Will Kevin Durant ever win a Championship as the best player on his team?

[fanofthegreats]

People arguing KD > LeBron and Steph are casuals.

[DirtyDez]

KD cheated to get those titles but he was the best player on those Golden St teams. Both statements are true.

[canada_dry]

He was the best player on at least one of em. Probably 2017.

inconvenient truth...we're too good! -Phil Blackson

[Richardbroraps]

He has already done it twice with the Warriors. He almost did it 3 times (2019). If he didn't get injured and GS beat my raps he would have won his 3rd straight finals MVP. His 2019 playoff run is underrated, he was the scariest player on the planet to face.

[SmashMouthRod]

I think KD is done winning chips as the franchise player. He might get 1 later as a complementary player on a different roster.

[HMFFL]

I think KD is done winning chips as the franchise player. He might get 1 later as a complementary player on a different roster.

Random question out of curiosity.

If KD and Joel Embiid won a chip playing together, which guy is the teams #1?


Sent from my SM-S928U1 using RealGM mobile app

[SmashMouthRod]

I think KD is done winning chips as the franchise player. He might get 1 later as a complementary player on a different roster.

Random question out of curiosity.

If KD and Joel Embiid won a chip playing together, which guy is the teams #1?


Sent from my SM-S928U1 using RealGM mobile app

Good question. Probably a healthy Embiid. But night to night the production can flip flop similarly to how Maxey currently puts up superstar numbers carrying the team to wins sometimes.

[Iwasawitness]

KD wasn't even the main defensive target on his own team during those championship runs. Curry was. He benefited massively from single coverage pretty much the entire time in both series. People who try pulling the "he outplayed LeBron" card (which he didn't) are purposely straying away from the point, which is that he wasn't getting an equal amount of defensive attention. Hell, there are actual clips of Durant just straight up being ignored on defense. Durant has pretty numbers and had some big buckets, but Curry was definitely the better player.

Someone in here actually asked a very silly question, which is why didn't Golden State win without Durant in 2016 (which doesn't even make any sense). I think the better question is why do we think Golden State doesn't win again in 2017, or 2018 for that matter, without him? 2016 happened due to very specific circumstances (Green's suspension, injuries to Bogut and Iggy, LeBron and Irving going nuclear). There's a reason Golden State was up 3-1 in the first place.

[michaelm]

KD wasn't even the main defensive target on his own team during those championship runs. Curry was. He benefited massively from single coverage pretty much the entire time in both series. People who try pulling the "he outplayed LeBron" card (which he didn't) are purposely straying away from the point, which is that he wasn't getting an equal amount of defensive attention. Hell, there are actual clips of Durant just straight up being ignored on defense. Durant has pretty numbers and had some big buckets, but Curry was definitely the better player.

Someone in here actually asked a very silly question, which is why didn't Golden State win without Durant in 2016 (which doesn't even make any sense). I think the better question is why do we think Golden State doesn't win again in 2017, or 2018 for that matter, without him? 2016 happened due to very specific circumstances (Green's suspension, injuries to Bogut and Iggy, LeBron and Irving going nuclear). There's a reason Golden State was up 3-1 in the first place.

I don’t agree and I am a GSW fan who has Curry as his all time favorite player.

Bottom line is that they were unstoppable together in 2017. The defensive focus may even have been more on Curry as some have hypothesised in the past because there was an ultimately of course vain hope that there was some vague chance of stopping Curry and hence the duo while there was almost nothing which could be done about KD if he was next to Curry.

Westbrook was very talented athletically, even more so before the knee injury, but didn’t play smart basketball back in the KD days and OKC sometimes came unstuck because a dual iso game plan didn’t maximise their talents or their benefit to the team, and both were both prone to poor decisions in the denouement of close games.

It is indeed remarkable that LeBron is a great PG along with everything else but since when have all small forwards needed to be point guards ?, particularly one who is possibly the tallest SF ever and quite likely the purest scoring SF ever. He actually said outright that he was going to GSW to play with Curry and to play a more team game, which proved to be a fairly good plan when he duly executed said plan in 2017. Kerr didn’t even go all out because he has a philosophical belief in ensemble play and keeping everyone involved both offensively and defensively, had he chosen he could have just run constant Curry/KD pick and roll plays about which absolutely nothing could have been done. Sure KD flourishes with someone else primarily running the team, but so what ?. As above he played the SF position and some center minutes for GSW,

[Iwasawitness]

KD wasn't even the main defensive target on his own team during those championship runs. Curry was. He benefited massively from single coverage pretty much the entire time in both series. People who try pulling the "he outplayed LeBron" card (which he didn't) are purposely straying away from the point, which is that he wasn't getting an equal amount of defensive attention. Hell, there are actual clips of Durant just straight up being ignored on defense. Durant has pretty numbers and had some big buckets, but Curry was definitely the better player.

Someone in here actually asked a very silly question, which is why didn't Golden State win without Durant in 2016 (which doesn't even make any sense). I think the better question is why do we think Golden State doesn't win again in 2017, or 2018 for that matter, without him? 2016 happened due to very specific circumstances (Green's suspension, injuries to Bogut and Iggy, LeBron and Irving going nuclear). There's a reason Golden State was up 3-1 in the first place.

I don’t agree and I am a GSW fan who has Curry as his all time favorite player.

Bottom line is that they were unstoppable together in 2017. The defensive focus may even have been more on Curry as some have hypothesised in the past because there was an ultimately of course vain hope that there was some vague chance of stopping Curry and hence the duo while there was almost nothing which could be done about KD if he was next to Curry.

Westbrook was very talented athletically, even more so before the knee injury, but didn’t play smart basketball back in the KD days and OKC sometimes came unstuck because a dual iso game plan didn’t maximise their talents or their benefit to the team, and both were both prone to poor decisions in the denouement of close games.

It is indeed remarkable that LeBron is a great PG along with everything else but since when have all small forwards needed to be point guards ?, particularly one who is possibly the tallest SF ever and quite likely the purest scoring SF ever. He actually said outright that he was going to GSW to play with Curry and to play a more team game, which proved to be a fairly good plan when he duly executed said plan in 2017. Kerr didn’t even go all out because he has a philosophical belief in ensemble play and keeping everyone involved both offensively and defensively, had he chosen he could have just run constant Curry/KD pick and roll plays about which absolutely nothing could have been done. Sure KD flourishes with someone else primarily running the team, but so what ?. As above he played the SF position and some center minutes for GSW,

Curry getting more defensive focus isn’t a hypothesis… it’s a fact.

[bovice]

he already did

[Young gun 6]

He’s already won 2.

Finals MVP and clearly 1A to Curry being the 1B those 2 years.

[bovice]

if you added Tim Duncan to James Harden's Rockets teams the on/off numbers may lead you to believe James Harden is the best player on that team. it's a very elementary way of looking at the game. Do better.

[Bush4Ever]

I have no idea how people can't see the difference of effect of Curry vs. Durant on those legendary teams.

There was a very clear difference of impact over the entire tenure, or even the title seasons in isolation.

Unless you give Finals MVPs hugely disproportionate weight to everything else in-season, there is no reasonable way to call Durant a "bus driver" on those teams. As in, literally zero.

Durant will most likely go down in history as a (the?) GOAT-tier scorer, with a pair of earned (albeit, easy modeish) titles as a very rich sidekick.

That's legendary...but no he can't claim a bus driver title. It just didn't happen that way.

[michaelm]

KD wasn't even the main defensive target on his own team during those championship runs. Curry was. He benefited massively from single coverage pretty much the entire time in both series. People who try pulling the "he outplayed LeBron" card (which he didn't) are purposely straying away from the point, which is that he wasn't getting an equal amount of defensive attention. Hell, there are actual clips of Durant just straight up being ignored on defense. Durant has pretty numbers and had some big buckets, but Curry was definitely the better player.

Someone in here actually asked a very silly question, which is why didn't Golden State win without Durant in 2016 (which doesn't even make any sense). I think the better question is why do we think Golden State doesn't win again in 2017, or 2018 for that matter, without him? 2016 happened due to very specific circumstances (Green's suspension, injuries to Bogut and Iggy, LeBron and Irving going nuclear). There's a reason Golden State was up 3-1 in the first place.

I don’t agree and I am a GSW fan who has Curry as his all time favorite player.

Bottom line is that they were unstoppable together in 2017. The defensive focus may even have been more on Curry as some have hypothesised in the past because there was an ultimately of course vain hope that there was some vague chance of stopping Curry and hence the duo while there was almost nothing which could be done about KD if he was next to Curry.

Westbrook was very talented athletically, even more so before the knee injury, but didn’t play smart basketball back in the KD days and OKC sometimes came unstuck because a dual iso game plan didn’t maximise their talents or their benefit to the team, and both were both prone to poor decisions in the denouement of close games.

It is indeed remarkable that LeBron is a great PG along with everything else but since when have all small forwards needed to be point guards ?, particularly one who is possibly the tallest SF ever and quite likely the purest scoring SF ever. He actually said outright that he was going to GSW to play with Curry and to play a more team game, which proved to be a fairly good plan when he duly executed said plan in 2017. Kerr didn’t even go all out because he has a philosophical belief in ensemble play and keeping everyone involved both offensively and defensively, had he chosen he could have just run constant Curry/KD pick and roll plays about which absolutely nothing could have been done. Sure KD flourishes with someone else primarily running the team, but so what ?. As above he played the SF position and some center minutes for GSW,

Curry getting more defensive focus isn’t a hypothesis… it’s a fact.

As I posted in some detail they were a duo playing a team game plan which worked rather well, and it was their combination that made the 2017 GSW team so good. One of them was playing the PG/SG position, the other the SF position, and both of them have all time great skills which are complementary rather than identical. That neither of them tried to do it all on his own is rather the point. It is even vaguely possible that ensemble/team play is superior to heliocentric play in the team sport of basketball.

The strategy which the Cavs adopted which was to focus on Curry actually failed, so there is no proof the strategy was correct or that they could have stopped KD if he had been more their focus. Some have hypothesised that they focused on Curry because they thought there was more chance of stopping Curry than KD. They may have thought there was more chance of stopping them as a duo which is what they needed to do by focusing on Curry. A personal theory of mine at the time was that LeBron decided he would rather be beaten by KD than by a small and by NBA standards unathletic guard.

[picc]

Defense literally ceases to exist when the opportunity to downplay Durant is there. People will argue til they're blue in the face about Durant's offense being less than Curry's, and the fact he was a nationally lauded defensive anchor that postseason will never cross their mind. And then they'll probably go right into another thread and argue on both sides to the ball again.

KD broke people's brains when he broke the league, and that's the reason he'll never be respected the way he could/should.

[The4thHorseman]

Defense literally ceases to exist when the opportunity to downplay Durant is there. People will argue til they're blue in the face about Durant's offense being less than Curry's, and the fact he was a nationally lauded defensive anchor that postseason will never cross their mind. And then they'll probably go right into another thread and argue on both sides to the ball again.

KD literally broke people's brains when he broke the league, and that's the reason he'll never be respected the way he could/should.

So none of the Golden St. players should lose any respect for recruiting him throughout the 2016 season?

Woj writes about it right here
https://www.nbcsports.com/nba/news/report-warriors-players-recruited-kevin-durant-throughout-season

[picc]

Defense literally ceases to exist when the opportunity to downplay Durant is there. People will argue til they're blue in the face about Durant's offense being less than Curry's, and the fact he was a nationally lauded defensive anchor that postseason will never cross their mind. And then they'll probably go right into another thread and argue on both sides to the ball again.

KD literally broke people's brains when he broke the league, and that's the reason he'll never be respected the way he could/should.

So none of the Golden St. players should lose any respect for recruiting him throughout the 2016 season?

Woj writes about it right here
https://www.nbcsports.com/nba/news/report-warriors-players-recruited-kevin-durant-throughout-season

I don't understand what that has to do with what I wrote.

[bledredwine]

KD wasn't even the main defensive target on his own team during those championship runs. Curry was. He benefited massively from single coverage pretty much the entire time in both series. People who try pulling the "he outplayed LeBron" card (which he didn't) are purposely straying away from the point, which is that he wasn't getting an equal amount of defensive attention. Hell, there are actual clips of Durant just straight up being ignored on defense. Durant has pretty numbers and had some big buckets, but Curry was definitely the better player.

Someone in here actually asked a very silly question, which is why didn't Golden State win without Durant in 2016 (which doesn't even make any sense). I think the better question is why do we think Golden State doesn't win again in 2017, or 2018 for that matter, without him? 2016 happened due to very specific circumstances (Green's suspension, injuries to Bogut and Iggy, LeBron and Irving going nuclear). There's a reason Golden State was up 3-1 in the first place.

I don’t agree and I am a GSW fan who has Curry as his all time favorite player.

Bottom line is that they were unstoppable together in 2017. The defensive focus may even have been more on Curry as some have hypothesised in the past because there was an ultimately of course vain hope that there was some vague chance of stopping Curry and hence the duo while there was almost nothing which could be done about KD if he was next to Curry.

Westbrook was very talented athletically, even more so before the knee injury, but didn’t play smart basketball back in the KD days and OKC sometimes came unstuck because a dual iso game plan didn’t maximise their talents or their benefit to the team, and both were both prone to poor decisions in the denouement of close games.

It is indeed remarkable that LeBron is a great PG along with everything else but since when have all small forwards needed to be point guards ?, particularly one who is possibly the tallest SF ever and quite likely the purest scoring SF ever. He actually said outright that he was going to GSW to play with Curry and to play a more team game, which proved to be a fairly good plan when he duly executed said plan in 2017. Kerr didn’t even go all out because he has a philosophical belief in ensemble play and keeping everyone involved both offensively and defensively, had he chosen he could have just run constant Curry/KD pick and roll plays about which absolutely nothing could have been done. Sure KD flourishes with someone else primarily running the team, but so what ?. As above he played the SF position and some center minutes for GSW,

Curry getting more defensive focus isn’t a hypothesis… it’s a fact.

Lebron guarded Durant and got lit up, then chose not to guard him the following year sooo…

no excuses. Durant FMVP

[Iwasawitness]

I don’t agree and I am a GSW fan who has Curry as his all time favorite player.

Bottom line is that they were unstoppable together in 2017. The defensive focus may even have been more on Curry as some have hypothesised in the past because there was an ultimately of course vain hope that there was some vague chance of stopping Curry and hence the duo while there was almost nothing which could be done about KD if he was next to Curry.

Westbrook was very talented athletically, even more so before the knee injury, but didn’t play smart basketball back in the KD days and OKC sometimes came unstuck because a dual iso game plan didn’t maximise their talents or their benefit to the team, and both were both prone to poor decisions in the denouement of close games.

It is indeed remarkable that LeBron is a great PG along with everything else but since when have all small forwards needed to be point guards ?, particularly one who is possibly the tallest SF ever and quite likely the purest scoring SF ever. He actually said outright that he was going to GSW to play with Curry and to play a more team game, which proved to be a fairly good plan when he duly executed said plan in 2017. Kerr didn’t even go all out because he has a philosophical belief in ensemble play and keeping everyone involved both offensively and defensively, had he chosen he could have just run constant Curry/KD pick and roll plays about which absolutely nothing could have been done. Sure KD flourishes with someone else primarily running the team, but so what ?. As above he played the SF position and some center minutes for GSW,

Curry getting more defensive focus isn’t a hypothesis… it’s a fact.

As I posted in some detail they were a duo playing a team game plan which worked rather well, and it was their combination that made the 2017 GSW team so good. One of them was playing the PG/SG position, the other the SF position, and both of them have all time great skills which are complementary rather than identical. That neither of them tried to do it all on his own is rather the point. It is even vaguely possible that ensemble/team play is superior to heliocentric play in the team sport of basketball.

The strategy which the Cavs adopted which was to focus on Curry actually failed, so there is no proof the strategy was correct or that they could have stopped KD if he had been more their focus. Some have hypothesised that they focused on Curry because they thought there was more chance of stopping Curry than KD. They may have thought there was more chance of stopping them as a duo which is what they needed to do by focusing on Curry. A personal theory of mine at the time was that LeBron decided he would rather be beaten by KD than by a small and by NBA standards unathletic guard.

It’s not a matter of whether or not focusing more on Curry was the correct move or not. That’s not what the discussion at hand is about. It’s what the cavaliers did at the end of the day.