Haynes: Damian Lillard Requests Trade

[wegotthabeet]

We’re not trading Scottie for Lillard you casuals.

thank god someone else said this so i didn't have to.

[StopitLeo]

Adding a 3rd team will be tricky if Portland doesn't want Herro and or Lowry can be redirected but I can't fathom what team that would be. Herro's a 20/5/4 guy with great splits. We know that Masai tried to get him before and our offense can get stagnant. I'm a HUGE OG fan and OG wants more of an offensive role and ballhandling, as he's again putting that out there - I just don't think that's for him and I actually think he wants to go. Trade defense that's expiring for offense/ballhandling that the Raptors need that's locked in for 4 years. I just worry about moving a top 5 defensive player, steals leader and potential DPOY candidate - but Id hate to lose him for nothing next offseason.

Portland out - Dame
Portland in - OG, Lowry, 2 frps, 3 swaps
TO out - OG, OPJ
TO in - Herro
Heat out - Lowry, Herro, 2 frps, 3 swaps
Heat in - Lillard, OPJ

Miami gets: Lillard
Toronto gets: Butler
Portland gets: OG, Boucher, Thad, and picks/swaps

[T_saurus]

I think raptors could have a chance to get Lillard.

But the cost would be Scottie and picks. The blazers would be under going a youth movement so I think giving up Scottie would put raptors ahead of Miami or Brooklyn. Miami assets are meh and Brooklyn has a lot of weak picks so I think raptors could offer better value for a youth movement with a blue chip in Scottie.

The question is if Masai would want to risk it all in this move. Lillard probably good for 2 more years and together with Siakam, puertle and OG, is it enough to win the East much less a championship?

[RapsFanInOhio]

After what he's meant to that team and city, they would be crucified by players/agents/media if they sent him anywhere other than Miami. We could offer Siakam, OG, Barnes, GTJ and Dick and if Dame says no to Toronto, then that trade isn't happening. Rightly or wrongly, that is the NBA now.

No it isn’t. Dame has no leverage here - he doesn’t have a NTC. Beal could dictate where he went because of that but Dame doesn’t have it and he’s locked into a deal, so he’s going where the Blazers trade him.

Teams try to accommodate player requests and Dame hasn’t been a headache for them so they’ll definitely work with him. But they could also just.. not trade him. Guys threaten to sit out all the time but it never happens.

[JRoy]

Adding a 3rd team will be tricky if Portland doesn't want Herro and or Lowry can be redirected but I can't fathom what team that would be. Herro's a 20/5/4 guy with great splits. We know that Masai tried to get him before and our offense can get stagnant. I'm a HUGE OG fan and OG wants more of an offensive role and ballhandling, as he's again putting that out there - I just don't think that's for him and I actually think he wants to go. Trade defense that's expiring for offense/ballhandling that the Raptors need that's locked in for 4 years. I just worry about moving a top 5 defensive player, steals leader and potential DPOY candidate - but Id hate to lose him for nothing next offseason.

Portland out - Dame
Portland in - OG, Lowry, 2 frps, 3 swaps
TO out - OG, OPJ
TO in - Herro
Heat out - Lowry, Herro, 2 frps, 3 swaps
Heat in - Lillard, OPJ

Miami gets: Lillard
Toronto gets: Butler
Portland gets: OG, Boucher, Thad, and picks/swaps

The whole point of going to MIA is to join Butler.

[raptor jesus]

I was on board with trading Scottie for KD before last season. Trading Scottie for Lillard... not interested. Great player, but not superstar level like KD, turning 33 in a couple weeks. Meh.

[JRoy]

Do you think Portland would value OG over Scottie? So if the Og was the centerpiece of a trade over OG. I think raps can put together a better package than the heat or nets.

Absolutely not.

[MiamiSPX]

After what he's meant to that team and city, they would be crucified by players/agents/media if they sent him anywhere other than Miami. We could offer Siakam, OG, Barnes, GTJ and Dick and if Dame says no to Toronto, then that trade isn't happening. Rightly or wrongly, that is the NBA now.

No it isn’t. Dame has no leverage here - he doesn’t have a NTC. Beal could dictate where he went because of that but Dame doesn’t have it and he’s locked into a deal, so he’s going where the Blazers trade him.

Teams try to accommodate player requests and Dame hasn’t been a headache for them so they’ll definitely work with him. But they could also just.. not trade him. Guys threaten to sit out all the time but it never happens.

I disagree. We will know soon enough but I will bet you anything he goes to Miami. And that will be the 5th or 6th consecutive star that asks out AND picked his team.

[Los_29]

I'm sorry what? The Dubs never tanked?

* 2008-09 They went 29-53, got the 7th pick and got Curry. This season they lost big contributors from the previous seasons run to the playoffs, either from free agency (notably their franchise player Baron Davis), trades, or injuries. And ultimately they replaced their GM.
* 2009-10 They went 26-56, got the 6th pick and (stupidly) picked Ekpe Udoh. Then traded more players away, notably Jax.
* 2010-11 They went 36-46, got the 11th pick and got Klay. Traded a lotto pick (Randolph 14th) for David Lee.
* 2011-12 They went 23-43, got the 7th pick and got Barnes. Also drafted Draymond with the 35th, a second that they traded for. Injuries and the lockout derailed this season. Traded their team leader Ellis, Kwame, and Udoh (6th pick) to get Bogut.
* 2012-13 They went 47-35, and the rest is history.

Bad records, trading away or losing key players (Davis) to FA, drafting promising young talent, and trading for more players (Lee and Bogut) that will fit around the new talent. They used 5 lotto picks to either directly draft their future championship core (Steph/Klay) or starters (Barnes), traded for players to continue rebuilding (Randolph 14th OA, Udoh 6th OA) by using those lotto picks, and traded major core pieces (Ellis).

Sure looks a lot like a rebuild to me.

I'd rather not have to spend this effort breaking down the other bad examples you provided. No the bucks didn't tank explicitly, but they also used a non lotto pick to draft arguably one of, if not THE greatest PF of all time. And then the Nuggets drafted again, one of, if not THE greatest center of all time with a random SRP, and then multiple lotto picks.

So yeah, if your "other options" are you draft generational talents and once in a lifetime players using mid firsts and late seconds, sure lets go ahead and put all our chips behind that. Instead of the much much much higher chance of using high lotto picks.

I doubt the warriors tanked by purpose. they were just bad for several years with bad management.

Or, maybe READ the post and how I clearly outlined massive events that moved them to tank. Davis leaving in FA, major injuries, trading lotto picks for established players to start rebuilding the roster. Like god damn dude, read it.

Bad management tends to get a team mired in mediocrity, look no further than BC. He was a bad GM, and in his tenure we went :

* 41-41
* 33-49
* 40-42
* 22-60
* 23-43
* 34-48

Multiple mediocre seasons that resulted in eventually really bad teams. Bad management doesn't make you a bottom feeder over night. The dubs were 48-34 the year before they lost Davis and had injuries. They were just smart enough to see those signs and lean into the rebuild. You know instead of trade away FRPs to end up .500 and try your hardest to bring back a mediocre guard to run back another mid season.

Sometimes it's not about what you do, it's about what you don't do.

They never tanked, they were just bad. The year in which they got Curry they had guys like Jackson, Biedrins, Maggette and Monta. The year before that they won 48 games with essentially the same roster minus Baron Davis. No one will argue that they were a poorly constructed team. But you can't say they had the goal of tanking prior to the beginning of the season. They kept a lot of those mediocre guys around the team for a long time. In fact, Monta didn't even get traded until like 2012.

[kirkwood]

Raptors could have had Durant and passed, if they don’t want to rebuild they should be going balls deep to get Lillard and stick it to FVV

[Mattatron]

Do you think Portland would value OG over Scottie? So if the Og was the centerpiece of a trade over OG. I think raps can put together a better package than the heat or nets.

Absolutely not.

Imagine declining OG for #7 last year but accepting og for Lillard lmaooo

[Nebuchadnezzar]

After what he's meant to that team and city, they would be crucified by players/agents/media if they sent him anywhere other than Miami. We could offer Siakam, OG, Barnes, GTJ and Dick and if Dame says no to Toronto, then that trade isn't happening. Rightly or wrongly, that is the NBA now.

I think Masai has shown he does not give an F what the rest of the league or fans thinks. From trading away demar when he got flack, to trading for Kawhi when many said he wouldn't play in TO, to not tanking when the whole world wanted him to. He refused to sell his players for bit parts when that's what everyone was doing - with the exception of Darell Morey who also didn't budge.. He was a pioneer in asset accumulation for trades as an approach, and now that's what teams do.

Masai doesn't care about your new NBA, and he'd work with Portland on a Dame trade by helping them manage their poor optics by giving them the playbook for how the team handled the Demar/Kawhi situation.

[MiamiSPX]

After what he's meant to that team and city, they would be crucified by players/agents/media if they sent him anywhere other than Miami. We could offer Siakam, OG, Barnes, GTJ and Dick and if Dame says no to Toronto, then that trade isn't happening. Rightly or wrongly, that is the NBA now.

I think Masai has shown he does not give an F what the rest of the league or fans thinks. From trading away demar when he got flack, to trading for Kawhi when many said he wouldn't play in TO, to not tanking when the whole world wanted him to. He refused to sell his players for bit parts when that's what everyone was doing - with the exception of Darell Morey who also didn't budge.. He was a pioneer in asset accumulation for trades as an approach, and now that's what teams do.

Masai doesn't care about your new NBA, and he'd work with Portland on a Dame trade by helping them manage their poor optics by giving them the playbook for how the team handled the Demar/Kawhi situation.

Lol ok. Let's completely ignore the fact that Kawhi had no leverage and the team trading him now hated him.

[2019nbachamps]

I hope the next Cba has a provision on players asking out. Guys like KD, Harden, Dame, PG sign max deals and then want out within 1 year. It’s a joke. Impossible for teams to plan ahead. If players want flexibility they shouldn’t resign and do whatever they please in free agency.

[RapsFanInOhio]

After what he's meant to that team and city, they would be crucified by players/agents/media if they sent him anywhere other than Miami. We could offer Siakam, OG, Barnes, GTJ and Dick and if Dame says no to Toronto, then that trade isn't happening. Rightly or wrongly, that is the NBA now.

No it isn’t. Dame has no leverage here - he doesn’t have a NTC. Beal could dictate where he went because of that but Dame doesn’t have it and he’s locked into a deal, so he’s going where the Blazers trade him.

Teams try to accommodate player requests and Dame hasn’t been a headache for them so they’ll definitely work with him. But they could also just.. not trade him. Guys threaten to sit out all the time but it never happens.

I disagree. We will know soon enough but I will bet you anything he goes to Miami. And that will be the 5th or 6th consecutive star that asks out AND picked his team.

I also think he probably ends up with Miami because Miami has the assets to get him (Herro, contracts, 1sts). That said, who are the 5-6 stars you’re talking about picking their teams excluding Beal? KD may be one, but Brooklyn got a haul. Who else? Not attacking, just trying to remember and drawing a blank.

[mihaic]

Do you think Portland would value OG over Scottie? So if the Og was the centerpiece of a trade over OG. I think raps can put together a better package than the heat or nets.

Absolutely not.

36M filler (Thad, Boucher, Porter, Flynn, Trent, etc) plus all our picks and/or swaps (assuming renounce 2024, means 3x 1sts + swaps)
I think that's probably gonna beat the best you will get.

Won't happen though. Realistically, Dame will pick his destination (i.e. not Toronto, none of the teams with good picks/prospects) and in the process he will screw the Blazers org. You will likely get Lowry, Herro and 2 picks (late 20s) and 3 seconds, and Riley's greetings

BTW I think Dame intentionally and purposely wait it out, to make sure all FA money are gone and PDX has less options.
Sorry JRoy, your team deserved better.

Edit: I mean they should have traded him a week ago.

[Scase]

After what he's meant to that team and city, they would be crucified by players/agents/media if they sent him anywhere other than Miami. We could offer Siakam, OG, Barnes, GTJ and Dick and if Dame says no to Toronto, then that trade isn't happening. Rightly or wrongly, that is the NBA now.

I think Masai has shown he does not give an F what the rest of the league or fans thinks. From trading away demar when he got flack, to trading for Kawhi when many said he wouldn't play in TO, to not tanking when the whole world wanted him to. He refused to sell his players for bit parts when that's what everyone was doing - with the exception of Darell Morey who also didn't budge.. He was a pioneer in asset accumulation for trades as an approach, and now that's what teams do.

Masai doesn't care about your new NBA, and he'd work with Portland on a Dame trade by helping them manage their poor optics by giving them the playbook for how the team handled the Demar/Kawhi situation.

Are you pretending that trading assets for a disgruntled star is something new that only Masai pioneered? Dude did nothing special, he built a team that was flaming out every playoff series for years, then pounced on a disgruntled star. Kudos for the timing and making it work, but this isn't some new concept. It just worked out.

Give him roses for things working out, but can we stop acting like he's the smartest man in NBA history, holy ****.

[HumbleRen]

If Masai doesn’t want to rebuild, trade Scottie for Dame.

I have 0 confidence in this FO to build around Scottie in time.

[Scase]

I doubt the warriors tanked by purpose. they were just bad for several years with bad management.

Or, maybe READ the post and how I clearly outlined massive events that moved them to tank. Davis leaving in FA, major injuries, trading lotto picks for established players to start rebuilding the roster. Like god damn dude, read it.

Bad management tends to get a team mired in mediocrity, look no further than BC. He was a bad GM, and in his tenure we went :

* 41-41
* 33-49
* 40-42
* 22-60
* 23-43
* 34-48

Multiple mediocre seasons that resulted in eventually really bad teams. Bad management doesn't make you a bottom feeder over night. The dubs were 48-34 the year before they lost Davis and had injuries. They were just smart enough to see those signs and lean into the rebuild. You know instead of trade away FRPs to end up .500 and try your hardest to bring back a mediocre guard to run back another mid season.

Sometimes it's not about what you do, it's about what you don't do.

They never tanked, they were just bad. The year in which they got Curry they had guys like Jackson, Biedrins, Maggette and Monta. The year before that they won 48 games with essentially the same roster minus Baron Davis. No one will argue that they were a poorly constructed team. But you can't say they had the goal of tanking prior to the beginning of the season. They kept a lot of those mediocre guys around the team for a long time. In fact, Monta didn't even get traded until like 2012.

4 seasons in a row they were horrible to bad. But yeah, all just coincidence. How people can quote a post, and respond to it, while ignoring the entire body of the post, just blows my mind.

They did not CHOOSE the first year, Davis and injuries made it happen. They CHOSE to lean into it the following 2-3 years cause they were smart enough to know when to stop forcing a square peg into a round hole.

[mihaic]

After what he's meant to that team and city, they would be crucified by players/agents/media if they sent him anywhere other than Miami. We could offer Siakam, OG, Barnes, GTJ and Dick and if Dame says no to Toronto, then that trade isn't happening. Rightly or wrongly, that is the NBA now.

I think Masai has shown he does not give an F what the rest of the league or fans thinks. From trading away demar when he got flack, to trading for Kawhi when many said he wouldn't play in TO, to not tanking when the whole world wanted him to. He refused to sell his players for bit parts when that's what everyone was doing - with the exception of Darell Morey who also didn't budge.. He was a pioneer in asset accumulation for trades as an approach, and now that's what teams do.

Masai doesn't care about your new NBA, and he'd work with Portland on a Dame trade by helping them manage their poor optics by giving them the playbook for how the team handled the Demar/Kawhi situation.

Are you pretending that trading assets for a disgruntled star is something new that only Masai pioneered? Dude did nothing special, he built a team that was flaming out every playoff series for years, then pounced on a disgruntled star. Kudos for the timing and making it work, but this isn't some new concept. It just worked out.

Give him roses for things working out, but can we stop acting like he's the smartest man in NBA history, holy ****.

TBH I can't remember last small market or Canadian team that did that, if any. I could be wrong, but it's probably not common (Kawhi was arguably top 3 in NBA at that time).