bwgood77 wrote:ChuckS wrote:Revived wrote:“Great player now” yeah that must be why he took the Suns to…missing the playoffs and 35 wins this season.
There is no “future” with a 36 yr old. That trade giving up Mikal, Cam and 4 first round picks is one of the worst trades to ever be made. Mikal himself netted 5 first rd picks so basically Suns traded 9 first rd picks and Cam Johnson for a 35 yr old KD.
Mikal helped this team get to the Finals and come just 2 wins shy of a chip. KD helped this team get swept in the first round and for players to do this to the Suns:
KD is the most overrated superstar player in maybe all of sports history. Guy is extremely turnover prone in big moments and only time he’s ever won jack **** in his life was he did the weakest move ever in sports by joining a 63 win team like a b****h. That same team won before he joined and after he left. Meanwhile he’s accomplished absolutely nothing in his career without that team.
You keep licking that boot though man, nobody else here can do it as well as you. I know Ishbia appreciates it.
Everyone has a favorite player, and I really liked Mikal when I followed the Nets. And he was on the one finals team (that lost) with the Suns, in its 56 or so years. But KD was on four finals teams in his 17 years. With OKC he lost two, once against LeBron, Wade, and Bosch, and the other against Curry, Thompson, Green, etal. He won twice with GS, being finals MVP both times. Looking at that and the totality of their respective careers I doubt anyone in the NBA could really believe that Mikal is anywhere close to KD. I suspect it's an Arizona thing. I'm not knocking anyone. When I followed GS with KD, Steph, Klay, and Draymond, my favorite players were Iguodala and Livingston. So I can be as dumb as anyone. In my defense, though, I never believed my favorites were the teams' best.
The finals MVPs should say it all about Durant's exceptionalism, but I think Draymond's opinion is also helpful when weighing the valuable opinions of anonymous posters. He said: “But the reality is, I don’t think that team wins another championship if Kevin doesn’t come … We would not have beat the Cavs coming back around without Kevin.” “Teams had figured us out, and I personally don’t think at that point Steph Curry had figured out, ‘I’m going to get a bucket whenever I want to,’” Green said. “I don’t think he was capable of that yet. I think he was still growing into that.” (My Note --Remember that Iguodala won their previous finals MVP.) “... The reality is, we got to a point where we needed to be able to give someone the ball that can just go get a bucket,” Green continued. “And Kevin was already there. I don’t think Steph was there yet. So it gets us through those two years. We get those two championships.” Also while with GS, Kevin was an NBA first team and a 2d team selection, and a defensive player of the year consideration..
With OKC he won four scoring titles, was a league MVP, with three 2d place runner ups, and a ROY. He was an all-star with every team he has played for, with (I think) 15 in all. So, in summary, I believe your analyses of KD and Saber are not supported by the facts, and I will just agree to disagree.
He only made one finals with OKC. He obviously couldn't have played the Warriors in the finals with OKC. He made 4 but his last one he got injured and they lost to Toronto. GS still easily wins finals without him. The Cavs got pretty lucky with Draymond out and had a few great plays in that one.
No one is arguing Mikal is anywhere near as good as KD. People may like him better as a player. KD is talented, I enjoyed watching him on OKC, but hated seeing him join that championship team. He just joined a team and made a team that already broke the record in season wins and had won a championship so stacked it wouldn't lose. They were already miles better than anyone in the west and the Cavs had just had a crazy series to take one from them.
Anyway, we've seen what he can do post Warriors even with multiple other stars...not much. He is a great player but not really a guy that you want to build around to consistently get far. That's been proven.
My bad. You are correct that KD had 3 finals with GS and only one with OKC. But that one WAS against GS (in 2016) and although KD was high scorer for the series, OKC lost in seven games. -- EDIT: MY BAD PART 2: I'M SO SCREWED UP -- IT OF COURSE WAS THE CONFERENCE FINALS. (VERY EMBARRASSING -- THANKS FOR IGNORING IT.) -- Some believe he would have had a third title, or at least another finals, if his toe wasn't on the line on a clutch three point attempt that would have won the seven game series against the Bucks in the 21 conference semi-finals. So he wasn't as unimportant as you suggest even with the Nets. That leaves the Suns which everyone knows suck because of a horrible supporting cast. I think it is for lack of a good four and PG, which would also solve their currently poor depth. So the only thing that has been proven is that a TEAM has to be good to win a title or even reach the finals, not that KD is great but has some tragic flaw. Most players who have won more than two titles have been on long, or shorter, dynasty teams, mostly the Minny Lakers, LAL, Boston, or GSW, Chicago, Spurs etc. Even Wilt won only two, Oscar and West only one, and numerous other all time 75 none. But on this board Kevin's two championships and two finals appearances don't seem to count. I will not characterize such thinking, merely disagree.
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10053107-klay-thompson-it-bothers-me-when-people-dont-talk-about-kevin-durants-greatness
