OKC Thunder 2022-23 Regular Season Discussion

[Old Man Game]

Looks like Coach Mark has started benching Josh Giddey in favor of JDubb in key moments.

Brian Scalabrine said this on NBA radio a few months back and I think it applies to Jalen v. Giddey: fans see the ceiling, coaches see the floor.

I think JG's flashy passing and those triple doubles have obscured for many people how little else the guy is bringing to the table at this point.

[Dadouv47]

Chet better be a great player or Presti draft record from 2019-2022 gonna be beyond terrible.

[cjmcallist]

Missed the game last night. I try to think back about recent championships to get a feel for what direction was want to head - has there been a team that had two primary ball handlers? I can’t think of any. Maybe the 2013 Miami Heat is the answer.

But, hard to ask two young guys to sort it out. Wade and LBJ struggled, even at a more mature part of their career.

[ThunderBolt]

Missed the game last night. I try to think back about recent championships to get a feel for what direction was want to head - has there been a team that had two primary ball handlers? I can’t think of any. Maybe the 2013 Miami Heat is the answer.

But, hard to ask two young guys to sort it out. Wade and LBJ struggled, even at a more mature part of their career.

Houston would be added to that list if not for CP3's hamstring. However Josh doesn't really fit the mold of CP3.

[slick_watts]

shai with giddey: 29% usage, 59% ts, 100.0pp100
shai w/o giddey: 33% usage, 63% ts, 118.6pp100

[Old Man Game]

Think about the ways that non-scorers can be impactful and still be positive forces on offense. I'm thinking mostly like screener and roll man. Think about Draymond Green. He sets screens he rolls. He's a ball mover without dominating the ball. A guy like giddy who's principal skill is having the ball in his hands mostly can't do those things.

I wish we'd have picked Wagner.

[Dadouv47]

Think we are talking too much about fit right now while our real issue is lack of talent. I do have some concerns about a SGA/Giddey duo long term but Giddey is very young and could improve over time...they are both very smart and could make it work (I don't think a SGA/Giddey/Dort team can work though).

[ThunderBolt]

There are a lot of unknowns about the rebuild. Shai appears to be awesome. I’d go so far as to say that’s a fact. Everything else is an unknown. That’s not necessarily bad but as each year, month, and day goes by it becomes more concerning. I think the success of this season is if just one player becomes a known productive player.. I don’t buy Dort and never have. I haven’t given up on Giddey but he’s got a ways to go. I was hopeful for Mann but he’s not ready yet. I was pumped about Jalen but we need more. Dieng is probably our highest ceiling prospect but he’s unlikely to show enough in year one. This will likely be a tough year.

[cjmcallist]

Think we are talking too much about fit right now while our real issue is lack of talent. I do have some concerns about a SGA/Giddey duo long term but Giddey is very young and could improve over time...they are both very smart and could make it work (I don't think a SGA/Giddey/Dort team can work though).

Agree. It’s all knee jerk reaction as well. I think anything less than 20 games is. But it’s also all we have.

I do think there’s a minor difference so far - it appears that the fit is inhibiting development of our talent (really just Giddey). Maybe the real answer is we shouldn’t have gotten screwed by the 2021 draft lottery.

Also I’m on the precipice with Dort. I like him but he’s gotta stop shooting.

[kdthunderup]

I don’t know why we keep forcing Dort to become something he isn’t. In the process of trying to expand his game I feel like he has gotten worse at what his strengths are.

He should focus on just being a great defender and hitting his open 3’s.

[Xatticus]

Think we are talking too much about fit right now while our real issue is lack of talent. I do have some concerns about a SGA/Giddey duo long term but Giddey is very young and could improve over time...they are both very smart and could make it work (I don't think a SGA/Giddey/Dort team can work though).

Probably not in their current forms, but I see nothing wrong with letting them try to work it out. There is only one ball to go around, so pretty much everyone needs to learn to play off the ball. SGA and Giddey are both better with the ball in their hands right now, but I'd prefer not to end up being completely SGA-centric in the way that Dallas is with Doncic.

[ThunderBolt]

I wasn’t able to watch the game. From the box score it looks like the kind of game I would have felt good about watching some of the young guys.

[Big nick]

Yes the young guys looked great poku was outstanding Mann was great jdub was also. Looks like poku has finally taken a big step this year. Sga is going to big a star if he can stay healthy.

[ThunderBolt]

Think we are talking too much about fit right now while our real issue is lack of talent. I do have some concerns about a SGA/Giddey duo long term but Giddey is very young and could improve over time...they are both very smart and could make it work (I don't think a SGA/Giddey/Dort team can work though).

Probably not in their current forms, but I see nothing wrong with letting them try to work it out. There is only one ball to go around, so pretty much everyone needs to learn to play off the ball. SGA and Giddey are both better with the ball in their hands right now, but I'd prefer not to end up being completely SGA-centric in the way that Dallas is with Doncic.

I’m fine trading Giddey if we find a deal that’s worth it. I’m even more fine if we give them more time to work it out. I think there is a bit of a fear among thunder fans that Giddey can’t/won’t improve on any of his weaknesses and Sam is throwing a max contract at him regardless.

[slick_watts]

josh giddey's biggest problem is that he's 6'8" but he has the wingspan of a 6'4" player, limited vertical, and limited explosiveness. aside from the added mass that his frame affords him, when he drives to the rim and is finishing with any defensive player nearby, he has to overcome that physical profile by awkwardly shielding the ball with his body. he has no lift and lacks the length to finish over anyone. it's why so many of his layups in traffic he is moving away from the rim. it makes those shots difficult, and the problem will always be there.

i really liked towards the end of the game when he was taking smaller defenders to the post with his back to the basket. this neutralizes the advantage defenses have on him as a face up dribbler. he was successful on these possessions, got off shots that were moving towards the rim and not off balance, and he should do a lot more of this / work on it more to turn it into a weapon. maybe it's also a way he can get more free throws.

giddey is one of the most accurate passers i've ever seen, and he's also creative as a passer. but these skills aren't worth all that much unless they are connected to something else. he's so great on inbounds plays since that's the only time his passing can be fully featured without being compromised by his phyiscal shortcomings / lack of shooting. you can see what giddey wants to be, but the path to get there is going to require a lot of work.

[slick_watts]

giddey is currently last on 538 RAPTOR, mostly driven by the fact his net rating is one of the worst in the nba.

[ThunderBolt]

Poku potentiality not being a bust just blows my mind.

[Devilanche]

I want see more out of Poku .

[QPR]

I mean he's 20, not 25.

[mr570]

shai with giddey: 29% usage, 59% ts, 100.0pp100
shai w/o giddey: 33% usage, 63% ts, 118.6pp100

We need to trade him.