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sol537 wrote:Randle will do an opt-in and extend. $30m (final year) and then 3 more years at around $34m + $36M + $38m with the final year being a player option. So around 4 years $148m... Keeps us under the second apron for an extra season or two and lets us keep the core while upgrading around the edges.
R-DAWG wrote:Iron Mantis wrote:spree2kawhi wrote:Like the bridges and OG trades? I agree that it likely won’t happen, but I won’t be surprised if it does.
Before the bridges trade if you asked anyone who the Knicks were more likely to trade for, between Bridges and KAT, everyone would have said that KAT is more attainable.
Really, everyone thought getting Mikal off the Nets was impossible for the Knicks .
I learned not to doubt Leon the Don. He gits 'er dun.
Before the Bridges trade the Knicks were loaded with assets. They used those assets to get Bridges. We can debate if we feel the trade was an overpay or worth it. But it doesn’t change the fact that before the Bridges trade and this years draft we had all our future picks to trade, now we have none, and instead of 4 extras 1sts from other teams, we only have 2 - one of which is unlikely to convey.
So call a spade a spade - Leon paid anywhere between a very high price to an historic overpay for Bridges and will be operating with very few assets over the next 5 years.
KnixinSix wrote:R-DAWG wrote:spree2kawhi wrote:I mean, Bridges is certainly worth the gamble. I just hope people here in this place remember how open they were to that trade if Bridges turns out to be an underperformer over the years.
In theory, he’s certainly the type of player to lift this promising roster over the top, fills structural needs and then there is the chemistry with the players already here. I wouldn’t call that an overpay.
No one is debating Bridges fit. But the price of 5 1st rd picks for an elite role player is more than most multi-time all-stars are acquired for. That's an overpay. A BMW 7-Serries is a great car, and we would all love to own one, just not at the cost of a Ferrari.
Why are our future draft picks 5-7 years down the road depreciating assets? And why was this a use it or lose it opportunity? And how do we know who/what will become available over a 5 year window.
I think turning Quickely into OG, while getting off RJ's money (needed to justify paying OG) was a use it or lose it opportunity.
Had the Bridges trade included a 2024 1st, and the DET 1st - then it was a little more use it or lose it. And frankly, I would feel so different about the trade if it was those 2 picks, plus the MIL and NY 25 and NY 27, even if it included the WAS 1st (likely 2 2nds) and a 26 swap. While that is still a substantial overpay, it's a 3 year window and then a path to a re-set (most NBA windows last closer to 3 years than 7 years)
I'm really surprised how people just undervalue the future, unprotected 1sts and why this offseason became a use it or lose it. These are probably the same people who thought using the amnesty on 1 year of Chauncy Billups to sign Tyson Chandler was use it or lose it.
Those unprotected future 1sts are like maxing out your credit cards - you don't feel it at first, but the bill comes due. You might love the Bridges trade and what this roster can be. But it's also not hard to look at the cost of this roster and see some of the impulsive decisions that have plugged this organization for decades - and a world where in 24 months we are looking at a bloated payroll and no future draft picks. For a team that is a fringe contender at best.
As I mentioned above, I'm all for adding Bridges to the roster. But overpaying in terms of picks and dollars and handcuffed this organization for decades.
I absolutely think it was an overpay. But they got perhaps one of the best fitting pieces for a Thibs coached roster they could get in the entire league.
If you believe Brunson is officially a top 10 player in the entire NBA and combine that with the elite defense and 3 point spacing we now have this team is absolutely a contender.
Now the huge X factor is Randle. He is a proven 25/10/5 guy but will he adapt to becoming a more team friendly scorer and score within the ebb and flow rather than ball stopping/ iso too much and trying to be the alpha?
He's showed strong signs of this before he went down so it is certainly possible. But this is probably the biggest factor of the team. A Randle that complements Brunson as a legit #2 scorer that plays within himself and the team makes this team a Finals contender.
Or of course you bring in a guy like KAT who can both take Randles role as the #2 scorer and play either 4 or the sorely needed 5 spot on this team.
R-DAWG wrote:KnixinSix wrote:R-DAWG wrote:
No one is debating Bridges fit. But the price of 5 1st rd picks for an elite role player is more than most multi-time all-stars are acquired for. That's an overpay. A BMW 7-Serries is a great car, and we would all love to own one, just not at the cost of a Ferrari.
Why are our future draft picks 5-7 years down the road depreciating assets? And why was this a use it or lose it opportunity? And how do we know who/what will become available over a 5 year window.
I think turning Quickely into OG, while getting off RJ's money (needed to justify paying OG) was a use it or lose it opportunity.
Had the Bridges trade included a 2024 1st, and the DET 1st - then it was a little more use it or lose it. And frankly, I would feel so different about the trade if it was those 2 picks, plus the MIL and NY 25 and NY 27, even if it included the WAS 1st (likely 2 2nds) and a 26 swap. While that is still a substantial overpay, it's a 3 year window and then a path to a re-set (most NBA windows last closer to 3 years than 7 years)
I'm really surprised how people just undervalue the future, unprotected 1sts and why this offseason became a use it or lose it. These are probably the same people who thought using the amnesty on 1 year of Chauncy Billups to sign Tyson Chandler was use it or lose it.
Those unprotected future 1sts are like maxing out your credit cards - you don't feel it at first, but the bill comes due. You might love the Bridges trade and what this roster can be. But it's also not hard to look at the cost of this roster and see some of the impulsive decisions that have plugged this organization for decades - and a world where in 24 months we are looking at a bloated payroll and no future draft picks. For a team that is a fringe contender at best.
As I mentioned above, I'm all for adding Bridges to the roster. But overpaying in terms of picks and dollars and handcuffed this organization for decades.
I absolutely think it was an overpay. But they got perhaps one of the best fitting pieces for a Thibs coached roster they could get in the entire league.
If you believe Brunson is officially a top 10 player in the entire NBA and combine that with the elite defense and 3 point spacing we now have this team is absolutely a contender.
Now the huge X factor is Randle. He is a proven 25/10/5 guy but will he adapt to becoming a more team friendly scorer and score within the ebb and flow rather than ball stopping/ iso too much and trying to be the alpha?
He's showed strong signs of this before he went down so it is certainly possible. But this is probably the biggest factor of the team. A Randle that complements Brunson as a legit #2 scorer that plays within himself and the team makes this team a Finals contender.
Or of course you bring in a guy like KAT who can both take Randles role as the #2 scorer and play either 4 or the sorely needed 5 spot on this team.
I will make the argument that this version of the Knicks is only a contender if you get the all-NBA version of Randle in both the regular season for this team to be a contender.
Without Randle, elite teams in the playoffs will blitz Brunson and there isn't enough high level shot creation or volume scoring.
R-DAWG wrote:KnixinSix wrote:R-DAWG wrote:
No one is debating Bridges fit. But the price of 5 1st rd picks for an elite role player is more than most multi-time all-stars are acquired for. That's an overpay. A BMW 7-Serries is a great car, and we would all love to own one, just not at the cost of a Ferrari.
Why are our future draft picks 5-7 years down the road depreciating assets? And why was this a use it or lose it opportunity? And how do we know who/what will become available over a 5 year window.
I think turning Quickely into OG, while getting off RJ's money (needed to justify paying OG) was a use it or lose it opportunity.
Had the Bridges trade included a 2024 1st, and the DET 1st - then it was a little more use it or lose it. And frankly, I would feel so different about the trade if it was those 2 picks, plus the MIL and NY 25 and NY 27, even if it included the WAS 1st (likely 2 2nds) and a 26 swap. While that is still a substantial overpay, it's a 3 year window and then a path to a re-set (most NBA windows last closer to 3 years than 7 years)
I'm really surprised how people just undervalue the future, unprotected 1sts and why this offseason became a use it or lose it. These are probably the same people who thought using the amnesty on 1 year of Chauncy Billups to sign Tyson Chandler was use it or lose it.
Those unprotected future 1sts are like maxing out your credit cards - you don't feel it at first, but the bill comes due. You might love the Bridges trade and what this roster can be. But it's also not hard to look at the cost of this roster and see some of the impulsive decisions that have plugged this organization for decades - and a world where in 24 months we are looking at a bloated payroll and no future draft picks. For a team that is a fringe contender at best.
As I mentioned above, I'm all for adding Bridges to the roster. But overpaying in terms of picks and dollars and handcuffed this organization for decades.
I absolutely think it was an overpay. But they got perhaps one of the best fitting pieces for a Thibs coached roster they could get in the entire league.
If you believe Brunson is officially a top 10 player in the entire NBA and combine that with the elite defense and 3 point spacing we now have this team is absolutely a contender.
Now the huge X factor is Randle. He is a proven 25/10/5 guy but will he adapt to becoming a more team friendly scorer and score within the ebb and flow rather than ball stopping/ iso too much and trying to be the alpha?
He's showed strong signs of this before he went down so it is certainly possible. But this is probably the biggest factor of the team. A Randle that complements Brunson as a legit #2 scorer that plays within himself and the team makes this team a Finals contender.
Or of course you bring in a guy like KAT who can both take Randles role as the #2 scorer and play either 4 or the sorely needed 5 spot on this team.
I will make the argument that this version of the Knicks is only a contender if you get the all-NBA version of Randle in both the regular season for this team to be a contender.
Without Randle, elite teams in the playoffs will blitz Brunson and there isn't enough high level shot creation or volume scoring.
aggo wrote:
1
brunson + Mitch
for
Curry
Besart19 wrote:aggo wrote:Knick4Real wrote:
Can he play the 5?
1
brunson + Mitch
for
Curry
stop it
nykballa2k4 wrote:Besart19 wrote:aggo wrote:
1
brunson + Mitch
for
Curry
stop it
He just wanted to add the Olympics stuff... nothing to see here.Spoiler:
Besart19 wrote:aggo wrote:Knick4Real wrote:
Can he play the 5?
1
brunson + Mitch
for
Curry
stop it
spree2kawhi wrote:Besart19 wrote:aggo wrote:
1
brunson + Mitch
for
Curry
stop it
lol out of all people taking offense here it’s you
Besart19 wrote:aggo wrote:Knick4Real wrote:
Can he play the 5?
1
brunson + Mitch
for
Curry
stop it
RHODEY wrote:R-DAWG wrote:KnixinSix wrote:
I absolutely think it was an overpay. But they got perhaps one of the best fitting pieces for a Thibs coached roster they could get in the entire league.
If you believe Brunson is officially a top 10 player in the entire NBA and combine that with the elite defense and 3 point spacing we now have this team is absolutely a contender.
Now the huge X factor is Randle. He is a proven 25/10/5 guy but will he adapt to becoming a more team friendly scorer and score within the ebb and flow rather than ball stopping/ iso too much and trying to be the alpha?
He's showed strong signs of this before he went down so it is certainly possible. But this is probably the biggest factor of the team. A Randle that complements Brunson as a legit #2 scorer that plays within himself and the team makes this team a Finals contender.
Or of course you bring in a guy like KAT who can both take Randles role as the #2 scorer and play either 4 or the sorely needed 5 spot on this team.
I will make the argument that this version of the Knicks is only a contender if you get the all-NBA version of Randle in both the regular season for this team to be a contender.
Without Randle, elite teams in the playoffs will blitz Brunson and there isn't enough high level shot creation or volume scoring.
We were without Randle in the playoffs versus the Sixers..an elite team known for defense and what did their blitzing do to Brunson? Mind you we were hobbled even in that series.. But healthy with Randle and Bridge?s....it's not even a question to me that we are a contender.
R-DAWG wrote:RHODEY wrote:R-DAWG wrote:
I will make the argument that this version of the Knicks is only a contender if you get the all-NBA version of Randle in both the regular season for this team to be a contender.
Without Randle, elite teams in the playoffs will blitz Brunson and there isn't enough high level shot creation or volume scoring.
We were without Randle in the playoffs versus the Sixers..an elite team known for defense and what did their blitzing do to Brunson? Mind you we were hobbled even in that series.. But healthy with Randle and Bridge?s....it's not even a question to me that we are a contender.
We won in 6 close games while Philly had a hobbled Embiid. Philly has since replaced Tobias Harris and Nic Batum with Paul George and Kaleb Martin
By the middle of the 2nd rd against Indiana the team was out of gas.
We need Randle.
R-DAWG wrote:RHODEY wrote:R-DAWG wrote:
I will make the argument that this version of the Knicks is only a contender if you get the all-NBA version of Randle in both the regular season for this team to be a contender.
Without Randle, elite teams in the playoffs will blitz Brunson and there isn't enough high level shot creation or volume scoring.
We were without Randle in the playoffs versus the Sixers..an elite team known for defense and what did their blitzing do to Brunson? Mind you we were hobbled even in that series.. But healthy with Randle and Bridge?s....it's not even a question to me that we are a contender.
We won in 6 close games while Philly had a hobbled Embiid. Philly has since replaced Tobias Harris and Nic Batum with Paul George and Kaleb Martin
By the middle of the 2nd rd against Indiana the team was out of gas.
We need Randle.
WaltFrazier wrote:R-DAWG wrote:RHODEY wrote:We were without Randle in the playoffs versus the Sixers..an elite team known for defense and what did their blitzing do to Brunson? Mind you we were hobbled even in that series.. But healthy with Randle and Bridge?s....it's not even a question to me that we are a contender.
We won in 6 close games while Philly had a hobbled Embiid. Philly has since replaced Tobias Harris and Nic Batum with Paul George and Kaleb Martin
By the middle of the 2nd rd against Indiana the team was out of gas.
We need Randle.
Philly will be good, Boston is still Boston. Knicks if healthy plus Mikal plus Randle as #2 scorer are right with them. The thing that scares me is the loss of Hartenstein. I saw replays of 2 games recently, the Minnesota game from January and one of the playoff wins vs Sixers. It stood out to me how valuable iHart was. I'm not sure even a healthy Mitch plus say JV as a backup can replace what he brought.
RHODEY wrote:R-DAWG wrote:Iron Mantis wrote:Before the bridges trade if you asked anyone who the Knicks were more likely to trade for, between Bridges and KAT, everyone would have said that KAT is more attainable.
Really, everyone thought getting Mikal off the Nets was impossible for the Knicks .
I learned not to doubt Leon the Don. He gits 'er dun.
Before the Bridges trade the Knicks were loaded with assets. They used those assets to get Bridges. We can debate if we feel the trade was an overpay or worth it. But it doesn’t change the fact that before the Bridges trade and this years draft we had all our future picks to trade, now we have none, and instead of 4 extras 1sts from other teams, we only have 2 - one of which is unlikely to convey.
So call a spade a spade - Leon paid anywhere between a very high price to an historic overpay for Bridges and will be operating with very few assets over the next 5 years.
Bridges was the perfect missing piece.
Thought to be unobtainable. Gives us (2) of the best 2 way wing defenders of the league. Bolsters our Bench - because you now add Ragu to it. Insane chemistry , insane options, insane offense, insane defense. We are undoubtable true contenders.
All for just soon to be geriatric Bogodonivic and some draft pics , most of which would not amount to much anyway IMO. I don t think we over-payed at all.
