Shams: Raps acquire Ingram for Brown + Olynyk + IND 1st

[douggood]

First post in i don't know how long but wanted to jump on to say i like this trade. I don't understand the skepticism from some posters on it. The team being as bad as it has been is largely due to injuries more than the actual talent on the roster. I really don't believe the trade alters our tank in the slightest, regardless of Ingram or not, the chances of the team bottoming out are slim. So you stay in the 6-12 range, add a all-star level player and look to bounce back next year. Acquisition cost is low, you have to believe that a extension has already been discussed/agreed to. I really like the move, fit is a bit questionable potentially but you are adding talent at a very low cost. The net result of the Siakam trade looks much better now on paper and i think theres more to come (Boucher/Mitchell).

there are 31 games left, raptors will be in tier 2 of tankers, end up in the 5-7 range of the draft. the third tier teams are going for it.

was 9 wins
pels 12 wins
jazz 12 wins
hornets 12 wins
------------------
raptors 16 wins
bkn 17 wins
bulls 22 wins
--------------
sixers 20 wins
blazers 22 wins
hawks 23 wins
spurs 22 wins

[PushDaRock]

$137.3M - Currently guaranteed (9 players)
$40M - Ingram
$2M - Battie (RFA)
$8-13M - FRP

That already gets them to 12 players and $187-192M depending on the pick slot - remember that rookies almost always sign for 20% above the scale. Odd man out could be Agbaji

I'm guessing his first year salary starts at $35m.

Year 2 $37,800,000
Year 3 $40,824,000
Year 4 $44,089,920
PO Year 5 $47,617,113

Total $205,331,033

Pretty vomit-inducing, but I think the 5yr deal is likely advantage they can use to get BI to a lower number.

I think Masai will opt for 3 years at the higher AAV just like he was willing to pay Siakam.

[Psubs]

They need to extend him to a 4 year deal with a 4th year player option to keep things reasonable.

Give him security and possibly no one out there has the cap space to sign him out-right except, Brooklyn and Washington?

[Rapsobsessed7]

Brandon Ingram has a pretty similar impact to Jaylen Brown and Pascal Siakam and we got him for a first round pick.

I do think he can be better if we have him focus on certain areas in his game. He’s a good enough 3 point shooter where he should probably be taking more 3s and less mid range jumpers. He has had a few seasons where he shot 6 3s a game and he shot 39%, 38% and 37% in those seasons (last being this season so far). He is a very good passer which isn’t talked about much.

I think he will actually look better in our offense where we try not to stop the ball, so we’ll see. I do agree with those who say Barrett probably needs to be moved sometime in the near future as we do need another defender in the starting lineup. Maybe we get Harper and this is solved.

Agree 100% with this. If we did get Harper and could move RJ to the 6th man role, i think he would do really well there.

IQ
Harper
Ingram
Scottie
Poeltl

With RJ/Shead/Gradey/Agbaji/Walter off the bench. You probably then look to move on of those for a big but theres a lot to like.

[YogurtProducer]

the issue isn't the pick itself. Like the poeltl trade, the value is fair in a vacuum.
The issue is direction. Like the poeltl trade, we are going to be forced to re-sign Ingram. The team has been a complete disaster and the opportunity to tank in a loaded draft is right there for the taking (jst like the Wemby draft) but instead we are choosing to purse the play-in once again.

Just feels like management continues to take the wrong direction. Tickets sales must have been dropping.

The tank continues this year, I don't think Ingram affects this year.

why do say that? The team is already starting to win more games as they got healthier. Ingram is obviously a talent upgrade over Brown/Kelly.

If we're going to sit Ingram the rest of the season, are we going to be comfortable paying Ingram a huge contract?

Nothing Ingram does over 30 game this year changes what he’s worth or what he will demand.

So it really doesn’t matter.

We won a bunch of games when healthy, and then immediately starting shutting guys down again. Now we got Ingram who even if he plays is going to disrupt the chemistry we started to form, just like how IQ comes back randomly and we look out of sorts.

We’re not gonna win a bunch this year.

[sbsat]

the issue isn't the pick itself. Like the poeltl trade, the value is fair in a vacuum.
The issue is direction. Like the poeltl trade, we are going to be forced to re-sign Ingram. The team has been a complete disaster and the opportunity to tank in a loaded draft is right there for the taking (jst like the Wemby draft) but instead we are choosing to purse the play-in once again.

Just feels like management continues to take the wrong direction. Tickets sales must have been dropping.

The tank continues this year, I don't think Ingram affects this year.

why do say that? The team is already starting to win more games as they got healthier. Ingram is obviously a talent upgrade over Brown/Kelly.

If we're going to sit Ingram the rest of the season, are we going to be comfortable paying Ingram a huge contract?

it looks like they will shuffle him into 10-15 games for the rest of the year. Hes out at least another month from initial reports. The team's bench is now all of our rookies, Olynk and Brown helped us win games recently.

[Boogie!]

I’m honestly not mad at the trace considering the talent level exchanged.

[Jadoogar]

The tank continues this year, I don't think Ingram affects this year.

why do say that? The team is already starting to win more games as they got healthier. Ingram is obviously a talent upgrade over Brown/Kelly.

If we're going to sit Ingram the rest of the season, are we going to be comfortable paying Ingram a huge contract?

Nothing Ingram does over 30 game this year changes what he’s worth or what he will demand.

So it really doesn’t matter.

We won a bunch of games when healthy, and then immediately starting shutting guys down again. Now we got Ingram who even if he plays is going to disrupt the chemistry we started to form, just like how IQ comes back randomly and we look out of sorts.

We’re not gonna win a bunch this year.

i don't think we need to win a "bunch" to screw over the tank. If we go 0.500 the rest of the way it will be terrible. Real tanking teams are going to start putting in the work now. We were never going to catch the wizards or jazz but Nets/Bulls likely surpass us. Maybe the blazers too.

[johanliebert]

Read on Twitter

?s=46

This is what I expected to read but you pseduo execs are never pleased.

[Rapsobsessed7]

First post in i don't know how long but wanted to jump on to say i like this trade. I don't understand the skepticism from some posters on it. The team being as bad as it has been is largely due to injuries more than the actual talent on the roster. I really don't believe the trade alters our tank in the slightest, regardless of Ingram or not, the chances of the team bottoming out are slim. So you stay in the 6-12 range, add a all-star level player and look to bounce back next year. Acquisition cost is low, you have to believe that a extension has already been discussed/agreed to. I really like the move, fit is a bit questionable potentially but you are adding talent at a very low cost. The net result of the Siakam trade looks much better now on paper and i think theres more to come (Boucher/Mitchell).

there are 31 games left, raptors will be in tier 2 of tankers, end up in the 5-7 range of the draft. the third tier teams are going for it.

was 9 wins
pels 12 wins
jazz 12 wins
hornets 12 wins
------------------
raptors 16 wins
bkn 17 wins
bulls 22 wins
--------------
sixers 20 wins
blazers 22 wins
hawks 23 wins
spurs 22 wins

This is my point, Ingram or not, you arent making it into tier 1 baring some significant injury to Scottie. You are likely in that tier 2/early tier 3 position with or without Ingram.

[rapz101]

Whether you’d like the raptors to tank or only make moves that keep us ‘competitive’, the ultimate objective is always to accumulate talent and to optimize on how we do that. We just turned an expiring bruce brown, an old Olynyk, and a middling 1st rder into a talented player that has shown to be effective in certain roles.

I’ve been on the tank train this season. But this move (if the management can continue the stealth tank) can’t be seen as a negative in light of where we are and with hopes of competing meaningfully soon.

We go into next season with this roster healthy + a top 10 pick and hopefully internal growth with dick, jakobe, shead. How is that not something to look forward to?

[hyper316]

First post in i don't know how long but wanted to jump on to say i like this trade. I don't understand the skepticism from some posters on it. The team being as bad as it has been is largely due to injuries more than the actual talent on the roster. I really don't believe the trade alters our tank in the slightest, regardless of Ingram or not, the chances of the team bottoming out are slim. So you stay in the 6-12 range, add a all-star level player and look to bounce back next year. Acquisition cost is low, you have to believe that a extension has already been discussed/agreed to. I really like the move, fit is a bit questionable potentially but you are adding talent at a very low cost. The net result of the Siakam trade looks much better now on paper and i think theres more to come (Boucher/Mitchell).

there are 31 games left, raptors will be in tier 2 of tankers, end up in the 5-7 range of the draft. the third tier teams are going for it.

was 9 wins
pels 12 wins
jazz 12 wins
hornets 12 wins
------------------
raptors 16 wins
bkn 17 wins
bulls 22 wins
--------------
sixers 20 wins
blazers 22 wins
hawks 23 wins
spurs 22 wins

Just hoping for ATL type of luck on draft. Not gonna out tank the bottom 4 now

[disoblige]

Bad fit, we have 5 starters who needs the ball. Quickley, Barret, Barnes, Ingram, Poelt. Jesus

[brownbobcat]

I'm guessing his first year salary starts at $35m.

Year 2 $37,800,000
Year 3 $40,824,000
Year 4 $44,089,920
PO Year 5 $47,617,113

Total $205,331,033

Pretty vomit-inducing, but I think the 5yr deal is likely advantage they can use to get BI to a lower number.

I think Masai will opt for 3 years at the higher AAV just like he was willing to pay Siakam.

The issue with that will be the 1st apron. They're right up against it even if that 1st year starts $40M.

[Tha Cynic]

You could have used this package to trade for Luka.

If Masai was better friends with Nico, we may have been able to convince Nico that the first round pick was too much for a guy who was about to become fat in a few years.

[Duffman100]

Read on Twitter

?s=46

This is what I expected to read but you pseduo execs are never pleased.

Yeah I don't love Ingram, not excited about the deal....

But man the over reactions are nuts.

[rapz101]

Bad fit, we have 5 starters who needs the ball. Quickley, Barret, Barnes, Ingram, Poelt. Jesus

The fit could potentially be clunky, time will tell. But from an asset standpoint, the Raptors have gathered some talent. That has to be a plus in the grand scope of building a contender.

Build value, trade for better talent. We did that with Derozan for years, we’re doing that with RJ as we speak. I think Ingram could probably do that here.

[Tha Cynic]

I know some people are upset by this deal but it’s hard to land an Ingram level talent via free agency /draft and it’s also better than watching Brown expire for nothing

You know who is an ingram level talent? Siakam

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So what you’re saying is we won that trade since we now have Siakam who can play the 3, Ochai and Walter for Siakam who plays the 4?

[DreamTeam09]

RJ and BI are both younger & cheaper

And you forgot, are much worse players than both Siakam and OG

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Plus ingram is about to get paid.
No way we can afford to keep all 4 plus poeltl

Sent from my SM-S921W using RealGM mobile app

. your understanding of the cap is a little off then, besides, both players got paid more so the price comp I don't get

[Los_29]

Bad fit, we have 5 starters who needs the ball. Quickley, Barret, Barnes, Ingram, Poelt. Jesus

Poeltl needs the ball? lol.