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Nick Young

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Post#81 » by hands11 » Mon Mar 10, 2008 1:21 am

likwitdesi wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



We have the Early Bird exception on Mason meaning we can sign him to anything up to the MLE without using the MLE. Not sure if a team would make a trade if it can just straight up sign him.

Roger Mason is a real pro, but players like him are a dime a dozen. If ATL does not keep Jeremy Richardson, bring him in here and let him grow. I've monitored this guy for a couple years now and he is really progressing. Once he starts getting some semi-consistent minutes in the NBA, I think he will become a decent off-the-bench option. Give the guy a 3-year deal for minimum money each year (similar to what the Spurs offered Mason) so we can get his Bird rights too once he potentially blows up.


Well one thing for certain. There are cards in play this off-season. We haven't seen a lot of parts move on and off this team in the last few years but this off season we could. Or not.

But I'm sure there will be folks sticking around to post this off season.

The last biggest card we had on the table was Hughes. Though EG played a nice hand letting Kwame go for CB. I agreed with how EG handled Hughes, Jefferies and Hayes as I think most agreed. But either way things go with GA and AJ, some people aren't going to be happy unless he gets them for a good price or lets them walk for way to much.
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Post#82 » by BruceO » Mon Mar 10, 2008 4:53 am

put me on record fot saying i like nick. I liked him pre draft and like his personality as well. he's easy going. Also when it comes to tools he has alot of tools to be a first option wing scorer. Our players believe in him, and I'm sure they've seen alot of good players. This guy was havin g a field goal percentage that was over 52 percent. few guards do so granted this was college, but you guys have seen him score efficiently. The rest of the weaknesses can be accomodated, his defensive weaknesses are not that much anymore, hes showing improvement, not picking up BS fouls but he has picked up team fouls stopping people getting to the basket. Hes rebounding the ball better, and most of that is just effort working and learning to be in the right places, he has the hops to be able to contest for the ball atleast. Also he is passing, which opens up more options for him, and increases his offensive impact.
I'm on record that I like him. I think he'll give rip hamilton type numbers and better. I also think gil has vested interest in making him better. He really believes in him, and like myself thinks Nick scores too easy, thats what will make him stand out
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Post#83 » by dobrojim » Mon Mar 10, 2008 6:48 pm

BruceO wrote:put me on record fot saying i like nick. I liked him pre draft and like his personality as well. he's easy going. Also when it comes to tools he has alot of tools to be a first option wing scorer. Our players believe in him, and I'm sure they've seen alot of good players. This guy was havin g a field goal percentage that was over 52 percent. few guards do so granted this was college, but you guys have seen him score efficiently. The rest of the weaknesses can be accomodated, his defensive weaknesses are not that much anymore, hes showing improvement, not picking up BS fouls but he has picked up team fouls stopping people getting to the basket. Hes rebounding the ball better, and most of that is just effort working and learning to be in the right places, he has the hops to be able to contest for the ball atleast. Also he is passing, which opens up more options for him, and increases his offensive impact.
I'm on record that I like him. I think he'll give rip hamilton type numbers and better. I also think gil has vested interest in making him better. He really believes in him, and like myself thinks Nick scores too easy, thats what will make him stand out


I love guys that are high eff scorers. This is a key factor in winning
teams, scoring more efficiently.

As for N1 in college, great. Always like to see prior success. But
a note of caution is in order.

Calbert Cheney (we all remember him?) shot something like 56% in
college. In the pros, his FG% actually went down as his career went
on. NOT THAT N1 is going to be another CC. But we should be careful
in making projections.

That said, I like his game. He's a naturally gifted scorer who can
score in a variety of ways. That's obviously a good thing.
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Post#84 » by yungal07 » Tue Mar 11, 2008 2:04 am

The funny thing about Mason/Young is that Young is putting up comparable numbers to Mason.

Young averages 17.0 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 2.2 apg per 36 minutes. TS% = .512
Mason averages 14.9 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 2.7 apg per 36 minutes. TS% = .556

So they are playing pretty even basketball. That's why I won't lose it if Mason isn't resigned. I do feel that Young, by next season, can be every bit as good as Mason if not better. I would like Mason back, but we definitely should NOT break the bank to resign him.
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Post#85 » by doclinkin » Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:14 am

Longterm, playing next to Gil, whatever the questionmarks on defense, offensively Nick Young is going to look very very good.

Nick is just starting to score within the flow of the offense-- used to be any time Nick scored it was on a broken play... that he broke his dang self.

But Gil and this offense have gotten hefty contracts for a few players who couldn't create for themselves. Until DeShawn got Hoplacized we all saw how badly his offense suffered without Gil.

The key difference between Jarvis and Hayes, aside from age (which is significant -- most rooks don't settle in and start reliably producing until year three) the key difference is the % of points that were assisted. Nick has had his % of assisted goals in the 40%'s; Jarvis was closer to 60% here (and is above 60% this year). In otherwords Nick can create for himself. Usually though Nick's been the primary scoring threat when he's on the floor, especially when the youth squad is dropped out there. yeah he drives into traffic then makes something out of it, but with Gil on the floor, yah, Nicks not any kind of primary threat anymore, he's gonna see a few open shots, and imbalanced defense cheating towards Gil.

The offense is about creating mismatches then allowing talented players to exploit them. Nick Young, whatever he is, is an offensively talented player.
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Post#86 » by fifthstop » Tue Mar 11, 2008 3:48 am

dobrojim wrote:Calbert Cheney (we all remember him?) shot something like 56% in
college. In the pros, his FG% actually went down as his career went
on. NOT THAT N1 is going to be another CC. But we should be careful
in making projections.


I like Nick. He's a very solid draft choice. Obvious talent and big-time program leads one to think he'll be ready in big-time situations (BTW we saw the contrast for a while there with DMac who was not ready for the bright lights). A more than solid mid first-round pick.

Allow me to digress for a moment and muse that a '96 vintage Calbert Cheaney would be the perfect piece for this team. 6'7" or whatever. Scarey southpaw handle. Lightning fast. Decent rebounder. Team leading 3pt%. But best of all a truly elite defender. In fact MJ once said Calbert was the only guard he did not relish facing. Whatever head games Bobby Knight played that wrecked Calbert seemed to wash away when he faced Jordan and he had a few career nights on both ends of the floor against His Airness.

For some reason, Calbert's career arced in the opposite direction from normal: "blue chips" talent-->very good rookie-->solid sophomore-->solid rotation guy-->decent piece-->role player-->journeyman. I have a few theories: 1) he got more intereseted in his family than in b-ball; 2) Bobby Knight yelled and screamed the love of game out of him; 3) He was on a team with such a bunch of talented knuckleheads that he was just never motivated to improve his game. I tend to think it's all three. Thoughts?

Calbert would have been something special on a team led by Jamison, Tough Juice, Etan, and Gilbert.

Having said all that, N1 is a very nice piece. He's the lightning in the bottle an elite team needs. As someone said, the offense is about creating mismatches for talented ballers, which N1 certainly is. What I think will really set him apart is when he learns the second part of the offense--seeing when the offense also creates mismatches in other parts of the floor (eg a rebounder has both size and position advantage) before pulling the trigger. Then his trigger-happy ways will be about applying pressure on a defense rather than sending fast-breaks the other way. He's learning well, though, and I would grade him as better than satisfactory (say a B).
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Post#87 » by Kanyewest » Tue Mar 11, 2008 5:41 am

yungal07 wrote:The funny thing about Mason/Young is that Young is putting up comparable numbers to Mason.

Young averages 17.0 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 2.2 apg per 36 minutes. TS% = .512
Mason averages 14.9 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 2.7 apg per 36 minutes. TS% = .556

So they are playing pretty even basketball. That's why I won't lose it if Mason isn't resigned. I do feel that Young, by next season, can be every bit as good as Mason if not better. I would like Mason back, but we definitely should NOT break the bank to resign him.


I wonder how those numbers have changed since the all star break.
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Post#88 » by VAWiZKID » Tue Mar 11, 2008 6:25 am

where could i watch that movie second chance season?

looks interesting
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Post#89 » by Kanyewest » Tue Mar 11, 2008 6:39 am

fifthstop wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



I like Nick. He's a very solid draft choice. Obvious talent and big-time program leads one to think he'll be ready in big-time situations (BTW we saw the contrast for a while there with DMac who was not ready for the bright lights). A more than solid mid first-round pick.

Allow me to digress for a moment and muse that a '96 vintage Calbert Cheaney would be the perfect piece for this team. 6'7" or whatever. Scarey southpaw handle. Lightning fast. Decent rebounder. Team leading 3pt%. But best of all a truly elite defender. In fact MJ once said Calbert was the only guard he did not relish facing. Whatever head games Bobby Knight played that wrecked Calbert seemed to wash away when he faced Jordan and he had a few career nights on both ends of the floor against His Airness.

For some reason, Calbert's career arced in the opposite direction from normal: "blue chips" talent-->very good rookie-->solid sophomore-->solid rotation guy-->decent piece-->role player-->journeyman. I have a few theories: 1) he got more intereseted in his family than in b-ball; 2) Bobby Knight yelled and screamed the love of game out of him; 3) He was on a team with such a bunch of talented knuckleheads that he was just never motivated to improve his game. I tend to think it's all three. Thoughts?

Calbert would have been something special on a team led by Jamison, Tough Juice, Etan, and Gilbert.

Having said all that, N1 is a very nice piece. He's the lightning in the bottle an elite team needs. As someone said, the offense is about creating mismatches for talented ballers, which N1 certainly is. What I think will really set him apart is when he learns the second part of the offense--seeing when the offense also creates mismatches in other parts of the floor (eg a rebounder has both size and position advantage) before pulling the trigger. Then his trigger-happy ways will be about applying pressure on a defense rather than sending fast-breaks the other way. He's learning well, though, and I would grade him as better than satisfactory (say a B).


Nice post. It is interesting to speculate why Cheaney never became that all star caliber player. One of the biggest reasons was that his 3 point shot in college did not translate into the pros. His 3 point shooting was steadily improving early in his career but suddenly declined in both attempts and percentage in 96-97. The coaching staff probably told Cheaney to stop taking 3 pointers at that point to increase efficiency. However, it did little to increase his ts % (from .528 to .530) or efg% (.495 to .508). The increase in his percentages were most likely due to him taking less shots per game more than anything (from 16 to 12). I also don't think Cheaney was one who take over a game down the stretch which did not bode well for a team whose best late game go to option was Chris Webber.

In 97-98, Muresan went out for the entire season so Cheaney moved from a 5th option on offense to a 4th option. Cheaney could never get his 3 point shot back to above 30% with Washington. In the 98-99 season, Cheaney had moved to small forward as a result of the Chris Webber trade and it ended up as a failed experiment.
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Post#90 » by MDStar » Tue Mar 11, 2008 8:02 pm

I'm not sure why but I see a little Cheaney in Landon Milburn of MD. Not the college version but the role player one. Mayber it's that left handed mid range shot.
Just let the young boys play! It's truly the only hope at this point.
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Post#91 » by RickRoll_inDC » Wed Mar 12, 2008 3:53 am

Nick Young needs to drive the ball like that every game.....obviously he can do it, so why does he settle for jumpers all the time?

N1 is a future star. He might start next to Gil next year!
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Post#92 » by miller31time » Wed Mar 12, 2008 5:25 am

gilbertgoes05 wrote:Nick Young needs to drive the ball like that every game.....obviously he can do it, so why does he settle for jumpers all the time?

N1 is a future star. He might start next to Gil next year!


Well, to be fair, he won't get to go against the Milwaukee Bucks' perimeter defense every game.
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Post#93 » by picknrollaction » Wed Mar 12, 2008 5:50 am

Career high 22 tonite,didn't deserve the tech,though
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Post#94 » by hands11 » Wed Mar 12, 2008 12:33 pm

[quote="picknrollaction"]Career high 22 tonite,didn't deserve the

I didn't get that one at all.

Looked like he turned to get up court and they just bumped for a sec. Actually on reply, it looked like the MIL player took a little shot at Nick as they came together but it was all about nothing. At least that's what I saw.
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Post#95 » by ZonkertheBrainless » Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:27 pm

No, he deliberately turned towards Bogut and was going to get in his face, and Bogut thumped him. Young initiated it so he gets the t. Ref was looking right at it.
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Post#96 » by Donkey McDonkerton » Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:34 pm

count me in the group that didnt think he deserved a T. He turned towards Bogut, but that was it...Bogut was coming towards him too at the time, so when he turned he was right there and actually got cracked by Bogut.
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Post#97 » by dobrojim » Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:50 pm

fifthstop wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



I like Nick. He's a very solid draft choice. Obvious talent and big-time program leads one to think he'll be ready in big-time situations (BTW we saw the contrast for a while there with DMac who was not ready for the bright lights). A more than solid mid first-round pick.

Allow me to digress for a moment and muse that a '96 vintage Calbert Cheaney would be the perfect piece for this team. 6'7" or whatever. Scarey southpaw handle. Lightning fast. Decent rebounder. Team leading 3pt%. But best of all a truly elite defender. In fact MJ once said Calbert was the only guard he did not relish facing. Whatever head games Bobby Knight played that wrecked Calbert seemed to wash away when he faced Jordan and he had a few career nights on both ends of the floor against His Airness.

For some reason, Calbert's career arced in the opposite direction from normal: "blue chips" talent-->very good rookie-->solid sophomore-->solid rotation guy-->decent piece-->role player-->journeyman. I have a few theories: 1) he got more intereseted in his family than in b-ball; 2) Bobby Knight yelled and screamed the love of game out of him; 3) He was on a team with such a bunch of talented knuckleheads that he was just never motivated to improve his game. I tend to think it's all three. Thoughts?

Calbert would have been something special on a team led by Jamison, Tough Juice, Etan, and Gilbert.

Having said all that, N1 is a very nice piece. He's the lightning in the bottle an elite team needs. As someone said, the offense is about creating mismatches for talented ballers, which N1 certainly is. What I think will really set him apart is when he learns the second part of the offense--seeing when the offense also creates mismatches in other parts of the floor (eg a rebounder has both size and position advantage) before pulling the trigger. Then his trigger-happy ways will be about applying pressure on a defense rather than sending fast-breaks the other way. He's learning well, though, and I would grade him as better than satisfactory (say a B).


with apologies for the continuation of a thread hijack

I don't see how we can blame BK for what happened as CC's
career went on in the pros. It pretty much argues for the opposite
(I agree with your description completely). My thoughts are that
with CC, it was all about confidence. Once he started to second
guess himself, it was a downward spiral.

N1 appears to have confidence in great abundance.

Having attended last night's breakout vs MIL, it seemed to me that
this was not only a breakout in terms of point output, but also in
terms of his impact on team. We'd seen games where his O would
look good but his +/- would still be sucky. I've not looked at the
boxscore but I bet his +/- was pretty good last night. This is
obviously good news. That and (knock on wood) the fact that
he is healthy!
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Post#98 » by dobrojim » Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:54 pm

miller31time wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Well, to be fair, he won't get to go against the Milwaukee Bucks' perimeter defense every game.


very good point

their D was just not very good

we shot 50%

in the last game PHL scored big on them (~115-120).
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Post#99 » by ZonkertheBrainless » Wed Mar 12, 2008 6:37 pm

N1's (Mr. T's) +- was +21
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Post#100 » by yungal07 » Wed Mar 12, 2008 6:44 pm

Well, let's not dismiss his performance because the Bucks d is poor. To be fair to Nick, he's been shooting 52% from the field since the all-star break.

Now we're seeing first hand why the kid shot over 50% from the field his last season of college. He has a vast array of moves, can hit the 3, attack the rim, and finish. The scary part is that he's not close to being a finished product.

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