2023 Draft Discussion Part 4

[Rapsfan07]

Wouldn't Suggs be top 3 in this draft?
Would you take Dyson Daniels (8th pick last year) over a top 5 protected 1st of this year?

I personally feel this is a weak draft, and rather prefer to trade the pick for a proven player.

Suggs be top 3 lmao hell no!!

I would easily favour any of Scoot (especially), Miller or Amen over him. Heck there wouldn't be much that separates Suggs from Cason Wallace for me.

If I was assessing Dyson coming out of the G-League, he doesn't stand out to me anymore than Anthony Black tbh. But also what "proven player"?! That's a very blanket statement without actually presenting what you would consider a likely available trade that would also need to happen this summer as well before their contracts balloon even more.

There also seems to be this weird running misled belief that Pascal or OG would warrant some surefire young star in order to make the trade. When the reality is, if teams feel almost certain whatever young player will be a superstar, guess what?! They're not trading for a player the level of OG or Siakam lol those kinds of prospects are only moved to bring in a true star player. Pascal is wonderful but as his all-star reserve to not making a team at all shows, he's not that. So you have to roll the dice a little in players you believe could be better long term at the heights of their potentials and see at least 2-3 guys at that 3rd pick that could EASILY be better if you got the most out of them.

I don't think you remember the hype around Suggs and the season he put up.
I think he would be getting hype as a top 3-5 player in this draft.

Nah bro, I'm sorry. Suggs had massive hype at the draft, no doubt. Heck I wanted him over Barnes. But in this draft, he's 6-10 at best. I'd take Wemby, Scoot, Miller and both Twins over him

[Yallbecrazy]

Suggs be top 3 lmao hell no!!

I would easily favour any of Scoot (especially), Miller or Amen over him. Heck there wouldn't be much that separates Suggs from Cason Wallace for me.

If I was assessing Dyson coming out of the G-League, he doesn't stand out to me anymore than Anthony Black tbh. But also what "proven player"?! That's a very blanket statement without actually presenting what you would consider a likely available trade that would also need to happen this summer as well before their contracts balloon even more.

There also seems to be this weird running misled belief that Pascal or OG would warrant some surefire young star in order to make the trade. When the reality is, if teams feel almost certain whatever young player will be a superstar, guess what?! They're not trading for a player the level of OG or Siakam lol those kinds of prospects are only moved to bring in a true star player. Pascal is wonderful but as his all-star reserve to not making a team at all shows, he's not that. So you have to roll the dice a little in players you believe could be better long term at the heights of their potentials and see at least 2-3 guys at that 3rd pick that could EASILY be better if you got the most out of them.

I don't think you remember the hype around Suggs and the season he put up.
I think he would be getting hype as a top 3-5 player in this draft.

Nah bro, I'm sorry. Suggs had massive hype at the draft, no doubt. Heck I wanted him over Barnes. But in this draft, he's 6-10 at best. I'd take Wemby, Scoot, Miller and both Twins over him

This draft is nowhere near that draft. Very few if anyone had Wagner over Suggs. Wagner is probably 4th in this draft and Kuminga is also anywhere from 4-10.

[Psubs]

Tristan Vukcevic is not a well-known prospect because he plays in Europe, but 21 points in 16 mins today highlights his scoring potential.

This guy is very mobile, can shoot and pass. Not a rim protector at 7 feet, but plays more like a forward like Markkanen. I had him as a lotto pick earlier in the year, but he had a bad ankle injury in Feb. and it took him out for a while. The guy has an obscene handle for a seven footer.

Read on Twitter

A couple of years ago, I posted a lot about a guy that played for Mega Basket and he didn't make it yet. I feel like he's similar.

https://www.euroleaguebasketball.net/euroleague/players/filip-petrusev/011194/

Watch on YouTube

[Dalek]

If Toronto goes more Euro signing Scarliolo to be coach, I'd love to Vukcevic be his pick and roll / pick and pop big. This guy as the stretch C of the future will be fun - loads of upside.

Read on Twitter

[Clutch0z24]

Looking at our roster with GTJR out the door and the question mark of FVV....Our guard play with them 2 gone looks like

Flynn
Banton

Unless we have a way of upgrading our PG spot with a S&T for FVV or we move OG, Or Siakam for an elite guard....I do not see us drafting any other position in this draft at 13 ....Has to be a guard

You can say "Draft best available instead of position" ....Well it just so happens to be that at 13 there are a few guards who would be Best available...

Anthony Black
Cason Wallace

Kobe Bufkin*
Keyonte George*
Nick Smith Jr
Jordan Hawkins
Jalen Hood-Schifino
Rayan Rupert
Sidy Cissoko

This is the list of guards at around 13th ....I would bet one of these players will be a Raptor....Im all in on Bufkin at 13.

[Rapsfan07]

Read on Twitter

?s=20

Can't say I'm surprised. Always though 25+ was too late for him. 15-20 is much more like it.

[Yallbecrazy]

If Toronto goes more Euro signing Scarliolo to be coach, I'd love to Vukcevic be his pick and roll / pick and pop big. This guy as the stretch C of the future will be fun - loads of upside.

Read on Twitter

The team he was up against was hot garbage. It was basically Podziemski, Flagler and a bunch of guys who shouldn't get drafted in the 3rd round if there was one.

Box score link:
https://www.reddit.com/r/NBA_Draft/comments/13kfrbz/box_scores_from_the_2_combine_scrimmages_today/

[WuTang_CMB]

After 2 years of this core, I do hope we make some moves

[PhilBlackson]

I don't think you remember the hype around Suggs and the season he put up.
I think he would be getting hype as a top 3-5 player in this draft.

Nah bro, I'm sorry. Suggs had massive hype at the draft, no doubt. Heck I wanted him over Barnes. But in this draft, he's 6-10 at best. I'd take Wemby, Scoot, Miller and both Twins over him

This draft is nowhere near that draft. Very few if anyone had Wagner over Suggs. Wagner is probably 4th in this draft.

That's based on absolutely nothing lol since we have no idea as yet how good or bad anyone will be but that just flat out sounds silly when Vic absolutely annihilates any prospect in that draft to say this draft is nowhere near that one lol complete joke. Pretty much the entire year all anyone was saying is Scoot goes first in any other draft including the past one with Banchero who completely outplayed any rookie of Scottie's class by putting up near historic rookie numbers and is clearly the better player between him & Wagner.

It's also BECAUSE Vic and Scoot were considered so much higher than prospects from other recent drafts that many of the players after them have been overshadowed. Like I've said multiple times now, I don't forget the hype around Suggs (although seems some have selective memory that as it neared the draft, discussion became is one tier was the top 3 (none of which were considered to be on Vic or Scoot's level), then Suggs, then the field. AGAIN I believe Miller would have been FAR more in the conversation against Cade than Suggs ever actually was considering Miller put up much better numbers than Suggs nearly across the board. And I'm sorry you're not selling me that some short limbed tweener guard with average athleticism would be going ahead of 6'9 lights out shooter who can do so at 3 levels lol and I don't particularily believe he'd be ahead of Amen Thompson either when he does everything Suggs does but is bigger and thousand times more athletic. I guess some bought the Suggs' hype more than others but I definitely would not have put him ahead of Scoot (not in a thousand years lol) or Miller....and again for my liking of upside, I'd go with Amen as well and there's certainly no way of knowing yet who may or may not prove to be better than Wagner, unless you have a crystal ball there's no way of knowing which other prospects surprise just like him.

It also boils down to this, who do you think would go first, Scoot or Suggs if they both declared?!

Because for it's not particularily close, Scoot SMOKES Suggs, I don't believe for one second that if Scoot declared in that same draft that anyone would ever claim that Scoot was in tier just below as Suggs was and guess what?! Miller is challenging Scoot for 2nd, Suggs wouldn't even be close imo.

[Potential]

[Dalek]

Tristan Vukcevic is not a well-known prospect because he plays in Europe, but 21 points in 16 mins today highlights his scoring potential.

This guy is very mobile, can shoot and pass. Not a rim protector at 7 feet, but plays more like a forward like Markkanen. I had him as a lotto pick earlier in the year, but he had a bad ankle injury in Feb. and it took him out for a while. The guy has an obscene handle for a seven footer.

Read on Twitter

A couple of years ago, I posted a lot about a guy that played for Mega Basket and he didn't make it yet. I feel like he's similar.

https://www.euroleaguebasketball.net/euroleague/players/filip-petrusev/011194/

Watch on YouTube

I remember you posting about him. He was the Gonzaga guy who went to Europe and played well in the Adriatic league.

I think Tristan is a different pedigree. He came up through only Europe and played on Real Madrid for a while which is where I saw some of his highlights originally as a 17 year old. He had these guard like skills back then. He isn't just a stretch C but more of a driver with some creativity.

His dad played pro ball for 20 years in the Europe for a lot of good teams and now coaches so he has a strong background.

I don't have a definitive take on this guy, but he has a ton of skill and can play a point-center type of role which is unique. The fact he can just hope overseas and drop 20 points efficiently just shows he has talent.

That said, Sengun was one of the most dominant big man prospects and went 16 in his draft class.

[Psubs]

After 2 years of this core, I do hope we make some moves

Really should've sold on Pascal earlier being a year younger and more term left. I the very least now, the Raptors don't have to give him Supermax. Though even if he was traded, new team wouldn't have to give him that, right?

[XTC]

If Portland is serious about trading the #3 pick to improve the roster, I'd dangle either Pascal or OG.

[Yallbecrazy]

Nah bro, I'm sorry. Suggs had massive hype at the draft, no doubt. Heck I wanted him over Barnes. But in this draft, he's 6-10 at best. I'd take Wemby, Scoot, Miller and both Twins over him

This draft is nowhere near that draft. Very few if anyone had Wagner over Suggs. Wagner is probably 4th in this draft.

That's based on absolutely nothing lol since we have no idea as yet how good or bad anyone will be but that just flat out sounds silly when Vic absolutely annihilates any prospect in that draft to say this draft is nowhere near that one lol complete joke. Pretty much the entire year all anyone was saying is Scoot goes first in any other draft including the past one with Banchero who completely outplayed any rookie of Scottie's class by putting up near historic rookie numbers and is clearly the better player between him & Wagner.

It's also BECAUSE Vic and Scoot were considered so much higher than prospects from other recent drafts that many of the players after them have been overshadowed. Like I've said multiple times now, I don't forget the hype around Suggs (although seems some have selective memory that as it neared the draft, discussion became is one tier was the top 3 (none of which were considered to be on Vic or Scoot's level), then Suggs, then the field. AGAIN I believe Miller would have been FAR more in the conversation against Cade than Suggs ever actually was considering Miller put up much better numbers than Suggs nearly across the board. And I'm sorry you're not selling me that some short limbed tweener guard with average athleticism would be going ahead of 6'9 lights out shooter who can do so at 3 levels lol and I don't particularily believe he'd be ahead of Amen Thompson either when he does everything Suggs does but is bigger and thousand times more athletic. I guess some bought the Suggs' hype more than others but I definitely would not have put him ahead of Scoot (not in a thousand years lol) or Miller....and again for my liking of upside, I'd go with Amen as well and there's certainly no way of knowing yet who may or may not prove to be better than Wagner, unless you have a crystal ball there's no way of knowing which other prospects surprise just like him.

And then Scoot was really bad in the G league, he fell to #3 more than Miller surpassed him. I think Miller would have gone ahead of Suggs, but I don't see anyone else who would have/ should have. Mobley had way better stats than Miller did so he's definitely behind him.

You keep bringing up the twins, but I don’t think they would have gone top 10 in that draft, the only reason they are considered so high is because of the lack of top end guys in this draft.

Miller is valued highly because he's 6'9, a decent athlete with great shooting and good rebounding. His passing is meh, his defense is meh. He also flashes some ability to create his own shot, but by no means is considered to be a shot creator when entering the NBA.

[WuTang_CMB]

After 2 years of this core, I do hope we make some moves

Really should've sold on Pascal earlier being a year younger and more term left. I the very least now, the Raptors don't have to give him Supermax. Though even if he was traded, new team wouldn't have to give him that, right?

he's eligible if he makes all nba next season so incoming team will have to take that into account

[WuTang_CMB]

new thread
viewtopic.php?f=32&t=2291225&p =106322900#p106322900

[HumbleRen]

Suggs goes top 3 in this draft with ease lol. We're talking about prospects, don't let hindsight cloud your judgement.

[Dalek]

Read on Twitter

?s=20

I think Leonard Miller is going to be out of Toronto's range by the end of it. Too much productivity and growth over a short time. I am confident he is a lotto pick. His year over year progression is insane considering he wasn't playing at a high level prep school last year. Guy is a sponge.

I always have him in the lottery due to his motor. I asked earlier (3 months ago?), someone here said the concern is defense as the reason of him being low. I personally think he maybe an average defender, similar to Siakam, so it is not much of a concern.

My biggest concern is his fit, as he demands the ball much with Siakam and Barnes, while all of them need speed and shooting surrounding them, where OG would not be enough, so I have some doubt in roster construction, but I think he is top 10 to me due to star potential.

Personally do think we should draft a good guard.

Miller will be a project because he hasn't played enough organized ball and the G-League doesn't help. He does seem like a high effort guy so I think he can be passable. On ball he can keep up with guys, but he probably isn't ready for NBA processing speed.

I agree the fit in Toronto is bad as the team is constructed. But, I think the roster is going to change this off-season, so it may give him a bench role. At the very least he could slot in for Boucher/Precious if one of those guys is dealt.

Guard-wise I really think Jalen-Hood-Schifino has to be near the top of that board. After Anthony Black, he is the best natural PG and at 6'6 and 215 lbs he has the size that fits Toronto. Him in pick and roll with Poeltl will work, plus he can play offgaurd in a pinch and guard a few positions.

[DreamTeam09]

Who or what does Bilal come ??

I guess the best comp for his size n skillset is Mikal Bridges?? Bilal looks longer/lankier than him tho, but I don't know if the offensive arsenal is quite there like Mikal displayed this year.

[DatHomieYouHaTe]

Suggs goes top 3 in this draft with ease lol. We're talking about prospects, don't let hindsight cloud your judgement.

He's trash as a prospect. He's tiny and can't shoot.. maybe if you listened to the people on this board he'd go top three.. don't do that ever