2024-25 NBA MVP Discussion Thread (Pt. 2)

[zero rings]

It’s going to look very weird if Jokic averages 32/13/10 with a +24 on/off doesn’t win the MVP.

But that’s the kind of year SGA is having. He’s having the best season by a guard since 2016 Steph, and MJ before him. If the Thunder win 70 or close to it I don’t see how you can deny him.

[Exp0sed]

Sabonis deserves a shoutout after the 28 rebs massacare in Boston

Kings have looked so much better after Mike Brown, one has to assume the players just wanted him gone and didn't really give an effort so he'd be canned. without Fox these last couple of games, played in every game this season averaging 20.7 on just 13 FGA, let's call it 21\14\6 on 60\45\78 and the advanced stats paint him as top 5-10 this season

not gonna win obviously but actually has a decent case for some 5th place votes atm, imo

[Exp0sed]

It’s going to look very weird if Jokic averages 32/13/10 with a +24 on/off doesn’t win the MVP.

But that’s the kind of year SGA is having. He’s having the best season by a guard since 2016 Steph, and MJ before him. If the Thunder win 70 or close to it I don’t see how you can deny him.

yeah, we're likely never gonna see again in our lifetimes a player having a season as good as this and not win MVP

[LeBronSpaghetti]

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: it doesn’t matter how good of a season Jokic has, he will not win MVP. Giving him 4 is not something many media members can stomach. SGA won’t have as good of a season although it is absolutely an MVP worthy season in general.

[Exp0sed]

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: it doesn’t matter how good of a season Jokic has, he will not win MVP. Giving him 4 is not something many media members can stomach. SGA won’t have as good of a season although it is absolutely an MVP worthy season in general.

you are correct, sir

[Special_Puppy]

It’s going to look very weird if Jokic averages 32/13/10 with a +24 on/off doesn’t win the MVP.

But that’s the kind of year SGA is having. He’s having the best season by a guard since 2016 Steph, and MJ before him. If the Thunder win 70 or close to it I don’t see how you can deny him.

Is SGA having a better season than 2018-2020 Harden?

[zero rings]

It’s going to look very weird if Jokic averages 32/13/10 with a +24 on/off doesn’t win the MVP.

But that’s the kind of year SGA is having. He’s having the best season by a guard since 2016 Steph, and MJ before him. If the Thunder win 70 or close to it I don’t see how you can deny him.

Is SGA having a better season than 2018-2020 Harden?

I think he’s been better than peak Harden both this year and last.

SGA’s offensive floor is higher, and he’s obviously a way better defender. His night to night consistency is unreal.

[Exp0sed]

It’s going to look very weird if Jokic averages 32/13/10 with a +24 on/off doesn’t win the MVP.

But that’s the kind of year SGA is having. He’s having the best season by a guard since 2016 Steph, and MJ before him. If the Thunder win 70 or close to it I don’t see how you can deny him.

Is SGA having a better season than 2018-2020 Harden?

yeah, he is

Harden was breaking usage records and was using a ton of possesions and that's even if we disregard defense (and we shouldn't disregard defense). he had the gaudy raw stats not because he was doing anything that special but mostly because of the insane usage (and next level foul baiting)

[OkcSinceSGA]

It’s going to look very weird if Jokic averages 32/13/10 with a +24 on/off doesn’t win the MVP.

But that’s the kind of year SGA is having. He’s having the best season by a guard since 2016 Steph, and MJ before him. If the Thunder win 70 or close to it I don’t see how you can deny him.

Is SGA having a better season than 2018-2020 Harden?

I think he’s been better than peak Harden both this year and last.

SGA’s offensive floor is higher, and he’s obviously a way better defender. His night to night consistency is unreal.

What's nuts is he sits a fair bit of 4th quarters too due to blowouts. If he's surpassed peak Harden's best seasons... that means outside of MJ he's having the best SG season of all time? Harden, Kobe, Wade didn't peak this high.

[zero rings]

Is SGA having a better season than 2018-2020 Harden?

I think he’s been better than peak Harden both this year and last.

SGA’s offensive floor is higher, and he’s obviously a way better defender. His night to night consistency is unreal.

What's nuts is he sits a fair bit of 4th quarters too due to blowouts. If he's surpassed peak Harden's best seasons... that means outside of MJ he's having the best SG season of all time? Harden, Kobe, Wade didn't peak this high.

Yeah, I think he’s peaking higher than all of those guys. Maybe you could make an argument for CP3 during his best years.

[OkcSinceSGA]

I think he’s been better than peak Harden both this year and last.

SGA’s offensive floor is higher, and he’s obviously a way better defender. His night to night consistency is unreal.

What's nuts is he sits a fair bit of 4th quarters too due to blowouts. If he's surpassed peak Harden's best seasons... that means outside of MJ he's having the best SG season of all time? Harden, Kobe, Wade didn't peak this high.

Yeah, I think he’s peaking higher than all of those guys. Maybe you could make an argument for CP3 during his best years.

I was thinking of SG's, but yea if we include PG's it's gonna be basically Magic and CP3 in debating if he's having a better peak season than.

WS/48 SGA edges out both Magic and CP3 peak vs peak.

[zero rings]

What's nuts is he sits a fair bit of 4th quarters too due to blowouts. If he's surpassed peak Harden's best seasons... that means outside of MJ he's having the best SG season of all time? Harden, Kobe, Wade didn't peak this high.

Yeah, I think he’s peaking higher than all of those guys. Maybe you could make an argument for CP3 during his best years.

I was thinking of SG's, but yea if we include PG's it's gonna be basically Magic and CP3 in debating if he's having a better peak season than.

Traditional shooting guards barely exist anymore, so I think you have to compare him to guards generally.
Guard-Wing-Big are the only true positions in the modern game.

He’s been historically good no matter what position he plays.

[web123888]

It’s a tough call. Personally I’d give it to Jokic but couldn’t fault the voters for giving it to SGA.

Very similar to the Lamar Jackson / Josh Allen NFL MVP vote. Both players had monster seasons and are rightful MVPs. Unfortunately one player will get robbed.

[Exp0sed]

Is SGA having a better season than 2018-2020 Harden?

I think he’s been better than peak Harden both this year and last.

SGA’s offensive floor is higher, and he’s obviously a way better defender. His night to night consistency is unreal.

What's nuts is he sits a fair bit of 4th quarters too due to blowouts. If he's surpassed peak Harden's best seasons... that means outside of MJ he's having the best SG season of all time? Harden, Kobe, Wade didn't peak this high.

that's where the argument gets tricky tho..i'm a big SGA fan and he's a very unique player whose clearly and by far the best Guard in the NBA. however, these cross comparisons between eras don't really work

Kobe was allowed to do whatever the hell he wanted, can u imagine Kobe growing up and developing in the age of analytics? he would have been a completely different player and there's nothing to suggest he or D-wade wouldn't have put up similar or even better seasons than the last couple by SGA. Jordan is a diff discussion all together, can u imagine Jordan in the pace and space era, having this much space to work with when surrounded by shooters and schemes designed to get favorable switches for him? with no real help defense and very few big men lurking in the paint and those that are there, aren't allowed to breath on u let alone hack you without even making a play on the ball?

Jordan would avg 40 on insane efficiency in 3 quarters in today's league. whose gonna stop him from taking it to the rack, Lauri Markannen? (no offense Lauri )

there's a multitude of reasons to explain the inflation in scoring, efficiency and stats, that's just the natural evolution of game. players should be evaluated in comparison to their contemporary peers. saying SGA might be having the best statistical season for a SG ever (or since MJ, or whatever), while techinically true, is still entirely disregarding this inflation (which is a fact, not some obscure argument). it's the same as saying Jokic is having the GOAT season. it might be the best season ever statisitically but that doesn't make it the GOAT season, those are two different things

edit: cast in point, early 90's MJ had multiple 300+ TS added seasons (that's relative to his peers), SGA had 180 last season

obviously TS added isn't the best or the most definitive way to examine it but just off the top, to give some perspective

[jokeboy86]

It’s going to look very weird if Jokic averages 32/13/10 with a +24 on/off doesn’t win the MVP.

But that’s the kind of year SGA is having. He’s having the best season by a guard since 2016 Steph, and MJ before him. If the Thunder win 70 or close to it I don’t see how you can deny him.

Is SGA having a better season than 2018-2020 Harden?

I think he’s been better than peak Harden both this year and last.

SGA’s offensive floor is higher, and he’s obviously a way better defender. His night to night consistency is unreal.

Uh oh, now you've done it. You've just turned on the bat signal.

[jokeboy86]

It’s a tough call. Personally I’d give it to Jokic but couldn’t fault the voters for giving it to SGA.

Very similar to the Lamar Jackson / Josh Allen NFL MVP vote. Both players had monster seasons and are rightful MVPs. Unfortunately one player will get robbed.

I would be stunned if they gave Lamar the MVP this year.(even though the All-Pro nod is giving hints). Even though it would be deserved imo, similar to the NBA they usually are not keen on giving people a 3rd MVP w/o a title beforehand and Lamar doesn't even have a Super Bowl appearance.

[zero rings]

I think he’s been better than peak Harden both this year and last.

SGA’s offensive floor is higher, and he’s obviously a way better defender. His night to night consistency is unreal.

What's nuts is he sits a fair bit of 4th quarters too due to blowouts. If he's surpassed peak Harden's best seasons... that means outside of MJ he's having the best SG season of all time? Harden, Kobe, Wade didn't peak this high.

that's where the argument gets tricky tho..i'm a big SGA fan and he's a very unique player whose clearly and by far the best Guard in the NBA. however, these cross comparisons between eras don't really work

Kobe was allowed to do whatever the hell he wanted, can u imagine Kobe growing up and developing in the age of analytics? he would have been a completely different player and there's nothing to suggest he or D-wade wouldn't have put up similar or even better seasons than the last couple by SGA. Jordan is a diff discussion all together, can u imagine Jordan in the pace and space era, having this much space to work with when surrounded by shooters and schemes designed to get favorable switches for him? with no real help defense and very few big men lurking in the paint and those that are there, aren't allowed to breath on u let alone whack you without even making a play on the ball?

Jordan would avg 40 on insane efficiency in 3 quarters in today's league. whose gonna stop him from taking it to the rack, Lauri Markannen? (no offense Lauri )

there's a multitude of reasons to explain the inflation in scoring, efficiency and stats. players should be evalutaed in comparison to their contemporary peers. saying SGA might be having the best statistical season for a SG ever (or since MJ, or whatever), while techinically true, is still disregarding this inflation (which is a fact, not some obscure argument). it's the same as saying Jokic is having the GOAT season. it might be the best season ever statisitically but that doesn't make it the GOAT season, those are two different things

I’m fully aware of era differences, and I’m not just talking about box score stats. SGA is providing incredible lift for a truly dominant team. He completely carries them on the offensive end, and he’s a major contributor to a historically great defense.

Kobe was never even close to this consistent and efficient, even when adjusting for eras. Wade couldn’t shoot. And I’m not sure either of them were better on defense.

MJ and Cury are the only guards in the last ~30 years who have had this level of consistent impact. Maybe CP3, and that’s it.

[OkcSinceSGA]

What's nuts is he sits a fair bit of 4th quarters too due to blowouts. If he's surpassed peak Harden's best seasons... that means outside of MJ he's having the best SG season of all time? Harden, Kobe, Wade didn't peak this high.

that's where the argument gets tricky tho..i'm a big SGA fan and he's a very unique player whose clearly and by far the best Guard in the NBA. however, these cross comparisons between eras don't really work

Kobe was allowed to do whatever the hell he wanted, can u imagine Kobe growing up and developing in the age of analytics? he would have been a completely different player and there's nothing to suggest he or D-wade wouldn't have put up similar or even better seasons than the last couple by SGA. Jordan is a diff discussion all together, can u imagine Jordan in the pace and space era, having this much space to work with when surrounded by shooters and schemes designed to get favorable switches for him? with no real help defense and very few big men lurking in the paint and those that are there, aren't allowed to breath on u let alone whack you without even making a play on the ball?

Jordan would avg 40 on insane efficiency in 3 quarters in today's league. whose gonna stop him from taking it to the rack, Lauri Markannen? (no offense Lauri )

there's a multitude of reasons to explain the inflation in scoring, efficiency and stats. players should be evalutaed in comparison to their contemporary peers. saying SGA might be having the best statistical season for a SG ever (or since MJ, or whatever), while techinically true, is still disregarding this inflation (which is a fact, not some obscure argument). it's the same as saying Jokic is having the GOAT season. it might be the best season ever statisitically but that doesn't make it the GOAT season, those are two different things

I’m fully aware of era differences, and I’m not just talking about box score stats. SGA is providing incredible lift for a truly dominant team. He completely carries them on the offensive end, and he’s a major contributor to a historically great defense.

Kobe was never even close to this consistent and efficient, even when adjusting for eras. Wade couldn’t shoot. And I’m not sure either of them were better on defense.

MJ and Cury are the only guards in the last ~30 years who have had this level of consistent impact. Maybe CP3, and that’s it.

Oh man why did I forget Curry when I mentioned Magic and CP3. Yea, for peak I'd say among guards it's becoming MJ, Curry and SGA as the top 3.

[OkcSinceSGA]

PS anyone else remember when just 3-4 weeks ago Giannis was leading SGA in this poll 2.5 to 1 and everyone was yelling at me for being stupid because Giannis is clearly better and more deserving lol? Funny how fickle this board is sometimes.

[Castle Black]

It's still Jokic imo. SGA is a close 2nd, but OKC has a better team than Denver does, especially with Jamal Murray regressing this season. If you took both players off their respective teams, I think OKC would still be a Playoff team, whereas I think Denver would plummet to the bottom of the league.

With that said, a lot will depend on their overall records obviously. If Denver starts to slip in the standings and OKC keeps winning seemingly every game they play in, I think they'll be forced to give it to SGA and you couldn't really argue against it.

Crazy that the NFL and NBA both have really close MVP races this year.