Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7)

Moderators: Inigo Montoya, FJS

User avatar
FJS
Senior Mod - Jazz
Senior Mod - Jazz
Posts: 18,811
And1: 2,182
Joined: Sep 19, 2002
Location: Barcelona, Spain
   

Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#1 » by FJS » Mon Nov 21, 2022 11:27 am

Image
User avatar
FJS
Senior Mod - Jazz
Senior Mod - Jazz
Posts: 18,811
And1: 2,182
Joined: Sep 19, 2002
Location: Barcelona, Spain
   

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#2 » by FJS » Mon Nov 21, 2022 11:28 am

L.A. Clippers
Player Position Updated Injury Injury Status
Luke Kennard SG Sun, Nov 20 Calf Expected to be out until at least Nov 23
Paul George SF Sun, Nov 20 Knee Game Time Decision


Utah
Player Position Updated Injury Injury Status
Mike Conley PG Sun, Nov 20 Knee Expected to be out until at least Dec 7
Rudy Gay SF Thu, Nov 17 Finger Expected to be out until at least Dec 2
Image
Crunch 99
General Manager
Posts: 7,873
And1: 3,867
Joined: Jan 05, 2017
 

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#3 » by Crunch 99 » Mon Nov 21, 2022 1:11 pm

Rotowire shows Sexton replacing Conley in the expected lineup. If I were choosing the lineup, I would start THT with Clarkson in the backcourt to emphasize length and defense. I would put THT on Paul George, assuming Paul George (grey tossup) starts.

Additionally, THT has been a more willing passer than Sexton so far, averaging 5.4 ast/36 mins to Sexton's 3.2 ast/36 mins.

For bench, I would play Sexton in his usual microwave scorer off the bench role, while giving NAW THT's bench minutes.
User avatar
FJS
Senior Mod - Jazz
Senior Mod - Jazz
Posts: 18,811
And1: 2,182
Joined: Sep 19, 2002
Location: Barcelona, Spain
   

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#4 » by FJS » Mon Nov 21, 2022 1:24 pm

Crunch 99 wrote:Rotowire shows Sexton replacing Conley in the expected lineup. If I were choosing the lineups, I would start THT with Clarkson in the backcourt to emphasize length and defense. I would put THT on Paul George, assuming Paul George (tossup) starts.

Additionally, THT has been a more willing passer than Sexton so far, averaging 5.4 ast/36 mins so far to Sexton's 3.2 ast/36 mins.

For bench, I would play Sexton in his usual microwave scorer off the bench role and give NAW THT's bench minutes.


I agree with you. I think THT should start over Sexton.
Image
TNJazz
Rookie
Posts: 1,122
And1: 492
Joined: Jan 07, 2017
     

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#5 » by TNJazz » Mon Nov 21, 2022 3:09 pm

FJS wrote:
Crunch 99 wrote:Rotowire shows Sexton replacing Conley in the expected lineup. If I were choosing the lineups, I would start THT with Clarkson in the backcourt to emphasize length and defense. I would put THT on Paul George, assuming Paul George (tossup) starts.

Additionally, THT has been a more willing passer than Sexton so far, averaging 5.4 ast/36 mins so far to Sexton's 3.2 ast/36 mins.

For bench, I would play Sexton in his usual microwave scorer off the bench role and give NAW THT's bench minutes.


I agree with you. I think THT should start over Sexton.


I also agree but wonder if Sexton has it in his mind that he is the designated backup to Conley and is the rightful person to assume the starters role. Now it becomes a mind game for Hardy. If Hardy is working to keep things in a good place, maybe he starts Sexton, who gives tremendous energy, then brings THT off the bench and to finish. Also it's a game time decisions on PG playing, if he doesn't then the length aspect of THT over Sexton isn't as critical. My concern is with the distribution difference and the mind set that Sexton has as a scorer, then a scorer, Oh and then maybe I should attempt to be an assist guy... That impacts the entire flow the team.
User avatar
Inigo Montoya
Forum Mod - Jazz
Forum Mod - Jazz
Posts: 17,187
And1: 8,459
Joined: May 31, 2012

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#6 » by Inigo Montoya » Mon Nov 21, 2022 3:45 pm

I'll be surprised if Sexton doesn't start while Conley is out. But I expect him t dish the ball more and facilitate, otherwise it would show he did not really absorb anything playing with and being around Conley and it wouldn't bode well for his future as potential starting PG. If he wants to be a starter in this league, he needs to be able to pass more and not try to score all the time. I do like his motor, though. He plays hard on both ends.
Draft Nate Wolters - FAILED
Keep Nate Wolters - FAILED
Image
KqWIN wrote:Why are we talking about Middleton, Harris, and Porter?

The real decision the Jazz FO is making is between Continuity, Cap Flexibility, and Cash Considerations.
User avatar
Axolotl
Starter
Posts: 2,349
And1: 2,282
Joined: Feb 05, 2018
Location: The Vasty Deep

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#7 » by Axolotl » Mon Nov 21, 2022 5:04 pm

I just hope it's pass-the-ball Sexton's turn, and not his evil twin drive-to-traffic Sexton's
From the basketball's perspective, travel is a nice pause from being pounded to the floor.
Crunch 99
General Manager
Posts: 7,873
And1: 3,867
Joined: Jan 05, 2017
 

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#8 » by Crunch 99 » Mon Nov 21, 2022 5:24 pm

Inigo Montoya wrote:I'll be surprised if Sexton doesn't start while Conley is out. But I expect him t dish the ball more and facilitate, otherwise it would show he did not really absorb anything playing with and being around Conley and it wouldn't bode well for his future as potential starting PG. If he wants to be a starter in this league, he needs to be able to pass more and not try to score all the time. I do like his motor, though. He plays hard on both ends.


You are probably correct.

It's true that Sexton needs to be given plenty of opportunity to become a decent starter/facilitator, but I would base the THT v Sexton call on whether or not Paul George starts. If THT can slow down PG some, that would help a lot. The Jazz could still start Sexton in following games if they didn't start him tonight.

Sexton got the start in the one game that Conley sat out against Memphis, and he put up good offensive numbers in a one point Jazz win, but so did six foot Tyus Jones have good numbers, who was starting in place of Morant. Sexton had 19 pts on 12 fga with 4 ast, 3 tovs, while Tyus Jones had 23 pts on 15 fga with 10 ast and 1 tov.

PG is GTD. Game time might be too late in terms of Hardy's game planning to make the call concerning Sexton v THT.
Crunch 99
General Manager
Posts: 7,873
And1: 3,867
Joined: Jan 05, 2017
 

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#9 » by Crunch 99 » Mon Nov 21, 2022 5:51 pm

So I just checked Rotowire again, and now they've got an expected starting lineup without Sexton or THT. Could be another Crunch discussion above about nothing. :lol:

Current expected starting lineup at Rotowire: Clarkson, Beasley, Markkanen, Vanderbilt and Olynyk.
User avatar
FranchisePlayer
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,763
And1: 598
Joined: Oct 25, 2019
 

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#10 » by FranchisePlayer » Mon Nov 21, 2022 7:38 pm

Crunch 99 wrote:Rotowire shows Sexton replacing Conley in the expected lineup. If I were choosing the lineup, I would start THT with Clarkson in the backcourt to emphasize length and defense. I would put THT on Paul George, assuming Paul George (grey tossup) starts.

Additionally, THT has been a more willing passer than Sexton so far, averaging 5.4 ast/36 mins to Sexton's 3.2 ast/36 mins.

For bench, I would play Sexton in his usual microwave scorer off the bench role, while giving NAW THT's bench minutes.


Whoever can feed Markkanen should have starter's spot. Damn, we miss so much maturity when Conley's out.
MrSparkle wrote:I don't see a scenario here or there where Lauri becomes the "7-pick we thought he could be." If you remove his 3P ability, he's worse than Felicio by a mile.

12/2/2022
I like the quote- it makes me chuckle. And it was/is pretty much true.
User avatar
FranchisePlayer
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,763
And1: 598
Joined: Oct 25, 2019
 

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#11 » by FranchisePlayer » Mon Nov 21, 2022 7:41 pm

TNJazz wrote:
FJS wrote:
Crunch 99 wrote:Rotowire shows Sexton replacing Conley in the expected lineup. If I were choosing the lineups, I would start THT with Clarkson in the backcourt to emphasize length and defense. I would put THT on Paul George, assuming Paul George (tossup) starts.

Additionally, THT has been a more willing passer than Sexton so far, averaging 5.4 ast/36 mins so far to Sexton's 3.2 ast/36 mins.

For bench, I would play Sexton in his usual microwave scorer off the bench role and give NAW THT's bench minutes.


I agree with you. I think THT should start over Sexton.


I also agree but wonder if Sexton has it in his mind that he is the designated backup to Conley and is the rightful person to assume the starters role. Now it becomes a mind game for Hardy. If Hardy is working to keep things in a good place, maybe he starts Sexton, who gives tremendous energy, then brings THT off the bench and to finish. Also it's a game time decisions on PG playing, if he doesn't then the length aspect of THT over Sexton isn't as critical. My concern is with the distribution difference and the mind set that Sexton has as a scorer, then a scorer, Oh and then maybe I should attempt to be an assist guy... That impacts the entire flow the team.


You are right. The mindset Sexton had in Cleveland was a real team play killer.

He and Garland were the anti-match-made-in-heaven and obviously the Cavs chose the one with more talent.
MrSparkle wrote:I don't see a scenario here or there where Lauri becomes the "7-pick we thought he could be." If you remove his 3P ability, he's worse than Felicio by a mile.

12/2/2022
I like the quote- it makes me chuckle. And it was/is pretty much true.
User avatar
FranchisePlayer
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,763
And1: 598
Joined: Oct 25, 2019
 

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#12 » by FranchisePlayer » Mon Nov 21, 2022 7:47 pm

Axolotl wrote:I just hope it's pass-the-ball Sexton's turn, and not his evil twin drive-to-traffic Sexton's


The Cavs managed to keep their hope up for four seasons. We'll see if can mature and play the right kind of jazz.

ATM SG is like written all over him. It requires some robust change of mentality to see him evolve to a PG. But hey, anything is possible! I once managed to dream of Charlize Theron and myself doing something else than watching movies...
MrSparkle wrote:I don't see a scenario here or there where Lauri becomes the "7-pick we thought he could be." If you remove his 3P ability, he's worse than Felicio by a mile.

12/2/2022
I like the quote- it makes me chuckle. And it was/is pretty much true.
Jiipee84
Pro Prospect
Posts: 873
And1: 239
Joined: Feb 08, 2019
     

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#13 » by Jiipee84 » Mon Nov 21, 2022 9:34 pm

FranchisePlayer wrote:
Crunch 99 wrote:Rotowire shows Sexton replacing Conley in the expected lineup. If I were choosing the lineup, I would start THT with Clarkson in the backcourt to emphasize length and defense. I would put THT on Paul George, assuming Paul George (grey tossup) starts.

Additionally, THT has been a more willing passer than Sexton so far, averaging 5.4 ast/36 mins to Sexton's 3.2 ast/36 mins.

For bench, I would play Sexton in his usual microwave scorer off the bench role, while giving NAW THT's bench minutes.


Whoever can feed Markkanen should have starter's spot. Damn, we miss so much maturity when Conley's out.


It's about a damn time for Lauri finally learn to create his own shots and scoring chances.
If he truly wants to be an allstar he must learn that skill now not in the future.

Lauri is 25 yrs old and 6th year player so he shouldn't be so depend of PG anymore.
That's the difference ( skill to create own shots and scoring chances ) which separates star player of superstar player.
User avatar
Axolotl
Starter
Posts: 2,349
And1: 2,282
Joined: Feb 05, 2018
Location: The Vasty Deep

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#14 » by Axolotl » Tue Nov 22, 2022 6:27 am

Jiipee84 wrote:It's about a damn time for Lauri finally learn to create his own shots and scoring chances.
If he truly wants to be an allstar he must learn that skill now not in the future.


List of 7-footers who consistently create their own shots and scoring opportunities:

1. Kevin Durant

Markkanen has a developemental opportunity there, but if you play in a ball movement offense more of your shots will be assisted than in a iso-heavy offense. Jordan Clarkson went from 40% assisted last season to 47% assisted this season. I much prefer this years Clarkson - and he still isos too much.

Markkanen is at about 70% assisted now, a few percentage points down would likely to be ideal in his current context.

edit:
Maybe not. He is highly efficient as is:

Read on Twitter
From the basketball's perspective, travel is a nice pause from being pounded to the floor.
Crunch 99
General Manager
Posts: 7,873
And1: 3,867
Joined: Jan 05, 2017
 

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#15 » by Crunch 99 » Tue Nov 22, 2022 2:12 pm

We really missed Conley. The Jazz only had 22 assists for the game.

Sexton started. He only had 1 assist, 0 tovs and was a minus 9 plus/minus player. THT only had 2 ast, 2 steals along with 4 costly tovs, but it looked like THT played better overall than Sexton.
User avatar
FranchisePlayer
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,763
And1: 598
Joined: Oct 25, 2019
 

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#16 » by FranchisePlayer » Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:12 pm

Jiipee84 wrote:
FranchisePlayer wrote:
Crunch 99 wrote:Rotowire shows Sexton replacing Conley in the expected lineup. If I were choosing the lineup, I would start THT with Clarkson in the backcourt to emphasize length and defense. I would put THT on Paul George, assuming Paul George (grey tossup) starts.

Additionally, THT has been a more willing passer than Sexton so far, averaging 5.4 ast/36 mins to Sexton's 3.2 ast/36 mins.

For bench, I would play Sexton in his usual microwave scorer off the bench role, while giving NAW THT's bench minutes.


Whoever can feed Markkanen should have starter's spot. Damn, we miss so much maturity when Conley's out.


It's about a damn time for Lauri finally learn to create his own shots and scoring chances.
If he truly wants to be an allstar he must learn that skill now not in the future.

Lauri is 25 yrs old and 6th year player so he shouldn't be so depend of PG anymore.
That's the difference ( skill to create own shots and scoring chances ) which separates star player of superstar player.


You obviously haven't been watching the games or even the highlight reels; he creates his own shot in EVERY game.



He needs to be fed since he's by far the best scorer this team has inside the arc and it's plain common sense to create a scoring chance for that player. Moronic even to suggest someone has to create 30 points on his own just for the sake of it.

Thanks for the preach though, Boylen! Maybe you should focus on other players too and not be so fixated to dig any kind of dirt you can throw on Markkanen's face.
MrSparkle wrote:I don't see a scenario here or there where Lauri becomes the "7-pick we thought he could be." If you remove his 3P ability, he's worse than Felicio by a mile.

12/2/2022
I like the quote- it makes me chuckle. And it was/is pretty much true.
User avatar
FranchisePlayer
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,763
And1: 598
Joined: Oct 25, 2019
 

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#17 » by FranchisePlayer » Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:20 pm

Crunch 99 wrote:We really missed Conley. The Jazz only had 22 assists for the game.

Sexton started. He only had 1 assist, 0 tovs and was a -9 plus minus player. THT only had 2 ast, 2 steals along with 4 costly tovs, but it looked like THT played more competitively overall than Sexton.


Another game underlining why the Cavs wanted to get rid of Sexton: to put it kindly, he's completely useless as a PG. One assist in 28 minutes?! Which could be compensated with good scoring....um, FG% 38.5!

Like I said before the game, Sexton has good qualities but not BB IQ which every PG desperately needs. Something is not right when all the other startes get more AST than Sexton, lol.

I do hope Hardy has a really short leash on Sexton's PG tryout. At this rate Sexton does become the perfect tank commander. In this game it didnt' help that Clarkson decided to just chuck'em.

Hands down, D included, Markkanen was yet again the best Jazz out there. He needs help from others.
MrSparkle wrote:I don't see a scenario here or there where Lauri becomes the "7-pick we thought he could be." If you remove his 3P ability, he's worse than Felicio by a mile.

12/2/2022
I like the quote- it makes me chuckle. And it was/is pretty much true.
User avatar
FranchisePlayer
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,763
And1: 598
Joined: Oct 25, 2019
 

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#18 » by FranchisePlayer » Tue Nov 22, 2022 4:25 pm

Axolotl wrote:
Jiipee84 wrote:It's about a damn time for Lauri finally learn to create his own shots and scoring chances.
If he truly wants to be an allstar he must learn that skill now not in the future.


List of 7-footers who consistently create their own shots and scoring opportunities:

1. Kevin Durant

Markkanen has a developemental opportunity there, but if you play in a ball movement offense more of your shots will be assisted than in a iso-heavy offense. Jordan Clarkson went from 40% assisted last season to 47% assisted this season. I much prefer this years Clarkson - and he still isos too much.

Markkanen is at about 70% assisted now, a few percentage points down would likely to be ideal in his current context.

edit:
Maybe not. He is highly efficient as is:

Read on Twitter


Good points!

I'd add that without Conley or another competent PG this team won't continue it's cinderella run.

We lack depth in many positions and in PG it hurts since that has direct ramifications to the Finnisher's play. And if Lauri isn't your best scorer, then who out of this roster is? (rhetorical question)
MrSparkle wrote:I don't see a scenario here or there where Lauri becomes the "7-pick we thought he could be." If you remove his 3P ability, he's worse than Felicio by a mile.

12/2/2022
I like the quote- it makes me chuckle. And it was/is pretty much true.
Rauxcee
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,685
And1: 3,237
Joined: Jan 07, 2006
 

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#19 » by Rauxcee » Wed Nov 23, 2022 3:10 am

Sexton is looking worse each game while THT is looking better.
User avatar
Inigo Montoya
Forum Mod - Jazz
Forum Mod - Jazz
Posts: 17,187
And1: 8,459
Joined: May 31, 2012

Re: Game 19: Utah Jazz (12-6) @ Los Angeles Clippers (10-7) 

Post#20 » by Inigo Montoya » Wed Nov 23, 2022 10:28 am

Based on that chart, we should get Markkanen more possessions ASAP.
Draft Nate Wolters - FAILED
Keep Nate Wolters - FAILED
Image
KqWIN wrote:Why are we talking about Middleton, Harris, and Porter?

The real decision the Jazz FO is making is between Continuity, Cap Flexibility, and Cash Considerations.

Return to Utah Jazz