Trade Talk (Part 17): Early Offseason Planning

[BlacJacMac]

PHO OUT: KD
PHO IN: Rudy Gobert, Barnes, #14, #17

SAS OUT: Barnes, Fox, #14
SAS IN: KD

MIN OUT: Rudy Gobert, #17, Miller
MIN IN: Fox

Who says no?

I do!!!

Gross.

[Ethomasp31]

PHO OUT: KD
PHO IN: Rudy Gobert, Barnes, #14, #17

SAS OUT: Barnes, Fox, #14
SAS IN: KD

MIN OUT: Rudy Gobert, #17, Miller
MIN IN: Fox

Who says no?

I think I proposed a trade similar to this a couple of days ago. I certainly wouldn't say no. Who is getting Miller? We might have to give up TSJ or Clark instead of Miller. I kind of think that is a deal breaker for some on here.

[Ethomasp31]

PHO OUT: KD
PHO IN: Rudy Gobert, Barnes, #14, #17

SAS OUT: Barnes, Fox, #14
SAS IN: KD

MIN OUT: Rudy Gobert, #17, Miller
MIN IN: Fox

Who says no?

I do!!!

Gross.

Can you explain why you would say no? I get that Fox is a free agent after this season, but we would get out of Rudy's contract, which is $35M, $36.5M and a player option he would probably pick up for $38M the following year. I honestly think it's a no brainer for the Wolves. Connelly has hinted that he didn't see much a difference between 17 and 31. I think there is a good chance that pick will be moved whether we get KD or not. Moving that salary could keep us out of the 2nd Apron.

[Neeva]

That’s too good for Phoenix.

[moss_is_1]

PHO OUT: KD
PHO IN: Rudy Gobert, Barnes, #14, #17

SAS OUT: Barnes, Fox, #14
SAS IN: KD

MIN OUT: Rudy Gobert, #17, Miller
MIN IN: Fox

Who says no?

I do!!!

Gross.

Can you explain why you would say no? I get that Fox is a free agent after this season, but we would get out of Rudy's contract, which is $35M, $36.5M and a player option he would probably pick up for $38M the following year. I honestly think it's a no brainer for the Wolves. Connelly has hinted that he didn't see much a difference between 17 and 31. I think there is a good chance that pick will be moved whether we get KD or not. Moving that salary could keep us out of the 2nd Apron.

Fox doesn't make sense. Especially not at the expense of Rudy. Makes our defense way worse.

[BlacJacMac]

PHO OUT: KD
PHO IN: Rudy Gobert, Barnes, #14, #17

SAS OUT: Barnes, Fox, #14
SAS IN: KD

MIN OUT: Rudy Gobert, #17, Miller
MIN IN: Fox

Who says no?

I do!!!

Gross.

Can you explain why you would say no? I get that Fox is a free agent after this season, but we would get out of Rudy's contract, which is $35M, $36.5M and a player option he would probably pick up for $38M the following year. I honestly think it's a no brainer for the Wolves. Connelly has hinted that he didn't see much a difference between 17 and 31. I think there is a good chance that pick will be moved whether we get KD or not. Moving that salary could keep us out of the 2nd Apron.

He's not a shooter or defender and his game is based so much on his speed that he's likely not going to age well. And he needs the ball in his hands to be effective.

Plus Fox is eligible for a four-year, $228 million extension that would keep him under contract for the next five seasons, including the last year of his current contract. At almost 28 years-old, we would be paying Fox through his age 32 season, when he'd be making around $60 million.

[Neeva]

Yea Fox was kind of mediocre with the Spurs, doesn’t care on defense, way expensive for his on court production and low effect on winning .

[minimus]

PHO OUT: KD
PHO IN: Rudy Gobert, Barnes, #14, #17

SAS OUT: Barnes, Fox, #14
SAS IN: KD

MIN OUT: Rudy Gobert, #17, Miller
MIN IN: Fox

Who says no?

I think I proposed a trade similar to this a couple of days ago. I certainly wouldn't say no. Who is getting Miller? We might have to give up TSJ or Clark instead of Miller. I kind of think that is a deal breaker for some on here.

Yeah, I would NOT give up DDV, Dillingham, TSJ or Clark. The reasoning is simple: MIN need to balance very expensive Ant and Fox contracts with team friendly deals. Here is my explanation for this trade idea:

1) two years ago Fox was the best scorer in NBA in the clutch. I dont know whether injuries affected his game recently but he could be answer for Finch motion offense because it was something that Brown installed in SAC

Watch on YouTube

2) I see some similarities between SAC and MIN backcourt construction:

Monk - Dillingham as 6th man scorer
Huerter - DDV as off ball shooter (although DDV is much better defender, Hueter has edge as off ball scorer/passer)
Murray/Barnes - McDaniels/Reid as versatile defender and big wing shooter

3) this trade leaves obvious holes in frontcourt and assumes that TC can re-sign Reid (maybe by promising bigger role and starting PF job). But even with Reid, TC would need to trade Randle and find two bigs. My plan would be following: re-sign Reid, draft Hansen Yang, get Day'Ron Sharpe from Brooklyn

Sharpe/Reid/Yang
Reid/McDaniels/Minott
McDaniels/TJ/Clark
Edwards/DDV/Clark
Fox/Dillingham/Conley

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Finally, our coaching staff must convince and teach this roster how to play with pace and space. Basically learn and adopt from current Finals, it is not only about playing fast, but more importantly make quick, smart decisions with and without the ball.

[minimus]

Gobert is needed. Two man line ups

Gobert + Naz: +11.8
Gobert + Randle: +5.4
Naz + Randle: +2.4

Read on Twitter

Combining two things in one trade idea:

ATL IN: Gobert, 17 pick 2025, TJ, Minot
ATL OUT: Okongwu, Mann, Niang and 13 and 22 picks 2025

Why for ATL: improve defense, add size, get rid of Mann contract

ORL IN: Mann,
ORL OUT: Isaac

Why for ORL: get another shooter and pick

MIN IN: Okongwu, Isaac, Niang, 13 pick 2025
MIN OUT: Gobert, 17 pick 2025, TJ and Minot

Why for MIN: replace Gobert elite defense with combination of Okongwu/Isaac. As shrink wrote, Randle and Reid are better with elite rim protector. Then add two team friendly rookie contracts. Draft Demin at 13, one of Kalkbrenner, Beringer, Raynaud, Niederhauser at 31. Resign Randle and Reid at reasonable price. Isaac signed 60/4 extension starting next year, first season 2025/26 is fully guaranteed, in 2026/27 only 8 mil are guaranteed. Last two years are team option.

So final roster at the beginning of 2025-26 season could like

Okongwu/Isaac/Kalkbrenner
Randle/Reid/Miller
McDaniels/Demin/Niang
Edwards/Clark/DDV
DDV/Dillingham/Conley

Niang and Conley are 19 mil of expiring contracts. Isaac might only 8 mil guaranteed in 2026/27 might be an interesting tool for TC when some teams might find useful 15 mil outgoing in trade

[frankenwolf]

Gobert is needed. Two man line ups

Gobert + Naz: +11.8
Gobert + Randle: +5.4
Naz + Randle: +2.4

Read on Twitter

Combining two things in one trade idea:

ATL IN: Gobert, 17 pick 2025, TJ, Minot
ATL OUT: Okongwu, Mann, Niang and 13 and 22 picks 2025

Why for ATL: improve defense, add size, get rid of Mann contract

ORL IN: Mann,
ORL OUT: Isaac

Why for ORL: get another shooter and pick

MIN IN: Okongwu, Isaac, Niang, 13 pick 2025
MIN OUT: Gobert, 17 pick 2025, TJ and Minot

Why for MIN: replace Gobert elite defense with combination of Okongwu/Isaac. As shrink wrote, Randle and Reid are better with elite rim protector. Then add two team friendly rookie contracts. Draft Demin at 13, one of Kalkbrenner, Beringer, Raynaud, Niederhauser at 31. Resign Randle and Reid at reasonable price. Isaac signed 60/4 extension starting next year, first season 2025/26 is fully guaranteed, in 2026/27 only 8 mil are guaranteed. Last two years are team option.

So final roster at the beginning of 2025-26 season could like

Okongwu/Isaac/Kalkbrenner
Randle/Reid/Miller
McDaniels/Demin/Niang
Edwards/Clark/DDV
DDV/Dillingham/Conley

Niang and Conley are 19 mil of expiring contracts. Isaac might only 8 mil guaranteed in 2026/27 might be an interesting tool for TC when some teams might find useful 15 mil outgoing in trade

I am not sure I get why ATL would do this, based on their stated interest in Maluach. Goberts game isn't the same. This trade does not help them move up to get him, either.

[Dewey]

Gobert is needed. Two man line ups

Gobert + Naz: +11.8
Gobert + Randle: +5.4
Naz + Randle: +2.4

Read on Twitter

Combining two things in one trade idea:

ATL IN: Gobert, 17 pick 2025, TJ, Minot
ATL OUT: Okongwu, Mann, Niang and 13 and 22 picks 2025

Why for ATL: improve defense, add size, get rid of Mann contract

ORL IN: Mann,
ORL OUT: Isaac

Why for ORL: get another shooter and pick

MIN IN: Okongwu, Isaac, Niang, 13 pick 2025
MIN OUT: Gobert, 17 pick 2025, TJ and Minot

Why for MIN: replace Gobert elite defense with combination of Okongwu/Isaac. As shrink wrote, Randle and Reid are better with elite rim protector. Then add two team friendly rookie contracts. Draft Demin at 13, one of Kalkbrenner, Beringer, Raynaud, Niederhauser at 31. Resign Randle and Reid at reasonable price. Isaac signed 60/4 extension starting next year, first season 2025/26 is fully guaranteed, in 2026/27 only 8 mil are guaranteed. Last two years are team option.

So final roster at the beginning of 2025-26 season could like

Okongwu/Isaac/Kalkbrenner
Randle/Reid/Miller
McDaniels/Demin/Niang
Edwards/Clark/DDV
DDV/Dillingham/Conley

Niang and Conley are 19 mil of expiring contracts. Isaac might only 8 mil guaranteed in 2026/27 might be an interesting tool for TC when some teams might find useful 15 mil outgoing in trade

I am not sure I get why ATL would do this, based on their stated interest in Maluach. Goberts game isn't the same. This trade does not help them move up to get him, either.

Wolves going anywhere with DDV, Dillingham, Conley … unless Dillingham breaks out in a big way. Conley cooked and DDV is a role player

[minimus]

My last attempt before draft, lol

LAL OUT: Hachimura, Kleber
LAL IN: Vucevic, Dosunmu

Why for LAL: get a starting C

CHI OUT: Vucevic, Dosunmu, Ball, Smith
CHI IN: Gobert, Hachimura, Miller, Minot

Why for CHI: continues rebuild, on paper Gobert and Hachimura 3PT shooting can be a good fit

MIN OUT: Gobert, Miller, Minot
MIN IN: Kleber, Ball, Smith

Why for MIN: continues to reshape roster around Edwards. Re-sign Randle, Reid. Draft Sorber and let him fully recover, at 31 grab Thiero

Smith/Reid/Sorber
Randle/Kleber/Thiero
McDaniels/TJ/Thiero
Edwards/DDV/Clark
Ball/Dillingham/Conley

This is my variation of IND roster construction:

Smith/Kleber/Sorber as Turner/Toppin/Bryant/Jackson
Randle/Reid/Theiro as Siakam/Toppin/Walker
McDaniels/TJ/Clark as Neismith/Mathurin/Sheppard
Edwards/DDV/Ball/Dillingham as Haliburton/Nembhard/McConnell

Next offseason Ball, Kleber and Conley becomes 30 mil of expiring contracts (although Ball has team option for another season)

Smith/Reid/Sorber
Randle/???/Thiero
McDaniels/TJ/Thiero
Edwards/DDV/Clark
Ball/Dillingham/???

[shrink]

MIN OUT: Gobert, Miller, Minot
MIN IN: Kleber, Ball, Smith

Ball can’t be traded until August, and I think Gobert is worth more than this. He was still All Defense (second team) last year, and finished the season so strong, so age is not an answer. What he needs is for Ant to learn to throw the lob, and be willing to do it. This would increase the offense for both Rudy and Ant.

[BlacJacMac]

MIN OUT: Gobert, Miller, Minot
MIN IN: Kleber, Ball, Smith

Ball can’t be traded until August, and I think Gobert is worth more than this. He was still All Defense (second team) last year, and finished the season so strong, so age is not an answer. What he needs is for Ant to learn to throw the lob, and be willing to do it. This would increase the offense for both Rudy and Ant.

Yeah. I hate this one. And I've been about the biggest proponent of getting Ball here.

I actually like Smith, but he's in no way a starting Center. He's very undersized, very injury prone and probably not more than a 15-18 MPG change of pace. If he and Reid are our centers, we'd need Sorber to be ready to start nearly from Day 1.

Kleber is worthless.

[minimus]

MIN OUT: Gobert, Miller, Minot
MIN IN: Kleber, Ball, Smith

Ball can’t be traded until August, and I think Gobert is worth more than this. He was still All Defense (second team) last year, and finished the season so strong, so age is not an answer. What he needs is for Ant to learn to throw the lob, and be willing to do it. This would increase the offense for both Rudy and Ant.

Can TC somehow combine this trade with draft selection? I mean CHI will select for MIN sign rookie to a deal, MIN and CHI complete this trade later in August?

MIN OUT: Gobert, Miller, Minot
MIN IN: Kleber, Ball, Smith, 14th pick

Does it make sense?

[BlacJacMac]

MIN OUT: Gobert, Miller, Minot
MIN IN: Kleber, Ball, Smith

Ball can’t be traded until August, and I think Gobert is worth more than this. He was still All Defense (second team) last year, and finished the season so strong, so age is not an answer. What he needs is for Ant to learn to throw the lob, and be willing to do it. This would increase the offense for both Rudy and Ant.

Can TC agree and combine this trade with draft selection? I mean CHI will select for MIN sign rookie to a deal, MIN and CHI complete this trade later in August?

MIN OUT: Gobert, Miller, Minot
MIN IN: Kleber, Ball, Smith, 14th pick

Does it make sense?

I still think you're selling very low on Rudy.

Kleber has no value. Smith has very little. So you're hoping to score a star with the 14th pick and that Lonzo's knee doesn't explode.

I think I'd need to know that I could turn 14 and 17 into Maluach to even consider it.

[TimberKat]

Ball can’t be traded until August, and I think Gobert is worth more than this. He was still All Defense (second team) last year, and finished the season so strong, so age is not an answer. What he needs is for Ant to learn to throw the lob, and be willing to do it. This would increase the offense for both Rudy and Ant.

Can TC agree and combine this trade with draft selection? I mean CHI will select for MIN sign rookie to a deal, MIN and CHI complete this trade later in August?

MIN OUT: Gobert, Miller, Minot
MIN IN: Kleber, Ball, Smith, 14th pick

Does it make sense?

I still think you're selling very low on Rudy.

Kleber has no value. Smith has very little. So you're hoping to score a star with the 14th pick and that Lonzo's knee doesn't explode.

I think I'd need to know that I could turn 14 and 17 into Maluach to even consider it.

Gobert for the wrong Ball. If LaMelo, I would do it and throw in Dilly

[BlacJacMac]

Can TC agree and combine this trade with draft selection? I mean CHI will select for MIN sign rookie to a deal, MIN and CHI complete this trade later in August?

MIN OUT: Gobert, Miller, Minot
MIN IN: Kleber, Ball, Smith, 14th pick

Does it make sense?

I still think you're selling very low on Rudy.

Kleber has no value. Smith has very little. So you're hoping to score a star with the 14th pick and that Lonzo's knee doesn't explode.

I think I'd need to know that I could turn 14 and 17 into Maluach to even consider it.

Gobert for the wrong Ball. If LaMelo, I would do it and throw in Dilly

I'd actually rather have Lonzo.

LaMelo is turning into almost as much of a health risk, but doesn't seem to be serious about basketball and winning like his brother.

[minimus]

Ball can’t be traded until August, and I think Gobert is worth more than this. He was still All Defense (second team) last year, and finished the season so strong, so age is not an answer. What he needs is for Ant to learn to throw the lob, and be willing to do it. This would increase the offense for both Rudy and Ant.

Can TC combine this trade with draft selection? I mean CHI will select for MIN sign rookie to a deal, MIN and CHI complete this trade later in August?

MIN OUT: Gobert, Miller, Minot
MIN IN: Kleber, Ball, Smith, 14th pick

Does it make sense?

I still think you're selling very low on Rudy.

Kleber has no value. Smith has very little. So you're hoping to score a star with the 14th pick and that Lonzo's knee doesn't explode.

I think I'd need to know that I could turn 14 and 17 into Maluach to even consider it.

Yeah... It's tricky. On one hand I do agree that Gobert value for MIN is very high. On other hand, despite his successful run in WCF twice, he has not showed that he can be defensive anchor for championship team. And keep in mind that Gobert has almost the excellent supporting cast in defense, so I dont believe that there is a market for Gobert at all. Trading Gobert for Kleber, Ball, Smith and 14th pick it is more about financial flexibility and pieces that in theory fit better around Edwards in fast pace-and-space roster. Also 14, 17 and 31 is serious draft capital that can turn into three g-league players, but also can be developed into:

14: Carter Bryant / Cedric Coward - Jalen Williams
17: Sorber - Horford / Bam Adebayo
31: whoever falls out first round

Also trading Gobert BEFORE he starts rapidly decline might be a good move. Read: I dont believe in run it back.

[BlacJacMac]

Can TC combine this trade with draft selection? I mean CHI will select for MIN sign rookie to a deal, MIN and CHI complete this trade later in August?

MIN OUT: Gobert, Miller, Minot
MIN IN: Kleber, Ball, Smith, 14th pick

Does it make sense?

I still think you're selling very low on Rudy.

Kleber has no value. Smith has very little. So you're hoping to score a star with the 14th pick and that Lonzo's knee doesn't explode.

I think I'd need to know that I could turn 14 and 17 into Maluach to even consider it.

Yeah... It's tricky. On one hand I do agree that Gobert value for MIN is very high. On other hand, despite his successful run in WCF twice, he has not showed that he can be defensive anchor for championship team. And keep in mind that Gobert has almost the excellent supporting cast in defense, so I dont believe that there is a market for Gobert at all. Trading Gobert for Kleber, Ball, Smith and 14th pick it is more about financial flexibility and pieces that in theory fit better around Edwards in fast pace-and-space roster. Also 14, 17 and 31 is serious draft capital that can turn into three g-league players, but also can be developed into:

14: Carter Bryant / Cedric Coward - Jalen Williams
17: Sorber - Horford / Bam Adebayo
31: whoever falls out first round

Also trading Gobert BEFORE he starts rapidly decline might be a good move. Read: I dont believe in run it back.

I'm OK with trading Gobert, but I want something more than cap relief for him. Maluach, Ware...that level of prospect at a minimum.