Grant Williams thread

[TatumMVP]

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Celtics had to know this is a very real possibility. Going to be interesting to see what happens with Grant.

pass, S&T.

[shackles10]

A few thoughts after the Grant video:

-- He sure sounds like a future coach.

I can’t remember if it was early this season or in the summer but I was feeling strong vibes of this as well. Even posted once I think after the Ime debacle he’ll be a future Celtics head coach one day. Of course if he signs somewhere else for $20m next year then maybe not lol.

[JaMarco]

It's pretty irrelevant what Grant is asking for, all that matters is what teams will actually give him.

[zoyathedestroya]

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[Fencer reregistered]

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So Grant has:
-- Demonstrated his popularity around the league.
-- Surpassed Jaylen.
-- Surpassed Brogdon too.

And of course he gets to keep playing the "I'm a union leader, so I'll hang tough to set an example" card in salary negotiations.

[Spin Move]

I mean he fills the role of a Jae crowder type but that is a midlevel role, not a 20 million a year role, we are better of letting him walk at those numbers.

[Fencer reregistered]

I mean he fills the role of a Jae crowder type but that is a midlevel role, not a 20 million a year role, we are better of letting him walk at those numbers.

Jae has had one season each in his career with TS% or 3pt% better than Grant's career averages. (Admittedly, Grant's volume is lower, and his stats are bad in assists and TOs.) Grant is also a bigger contributor to defense and rebounding, although those are subjective judgments open to debate.

So Grant at least has the potential of well surpassing Jae.

Also, when Jae's at his best, he's a decent starter. His pay is held back by his inconsistency and, at times, his attitude as well.

[captain green]

11 max end of story. I googled every player that has currently a 19 million to 20 a year contract everyone avg 12ppg. I can't stand him as a starter in fact even with muscala, kornet, Hauser whom I don't like player wise I still hate can't will the most on this team. Too cocky, loud , and full of himself and still some boneheaded plays. I hate when he guards bigs or smalls. A back up, 8th man off the bench player.
Now I'm sure someone will come in and post some ridiculous stats that he is worth blah blah blah. You can't avg ten points a game no 15 mill for you let alone laughable 20 million

[165bows]

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So Grant has:
-- Demonstrated his popularity around the league.
-- Surpassed Jaylen.
-- Surpassed Brogdon too.

And of course he gets to keep playing the "I'm a union leader, so I'll hang tough to set an example" card in salary negotiations.

Yeah worst case scenario is some smart assed tanking team offers him a fat two year deal, and shoots the ability to match and use him as a trade piece.

[31to6]

Cap is going up, right? It’s going to depend a lot on how the playoffs go but I’d bet the Cs are lucky if they get Grant at $15M.

He looks sharp in a suit so overqualified to coach in today’s NBA.

I’ve never heard of a “first Vice President” is that common in whatever worlds you all are part of?

[165bows]

Cap is going up, right? It’s going to depend a lot on how the playoffs go but I’d bet the Cs are lucky if they get Grant at $15M.

He looks sharp in a suit so overqualified to coach in today’s NBA.

I’ve never heard of a “first Vice President” is that common in whatever worlds you all are part of?

Well I think some places esp. the corporate world VPs are a dime a dozen.

[cl2117]

I mean he fills the role of a Jae crowder type but that is a midlevel role, not a 20 million a year role, we are better of letting him walk at those numbers.

In my mind a big part of not letting him walk is about keeping the salary slot that he'd give us. If we let him walk, unless it's via a sign and trade, we'd lose out on the ability to add more around our core. And even if it's a sign and trade, look how we've struggled to make the most of the TPE's we had in recent years. In my eyes there is no way we shouldn't match almost any offer he'd get as a RFA.

There's a lot of positives to overpaying him, more-so than a lot of other guys you'd have in a similar situation:

- Cap is going up, which will help mitigate his overpayment
- He already plays an incredibly valuable role and would be insurance for Horford's eventual age decline
- He doesn't rely on athleticism as much as other similar players, so should age well
- Playing around the talent we already have should enable him to keep his stats where they are (key for future trades)
- Great locker room presence, so you're getting intangibles beyond just on court production
- 3&D skillset that can be transferrable to most team's systems, making it a very wide market for his skillset (key for future trades)

It's a classic "not my money, not my problem" situation, but I just see too much benefit for keeping him around to let him walk for nothing (obviously ignoring the luxury tax implications). Especially if you front-load the deal and have him become even more appealing as you get further into the contract.

In the short-term you're keeping the band together, longer term you've got good trade ballast to be able to attach 3-4 picks to try and bring in player X to pair with Tatum/Brown (or multiple players). Yes you risk him being overpaid and viewed as negative value, but I think there will ultimately be a team out there that values his skillset enough that'll offset the monetary downside of his contract. You might still pay to get off him, but it shouldn't be all that much. More importantly though you're not going to have to be aggregating guys you don't want to move in order to make said trade as Grant is now your ready-made trade filler.

If you can do a S&T and get another huge TPE then great, but the issue with that is the inability to add to it to absorb larger salaried players which really handcuffs you by putting a ceiling on the cost of the guy you're acquiring. Even if Grant ends up as a negative asset, the ability to use him for salary matching purposes helps offset that considerably.

[BK_2020]

- He already plays an incredibly valuable role and would be insurance for Horford's eventual age decline

He's a chunky guy who shoots threes and plays mediocre defense. That's a valuable role but far from incredibly valuable. If he was incredibly valuable, he would've been locked up with a 5 year max.

[cl2117]

- He already plays an incredibly valuable role and would be insurance for Horford's eventual age decline

He's a chunky guy who shoots threes and plays mediocre defense. That's a valuable role but far from incredibly valuable. If he was incredibly valuable, he would've been locked up with a 5 year max.

He's played the 4th most minutes on the team (5th most per game), he shoots the same % from 3 as Hauser and he can guard in the paint and on the perimeter mediocrely. He also showed up big time in the post-season last year (although admittedly not in the Finals, but that was the case for a lot of guys). That's incredibly useful.

He's not a star, nor does he have that kind of potential, but he's not a bum either. It's a spectrum. A team's sixth man can be incredibly valuable, you don't have to be a starter or a star.

When he gets overpaid his relative overall value will decrease, but his on court value will still be there. And that's my point. Yes, overpaying him will be painful for ownership, but his on court value will still be there and because we have everyone locked up for the most part him getting overpaid won't preclude us from running it back unless Wyc & co refuse to foot the bill.

[BK_2020]

- He already plays an incredibly valuable role and would be insurance for Horford's eventual age decline

He's a chunky guy who shoots threes and plays mediocre defense. That's a valuable role but far from incredibly valuable. If he was incredibly valuable, he would've been locked up with a 5 year max.

He's played the 4th most minutes on the team (5th most per game), he shoots the same % from 3 as Hauser and he can guard in the paint and on the perimeter mediocrely. He also showed up big time in the post-season last year (although admittedly not in the Finals, but that was the case for a lot of guys). That's incredibly useful.

He's not a star, nor does he have that kind of potential, but he's not a bum either. It's a spectrum. A team's sixth man can be incredibly valuable, you don't have to be a starter or a star.

When he gets overpaid his relative overall value will decrease, but his on court value will still be there. And that's my point. Yes, overpaying him will be painful for ownership, but his on court value will still be there and because we have everyone locked up for the most part him getting overpaid won't preclude us from running it back unless Wyc & co refuse to foot the bill.

I guess it's a matter of style. I tend to think words like "incredibly" or "elite" should mean what they actually say, instead of being placeholders for "good," "decent," "useful."

[Wes-J]

Not even gonna lie the thought of Grant getting 18-20 mill/yr from Boston makes me sick.

Literally want to punch him every time he whines about a missed foul call. It even kinda triggers me when he tilts his head to the side after shooting wide open after wide open three. Don't get me started on the pump fakes and getting blocked by the rim monster. Whether he plays good or bad for the night depends on if he's had a good and proper bowel movement, you just NEVER KNOW.

Won't be sorry to see him moved in a S&T.

[MagicBagley18]

Not even gonna lie the thought of Grant getting 18-20 mill/yr from Boston makes me sick.

Literally want to punch him every time he whines about a missed foul call. It even kinda triggers me when he tilts his head to the side after shooting wide open after wide open three. Don't get me started on the pump fakes and getting blocked by the rim monster. Whether he plays good or bad for the night depends on if he's had a good and proper bowel movement, you just NEVER KNOW.

Won't be sorry to see him moved in a S&T.

Don’t hold back at all let us know how you truly feel

[Wes-J]

Not even gonna lie the thought of Grant getting 18-20 mill/yr from Boston makes me sick.

Literally want to punch him every time he whines about a missed foul call. It even kinda triggers me when he tilts his head to the side after shooting wide open after wide open three. Don't get me started on the pump fakes and getting blocked by the rim monster. Whether he plays good or bad for the night depends on if he's had a good and proper bowel movement, you just NEVER KNOW.

Won't be sorry to see him moved in a S&T.

Don’t hold back at all let us know how you truly feel

Lol yeah, I know, weird random.

[Curmudgeon]

GWill is entitled to look for as much money as he can get. Some team is undoubtedly going to pay more than the $6.2M qualifying offer and the Celtics will have to decide whether or not to match. If no team thinks he's worth $20M he won't get it.

I think his defense is pretty good and he can be a small ball center if necessary. He shoots 40% from beyond the arc. He's durable, never on the injured list. That's a valuable player, but how valuable remains to be seen.

[bucknersrevenge]

Grant be livin rent-free in Celtics fans heads these days. It's kinda weird.