2023 NBA Draft Thread 3

[VFX]

The other interesting team nobody will talk about yet via the draft is Toronto.

They just fired their coach, botched the playoffs, and have a pretty decent salary situation with Siakem, FVV, Trent, and OG. They could blow it all up.

They make good trade partners with Dallas, Portland, and Orlando should they want to get into the lottery outside of their #13 in a complete rebuild.

[jonbob17]

We can take a Portland trade off the table. They have publicly said they are building around Lillard and will likely shop their pick for an immediate competitor.

So the two teams vocal about shopping their picks are Portland (#3) and Dallas (#10).

Doesn’t help Orlando for move up situations.

The question with Portland, has always been, and appears to still be who do you surround Dame with to make a team that as good at basketball. Last year they ranked 28th in Defensive Rating.

You can't have all your top three guards be terrible defenders, and Simons and Sharpe especially bad. If they wanted to try to win with Dame, they should have kept Josh Hart rather than move him for gambles. They got Thybulle, but he doesn't offer anything on offense.
Grant is ok. Nurkic...meh

Gobert actually might make sense here. Minnesota can get out from the mistake of having two very highly paid centers.

[eyriq]

We can take a Portland trade off the table. They have publicly said they are building around Lillard and will likely shop their pick for an immediate competitor.

So the two teams vocal about shopping their picks are Portland (#3) and Dallas (#10).

Doesn’t help Orlando for move up situations.

Not necessarily. Just means the Magic need to get creative and perhaps bring a third team into the mix.

Something like...

No. 3 to Orlando
Win Now Vet to Portland
No. 6 and No. 11 to third team pivoting to more of a rebuild

All the Magic need is for some team to value 6 and 11 combined more than 3 individually, which doesn't seem totally outrageous.

This is a great framework

[jonbob17]

The other interesting team nobody will talk about yet via the draft is Toronto.

They just fired their coach, botched the playoffs, and have a pretty decent salary situation with Siakem, FVV, Trent, and OG. They could blow it all up.

They make good trade partners with Dallas, Portland, and Orlando should they want to get into the lottery outside of their #13 in a complete rebuild.

Adding Poeltl is what makes me skeptical. You don't add a 27 year old, unrestricted FA center, who will probably be the best defender on the market, if you are blowing it up. The Raptors gave up next year's first rounder to get him. Dude is getting paid, and it is going to be by Toronto.

[VFX]

We can take a Portland trade off the table. They have publicly said they are building around Lillard and will likely shop their pick for an immediate competitor.

So the two teams vocal about shopping their picks are Portland (#3) and Dallas (#10).

Doesn’t help Orlando for move up situations.

The question with Portland, has always been, and appears to still be who do you surround Dame with to make a team that as good at basketball. Last year they ranked 28th in Defensive Rating.

You can't have all your top three guards be terrible defenders, and Simons and Sharpe especially bad. If they wanted to try to win with Dame, they should have kept Josh Hart rather than move him for gambles. They got Thybulle, but he doesn't offer anything on offense.
Grant is ok. Nurkic...meh

Gobert actually might make sense here. Minnesota can get out from the mistake of having two very highly paid centers.

The issue Portland has now is coming up with a package that makes sense numbers-wise on outgoing salary combined with the #3. Knightro is probably correct that it has to be some kind of 3 team trade.

Difficult situation now considering they have to be good enough to obviously be playoff hopefuls and appease Lillard without sacrificing more long term value. Nurkic is $15m/4yr and I agree their back court doesn't really make sense for the immediate future. That probably leaves Simons out for a more defensive guard.

[bigdogdylan5]

Idk if this 3 and 4 news is good for us. These picks are going to get devalued because of supply and demand with teams trying to trade them for veteran players. I might include us in that too. I don’t think we can squeeze in there because the team trading the good player will just want 3.

[bigdogdylan5]

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[jonbob17]

We can take a Portland trade off the table. They have publicly said they are building around Lillard and will likely shop their pick for an immediate competitor.

So the two teams vocal about shopping their picks are Portland (#3) and Dallas (#10).

Doesn’t help Orlando for move up situations.

The question with Portland, has always been, and appears to still be who do you surround Dame with to make a team that as good at basketball. Last year they ranked 28th in Defensive Rating.

You can't have all your top three guards be terrible defenders, and Simons and Sharpe especially bad. If they wanted to try to win with Dame, they should have kept Josh Hart rather than move him for gambles. They got Thybulle, but he doesn't offer anything on offense.
Grant is ok. Nurkic...meh

Gobert actually might make sense here. Minnesota can get out from the mistake of having two very highly paid centers.

The issue Portland has now is coming up with a package that makes sense numbers-wise on outgoing salary combined with the #3. Knightro is probably correct that it has to be some kind of 3 team trade.

Difficult situation now considering they have to be good enough to obviously be playoff hopefuls and appease Lillard without sacrificing more long term value. Nurkic is $15m/4yr and I agree their back court doesn't really make sense for the immediate future. That probably leaves Simons out for a more defensive guard.

Yah, i mean Minnesota is trying to win now, they would want vets back, from the 3rd or 4th team blowing it up. Portland would have Simons going out and could do a Nurkic sign and trade to match salary, or add some of their other guys. I don't think outgoing salary would be an issue.

Identifying the team and players headed to Minnesota would be the challenge. Would also be admitting almost immediate failure by their new GM, given what they gave up for Gobert. I think Minny have to move one of their centers, but maybe KAT is easier for that GM to stomach, even if it is the wrong decision.

[basketballRob]

I doubt Portland trades the pick.

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[GelbeWand09]

The other interesting team nobody will talk about yet via the draft is Toronto.

They just fired their coach, botched the playoffs, and have a pretty decent salary situation with Siakem, FVV, Trent, and OG. They could blow it all up.

They make good trade partners with Dallas, Portland, and Orlando should they want to get into the lottery outside of their #13 in a complete rebuild.

Toronto is super interesting. They probably should at least retool & maybe they lose there backcourt for nothing, but they traded next years pick with low protections to San Antonio for Poeltl in a win now move just to reach the playin. Maybe all the picks/young prospects they possibly get for Siakam & OG (Simmons & 3rd pick + future pick for Siakam? + 2 picks for OG) let them worry less about the possibility of losing there own pick in a retool/rebuilt year. But its definitely not a ideal situation.

[zaymon]

I doubt Portland trades the pick.

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They should trade pick or Lillard.

[Knightro]

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[ucfmay2000]

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So you may cross whoever Orlando meet or work out off the list. Based on historical data, Orlando will likely not draft whoever they meet or work out.

[jonbob17]

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Did they meet with Paolo and Suggs or did they just not work out? Actually, maybe neither even attended the the combine...I can't remember.

[Skybox]

We can take a Portland trade off the table. They have publicly said they are building around Lillard and will likely shop their pick for an immediate competitor.

So the two teams vocal about shopping their picks are Portland (#3) and Dallas (#10).

Doesn’t help Orlando for move up situations.

The question with Portland, has always been, and appears to still be who do you surround Dame with to make a team that as good at basketball. Last year they ranked 28th in Defensive Rating.

You can't have all your top three guards be terrible defenders, and Simons and Sharpe especially bad. If they wanted to try to win with Dame, they should have kept Josh Hart rather than move him for gambles. They got Thybulle, but he doesn't offer anything on offense.
Grant is ok. Nurkic...meh

Gobert actually might make sense here. Minnesota can get out from the mistake of having two very highly paid centers.

The issue Portland has now is coming up with a package that makes sense numbers-wise on outgoing salary combined with the #3. Knightro is probably correct that it has to be some kind of 3 team trade.

Difficult situation now considering they have to be good enough to obviously be playoff hopefuls and appease Lillard without sacrificing more long term value. Nurkic is $15m/4yr and I agree their back court doesn't really make sense for the immediate future. That probably leaves Simons out for a more defensive guard.

How about a ORL pick-heavy package to get OG to POR and we get back #2 and Simons?

ORL sends: #6, #11, DEN 25 frp, ORL 25 frp (top 3 protected), Fultz, Okeke
ORL gets: #2 (Scoot), Anfernee Simons, #23 (GG Jackson, Lively?)

POR sends: Anfernee Simons, #2, #23
POR gets: OG Anunoby, Chuma Okeke, #11, DEN 25 frp

TOR sends: OG Anunoby,
TOR gets: Markelle Fultz, #6, ORL 25 frp (top 3)

Scoot, Cole
Simons, Suggs
Franz, Houstan
Paolo, GG Jackson, M. Wagner
WCJ, Goga

[VFX]

The question with Portland, has always been, and appears to still be who do you surround Dame with to make a team that as good at basketball. Last year they ranked 28th in Defensive Rating.

You can't have all your top three guards be terrible defenders, and Simons and Sharpe especially bad. If they wanted to try to win with Dame, they should have kept Josh Hart rather than move him for gambles. They got Thybulle, but he doesn't offer anything on offense.
Grant is ok. Nurkic...meh

Gobert actually might make sense here. Minnesota can get out from the mistake of having two very highly paid centers.

The issue Portland has now is coming up with a package that makes sense numbers-wise on outgoing salary combined with the #3. Knightro is probably correct that it has to be some kind of 3 team trade.

Difficult situation now considering they have to be good enough to obviously be playoff hopefuls and appease Lillard without sacrificing more long term value. Nurkic is $15m/4yr and I agree their back court doesn't really make sense for the immediate future. That probably leaves Simons out for a more defensive guard.

How about a ORL pick-heavy package to get OG to POR and we get back #2 and Simons?

ORL sends: #6, #11, DEN 25 frp, ORL 25 frp (top 3 protected), Fultz, Okeke
ORL gets: #2 (Scoot), Anfernee Simons, #23 (GG Jackson, Lively?)

POR sends: Anfernee Simons, #2, #23
POR gets: OG Anunoby, Chuma Okeke, #11, DEN 25 frp

TOR sends: OG Anunoby,
TOR gets: Markelle Fultz, #6, ORL 25 frp (top 3)

Scoot, Cole
Simons, Suggs
Franz, Houstan
Paolo, GG Jackson, M. Wagner
WCJ, Goga

I don't think Portland bites on that. Too light of a return for #2 and Simons.

Edit: They will want Pascal from Toronto for #3.

[tiderulz]

I doubt Portland trades the pick.

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and i absolutely believe they will. they will drop back and get a good vet for Dame's last few years run.

[jonbob17]

How about a ORL pick-heavy package to get OG to POR and we get back #2 and Simons?

ORL sends: #6, #11, DEN 25 frp, ORL 25 frp (top 3 protected), Fultz, Okeke
ORL gets: #2 (Scoot), Anfernee Simons, #23 (GG Jackson, Lively?)

POR sends: Anfernee Simons, #2, #23
POR gets: OG Anunoby, Chuma Okeke, #11, DEN 25 frp

TOR sends: OG Anunoby,
TOR gets: Markelle Fultz, #6, ORL 25 frp (top 3)

Scoot, Cole
Simons, Suggs
Franz, Houstan
Paolo, GG Jackson, M. Wagner
WCJ, Goga

If that's the cost of of OG, maybe just cut Portland out and trade directly with Toronto. I know we need PG help, but make another trade for like Monte Morris or Delon Wright and play Suggs and Franz equally at the 2 with OG, and Franz at 3 while OG off the court.

Franz, OG, Paolo sound like a nice trio...or even pick Miller at 3. Not sure we would want Scoot and Simons as our starting guards together. Might be in the same situation as Portland.

Probably takes more than that but OG could definitely get moved, and maybe we could help facilitate that.

[Knightro]

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[Skybox]

I doubt Portland trades the pick.

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and i absolutely believe they will. they will drop back and get a good vet for Dame's last few years run.

I don't think Scoot makes sense for them, but Miller might be able to step right in and shoot. But I'd really look at moving it if I'm POR. I assume CHA also shops it unless they really think Miller has more value to them than what they could get for "Scoot" pick.

CHA is young enough that a pick-heavy package from ORL might do it. POR would have to be win-now pieces.