All of SGA game 1 drawn fouls

[AbeVigodaLive]

The last couple of posts is why this topic has legs.

1. If you look ever so slightly at here or here and then look into the glowing haze of the midnight moon on the latitudinal plane and imagine this and then check out this angle of the Zapruder film... you can see the contact!

2. Then why isn't it called when it happens to A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H... et al?

Both things can be true.

SGA is a gifted supremely talented athlete. He can do things nobody else can do. He also flops intentionally and flamboyantly after the most marginal contact with the clear intent of tricking officials into calling a foul. Both things can be true.

I don't see why this is all that difficult... even if someone is an SGA or OKC fan. It's ok to say (a) he's a deserving MVP, and (b) he's a foul grifter, which compromises the aesthetics and enjoyment (and possibly even integrity) of the game.

If that's what we want as NBA fans... cool. We'll adjust. Heck, we've seen it happen on the political stage. If it's what the people want... so be it.

But is this grifting really what most NBA fans want? Or, only fans of that team and player?

name the player that doesn't search for every possible advantage within the rules AND ill show you someone who isn't that good...

SGA is playing the game at the highest level and he is doing it the RIGHT way...how do I know its the right way?



he has the hardware to prove it now...he was rewarded for his game and crowned the MOST VALUEABLE PLAYER.

as famously said once by King Vegeta in the throne room on planet Vegeta to his son, also named Vegeta..."dont hate the player, hate the game"

That doesn't refute anything I wrote. LOL.

[Alatan]

NBA needs to get rid of these freedom of movement rules. They are killing the game. Allow players to make body to body contact while moving so we can see some defense being played without a whistle being blown selectively for ref darlings.

[Big nick]

So if Edwards wants to go to the free throw line he needs to drive the lane and stop shooting all those threes like a pus. Sga is so much better inside that defenders have to foul him. And why aren’t there aren’t gripes with lebron or Luka or Brunson curry or joker or others that get to the line often. People are jealous and going to hate I bet the complainers wouldn’t complain if sga was on there team BROTHER.

[CS707]

The criticism isn’t that he doesn’t get fouled, it’s that he plays the game to get fouled.

Is that different than someone trying to get fouled? In other words there's guys who try to avoid contact, guys who actively seek it (playing to get fouled), and those who look to "grift" players into fouling them? The distinction being some styles of play simply create more contact vs the focus being to get a foul called via trying to get a player off balance and then initiate contact for the foul to be called.

As I'd agree, SGA's zig zag style causes more players to foul him. That's not looking for fouls like a harden would do.

I'd put him closer to the Harden category but it's all subjective.

Do I think SGA actively applies drawing fouls as a scoring strategy? Yes.

That doesn't mean he's not actually being fouled.

[dhsilv2]

The criticism isn’t that he doesn’t get fouled, it’s that he plays the game to get fouled.

Is that different than someone trying to get fouled? In other words there's guys who try to avoid contact, guys who actively seek it (playing to get fouled), and those who look to "grift" players into fouling them? The distinction being some styles of play simply create more contact vs the focus being to get a foul called via trying to get a player off balance and then initiate contact for the foul to be called.

As I'd agree, SGA's zig zag style causes more players to foul him. That's not looking for fouls like a harden would do.

I'd put him closer to the Harden category but it's all subjective.

Do I think SGA actively applies drawing fouls as a scoring strategy? Yes.

That doesn't mean he's not actually being fouled.

Gotcha...yeah I can't see that at all. Harden was getting guys off balance to force them into fouling him. SGA's game leads to fouls because...he doesn't have that vertical speed and power to finish. So he kinda hunts for angles to get advantages...and people just foul there.

But fair enough.

[CobraCommander]

The last couple of posts is why this topic has legs.

1. If you look ever so slightly at here or here and then look into the glowing haze of the midnight moon on the latitudinal plane and imagine this and then check out this angle of the Zapruder film... you can see the contact!

2. Then why isn't it called when it happens to A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H... et al?

Both things can be true.

SGA is a gifted supremely talented athlete. He can do things nobody else can do. He also flops intentionally and flamboyantly after the most marginal contact with the clear intent of tricking officials into calling a foul. Both things can be true.

I don't see why this is all that difficult... even if someone is an SGA or OKC fan. It's ok to say (a) he's a deserving MVP, and (b) he's a foul grifter, which compromises the aesthetics and enjoyment (and possibly even integrity) of the game.

If that's what we want as NBA fans... cool. We'll adjust. Heck, we've seen it happen on the political stage. If it's what the people want... so be it.

But is this grifting really what most NBA fans want? Or, only fans of that team and player?

name the player that doesn't search for every possible advantage within the rules AND ill show you someone who isn't that good...

SGA is playing the game at the highest level and he is doing it the RIGHT way...how do I know its the right way?



he has the hardware to prove it now...he was rewarded for his game and crowned the MOST VALUEABLE PLAYER.

as famously said once by King Vegeta in the throne room on planet Vegeta to his son, also named Vegeta..."dont hate the player, hate the game"

That doesn't refute anything I wrote. LOL.

Cause I agree with 100% of what you wrote and thats what makes SGA the mvp...if you gonna be a foul merchant...be the best foul merchant possible!!!!

as seen in this interview where he said...

"im just out here trying to get the most fouls calls per game and I don't think anyone can stop me"- SGA

[ropjhk]

name the player that doesn't search for every possible advantage within the rules AND ill show you someone who isn't that good...

SGA is playing the game at the highest level and he is doing it the RIGHT way...how do I know its the right way?



he has the hardware to prove it now...he was rewarded for his game and crowned the MOST VALUEABLE PLAYER.

as famously said once by King Vegeta in the throne room on planet Vegeta to his son, also named Vegeta..."dont hate the player, hate the game"

That doesn't refute anything I wrote. LOL.

Cause I agree with 100% of what you wrote and thats what makes SGA the mvp...if you gonna be a foul merchant...be the best foul merchant possible!!!!

as seen in this interview where he said...

"im just out here trying to get the most fouls calls per game and I don't think anyone can stop me"- SGA

Don't hate the player. Hate the game.

It's not on SGA to not take advantage of the rules. It's up to the rules committee to redesign the rules to discourage the type of foul baiting play style that fans hate to see.

I think a lot of the fouls in those replays look soft. They look like they could be fouls according to the rulebook but they also look like the type of fouls that fans hate to see called.

[picc]

This is the approach I would take if I was a Thunder fan:

"Yeah, SGA gets reffed a little differently from everyone else, and the way OKC defends juxtaposed against that looks unfair and one-sided. For sure. But guess what? I don't give a ****. Its my team and I'm if it happens for anyone, I'm glad it's us. You're right but go cry a river."

I think that'd be a more respectable approach than just pretending literally everyone else on the planet is clinically insane. Or that SGA is the victim of some calculated hate campaign despite being as innocuous and non-polarizing a personality as a player can be.

I don't think SGA is a foul baiter like Harden or Brunson. He just gets an extremely friendly whistle that others don't. Same thing with Jimmy Butler. It's not their fault the refs like them better.

But insisting everyone is just conjuring all this up in their head makes you look either insanely dense and disingenuous or just plain dumb. Not that you are, but that's what it looks like. Just nut up and admit you don't' give a **** and it is what it is. Can respect that.

[CobraCommander]

That doesn't refute anything I wrote. LOL.

Cause I agree with 100% of what you wrote and thats what makes SGA the mvp...if you gonna be a foul merchant...be the best foul merchant possible!!!!

as seen in this interview where he said...

"im just out here trying to get the most fouls calls per game and I don't think anyone can stop me"- SGA

Don't hate the player. Hate the game.

It's not on SGA to not take advantage of the rules. It's up to the rules committee to redesign the rules to discourage the type of foul baiting play style that fans hate to see.

I think a lot of the fouls in those replays look soft. They look like they could be fouls according to the rulebook but they also look like the type of fouls that fans hate to see called.

“10 FTs a game from 90% ft shooter is better than 4 FTs… im - the greatest American” -signed. sga

[og15]

This is the approach I would take if I was a Thunder fan:

"Yeah, SGA gets reffed a little differently from everyone else, and the way OKC defends juxtaposed against that looks unfair and one-sided. For sure. But guess what? I don't give a ****. Its my team and I'm if it happens for anyone, I'm glad it's us. You're right but go cry a river."

I think that'd be a more respectable approach than just pretending literally everyone else on the planet is clinically insane. Or that SGA is the victim of some calculated hate campaign despite being as innocuous and non-polarizing a personality as a player can be.

I don't think SGA is a foul baiter like Harden or Brunson. He just gets an extremely friendly whistle that others don't. Same thing with Jimmy Butler. It's not their fault the refs like them better.

But insisting everyone is just conjuring all this up in their head makes you look either insanely dense and disingenuous or just plain dumb. Not that you are, but that's what it looks like. Just nut up and admit you don't' give a **** and it is what it is. Can respect that.

It's not about who is liked or not liked, it's more about what styles of play are more likely to generate calls. I think people get mixed up thinking of these things as refs liking this guy vs not liking this other guy.

Honestly, with SGA's calls, when I watch them over, they are usually not as bad as the reactions I see to them. I think after a while there's a level of confirmation bias and extra vigilance towards these things that we almost think guys like him should get zero FTA or like 3 FTA/game.

I just don't know what amount of FTA people think would be a fair whistle, because when I examine, I can see on average like 0.5 fewer FTA/G, at most like 1 FTA/G, but that's pushing it, and I'm just not going to get all riled up about that. (But others can, I'm not saying other people can't, we all have our tolerances)

[NoBias]

SGA haters are typically Jokic fans or Edward’s fans.

I can’t wait for him to get his first finals mvp.

They also tend to be fans of clean, honest and fair basketball who dislike underhanded tactics, but what would I know.

Then there’s a list of NBA players who’d be ahead of Shai in that category.

[badpotato]

SGA haters are typically Jokic fans or Edward’s fans.

I can’t wait for him to get his first finals mvp.

They also tend to be fans of clean, honest and fair basketball who dislike underhanded tactics, but what would I know.

Then there’s a list of NBA players who’d be ahead of Shai in that category.

You're telling me that dirty defenders like Dray or merchants like Harden get off free and no one complains about them?

We must've been attending different NBA forums then.

[picc]

This is the approach I would take if I was a Thunder fan:

"Yeah, SGA gets reffed a little differently from everyone else, and the way OKC defends juxtaposed against that looks unfair and one-sided. For sure. But guess what? I don't give a ****. Its my team and I'm if it happens for anyone, I'm glad it's us. You're right but go cry a river."

I think that'd be a more respectable approach than just pretending literally everyone else on the planet is clinically insane. Or that SGA is the victim of some calculated hate campaign despite being as innocuous and non-polarizing a personality as a player can be.

I don't think SGA is a foul baiter like Harden or Brunson. He just gets an extremely friendly whistle that others don't. Same thing with Jimmy Butler. It's not their fault the refs like them better.

But insisting everyone is just conjuring all this up in their head makes you look either insanely dense and disingenuous or just plain dumb. Not that you are, but that's what it looks like. Just nut up and admit you don't' give a **** and it is what it is. Can respect that.

It's not about who is liked or not liked, it's more about what styles of play are more likely to generate calls. I think people get mixed up thinking of these things as refs liking this guy vs not liking this other guy.

Honestly, with SGA's calls, when I watch them over, they are usually not as bad as the reactions I see to them. I think after a while there's a level of confirmation bias and extra vigilance towards these things that we almost think guys like him should get zero FTA or like 3 FTA/game.

I just don't know what amount of FTA people think would be a fair whistle, because when I examine, I can see on average like 0.5 fewer FTA/G, at most like 1 FTA/G, but that's pushing it, and I'm just not going to get all riled up about that. (But others can, I'm not saying other people can't, we all have our tolerances)

Again though, the point isn't that SGA's foul calls are all bogus. Its that he's the only one who gets to bowl with bumpers on the lanes, while everyone else has to play rugby -- especially against the OKC defense.

[MoneyTalks41890]

This is the approach I would take if I was a Thunder fan:

"Yeah, SGA gets reffed a little differently from everyone else, and the way OKC defends juxtaposed against that looks unfair and one-sided. For sure. But guess what? I don't give a ****. Its my team and I'm if it happens for anyone, I'm glad it's us. You're right but go cry a river."

I think that'd be a more respectable approach than just pretending literally everyone else on the planet is clinically insane. Or that SGA is the victim of some calculated hate campaign despite being as innocuous and non-polarizing a personality as a player can be.

I don't think SGA is a foul baiter like Harden or Brunson. He just gets an extremely friendly whistle that others don't. Same thing with Jimmy Butler. It's not their fault the refs like them better.

But insisting everyone is just conjuring all this up in their head makes you look either insanely dense and disingenuous or just plain dumb. Not that you are, but that's what it looks like. Just nut up and admit you don't' give a **** and it is what it is. Can respect that.

It's not about who is liked or not liked, it's more about what styles of play are more likely to generate calls. I think people get mixed up thinking of these things as refs liking this guy vs not liking this other guy.

Honestly, with SGA's calls, when I watch them over, they are usually not as bad as the reactions I see to them. I think after a while there's a level of confirmation bias and extra vigilance towards these things that we almost think guys like him should get zero FTA or like 3 FTA/game.

I just don't know what amount of FTA people think would be a fair whistle, because when I examine, I can see on average like 0.5 fewer FTA/G, at most like 1 FTA/G, but that's pushing it, and I'm just not going to get all riled up about that. (But others can, I'm not saying other people can't, we all have our tolerances)

Again though, the point isn't that SGA's foul calls are all bogus. Its that he's the only one who gets to bowl with bumpers on the lanes, while everyone else has to play rugby -- especially against the OKC defense.

The issue here is that there’s nothing empirical about this at all. It’s just feelings.

If you watch closely you see how SGA beats his man and often has the defender out of position/on the back of his hip and then makes a move forcing the defender to foul.

Does he deserve every foul? No, but that is true of every player.

At bottom, there’s a lot of complaining without presenting evidence, like OP did.

Folks have a right to complain about whatever they want but it doesn’t mean the rest of us have to take them seriously.

It’s not lost on me that a lot of the complaints come from fans of the teams the Thunder have passed by during the successful rebuild, as well as fans of players that SGA worked his butt off to be better than.

[badpotato]

The issue here is that there’s nothing empirical about this at all. It’s just feelings.

It's just feelings that are being evoked in fans repeatedly since start of the season whenever they watch OKC games. It is happening for a reason.

Not that you should care- your team will be getting a title soon. It's no coincidence that a lot of people have this ugly feeling that opposing team is being screwed over whenever they tune in to watch OKC game though.

[picc]

The issue here is that there’s nothing empirical about this at all. It’s just feelings.

If you watch closely you see how SGA beats his man and often has the defender out of position/on the back of his hip and then makes a move forcing the defender to foul.

Does he deserve every foul? No, but that is true of every player.

At bottom, there’s a lot of complaining without presenting evidence, like OP did.

Folks have a right to complain about whatever they want but it doesn’t mean the rest of us have to take them seriously.

It’s not lost on me that a lot of the complaints come from fans of the teams the Thunder have passed by during the successful rebuild, as well as fans of players that SGA worked his butt off to be better than.

Cool.

[Walmart]

OKC being allowed to play a different level of defense without getting reach-in fouls only requires two working eyeballs.

[DonaldSanders]

SGA dominated from start to finish. I didn't see many bunk calls, and the Wolves got some too.

Last game the 1st Q was a bit soft I agree, but tonight was a masterclass by SGA and if you're complaining about fouls you're just being salty.

I think the rulebook could use some tweaks, but I saw both teams getting some of those gimmies. Wolves short more FTs.

[CobraCommander]

Anyone hating SGA after watching today’s game and his mvp press conference has a serious issue with greatness and classy team first behavior


He thanked his teammates before anyone else- this dude is the mvp and most well liked mvp ever

[Patches Perry]

This is the approach I would take if I was a Thunder fan:

"Yeah, SGA gets reffed a little differently from everyone else, and the way OKC defends juxtaposed against that looks unfair and one-sided. For sure. But guess what? I don't give a ****. Its my team and I'm if it happens for anyone, I'm glad it's us. You're right but go cry a river."

I think that'd be a more respectable approach than just pretending literally everyone else on the planet is clinically insane. Or that SGA is the victim of some calculated hate campaign despite being as innocuous and non-polarizing a personality as a player can be.

I don't think SGA is a foul baiter like Harden or Brunson. He just gets an extremely friendly whistle that others don't. Same thing with Jimmy Butler. It's not their fault the refs like them better.

But insisting everyone is just conjuring all this up in their head makes you look either insanely dense and disingenuous or just plain dumb. Not that you are, but that's what it looks like. Just nut up and admit you don't' give a **** and it is what it is. Can respect that.

There was a poll like a week ago that hundreds of people on this forum voted in, and 80% think the NBA lottery is rigged despite all evidence pointing to the contrary. From the reactions after the lottery, that's likely the consensus of basketball fans at large. Just because a lot of people believe something, doesn't mean they aren't being conspiratorial about it, and it obviously doesn't mean they are correct.