The Anthony Black Thread

[Skybox]

I dont know why nobody sees that by drafting Black, we raised the importance of Gary Harris. He is the only guard on the roster who can successfuly play next to Black maybe besides Jett Howard.
Cole Anthony is propably second most important due to his 3 point shot and pnr offense.
Quite opposite from we would think before the draft.
We still have free agency to rock the boat. FVV still makes sense next to Black.

Agree to some extent...Gary Harris OR the guy they're about to trade for that shoots like Gary Harris (but more). I'm not betting on this, but I'd say that Harris' re-up will come down to the wire if they're trying to make a deal for a bigger fish at SG. If they're done, absolutely keep Gary Harris, particularly if they think Jett Howard or Suggs IS their high-scoring SG of the future.

I've said before, Harris is a rock solid guy to have on your team, but if he's starting...

[Petre1978]

As I said earlier, I don’t see roster balance as so desirable that I’m willing part with productive players to achieve it. We’d give up tangible assets for…what, exactly? A situation we *presume* will be better? As far as I’m concerned, Coach Mosley should start looking through offensive systems that utilize dual point guards.

Dual point guards?

[tiderulz]

We've seen enough to make a decision and the fact we drafted Black indicates that.

this is what i was thinking. Howard even intimated it. Many thought a Hendricks/SG would be a pretty perfect draft. The fact that they took a PG at #6, tells me that maybe the front office isnt as hot on Fultz as we all thought.

OR maybe our FO just drafts BPA instead of fit? Since Black was in the top5 discussions a lot, maybe he is BPA by the mertics of our FO.

you still have to take a little into account for position. yes, you can take BPA, but if you thought that Fultz was the future no matter what, you shouldnt take another PG.

[RookieStar]

this is what i was thinking. Howard even intimated it. Many thought a Hendricks/SG would be a pretty perfect draft. The fact that they took a PG at #6, tells me that maybe the front office isnt as hot on Fultz as we all thought.

OR maybe our FO just drafts BPA instead of fit? Since Black was in the top5 discussions a lot, maybe he is BPA by the mertics of our FO.

you still have to take a little into account for position. yes, you can take BPA, but if you thought that Fultz was the future no matter what, you shouldnt take another PG.

I somewhat agree....but the good thing is, Black is a multi-position player due to his height and skill, soooo.....

[tiderulz]

OR maybe our FO just drafts BPA instead of fit? Since Black was in the top5 discussions a lot, maybe he is BPA by the mertics of our FO.

you still have to take a little into account for position. yes, you can take BPA, but if you thought that Fultz was the future no matter what, you shouldnt take another PG.

I somewhat agree....but the good thing is, Black is a multi-position player due to his height and skill, soooo.....

i would say more height. his skill is bad shooting PG, but the defense should hopefully carry over to different positions. I wish he was longer, but 6'7 height and 6'7.5 reach wont do him extra favors

[Nyce_1]

this is what i was thinking. Howard even intimated it. Many thought a Hendricks/SG would be a pretty perfect draft. The fact that they took a PG at #6, tells me that maybe the front office isnt as hot on Fultz as we all thought.

OR maybe our FO just drafts BPA instead of fit? Since Black was in the top5 discussions a lot, maybe he is BPA by the mertics of our FO.

you still have to take a little into account for position. yes, you can take BPA, but if you thought that Fultz was the future no matter what, you shouldnt take another PG.

What if they still see Fultz as a combo-guard. Then drafting a PG is fine.

[89Magicfan]

What if Black wasn’t the guy they were shooting for?

[tiderulz]

OR maybe our FO just drafts BPA instead of fit? Since Black was in the top5 discussions a lot, maybe he is BPA by the mertics of our FO.

you still have to take a little into account for position. yes, you can take BPA, but if you thought that Fultz was the future no matter what, you shouldnt take another PG.

What if they still see Fultz as a combo-guard. Then drafting a PG is fine.

did anyone ever see him as a combo guard?

[RookieStar]

you still have to take a little into account for position. yes, you can take BPA, but if you thought that Fultz was the future no matter what, you shouldnt take another PG.

I somewhat agree....but the good thing is, Black is a multi-position player due to his height and skill, soooo.....

i would say more height. his skill is bad shooting PG, but the defense should hopefully carry over to different positions. I wish he was longer, but 6'7 height and 6'7.5 reach wont do him extra favors

skill is... ballhandling defense and BBIQ... so yeah, we could play him in "weird for everybody but us" lineups

[RookieStar]

you still have to take a little into account for position. yes, you can take BPA, but if you thought that Fultz was the future no matter what, you shouldnt take another PG.

What if they still see Fultz as a combo-guard. Then drafting a PG is fine.

did anyone ever see him as a combo guard?

I saw him as having a floor of MCW.. he is a combo-guard right?

[fendilim]

What team have been interested in Fultz recently?

[eyriq]

I get the logic.

1. Current pay is a baseline for future pay
2. Cole is "proven" as the combo guard off the bench
3. Fultz has more unknowns around fit

It's an interesting case. The one thing that gives me pause is Fultz's upside relative to Cole. I think Fultz has more upside, for various reasons.

Agree completely however Fultz’s upside is too similar and is now trumped by Black. Cole is proven to be the perfect 6th man/backup PG. The Black/Cole PG rotation seems perfect to move forward with. No issues.

Making evaluations like this without seeing a player on the court is silly and could be the kind of move that keeps us trapped as a play-in team if the move doesn’t work.

There’s no rush to make a move. Let’s see what Black’s game looks like on an NBA court before we make plans to clear a path for him by moving other guys.

If we moved Fultz and started Black we’d likely be back in the lottery and knowing this board people would be screaming for us to draft a PG who can shoot to replace Black already.

How much of a drop off is there from Fultz to Black? I've wondered this. I personally have Fultz as the 25th best PG in the league. There are no rookies or sophomores ahead of him, and only three juniors: Immanuel Quickley, LaMelo Ball, and Tyrese Haliburton.

We also know that rookies for the most part struggle to make an impact on winning basketball. But here is a list of rookie PG's that I'd rank ahead of Fultz since 1998.

Ben Simmons
Chris Paul
Brevin Knight
Steve Francis
Stephen Curry
Kyrie Irving
Andre Miller
Lonzo Ball
Brandon Jennings
Damian Lillard
Dwayne Wade
LaMelo Ball
Ricky Rubio
Ja Morant
Kirk Hinrich
John Wall

Does Anthony Black belong on this list?

[Nyce_1]

you still have to take a little into account for position. yes, you can take BPA, but if you thought that Fultz was the future no matter what, you shouldnt take another PG.

What if they still see Fultz as a combo-guard. Then drafting a PG is fine.

did anyone ever see him as a combo guard?

Yeah, Matt Lloyd did a podcast years ago (pod squad) and said the FO views Markelle as a combo-guard. Always stuck in my mind.

Idk if that viewpoint has changed.

[fendilim]

What if they still see Fultz as a combo-guard. Then drafting a PG is fine.

did anyone ever see him as a combo guard?

Yeah, Matt Lloyd did a podcast years ago (pod squad) and said the FO views Markelle as a combo-guard. Always stuck in my mind.

Idk if that viewpoint has changed.

Maybe the fact that he is the best playmaker amongst our guards?

[Knightro]

What if Black wasn’t the guy they were shooting for?

Then they shouldn’t have picked him?

[Bensational]

Agree completely however Fultz’s upside is too similar and is now trumped by Black. Cole is proven to be the perfect 6th man/backup PG. The Black/Cole PG rotation seems perfect to move forward with. No issues.

Making evaluations like this without seeing a player on the court is silly and could be the kind of move that keeps us trapped as a play-in team if the move doesn’t work.

There’s no rush to make a move. Let’s see what Black’s game looks like on an NBA court before we make plans to clear a path for him by moving other guys.

If we moved Fultz and started Black we’d likely be back in the lottery and knowing this board people would be screaming for us to draft a PG who can shoot to replace Black already.

How much of a drop off is there from Fultz to Black? I've wondered this. I personally have Fultz as the 25th best PG in the league. There are no rookies or sophomores ahead of him, and only three juniors: Immanuel Quickley, LaMelo Ball, and Tyrese Haliburton.

We also know that rookies for the most part struggle to make an impact on winning basketball. But here is a list of rookie PG's that I'd rank ahead of Fultz since 1998.

Ben Simmons
Chris Paul
Brevin Knight
Steve Francis
Stephen Curry
Kyrie Irving
Andre Miller
Lonzo Ball
Brandon Jennings
Damian Lillard
Dwayne Wade
LaMelo Ball
Ricky Rubio
Ja Morant
Kirk Hinrich
John Wall

Does Anthony Black belong on this list?

Not sure I agree with that list. Individually some had better statistical seasons but worse team results, some worse stats and team results (Lonzo).

I personally don’t think Black will be an early high achiever. He might rack up some assists and stocks but I think he’ll struggle scoring. That’s just the low bar I’m setting for his rookie season not his career though.

[89Magicfan]

What if Black wasn’t the guy they were shooting for?

Then they shouldn’t have picked him?

What if their guy was already taken and they couldn’t get a deal done so they went with BPA but still, wasn’t their guy?

[eyriq]

Making evaluations like this without seeing a player on the court is silly and could be the kind of move that keeps us trapped as a play-in team if the move doesn’t work.

There’s no rush to make a move. Let’s see what Black’s game looks like on an NBA court before we make plans to clear a path for him by moving other guys.

If we moved Fultz and started Black we’d likely be back in the lottery and knowing this board people would be screaming for us to draft a PG who can shoot to replace Black already.

How much of a drop off is there from Fultz to Black? I've wondered this. I personally have Fultz as the 25th best PG in the league. There are no rookies or sophomores ahead of him, and only three juniors: Immanuel Quickley, LaMelo Ball, and Tyrese Haliburton.

We also know that rookies for the most part struggle to make an impact on winning basketball. But here is a list of rookie PG's that I'd rank ahead of Fultz since 1998.

Ben Simmons
Chris Paul
Brevin Knight
Steve Francis
Stephen Curry
Kyrie Irving
Andre Miller
Lonzo Ball
Brandon Jennings
Damian Lillard
Dwayne Wade
LaMelo Ball
Ricky Rubio
Ja Morant
Kirk Hinrich
John Wall

Does Anthony Black belong on this list?

Not sure I agree with that list. Individually some had better statistical seasons but worse team results, some worse stats and team results (Lonzo).

I personally don’t think Black will be an early high achiever. He might rack up some assists and stocks but I think he’ll struggle scoring. That’s just the low bar I’m setting for his rookie season not his career though.

I binged watched some of Blacks games on 2x speed, quite fascinating watching him buzz up and down the court, guarding the point guard, switching onto anyone, attacking the basket with a knack of getting to the line, zipping the ball around to the right player, creating havoc on defense, pointing and talking on defense like a maestro. I love his game.

[Knightro]

What if Black wasn’t the guy they were shooting for?

Then they shouldn’t have picked him?

What if they’re guy was already taken and they couldn’t get a deal done so they went with BPA but still, wasn’t their guy?

Then they shouldn’t have picked him?

In all seriousness, a straight “take the best player available no matter what” is a fine draft strategy assuming it is accompanied by an understanding that trades and free agency is how the roster will be balanced.

Without that follow up, you end up with young players who aren’t being put in a premium position for their development.

[Black and Blue]

Then they shouldn’t have picked him?

What if they’re guy was already taken and they couldn’t get a deal done so they went with BPA but still, wasn’t their guy?

Then they shouldn’t have picked him?

In all seriousness, a straight “take the best player available no matter what” is a fine draft strategy assuming it is accompanied by an understanding that trades and free agency is how the roster will be balanced.

Without that follow up, you end up with young players who aren’t being put in a premium position for their development.

I think it’s a safe assumption based on their picks they were targeting guards in this draft, which makes sense given how set they are at SF, PF, and C. Unfortunately picks 2-5 (since Miller could have played SG) right before them were guards as well. We will likely never know how they valued picks 2-5 relative to Black, but they had their pick of players after them and STILL took a guard.

When Paolo tweeted “I see the vision” after the pick, I think from his perspective he was seeing the front office’s number 1 priority this off-season as upgrading the guard slots from every single conceivable angle.