2023 Draft Discussion Part 4

[duppyy]

Haven't been paying attention to the draft prospects but I thought a few weeks/months ago people were high on GG?

[Spates]

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has us selecting GG at 13

I'm not a huge GG Jackson fan, but I do think he might be the biggest boom or bust prospect. If he hits, he's a star. But hearing his interview with Rafael Barlowe and watching the scouting reports on him on youtube, he's got a lot of maturing to do. I think he might be one of the youngest prospect in the draft and it shows.

I think GG is a terrible basketball player with some really nice flashes and quite an impressive physical profile. I think the experience would be similar to the worst moments of Precious. Epitome of a prospect, who'd probably grow frustrated with a lack of playing time as he develops similar to Kuminga. I think he needs to be on a talented young team with a hierarchy and no expectations of winning. Basically Detroit or San Antonio.

[mtcan]

If all his picks were Bruno types you would be right but go look at the history.

Just naming guys off the top of my head (obviously Goggling for for actual measurements)...these are the guys that have been brought in either as drafted/undrafted/traded for while on a rookie scale contract in the Masai era:
Julyan Stone (6'6 point guard with 6'10 wingspan)
Bruno
Bebe Noguiera (not drafted but tall and long wingspan)
Jak
Pascal
OG
Delon (noted for his length at the point guard position)
DeAndre Daniels (6'9 tall, 7 ft wingspan)
Norm (long wingspan for his height 6'11 for a 6'4 guy)
Scottie
Chris Boucher
Dewan Hernandez
Delano Banton
Justin Champagnie (6'10 wingspan 8'8 standing reach)
Oshae Brissett (7 ft wingspan)
David Johnson (6'5 guard with 6'10 wingspan)
Terence Davis (8'5 standing reach and largest hands since 2010)
Christian Koloko
Precious Achiuwa

The above list outnumbers the list prospects with average to negative wingspan and/or height like:
Malachi Flynn
Jalen Harris
Dwight Buycks
Matt Thomas
Fred VanVleet

Who am I missing?

*oh and...Masai also loves prospects in their early to mid 20s that started basketball late or might be seen as late bloomers*

You said questionable basketball ability. Poeltl, Siakam, Norm, Delon, OG can all play and were picked all over the board. Their talent wasn't questionable. We have a certain type for sure but we find talent. Bruno was the one guy at #20 where he had zero skill.

I'd say a lot of these guys are drafted because of their size primarily and the hope that development system can teach them the necessary skills. Pascal wasn't seen as a skilled player when he was drafted. Diane Casey was quoted as comparing Pascal to Amir Johnson...an energy guy more than skilled. Delano was drafted as a major project. Precious is still a project as is Koloko.

But ya...sort through the list of guys measurements and sort by wingspan (overall and per position). Guys at the top of the list are prioritized. Then you hope these guys can shoot and even if not...you take them hoping you can develop that.

[ATLTimekeeper]

The funny thing is, about a month ago, I mentioned Coulibaly as a potential riser in the draft based on his upside. He was regularly ranked in the 2nd round. He was someone I thought Raps FO would like if we didn't draft based on consensus.

He's risen a bit (late 1st round in most mocks) and is currently 15th on The Ringer's Mock and 17th on nbadraft.net. By draft time, it might not even be considered a reach anymore.

I don't think he'll even stay in the draft without a lotto guarantee.

Forgot that was also an option. When is the deadline for international players to withdraw?

June 12th. He's repped by the same agent as Batum and Gobert and they both teased their eligibility before withdrawing, and actually dropped their stock the following year. I've heard him teased as a potential lotto candidate for next year, and the perception is that it's a weaker draft. He's definitely the biggest mystery box for me.

[WuTang_CMB]

Just naming guys off the top of my head (obviously Goggling for for actual measurements)...these are the guys that have been brought in either as drafted/undrafted/traded for while on a rookie scale contract in the Masai era:
Julyan Stone (6'6 point guard with 6'10 wingspan)
Bruno
Bebe Noguiera (not drafted but tall and long wingspan)
Jak
Pascal
OG
Delon (noted for his length at the point guard position)
DeAndre Daniels (6'9 tall, 7 ft wingspan)
Norm (long wingspan for his height 6'11 for a 6'4 guy)
Scottie
Chris Boucher
Dewan Hernandez
Delano Banton
Justin Champagnie (6'10 wingspan 8'8 standing reach)
Oshae Brissett (7 ft wingspan)
David Johnson (6'5 guard with 6'10 wingspan)
Terence Davis (8'5 standing reach and largest hands since 2010)
Christian Koloko
Precious Achiuwa

The above list outnumbers the list prospects with average to negative wingspan and/or height like:
Malachi Flynn
Jalen Harris
Dwight Buycks
Matt Thomas
Fred VanVleet

Who am I missing?

*oh and...Masai also loves prospects in their early to mid 20s that started basketball late or might be seen as late bloomers*

You said questionable basketball ability. Poeltl, Siakam, Norm, Delon, OG can all play and were picked all over the board. Their talent wasn't questionable. We have a certain type for sure but we find talent. Bruno was the one guy at #20 where he had zero skill.

I'd say a lot of these guys are drafted because of their size primarily and the hope that development system can teach them the necessary skills. Pascal wasn't seen as a skilled player when he was drafted. Diane Casey was quoted as comparing Pascal to Amir Johnson...an energy guy more than skilled. Delano was drafted as a major project. Precious is still a project as is Koloko.

But ya...sort through the lost of guys measurements and sort by wingspan (overall and per position). Guys at the top of the list are prioritized. Then you hope these guys can shoot and even if not...you take them hoping you can develop that.

Our first round picks were talented aside from Bruno. Pascal was WAC player of the year and an all american. That's talent, not just a tools guy. The second round guys we leaned more to tools and hope the development system can carry them. I don't mind that philosophy.

[ItsDanger]

Coulibaly should stay in the draft if he's projected around #16 or wherever. If you wait for '24 draft to move up 8 spots or so, is that really worth the risk? The $ difference isn't massive but the benefit of staying in '23 draft is you're 1 year closer to your 2nd contract and UFA. It hinges on how confident the player is in their talents. But, the critical variable is guaranteed money. If you got a near 100% guarantee of that in '23 draft, you declare now. Otherwise, fire your useless agent.

[niQ]

Haven't been paying attention to the draft prospects but I thought a few weeks/months ago people were high on GG?

Raphael Barlowe is still really high on GG. His last mock he had him at 5th. Though, I'm pretty sure he's mentioned that in his earlier podcasts as well.

[Yallbecrazy]

Haven't been paying attention to the draft prospects but I thought a few weeks/months ago people were high on GG?

People see a tall, strong, physical specimen that can dribble a basketball.

Others see a guy who doesn't know how to play basketball, both offensively and defensively.

[Jadoogar]

My board right now (of people reasonably likely to be available):
1. Gradey Dick
2. Taylor Hendricks
3. Kobe Bufkin
4. Anthony Black
5. Jordan Hawkins
6. Jett Howard
7. Colby Jones
8. Keyonte George

Guys i don't like
1. Jarace Walker
2. Cason Wallace (too small)
3. Nick Smith Jr
4. Bilal Coulibaly (too much overlap with existing players)

[ItsDanger]

I'd guess some of these internet draft junkies have aspirations beyond online content. If so, they need to differentiate themselves because too many of their lists/opinions are quite similar to one another. And this likely a contrast to actual NBA teams that have draft lists that vary quite a bit from one another.

[niQ]

I'm just saying, it would be pretty cool to come out of the draft with someone named Kobe, or Jordan.

[Yallbecrazy]

I'd guess some of these internet draft junkies have aspirations beyond online content. If so, they need to differentiate themselves because too many of their lists/opinions are quite similar to one another. And this likely a contrast to actual NBA teams that have draft lists that vary quite a bit from one another.

The problem with that is you are more likely to catch flak for the guy you were really low on relative to consensus that succeeded or the guy you were really high on that busted than gain notoriety for being right. All these guys copy each other because they're afraid that a couple outlandish takes that are wrong could sink them.

[Mister Ze]

Blazers Pacers and Mavs are all open to moving their pick.

Maybe we’ll find out the future of Fred OG and Siakam on draft night

[REJECTEDBYCLARK]

Haven't been paying attention to the draft prospects but I thought a few weeks/months ago people were high on GG?

People see a tall, strong, physical specimen that can dribble a basketball.

Others see a guy who doesn't know how to play basketball, both offensively and defensively.

lol

Good luck to GG, I will actually root for him to succeed and prove me wrong. Generally guys who are ball dominant who suck at passing and have 0 interest in defending don't fare well. He can say all he wants in interviews about being competitive and wanting to win badly, I'm not buying what he's selling. The defensive effort he displayed was shockingly bad and no player regardless of their age would produce that kind of effort if they were truly competitive and cared about winning.

[REJECTEDBYCLARK]

My board right now (of people reasonably likely to be available):
1. Gradey Dick
2. Taylor Hendricks
3. Kobe Bufkin
4. Anthony Black
5. Jordan Hawkins
6. Jett Howard
7. Colby Jones
8. Keyonte George

Guys i don't like
1. Jarace Walker
2. Cason Wallace (too small)
3. Nick Smith Jr
4. Bilal Coulibaly (too much overlap with existing players)

I don't see the guys on your board run the court in transition and block shots at the rim like teeny wittle ol' Cason Wallace does

[WuTang_CMB]

Read on Twitter

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[Jadoogar]

My board right now (of people reasonably likely to be available):
1. Gradey Dick
2. Taylor Hendricks
3. Kobe Bufkin
4. Anthony Black
5. Jordan Hawkins
6. Jett Howard
7. Colby Jones
8. Keyonte George

Guys i don't like
1. Jarace Walker
2. Cason Wallace (too small)
3. Nick Smith Jr
4. Bilal Coulibaly (too much overlap with existing players)

I don't see the guys on your board run the court in transition and block shots at the rim like teeny wittle ol' Cason Wallace does

Meh we've gone too hard on defensive prospects. If this guy turns out to be Kyle Lowry, i'll gladly eat crow but i just don't want to go hard after a small, defensive first guard.

[REJECTEDBYCLARK]

My board right now (of people reasonably likely to be available):
1. Gradey Dick
2. Taylor Hendricks
3. Kobe Bufkin
4. Anthony Black
5. Jordan Hawkins
6. Jett Howard
7. Colby Jones
8. Keyonte George

Guys i don't like
1. Jarace Walker
2. Cason Wallace (too small)
3. Nick Smith Jr
4. Bilal Coulibaly (too much overlap with existing players)

I don't see the guys on your board run the court in transition and block shots at the rim like teeny wittle ol' Cason Wallace does

Meh we've gone too hard on defensive prospects. If this guy turns out to be Kyle Lowry, i'll gladly eat crow but i just don't want to go hard after a small, defensive first guard.

He's not a defensive prospect though, he's a legit two way player who can hit pullup and C&S jumpshots at a high level beyond the arc or midrange. He has a decent floater too. I'm betting on his shooting numbers improving, there are already a lot of good markers.

[ArthurVandelay]

I get enraged reading these tweets smdh

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Duff & Los will likely tell you Purdle was worth it and tanking doesn't work.

Does tanking work? What's the evidence?

I was all aboard the tank train at deadline to be clear.

Detroit fans might not be digging the tank today. I don't think after 3 years they have the guy yet. Cade ain't him.

[Mark_83]

That Jonathan Givony mock draft is legit horrible. Dude has fallen off since moving to ESPN.

Don't worry, he can always edit the mock later.