The Official 2025 Offseason Thread Part 1

[Ghost of Kleine]

And come back to GM the Phoenix Suns? Tough sell imo. The positive is that Ishbia is not Sarver and won't nickle and dime Myers on a contract and will pay him his worth. The negative is that Ishbia will be very hands on.

I didn't read the stuff about Suns being interested in Myers but if it's in any way true, doesn't that mean JJ is out? Unless it's in a higher position

Ishbia doesn't really want a strong presence like Meyers or another tenured/ established GM. If he did, then he wouldn't have kept Jones and Bartlestein. He obviously wants " YES MEN" that can also be insulatory shields to accountability, so he can continue to play 2K GM/ Owner.

That's also why he previously said he wouldn't have interest in Meyers and this was confirmed before by Gambo who's a mouthpiece for their front office.

I see where you're coming from and it's an argument I've made previously as well but he also like Big Names which Myers absolutely is, Bud absolutely was and so was Vogel

Agreed! Good points!
Ultimately I don't care that much just as long as he doesn't try some BS musical chairs scheme that doesn't really change anything in the front office and tries to pass it off as a forward move towards improvement.

That'd tell me that he hasn't really learned anything so far and that his ego is still dictating outcome.

[lilfishi22]

Ishbia doesn't really want a strong presence like Meyers or another tenured/ established GM. If he did, then he wouldn't have kept Jones and Bartlestein. He obviously wants " YES MEN" that can also be insulatory shields to accountability, so he can continue to play 2K GM/ Owner.

That's also why he previously said he wouldn't have interest in Meyers and this was confirmed before by Gambo who's a mouthpiece for their front office.

I see where you're coming from and it's an argument I've made previously as well but he also like Big Names which Myers absolutely is, Bud absolutely was and so was Vogel

Agreed! Good points!
Ultimately I don't care that much just as long as he doesn't try some BS musical chairs scheme that doesn't really change anything in the front office and tries to pass it off as a forward move towards improvement.

That'd tell me that he hasn't really learned anything so far and that his ego is still dictating outcome.

The biggest reason I don't think he comes is that it just isn't a good career move

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

[Ghost of Kleine]

I see where you're coming from and it's an argument I've made previously as well but he also like Big Names which Myers absolutely is, Bud absolutely was and so was Vogel

Agreed! Good points!
Ultimately I don't care that much just as long as he doesn't try some BS musical chairs scheme that doesn't really change anything in the front office and tries to pass it off as a forward move towards improvement.

That'd tell me that he hasn't really learned anything so far and that his ego is still dictating outcome.

The biggest reason I don't think he comes is that it just isn't a good career move

That might be a prevalent concern for most potential GMs' if even contemplating Phoenix! It could end up career suicide. Also possibly being a GM in name only as Ishbia would likely still play GM behind the scenes given his propensity to tell the fanbase one thing, and then do something completely different.

Just like when he promised Isaiah Thomas wouldn't be involved or making decisions after trying to sell the fanbase on him. But come to find out later that the exact same patterns that led to New York's demise while under his tenure is playing out here now in Phoenix.


The roster building strategy, player archetypes targeted, and the picks thrown away to the point of having no draft capital, etc are identical to what happened in New York.

[Saberestar]

The Orlando Magic couldn't do **** @ Boston even with Tatum out.

I didn't watch the game but just watching the boxscore I understand that they need to get an upgrade at SG. It's a must for them with Banchero and Wagner getting into their primes.

Jonathan Isaac played 7 minutes. He is basically out of their rotation with WCJ, Bitadze and Banchero playing most of PF/C minutes. And they are missing M. Wagner.

I expect them to trade Isaac for whatever. And KCP has been disappointing for them. Then you add Gary Harris and you have (almost) the perfect package for Bradley Beal.

I said it before... Beal HAS TO LOVE the idea of coming back to Florida with the warm weather and an starting role next so Suggs/Wagner/Banchero/WCJ.

Let's try it and avoid the buyout.

[thamadkant]

The Orlando Magic couldn't do **** @ Boston even with Tatum out.

I didn't watch the game but just watching the boxscore I understand that they need to get an upgrade at SG. It's a must for them with Banchero and Wagner getting into their primes.

Jonathan Isaac played 7 minutes. He is basically out of their rotation with WCJ, Bitadze and Banchero playing most of PF/C minutes. And they are missing M. Wagner.

I expect them to trade Isaac for whatever. And KCP has been disappointing for them. Then you add Gary Harris and you have (almost) the perfect package for Bradley Beal.

I said it before... Beal HAS TO LOVE the idea of coming back to Florida with the warm weather and an starting role next so Suggs/Wagner/Banchero/WCJ.

Let's try it and avoid the buyout.

Yeah but Magic don't want Beal... and if they did, they would want him cheap.

[Saberestar]

The Orlando Magic couldn't do **** @ Boston even with Tatum out.

I didn't watch the game but just watching the boxscore I understand that they need to get an upgrade at SG. It's a must for them with Banchero and Wagner getting into their primes.

Jonathan Isaac played 7 minutes. He is basically out of their rotation with WCJ, Bitadze and Banchero playing most of PF/C minutes. And they are missing M. Wagner.

I expect them to trade Isaac for whatever. And KCP has been disappointing for them. Then you add Gary Harris and you have (almost) the perfect package for Bradley Beal.

I said it before... Beal HAS TO LOVE the idea of coming back to Florida with the warm weather and an starting role next so Suggs/Wagner/Banchero/WCJ.

Let's try it and avoid the buyout.

Yeah but Magic don't want Beal... and if they did, they would want him cheap.

Well, I know that is a LONG shot but hopefully we try every avenue. Any type of trade involving Beal would be welcome.

I would keep an eye on Washington. Atlanta and Washington were the only two teams that accepted to take Beal's contract at the past deadline.

Probably Beal is OK going back to his home in the summer with more time to readjust and they would give us their "trash".

Beal ($53.7M) for Kris Middleton ($34M) and Richaun Holmes ($13.3M). Both are expirings. $47.3M so we would reduce our payroll around $6M.

Is that too good? Well, there is another option. We can give them #52 in this year's draft.

Too good yet? Well, we can give them our low 2029 FRP. Hopefully we can get a 2nd back, like we did when trading Nurkic at the deadline.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

Neoklis Avidalas is a 6'8 Greek/:Eurpeon point Guard that's decided to put his name into the draft to test the waters while maintaining college eligibility.

I'd only ask that you watch him play in this clip and tell me who he reminds you of?? 6'8 with great mobility, high IQ, flashy passing, smooth ballhandling and scoring with deep range on his shot. Even good athleticism and vertical burst.

[King4Day]

Things to keep in mind / remember

Beal has major negative value. Teams acquiring him are stuck with a massive cap hit and if it doesn't work, they're screwed (like us).
Kel'el Ware is likely untouchable. Even in a Durant trade

[Ghost of Kleine]

The Orlando Magic couldn't do **** @ Boston even with Tatum out.

I didn't watch the game but just watching the boxscore I understand that they need to get an upgrade at SG. It's a must for them with Banchero and Wagner getting into their primes.

Jonathan Isaac played 7 minutes. He is basically out of their rotation with WCJ, Bitadze and Banchero playing most of PF/C minutes. And they are missing M. Wagner.

I expect them to trade Isaac for whatever. And KCP has been disappointing for them. Then you add Gary Harris and you have (almost) the perfect package for Bradley Beal.

I said it before... Beal HAS TO LOVE the idea of coming back to Florida with the warm weather and an starting role next so Suggs/Wagner/Banchero/WCJ.

Let's try it and avoid the buyout.

This would be a very good trade for both teams involved. For Orlando getting Beal would give them a great scoring guard that'd be a perfect compliment next to the defensively dominant Suggs. And getting Beal would also help space the floor tremendously for Wagner to have open lanes and Banchero to have more room to operate in the paint with his dominant physical play.

Additional bonuses for them in getting off of KCP Who's very solid defensively (fits our interests) but just hasn't shot well for them. And Isaac although a favorite player of the owner for shared political and religious alignments could be swapped similarly for Beal who also shares those similar views/ beliefs. Giving them the floor spacing, and scoring they've desperately searched for.

And for us, Isaac would be another ideal fit for our defensive interests, even if in limited playing time. And is on a low cost only partially guaranteed deal. Losing Bodatze for depth wouldn't feel great, but worse comes to worse, they have multiple picks in this draft to add any number of centers to be his replacement.

OR we could willingly add Richards along with Beal in a follow up trade to fill the gap for them at the low cost of two of their countless future 2nds. And lastly, Gary Harris is just an expiring 7 million salary filler. But for us, can help us stay under the 2nd apron while taking back multiple salaries in the deal.

This is actually a pretty perfect trade for both sides. Neither reallybwilling from a value optics standpoint. So it has a good likelihood of getting done too.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Things to keep in mind / remember

Beal has major negative value. Teams acquiring him are stuck with a massive cap hit and if it doesn't work, they're screwed (like us).
Kel'el Ware is likely untouchable. Even in a Durant trade

Each year that passes though, as he becomes an expiring contract and will have interest in showcasing himself more for his next and potentially last big or decent contract, two things happen:

1- Beal becomes much more amenable to potential trades and waiving his NTC forbthe opportunity to market himself in a more favorable manner to potential teams. Rather than coming across as a difficult player to work with contractually vetoing decisions by authority of his NTC.

He'll absolutely be trying to repair those aspects of his image to not further diminish his percieved market value.

2- The concerns over implied risks become more minimized by the fact that if it doesn't work even with a fully invested Beal (trying to earn his next contract), he'll still afford the recieving team a massive expiring that'd conveniently come off the books in 2027. Giving that team close to 60 million towards a very loaded free agency that summer.

For teams like Miami or any other teams really looking to add another big name or possibly multiple high end depth pieces to their rosters, Beal's expiring represents premium value towards that very interest! A lot can change year to year.

[bwgood77]

That is a very good package. I'm not much of a fan of Robinson or Rozier, but they both can play, possibly have trade value, and to get Ware and two firsts would be awesome.

Man, we really setting our bar low for what we can get in return for KD. Wild.

I think its a reality bar
If you are comparing to what Ishbia paid -- that was such a total overpayment - it skews the return
He is 37 year olds, one year left on his contract -- so of course teams are not going to overpay

I am good with the Miami trade - still hoping for Houston

I don't really see Houston, being that they are loaded at forward. Maybe if they want to deal Brooks, but he is a defensive tone setter who hustles. Book is perfect there. For them it would be best to deal FVV, Eason and maybe another prospect plus 3-4 picks for Book.

[sunsfan1o1]

Read on Twitter

This trade is very solid!! I'd take this and be fairly happy with it honestly. Not as good as the OKC trade with Hartenstein/ Dort/ Wallace/ 2 firsts. But still very solid value for KD.

The trade:

That is a very good package. I'm not much of a fan of Robinson or Rozier, but they both can play, possibly have trade value, and to get Ware and two firsts would be awesome.

Rozier and Robinson's value would be that together they'd give us upwards of 44 million in expiring cap space to begin making key moves as we dip under the 2nd apron.

Now the picks are solid, but the centerpiece that swings this deal to a " yes" is Ware, because without him, the deal just isn't palatable.

Bruh
It’s Kevin Durant. That’s a trade for Bradley Beal.
So you want a guy who doesn’t play (Rozier), a 1 dimensional 3pt shooter unathletic non defender (Robinson), a young big who’s gonna be average at best, a 20th pick who probably won’t amount to anything, a top 5 protected pick that will probably be a mid to lat first rounder because Heat always make the playoffs.
Who’s the point guard of the future? Where are we getting him because we have no draft picks. Smh.

[Frank Lee]

Things to keep in mind / remember

Beal has major negative value. Teams acquiring him are stuck with a massive cap hit and if it doesn't work, they're screwed (like us).
Kel'el Ware is likely untouchable. Even in a Durant trade

Furthermore, yall need not worry about figuring out the picks and swaps as they will be trade fodder anyway.

Somehow this team has to get a legit PG this off season. It’s only a matter of time before the DLo chatter begins. I’m mixed on him, but if he’ll ink up for a one yr cheap deal, it is certainly an option.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Read on Twitter

Alot of credentialed suns media parroting the samevstorybabout Ishbia having interest in Meyers. But as many very smart people here have mentioned,

I just can't see Meyers having interest in trying himself to this reputation killing trainwreck! Especially not knowing the likelihood of being a GM in name only to shadow puppeteer GMs in Ishbia and Thomas.

But this article does mention a likely plan B for Ishbia not being discussed in Milwaukee GM Jon Horst due to his Michigan connection, from Sandusky Michigan.But I'm just not sure about Horst as our new puppet GM??

Anyone know much about him? Good, bad or other??

[dremill24]

Things to keep in mind / remember

Beal has major negative value. Teams acquiring him are stuck with a massive cap hit and if it doesn't work, they're screwed (like us).
Kel'el Ware is likely untouchable. Even in a Durant trade

Furthermore, yall need not worry about figuring out the picks and swaps as they will be trade fodder anyway.

Somehow this team has to get a legit PG this off season. It’s only a matter of time before the DLo chatter begins. I’m mixed on him, but if he’ll ink up for a one yr cheap deal, it is certainly an option.

He might end up being too expensive but if we're wheeling n dealing and get under the 2nd apron, I've had my eye on Dennis Schröder as a stopgap option.

[Saberestar]

Things to keep in mind / remember

Beal has major negative value. Teams acquiring him are stuck with a massive cap hit and if it doesn't work, they're screwed (like us).
Kel'el Ware is likely untouchable. Even in a Durant trade

Ware is invisible so far against the Cavs. And I understand that "bigs take longer to develop" lol but you guys are talking about him like he is putting 20/10 in his sleep.

I have seen so many interesting Cs (Wiseman/Bagley/Bamba comes to my mind) not improving his game for years and years. I would be cautious about him.

[BobbieL]

Read on Twitter

Alot of credentialed suns media parroting the samevstorybabout Ishbia having interest in Meyers. But as many very smart people here have mentioned,

I just can't see Meyers having interest in trying himself to this reputation killing trainwreck! Especially not knowing the likelihood of being a GM in name only to shadow puppeteer GMs in Ishbia and Thomas.

But this article does mention a likely plan B for Ishbia not being discussed in Milwaukee GM Jon Horst due to his Michigan connection, from Sandusky Michigan.But I'm just not sure about Horst as our new puppet GM??

Anyone know much about him? Good, bad or other??

I can see why Ishbia would want Myers - he has the name and cache

For Myers this would be the ultimate challenge -- team is not in a good place. If he could build this team up - would be impressive and Ishbia might listen to him

EdIT; Horst just signed an extension per Shams
X/Twitter is not letting me embed the post

Myers or bust... Ishbia -= open the wallet!

[BobbieL]

That is a very good package. I'm not much of a fan of Robinson or Rozier, but they both can play, possibly have trade value, and to get Ware and two firsts would be awesome.

Rozier and Robinson's value would be that together they'd give us upwards of 44 million in expiring cap space to begin making key moves as we dip under the 2nd apron.

Now the picks are solid, but the centerpiece that swings this deal to a " yes" is Ware, because without him, the deal just isn't palatable.

Bruh
It’s Kevin Durant. That’s a trade for Bradley Beal.
So you want a guy who doesn’t play (Rozier), a 1 dimensional 3pt shooter unathletic non defender (Robinson), a young big who’s gonna be average at best, a 20th pick who probably won’t amount to anything, a top 5 protected pick that will probably be a mid to lat first rounder because Heat always make the playoffs.
Who’s the point guard of the future? Where are we getting him because we have no draft picks. Smh.

Kevin Durant is being over-valued because of his name. This is not the 32 year old Durant or the guy the Suns traded for.

[bwgood77]

Rozier and Robinson's value would be that together they'd give us upwards of 44 million in expiring cap space to begin making key moves as we dip under the 2nd apron.

Now the picks are solid, but the centerpiece that swings this deal to a " yes" is Ware, because without him, the deal just isn't palatable.

Bruh
It’s Kevin Durant. That’s a trade for Bradley Beal.
So you want a guy who doesn’t play (Rozier), a 1 dimensional 3pt shooter unathletic non defender (Robinson), a young big who’s gonna be average at best, a 20th pick who probably won’t amount to anything, a top 5 protected pick that will probably be a mid to lat first rounder because Heat always make the playoffs.
Who’s the point guard of the future? Where are we getting him because we have no draft picks. Smh.

Kevin Durant is being over-valued because of his name. This is not the 32 year old Durant or the guy the Suns traded for.

I don't "want" Rozier or Robinson, but we need salary fillers to match. They expire and give us a ton of cap space, then we get a very good rookie prospect and 2 first round picks, which we desperately need.

We are not going to get a better offer than 2 firsts and a good prospect. I don't care about older players. I don't plan on keeping them. I either trade them or let them expire. Then we have 2 firsts, a C for the future and cap space.