[Shams] Raptors expected to have interest in Lavine

[bballsparkin]

OG was out back then when it mattered

Id argue Pascal and Barnes are more dynamic then Pascal and Ibaka and will continue to become more. Gasol obvi more the Poeltl with one on one D and passing but he's not needed in a smaller lineups anyway. Gasols minutes were also used in matchup driven scenarios. Really not much of a drop in bigs here, Pascal is more skilled now and Scottie has a bigger upside then Ibaka

My point was some make it seem like Pascal takes up space for Lavine, yet thats proven false. Ridiculous actually.

Schroeder
Lavine
OG
Scottie
Pascal / Poeltl

Is a very nice lineup with players that can play multiple positions to open things up in the right matchups.

That team looks expensive. I don't pay the bill so not my concern. How many FRP's need to go Chicago's way is my question? Especially with the 2024 FRP already owed. I'm not a huge LaVine fan and his injury risk concerns me. If he bought in defensively he could be a good fit.

I don't like it; but it's something and could be fun to watch.

[Scase]

How come Kawai never had an issue with Siakam on the floor?

Y'all on some chit.

Kawhi and Barnes are different players defensively. You need to get your eyes checked if you think Barnes is the same from a perimeter perspective defensively as Kawhi freaking Leonard.

The comparison was never between Kawai and Barnes? You need to get your eyes checked before making up such rude and unrelated posts.

The comparison was about floor spacing for Lavine with Pascal and Barnes vs. Pascal and Ibaka or Pascal and Poeltl vs. Pascal and Gasol. Cause peeps were saying there is no room for Lavine to get in the paint with Pascal.

Which is complete BS as Kawai clearly never had an issue on the offensive end.

Ibaka 36% 3pt shooter
Gasol 36% 3pt shooter
Jakob 0% 3pt shooter
Siakam 32% 3pt shooter

You don't see a difference there? Ibaka and Gasol didn't impact spacing negatively, they were both legitimate threats from 3. Siakam and Jak are neither, that is 2 players guaranteed to be in or around the paint basically 99% of the time they are on the court.

How is this such a difficult concept.

[TheFutureMM]

How come Kawai never had an issue with Siakam on the floor?

Y'all on some chit.

Kawhi and Barnes are different players defensively. You need to get your eyes checked if you think Barnes is the same from a perimeter perspective defensively as Kawhi freaking Leonard.

The comparison was never between Kawai and Barnes? You need to get your eyes checked before making up such rude and unrelated posts.

The comparison was about floor spacing for Lavine with Pascal and Barnes vs. Pascal and Ibaka or Pascal and Poeltl vs. Pascal and Gasol. Cause peeps were saying there is no room for Lavine to get in the paint with Pascal.

Which is complete BS as Kawai clearly never had an issue on the offensive end.

Oh my bad dude. The comparisons you highlighted didn't jump to my mind when reading your comment because I thought a deal for Lavine would pretty much have to be centered around Siakam.

But in terms of spacing issues - Pascal provides enough shooting from the 4 for it not really to be an issue for Lavine.

[refshateRaps]

Kawhi and Barnes are different players defensively. You need to get your eyes checked if you think Barnes is the same from a perimeter perspective defensively as Kawhi freaking Leonard.

The comparison was never between Kawai and Barnes? You need to get your eyes checked before making up such rude and unrelated posts.

The comparison was about floor spacing for Lavine with Pascal and Barnes vs. Pascal and Ibaka or Pascal and Poeltl vs. Pascal and Gasol. Cause peeps were saying there is no room for Lavine to get in the paint with Pascal.

Which is complete BS as Kawai clearly never had an issue on the offensive end.

Ibaka 36% 3pt shooter
Gasol 36% 3pt shooter
Jakob 0% 3pt shooter
Siakam 32% 3pt shooter

You don't see a difference there? Ibaka and Gasol didn't impact spacing negatively, they were both legitimate threats from 3. Siakam and Jak are neither, that is 2 players guaranteed to be in or around the paint basically 99% of the time they are on the court.

How is this such a difficult concept.

Your original concept being questioned was that Pascal was the space issue.

Now based on what you show above it seems to be Yak? Which actually would have been a valid point, tho I can see many beneficial scenarios for Yak depending on match-ups and a solid rotational piece.

Barnes is shooting at 38% this season
Clearly not an issue with Pascal just as Ibaka wasnt.

Nothing you showed above makes Pascal the issue. They are fine together and Lavine will have plenty of space.

[Brinbe]

let's see how desperate MLSE will be for those play-in dollars. have a feeling they'll be inclined to take on that lavine contract at this point.

[Scase]

The comparison was never between Kawai and Barnes? You need to get your eyes checked before making up such rude and unrelated posts.

The comparison was about floor spacing for Lavine with Pascal and Barnes vs. Pascal and Ibaka or Pascal and Poeltl vs. Pascal and Gasol. Cause peeps were saying there is no room for Lavine to get in the paint with Pascal.

Which is complete BS as Kawai clearly never had an issue on the offensive end.

Ibaka 36% 3pt shooter
Gasol 36% 3pt shooter
Jakob 0% 3pt shooter
Siakam 32% 3pt shooter

You don't see a difference there? Ibaka and Gasol didn't impact spacing negatively, they were both legitimate threats from 3. Siakam and Jak are neither, that is 2 players guaranteed to be in or around the paint basically 99% of the time they are on the court.

How is this such a difficult concept.

Your original concept being questioned was that Pascal was the space issue.

Now based on what you show above it seems to be Yak? Which actually would have been a valid point, tho I can see many beneficial scenarios for Yak depending on match-ups and a solid rotational piece.

Barnes is shooting at 38% this season
Clearly not an issue with Pascal just as Ibaka wasnt.

Nothing you showed above makes Pascal the issue. They are fine together and Lavine will have plenty of space.

No, my point as it always has been, is that you cannot have all 3 of them. How are you getting this lost?

Siakam/Gasol/Ibaka could work because 2 of them can shoot the 3.
Scottie/Jak/Siakam doesn't cause only one of them can shoot the 3.

I actually don't know how much simpler I can make this.

[Tripod]

Ibaka 36% 3pt shooter
Gasol 36% 3pt shooter
Jakob 0% 3pt shooter
Siakam 32% 3pt shooter

You don't see a difference there? Ibaka and Gasol didn't impact spacing negatively, they were both legitimate threats from 3. Siakam and Jak are neither, that is 2 players guaranteed to be in or around the paint basically 99% of the time they are on the court.

How is this such a difficult concept.

Your original concept being questioned was that Pascal was the space issue.

Now based on what you show above it seems to be Yak? Which actually would have been a valid point, tho I can see many beneficial scenarios for Yak depending on match-ups and a solid rotational piece.

Barnes is shooting at 38% this season
Clearly not an issue with Pascal just as Ibaka wasnt.

Nothing you showed above makes Pascal the issue. They are fine together and Lavine will have plenty of space.

No, my point as it always has been, is that you cannot have all 3 of them. How are you getting this lost?

Siakam/Gasol/Ibaka could work because 2 of them can shoot the 3.
Scottie/Jak/Siakam doesn't cause only one of them can shoot the 3.

I actually don't know how much simpler I can make this.

And crazy that it's Barnes who can shoot

[Scase]

Your original concept being questioned was that Pascal was the space issue.

Now based on what you show above it seems to be Yak? Which actually would have been a valid point, tho I can see many beneficial scenarios for Yak depending on match-ups and a solid rotational piece.

Barnes is shooting at 38% this season
Clearly not an issue with Pascal just as Ibaka wasnt.

Nothing you showed above makes Pascal the issue. They are fine together and Lavine will have plenty of space.

No, my point as it always has been, is that you cannot have all 3 of them. How are you getting this lost?

Siakam/Gasol/Ibaka could work because 2 of them can shoot the 3.
Scottie/Jak/Siakam doesn't cause only one of them can shoot the 3.

I actually don't know how much simpler I can make this.

And crazy that it's Barnes who can shoot

Imagine that, an NBA player improving his game. What's super weird is all I've heard for years is that Siakam is first one in last one out. And yet, what's he added?

Scottie adds a 38% 3pt shot in literally one season.

[Tripod]

No, my point as it always has been, is that you cannot have all 3 of them. How are you getting this lost?

Siakam/Gasol/Ibaka could work because 2 of them can shoot the 3.
Scottie/Jak/Siakam doesn't cause only one of them can shoot the 3.

I actually don't know how much simpler I can make this.

And crazy that it's Barnes who can shoot

Imagine that, an NBA player improving his game. What's super weird is all I've heard for years is that Siakam is first one in last one out. And yet, what's he added?

Scottie adds a 38% 3pt shot in literally one season.

Removing Siakam's inside points to a guy like Lavine who can shoot from inside, would just clear up so much room inside.

And of course give Barnes, Yak and Schroeder a great target to kick the ball out to.

[Scase]

And crazy that it's Barnes who can shoot

Imagine that, an NBA player improving his game. What's super weird is all I've heard for years is that Siakam is first one in last one out. And yet, what's he added?

Scottie adds a 38% 3pt shot in literally one season.

Removing Siakam's inside points to a guy like Lavine who can shoot from inside, would just clear up so much room inside.

And of course give Barnes, Yak and Schroeder a great target to kick the ball out to.

I'm 100% against the Lavine trade, but functionally it should work. I just think it's an ultra treadmill move that just kicks the can down the road a couple more years.

It would definitely be better than whatever this SIakam led garbage is.

[Tripod]

Imagine that, an NBA player improving his game. What's super weird is all I've heard for years is that Siakam is first one in last one out. And yet, what's he added?

Scottie adds a 38% 3pt shot in literally one season.

Removing Siakam's inside points to a guy like Lavine who can shoot from inside, would just clear up so much room inside.

And of course give Barnes, Yak and Schroeder a great target to kick the ball out to.

I'm 100% against the Lavine trade, but functionally it should work. I just think it's an ultra treadmill move that just kicks the can down the road a couple more years.

It would definitely be better than whatever this SIakam led garbage is.

Oh I agree that we SHOULD be getting picks, hopefully 1-2 prospects and filler in any Siakam deal.

But I can see a scenario where they go the Lavine route...to try and stay more competitive.

[Scase]

Removing Siakam's inside points to a guy like Lavine who can shoot from inside, would just clear up so much room inside.

And of course give Barnes, Yak and Schroeder a great target to kick the ball out to.

I'm 100% against the Lavine trade, but functionally it should work. I just think it's an ultra treadmill move that just kicks the can down the road a couple more years.

It would definitely be better than whatever this SIakam led garbage is.

Oh I agree that we SHOULD be getting picks, hopefully 1-2 prospects and filler in any Siakam deal.

But I can see a scenario where they go the Lavine route...to try and stay more competitive.

More likely we give up a top 3 protected first for Brogdon.

[MiamiSPX]

Imagine that, an NBA player improving his game. What's super weird is all I've heard for years is that Siakam is first one in last one out. And yet, what's he added?

Scottie adds a 38% 3pt shot in literally one season.

Removing Siakam's inside points to a guy like Lavine who can shoot from inside, would just clear up so much room inside.

And of course give Barnes, Yak and Schroeder a great target to kick the ball out to.

I'm 100% against the Lavine trade, but functionally it should work. I just think it's an ultra treadmill move that just kicks the can down the road a couple more years.

It would definitely be better than whatever this SIakam led garbage is.

There is no doubt we are probably a better fitting team with Lavine. And I could see our FO talking themselves into the financial aspect of it. You're actually saving money and term when you contrast Lavine's contract with what Siakam is going to get. But like you said, it would just be such a meh move.

I've said it before but the good news for us is that there are many teams interested in Lavine. I think he actually gets moved within the next few weeks, their season is already done. There is just no way our FO will move expeditiously enough to land him. Their current paralysis works in our favour on this one.

[Scase]

Removing Siakam's inside points to a guy like Lavine who can shoot from inside, would just clear up so much room inside.

And of course give Barnes, Yak and Schroeder a great target to kick the ball out to.

I'm 100% against the Lavine trade, but functionally it should work. I just think it's an ultra treadmill move that just kicks the can down the road a couple more years.

It would definitely be better than whatever this SIakam led garbage is.

There is no doubt we are probably a better fitting team with Lavine. And I could see our FO talking themselves into the financial aspect of it. You're actually saving money and term when you contrast Lavine's contract with what Siakam is going to get. But like you said, it would just be such a meh move.

I've said it before but the good news for us is that there are many teams interested in Lavine. I think he actually gets moved within the next few weeks, their season is already done. There is just no way our FO will move expeditiously enough to land him. Their current paralysis works in our favour on this one.

It's a shame that the Bulls can recognize a wasted season but we can't.

[Merit]

Your original concept being questioned was that Pascal was the space issue.

Now based on what you show above it seems to be Yak? Which actually would have been a valid point, tho I can see many beneficial scenarios for Yak depending on match-ups and a solid rotational piece.

Barnes is shooting at 38% this season
Clearly not an issue with Pascal just as Ibaka wasnt.

Nothing you showed above makes Pascal the issue. They are fine together and Lavine will have plenty of space.

No, my point as it always has been, is that you cannot have all 3 of them. How are you getting this lost?

Siakam/Gasol/Ibaka could work because 2 of them can shoot the 3.
Scottie/Jak/Siakam doesn't cause only one of them can shoot the 3.

I actually don't know how much simpler I can make this.

And crazy that it's Barnes who can shoot

Consider me surprised that Barnes is a better shooter than Gary this season. And a better shooter than Pascal, for that matter.

[Scase]

No, my point as it always has been, is that you cannot have all 3 of them. How are you getting this lost?

Siakam/Gasol/Ibaka could work because 2 of them can shoot the 3.
Scottie/Jak/Siakam doesn't cause only one of them can shoot the 3.

I actually don't know how much simpler I can make this.

And crazy that it's Barnes who can shoot

Consider me surprised that Barnes is a better shooter than Gary this season. And a better shooter than Pascal, for that matter.

The first one is surprising, not so much the second one. Siakam has never been a good shooter.

[Merit]

And crazy that it's Barnes who can shoot

Consider me surprised that Barnes is a better shooter than Gary this season. And a better shooter than Pascal, for that matter.

The first one is surprising, not so much the second one. Siakam has never been a good shooter.

Fair enough. I guess I'm saying I didn't expect Gary to regress and I didn't expect Scottie to improve as much as he did. Pascal's gonna Pascal. I guarantee Pascal hits more 3's and at a better percentage if we have more spacing though.

[Merit]

While I agree with you on this, it begs the question - if this is in fact true, why did we bother doubling down by acquiring Yak in the first place when we knew this was the case at the time of acquisition?

Don't think there's a good answer to that question.

He filled a need but we overpaid in assets and contract for him.

It was done for multiple reasons: get someone to run the pick and roll with FVV, get a quality pick setter in in general (no one on this team other than Jak can set a good pick to free anyone up), get a rim protector in to shore up our defense, and get another quality starter in to spread some minutes out. With Fred on this team, Jak makes a lot more sense which is why I wasn't mad at the time the deal was done. Once FVV walked, that trade became a bad trade.

Not a bad trade, but not the synergistic trade we had hoped for. We really needed Fred to re-up to make things make sense here. He chose his bag over the team. Pascal is still salty AF about it.

[Merit]

Removing Siakam's inside points to a guy like Lavine who can shoot from inside, would just clear up so much room inside.

And of course give Barnes, Yak and Schroeder a great target to kick the ball out to.

I'm 100% against the Lavine trade, but functionally it should work. I just think it's an ultra treadmill move that just kicks the can down the road a couple more years.

It would definitely be better than whatever this SIakam led garbage is.

There is no doubt we are probably a better fitting team with Lavine. And I could see our FO talking themselves into the financial aspect of it. You're actually saving money and term when you contrast Lavine's contract with what Siakam is going to get. But like you said, it would just be such a meh move.

I've said it before but the good news for us is that there are many teams interested in Lavine. I think he actually gets moved within the next few weeks, their season is already done. There is just no way our FO will move expeditiously enough to land him. Their current paralysis works in our favour on this one.

I happen to think that the Raps could get both Lavine and some sort of return for Pascal from Atlanta. The bulls could use expiring contracts. Agreed on the financials when we compare Lavine and Pascal. I feel like the Bulls could do Rudy Gay redux and pivot.

GTJ/OPJ/Boucher/Thad/McDaniels for Lavine/Carter

Hunter/Bogdanovic/Okongwu/Griffin for Pascal/Precious/Temple

PG Bogdanovic/Carter
SG Lavine/Schroeder
SF OG/Griffin
PF Scottie/Hunter
C Okongwu/Poeltl

[Scase]

Consider me surprised that Barnes is a better shooter than Gary this season. And a better shooter than Pascal, for that matter.

The first one is surprising, not so much the second one. Siakam has never been a good shooter.

Fair enough. I guess I'm saying I didn't expect Gary to regress and I didn't expect Scottie to improve as much as he did. Pascal's gonna Pascal. I guarantee Pascal hits more 3's and at a better percentage if we have more spacing though.

Gary is only down about 1% vs his career, that can be chalked up to sample size I think.

As for Siakam and the spacing, he's the reason why we don't have any. Our SL has a 36%, 40%, and 38% 3pt shooters. There is spacing, and the SL was running so much better with Scottie being the focal point. But because Siakam can't hit the broad side of the barn, we had to revert back to last years schemes, and even with that, he continues to shoot like trash.

He doesn't get a pass on this.