Old man MJ vs Old man Lebron

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Jaivl
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Re: Old man MJ vs Old man Lebron 

Post#101 » by Jaivl » Fri Aug 18, 2023 7:12 am

lessthanjake wrote:
ShaqAttac wrote:
falcolombardi wrote:Using different metrics for players then comparing them is pretty bonkers

Is the minimum expected to actually make sure a comparision of two players on a specific stat is the same stat

if a 6 game sample is already showing difference in results that makes the bigger less sample -more- likely to keep differing, not less

comparin career stuff to short stuff when a dude is already winning with longer stuff is also pretty sus.

also look to me mj squad making up numbers again. i thought the 86 rox thread woulda been the end of it, but they really have no shame


Umm, the data I provided goes year by year and provides the data we have, so I don’t know what you’re talking about. And it’s worth noting that in the years where it’s only a portion of the year (i.e. the Squared stuff), the Bulls actually did *worse* in the sampled data than in the full seasons. So, if anything, the data as presented is biased in favor of games where the Bulls were winning less.

Meanwhile, the only “career” stuff I included was a career playoff number, but the data set includes over 90% of Jordan’s playoff games, so it’s by no means “short stuff.”

Also, stop trying to stir things up. You appear to think a substantial portion of your role on the forum is to make snide posts referencing past discussions and suggesting that someone in the current discussion was wrong in those past discussions. It’s something you consistently do, and often in posts that have virtually no other content. That’s not productive posting in any way, and it needs to stop.

And that seems to happen exclusively on "anti-LeBron" (pro-Jordan, Durant, Curry, etc) arguments, if I may add.
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Re: Old man MJ vs Old man Lebron 

Post#102 » by spree8 » Fri Aug 18, 2023 8:21 am

Colbinii wrote:
atlantabbq99 wrote:MJ at age 38 shot 41% and Lebron at age 38 shot 52%

Lebron is clearly the better player late in his career, but does this matter in the overall GOAT debate?


It does matter to some.

There are three major groups and this isn't exact but an easy way to look at things.

Group 1: Jordan is the GOAT. He will always be my GOAT. Just look at Wade's comments recently about Jordan being "his GOAT".

No amount of statistical evidence, film study, or deeper understanding of basketball will ever change someone with this mentality.

Group 2: LeBron passed Jordan in 2018 or 2020. He surpassed Jordan, rivalled his Peak/Prime but played much longer at near-Peak levels.

This group tends to look at all the statistical evidence laid out, follows the evolution of the NBA over the years, and it open to the idea that there could be a new GOAT in 20-30 years who surpasses LeBron.

Group 3: LeBron is the GOAT. He will always be my GOAT. He is my generation's Jordan.

See reasoning for Group 1.

I don't see anyone who seriously had Jordan ahead of LeBron only for 2022 or 2023 to be the nail-in-the-coffin for the debate or the evidence needed for LeBron to supplant Jordan.



Wow lol, this is pretty troll worthy. Be better

Wow, tremendous irony. I'll leave it at that given the thread has already been locked for escalating derailing/bad behaviour. trex
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Re: Old man MJ vs Old man Lebron 

Post#103 » by ShaqAttac » Fri Aug 18, 2023 8:58 am

Jaivl wrote:
lessthanjake wrote:
ShaqAttac wrote:comparin career stuff to short stuff when a dude is already winning with longer stuff is also pretty sus.

also look to me mj squad making up numbers again. i thought the 86 rox thread woulda been the end of it, but they really have no shame


Umm, the data I provided goes year by year and provides the data we have, so I don’t know what you’re talking about. And it’s worth noting that in the years where it’s only a portion of the year (i.e. the Squared stuff), the Bulls actually did *worse* in the sampled data than in the full seasons. So, if anything, the data as presented is biased in favor of games where the Bulls were winning less.

Meanwhile, the only “career” stuff I included was a career playoff number, but the data set includes over 90% of Jordan’s playoff games, so it’s by no means “short stuff.”

Also, stop trying to stir things up. You appear to think a substantial portion of your role on the forum is to make snide posts referencing past discussions and suggesting that someone in the current discussion was wrong in those past discussions. It’s something you consistently do, and often in posts that have virtually no other content. That’s not productive posting in any way, and it needs to stop.

And that seems to happen exclusively on "anti-LeBron" (pro-Jordan, Durant, Curry, etc) arguments, if I may add.

Idk, seems to me like ur making something up

u also definitely didnt just call me snide defending ltj...

aint i supposed to be a shitposter who cant read?
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Re: Old man MJ vs Old man Lebron 

Post#104 » by ShaqAttac » Fri Aug 18, 2023 9:01 am

spree8 wrote:
Colbinii wrote:
atlantabbq99 wrote:MJ at age 38 shot 41% and Lebron at age 38 shot 52%

Lebron is clearly the better player late in his career, but does this matter in the overall GOAT debate?


It does matter to some.

There are three major groups and this isn't exact but an easy way to look at things.

Group 1: Jordan is the GOAT. He will always be my GOAT. Just look at Wade's comments recently about Jordan being "his GOAT".

No amount of statistical evidence, film study, or deeper understanding of basketball will ever change someone with this mentality.

Group 2: LeBron passed Jordan in 2018 or 2020. He surpassed Jordan, rivalled his Peak/Prime but played much longer at near-Peak levels.

This group tends to look at all the statistical evidence laid out, follows the evolution of the NBA over the years, and it open to the idea that there could be a new GOAT in 20-30 years who surpasses LeBron.

Group 3: LeBron is the GOAT. He will always be my GOAT. He is my generation's Jordan.

See reasoning for Group 1.

I don't see anyone who seriously had Jordan ahead of LeBron only for 2022 or 2023 to be the nail-in-the-coffin for the debate or the evidence needed for LeBron to supplant Jordan.



Wow lol, this is pretty troll worthy. Be better

didnt u get a thread locked by accusing everyone of not knowin how stats work coz your eyetest disagreed
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Re: Old man MJ vs Old man Lebron 

Post#105 » by spree8 » Fri Aug 18, 2023 9:17 am

ShaqAttac wrote:
spree8 wrote:
Colbinii wrote:
It does matter to some.

There are three major groups and this isn't exact but an easy way to look at things.

Group 1: Jordan is the GOAT. He will always be my GOAT. Just look at Wade's comments recently about Jordan being "his GOAT".

No amount of statistical evidence, film study, or deeper understanding of basketball will ever change someone with this mentality.

Group 2: LeBron passed Jordan in 2018 or 2020. He surpassed Jordan, rivalled his Peak/Prime but played much longer at near-Peak levels.

This group tends to look at all the statistical evidence laid out, follows the evolution of the NBA over the years, and it open to the idea that there could be a new GOAT in 20-30 years who surpasses LeBron.

Group 3: LeBron is the GOAT. He will always be my GOAT. He is my generation's Jordan.

See reasoning for Group 1.

I don't see anyone who seriously had Jordan ahead of LeBron only for 2022 or 2023 to be the nail-in-the-coffin for the debate or the evidence needed for LeBron to supplant Jordan.



Wow lol, this is pretty troll worthy. Be better

didnt u get a thread locked by accusing everyone of not knowin how stats work coz your eyetest disagreed



Lol your memory of what happened is almost as bad as the grammar displayed in this post. But I’m flattered I’ve taken up that much real estate in your bank.
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Re: Old man MJ vs Old man Lebron 

Post#106 » by ShaqAttac » Fri Aug 18, 2023 9:20 am

spree8 wrote:
ShaqAttac wrote:
spree8 wrote:

Wow lol, this is pretty troll worthy. Be better

didnt u get a thread locked by accusing everyone of not knowin how stats work coz your eyetest disagreed



Lol your memory of what happened is almost as bad as the grammar displayed in this post. But I’m flattered I’ve taken up that much real estate in your bank.

u took up a sentence
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Re: Old man MJ vs Old man Lebron 

Post#107 » by spree8 » Fri Aug 18, 2023 9:39 am

ShaqAttac wrote:
spree8 wrote:
ShaqAttac wrote:didnt u get a thread locked by accusing everyone of not knowin how stats work coz your eyetest disagreed



Lol your memory of what happened is almost as bad as the grammar displayed in this post. But I’m flattered I’ve taken up that much real estate in your bank.

u took up a sentence



Lol your memory bank dude (past not present). What you brought up happened so long ago that I’m flattered I had such a profound impact on you. The grammar tho… be better
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Re: Old man MJ vs Old man Lebron 

Post#108 » by Colbinii » Fri Aug 18, 2023 1:08 pm

spree8 wrote:
ShaqAttac wrote:
spree8 wrote:

Lol your memory of what happened is almost as bad as the grammar displayed in this post. But I’m flattered I’ve taken up that much real estate in your bank.

u took up a sentence



Lol your memory bank dude (past not present). What you brought up happened so long ago that I’m flattered I had such a profound impact on you. The grammar tho… be better


You shouldn't be making fun of someone's Grammar. You don't know where they are from, what languages they speak, where and how they grew up or what education level they have.

The irony of someone being a huge New York fan [I assume you have been to New York] and making fun of someone's Grammar isn't just comical--it's cruel.
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Re: Old man MJ vs Old man Lebron 

Post#109 » by spree8 » Fri Aug 18, 2023 2:44 pm

Colbinii wrote:
spree8 wrote:
ShaqAttac wrote:u took up a sentence



Lol your memory bank dude (past not present). What you brought up happened so long ago that I’m flattered I had such a profound impact on you. The grammar tho… be better


You shouldn't be making fun of someone's Grammar. You don't know where they are from, what languages they speak, where and how they grew up or what education level they have.

The irony of someone being a huge New York fan [I assume you have been to New York] and making fun of someone's Grammar isn't just comical--it's cruel.



Cut the bs and stop derailing the thread with another troll post. Don’t tell me the guy doesn’t know how to spell “you” instead of “u” or “knowing” instead of “knowin” or “because” instead of “coz”. That’s English texting slang dude, grow up. Also don’t know what NY has to do with it, but I’m not from there so I’m not even offended if that was your intention.

Back on topic…

Old man Jordan obviously isn’t as good as old man LeBron because he was out of the league a few years, which matters. Not to mention he was on a completely new (and weak) team. I don’t know how or why anyone would say they weigh that stint much at all when comparing careers.

Your generalization of people who think Jordan is better is funny, but also not taken seriously. LeBron has a better overall career no doubt, but at their peak, Jordan’s the better player.
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Re: Old man MJ vs Old man Lebron 

Post#110 » by penbeast0 » Fri Aug 18, 2023 3:59 pm

Obviously I am closing this because of the amount of personal attacks being thrown around. If I have the patience (I am a teacher and school is just opening), I will go back and deal with warnings, suspensions, and possible board bans.
“Most people use statistics like a drunk man uses a lamppost; more for support than illumination,” Andrew Lang.

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