It was a nice run, Jokic

[Wolfgang630]

So much for “nice run”. He’s been the best player for years and still is.

[brutalitops]

Best player on the planet still.

If he's the best player on the planet why doesn't he win more in the playoffs?

Only the true elites like Tristan Thompson, Richard Jefferson and Haslem can win more then 20 playoff games. It's unfair to compare Jokics skill level to Thompson.

[p0peye]

It is safe to say that he is now in the same tier as Jrue Holiday.

[brutalitops]

It is safe to say that he is now in the same tier as Jrue Holiday.

Needs to show he's Better then Aaron before we can start comparing him with Jrue

[RoxSteady]

This thread had a nice run; for about 4 games.

[prime1time]

So much for “nice run”. He’s been the best player for years and still is.

Jokic needs to win in the playoffs. The days of him putting up nice stats in regular season games and everyone fawning over him should be over.

[badpotato]

So much for “nice run”. He’s been the best player for years and still is.

Jokic needs to win in the playoffs. The days of him putting up nice stats in regular season games and everyone fawning over him should be over.

Wake up man - 2023 is over already.

[Maxthirty]

It is safe to say that he is now in the same tier as Jrue Holiday.

Let’s not overreact.

[prime1time]

Best player on the planet still.

If he's the best player on the planet why doesn't he win more in the playoffs?

Only the true elites like Tristan Thompson, Richard Jefferson and Haslem can win more then 20 playoff games. It's unfair to compare Jokics skill level to Thompson.

Yeah, yeah, yeah always some excuse. Great players lead their teams to victory in the playoffs. Not just once or twice. But consistently. Jokic's stats are a mirage. He puts up great stats in the regular season but his limitations get magnified in the playoffs against good teams. In those games nothing comes easy. Jokic will have to initiate the offense, get his own shot, get the rebound and create for others. All the things he does in the regular season to put up nice stats. But in the playoffs he also has to play defense. He's not going to do both at a high level. And it's why I expect Wemby and the Spurs to send the Nuggets packing in the playoffs.

[prime1time]

If he's the best player on the planet why doesn't he win more in the playoffs?

Only the true elites like Tristan Thompson, Richard Jefferson and Haslem can win more then 20 playoff games. It's unfair to compare Jokics skill level to Thompson.

Yeah, yeah, yeah always some excuse. Great players lead their teams to victory in the playoffs. Not just once or twice. But consistently. Jokic's stats are a mirage. He puts up great stats in the regular season but his limitations get magnified in the playoffs against good teams. In those games nothing comes easy. Jokic will have to initiate the offense, get his own shot, get the rebound and create for others. All the things he does in the regular season to put up nice stats. But in the playoffs he also has to play defense. He's not going to do both at a high level. And it's why I expect Wemby and the Spurs to send the Nuggets packing in the playoffs.

It's always easy to hide behind the Robert Horry's and the Derek Fishers. But top 15 players in NBA history win in the playoffs and they do it consistently.

Malone had 6 Conference Finals.
Hakeem made 4
Duncan made 9
Shaq made 13
Lebron made 12
Garnett made 4

I'm not even talking about championships. What's the excuse for Jokic making only 2 conference finals? If he doesn't make another, and SGA makes 5 or 6 in a row, do you really think people are going to call this the "Jokic" era? Lol.

[Patches Perry]

Only the true elites like Tristan Thompson, Richard Jefferson and Haslem can win more then 20 playoff games. It's unfair to compare Jokics skill level to Thompson.

Yeah, yeah, yeah always some excuse. Great players lead their teams to victory in the playoffs. Not just once or twice. But consistently. Jokic's stats are a mirage. He puts up great stats in the regular season but his limitations get magnified in the playoffs against good teams. In those games nothing comes easy. Jokic will have to initiate the offense, get his own shot, get the rebound and create for others. All the things he does in the regular season to put up nice stats. But in the playoffs he also has to play defense. He's not going to do both at a high level. And it's why I expect Wemby and the Spurs to send the Nuggets packing in the playoffs.

It's always easy to hide behind the Robert Horry's and the Derek Fishers. But top 15 players in NBA history win in the playoffs and they do it consistently.

Malone had 6 Conference Finals.
Hakeem made 4
Duncan made 9
Shaq made 13
Lebron made 12
Garnett made 4

I'm not even talking about championships. What's the excuse for Jokic making only 2 conference finals? If he doesn't make another, and SGA makes 5 or 6 in a row, do you really think people are going to call this the "Jokic" era? Lol.

Conference finals seems arbitrary. Denver OKC was basically conference finals last season but due to a regular season game or two difference, they matched up 2nd round instead of 3rd.

I do think Jokic needs more titles if he is to enter top 7 all time territory. Fair or not, thats how all players in contention for that tier are judged.

[Cubbies2120]

So much for “nice run”. He’s been the best player for years and still is.

Jokic needs to win in the playoffs. The days of him putting up nice stats in regular season games and everyone fawning over him should be over.

The only season this is an argument in his MVP years is 2024. That was a disappointment.

Outside of that...

2021 - Murray injured, lost to WC Champs
2022 - Murray AND MPJ injured, lost to NBA Champs
2023 - Won it all when team healthy
2024 - Disappointing loss
2025 - Lost to NBA champs and massive favorites OKC in a 7 game series, Jokic underperformed first 3 games of the series, and two starters playing through injuries

It's not like he's out here losing to the Atlanta Hawks in the playoffs or something every year - he's losing to the best team in the league or conference (and with injuries to key starters) in most of these seasons..

[Sgt Major]

And without A SINGLE current All-Star, All-Defense or All-NBA teammate EVER.

[zero rings]

So much for “nice run”. He’s been the best player for years and still is.

Jokic needs to win in the playoffs. The days of him putting up nice stats in regular season games and everyone fawning over him should be over.

As the years have gone by, I've come to accept that Lebron and KD were 100% right to leave the teams that drafted them and form superteams, even though I hated it at the time.

The average fan is completely shook by "ring culture." It has paralyzed their brains. They are so terrified to say anything positive about any player if it isn't backed up by "rangz", because the other lemmings will all gang up on them.

Jokic could leave the Nuggets and team up with Giannis, win a bunch of championships on easy mode, and you guys would all start saying what's been obvious for years: that Jokic is one the greatest to ever do it.

Thank God Jokic doesn't care what people like you think.

[GrindCityHustle]

And without A SINGLE current All-Star, All-Defense or All-NBA teammate EVER.

I like your avatar because I feel like your the real Dennis Rodman lurking these forums. It makes me happy somehow lol

[prime1time]

So much for “nice run”. He’s been the best player for years and still is.

Jokic needs to win in the playoffs. The days of him putting up nice stats in regular season games and everyone fawning over him should be over.

As the years have gone by, I've come to accept that Lebron and KD were 100% right to leave the teams that drafted them and form superteams, even though I hated it at the time.

The average fan is completely shook by "ring culture." It has paralyzed their brains. They are so terrified to say anything positive about any player if it isn't backed up by "rangz", because the other lemmings will all gang up on them.

Jokic could leave the Nuggets and team up with Giannis, win a bunch of championships on easy mode, and you guys would all start saying what's been obvious for years: that Jokic is one the greatest to ever do it.

Thank God Jokic doesn't care what people like you think.

Of course Jokic shouldn't care what I think. But I don't even talk about rings with Jokic because he's clearly not a top 5 player. I talk about conference finals. If you're a top 15 player you should be leading your team to conference finals consistently. Now Championships are harder because maybe there's a top 5 or top 10 player in the league or in your conference. But to say that it's expecting too much from Jokic to make a conference finals is laughable. Here's the irony about Jokic. Jokic stands will claim he's one of the best centers ever but if you compare his defense to any other great big it's clearly the worst. Now his offense is clearly out of this world, but in the playoffs this dynamic breaks. Playoff basketball forces Jokic to do more on both ends and play longer minutes.

Look at that game 7 vs. the T-Wolves. He played 46+ minutes. Carried the offense. And was supposed to be the anchor for the defense. But he couldn't deliver. And they got sent home by a young Ant and Rudy Gobert. This is the reality with Jokic. The bigger the game. The more the Nuggets need to rely on his offense. The more minutes Jokic needs to play. And what's going to give is his ability to anchor the defense. Jokic is a center. Center's anchor defenses. But with Jokic you basically need to treat him like Steph and hide him.

Obviously we'll see, but if Wemby plays Jokic in the playoffs let's see what happens. If Wemby knocks Jokic out 4 or 5 years in a row. Even if somehow the Nuggets win this year. There's no way I'm taking Jokic over Wemby period.

[Bornstellar]

Yeah, Jokic is still the best player in the world, pretty easily

[tsherkin]

Look at that game 7 vs. the T-Wolves. He played 46+ minutes. Carried the offense. And was supposed to be the anchor for the defense. But he couldn't deliver. And they got sent home by a young Ant and Rudy Gobert. This is the reality with Jokic. The bigger the game. The more the Nuggets need to rely on his offense. The more minutes Jokic needs to play. And what's going to give is his ability to anchor the defense. Jokic is a center. Center's anchor defenses. But with Jokic you basically need to treat him like Steph and hide him.

So what ACTUALLY happened in that game was that Murray sucked, MPJ sucked, their entire bench sucked (shot 10/35) and OKC's perimeter guys lit off like a bang.

No one player was going to do anything about that against a team like OKC. Not one, no matter where they are ranked. That's just the reality of sport. It is why, for example, Jordan was getting his head stomped by Boston and Detroit when he didn't have enough help around him, because it's a team game. In Game 7, MPJ's injury and Murray's inability to do anything if his jumper isn't falling coupled to the lack of contribution from the bench and that was the end of that chapter.

That's just the reality of competition.

[web123888]

Jokic with a single legitimate all-star probably has 3 titles. Give him a super team and he’d compete with Kareem for most titles for a center.

[Ambrose]

I understand every time there is a clear cut #1 (LeBron, Jokic) they will have haters or contrarians, but the excuses people make to detract from them never ceases to amaze me. Though it's hilarious to see how poorly those takes age.