry-finals/

The Celtics’ combination of perimeter protection and shot-blocking was too daunting for their usual democratic offense. Curry is the lone playmaker the Warriors have to churn Boston’s defense. So Golden State unleashed its guy. Curry had 12 pick-and-rolls in Game 1, according to Synergy Sports. He finished with 12 in Game 2 as well, except he did it in three quarters. He ran six in the third quarter alone. But even that undersells how much Curry had the ball in his hands. His combination of pick-and-rolls, transition and isolations added up to about 12 let-Curry-cook possessions in the third quarter.

I do not expect our 3 and 4 to only stand at the 3-point line and shoot wide open 3's. For one, what's important is to actually shoot these 3's but rather to keep the defense honest so that your offensive skilled players attack their defender in 1-on-1 situations. A movement-based offense, that is built on top of a foundation of good 3-point shooting is obviously ideal. Motion makes it harder for defenses to guard. But just finding good 3-point shooters who can also defend are tough. Now that you add in this notion of movement, ball iq, passing, you are starting to limit the players you can choose. It is this dynamic that led us to draft Avdija in my opinion. Teach him to shoot 3's and now you can really benefit because he does so many other things well offensively.

My ideal offense has a foundation of good 3-point shooting to keep the defense honest, highly skilled offensive players that can dribble/pass/playmake for others and elite one-on-one scoring. 3-point shooting is the beginning of the conversation, not the end.

[prime1time]

Read on Twitter

Hopefully, he's spending an equal amount of time on the other side of the court because you know, defense is half the game...lol

I think the idea here is to put in EXTRA work where it's most needed. Deni is an excellent defender, but a very poor shooter. I recall seeing a Youtube micro-analysis of his shooting form before he was drafted. This guy's take was that Deni's shot was broken - yes, the knee-bend thing. In short, Deni learned to shoot from his father (a euro pro baller himself), and thus was taught to shoot like a "big," i.e., his shooting motion begins at the shoulders - with little thought given to his legs. His release is good, but he still needs about 10,000 hours worth of shooting reps with a good shooting coach to become a serviceable two-way wing.

I was being sarcastic lol

[tontoz]

Deni shot 76% from the foul line which certainly qualifies as improvement.

His offense overall was disappointing but I will give the benefit of the doubt to a guy with good on/off numbers, +5.8 per 48.

http://www.82games.com/2122/21WAS17.HTM#onoff

[nate33]

Deni shot 76% from the foul line which certainly qualifies as improvement.

His offense overall was disappointing but I will give the benefit of the doubt to a guy with good on/off numbers, +5.8 per 48.

http://www.82games.com/2122/21WAS17.HTM#onoff

He inexplicably shot 54% from the FT line over his first 9 games. Over the following 73 games, he shot 80%.

[payitforward]

You can't compare like that between Deni and Hachi while the 2nd one was picked on 2019 and is 24 yo, and the 1st one was picked on 2020 and he's 21 yo. Different players on the floor, with different types of plays. If you want to compare between them, the upside and ceiling is what you can rely on - all the rest - doesn't matter in my opinion (Who is now better ect ect).

In fairness, prime only commented on that last question, because I asked him to. &, also in fairness, I only asked him to comment, because I knew that he'd have to figure out a way to say Rui was better.

Why? Because Rui is obviously his favorite player: what Rui does badly has to be explained away, while whatever Rui does well has to be made to seem more significant than it is (though, obviously, it's always significant if a player does something well).

The truth is that neither of these guys has actually been any good so far. &, it's an unknown whether either of them will ever be any good.

At 24, Rui has this year & that's it: he needs to post numbers that are above average for a 4. Above average overall -- taking all the numbers into account. If he doesn't, you can call him a failure. Deni has a couple more years at most to do the same thing. But, that's as far as it goes.

I tell you what, if you offered either of these guys to Memphis for Jake LaRavia, the kid they took #19 in the draft 2 weeks ago, I'm pretty sure they wouldn't be interested.

[payitforward]

What the H@ll, since we might as well look the facts in the face:

Deni went #9 in 2020. Memphis took Desmond Bane #30 that year. Do you think they'd give us Desmond Bane straight up for Deni Avdija?

Rui went #9 in 2019. Memphis took Brandon Clarke #21 that year. Do you think they'd give us Brandon Clarke straight up for Rui Hachimura?

That ought to put the debate between Deni & Rui in the right context....

[prime1time]

What the H@ll, since we might as well look the facts in the face:

Deni went #9 in 2020. Memphis took Desmond Bane #30 that year. Do you think they'd give us Desmond Bane straight up for Deni Avdija?

Rui went #9 in 2019. Memphis took Brandon Clarke #21 that year. Do you think they'd give us Brandon Clarke straight up for Rui Hachimura?

That ought to put the debate between Deni & Rui in the right context....

Clarke is a very fascinating player. What he does well, he does well. But like we pointed out at the draft, there really isn't a capacity for him to expand his role. Every season Clarke's 3-point shooting has gotten worse and last season he only shot .3 3's a game. Memphis is a good young team but once they start paying their players - how much will Desmond Bane command? - they will have to face some tough decisions. Where does that team improve if Jackson, Morant, Bane and Brooks are all locked in?