Portland @ MN (official Al>>>LMA thread)

[PeeDee]

Hope you guys win the lotto!

Thanks man. I'm hoping for many western conference final battles between the Blazers and the Wolves. Should be fun.

[horaceworthy]

^ +1

This flaming stuff between individual PDX and Minny players is getting out of hand. Its a frickin team game.

Please don't have any hard feelings over PDX posters as a whole. If there is one thing I hate most about Real GM is the tendency to stereotype an entire team's posters.

Anyhow I emphasize with you Minny fans. You have a solid young group who knows how to play competitively for 3.5 quarters of the game, but still aren't mature enough to close games out. Portland's still going through that, but we've markedly improved this year in finishing teams off. I'm sure the T-Wolves will as well.

I agree about the flaming being out of hand.

I don't like to stereotype, but it's hard not to in regards to most of the Blazer posters. I just took a quick glance at the game thread on the PDX board, and it seemed like there were only 2 posts made by the same MN fan in the entire thread. Glancing through this thread (and just about every PDX-MN game thread since last year), there seems to be a litany of Portland fans attempting to rub Roy in our faces (and it seems like a different group every game, not just the same posters over and over).

I just don't understand the depth of that particular inferiority complex. You'd think that having the best collection of young talent in the league, a great financial situation, an owner willing to provide money and a GM willing to use it to acquire good, young assets would be enough, but apparently every poster on our board has to agree with that, or else it turns into a ridiculous, waste of time back and forth.

Yourself and some others have been respectful, and I thank you for that, since that hasn't been my experience with most of the PDX posters I've interacted with. I've got no problem with the posters such as yourself, if you're going to actually be respectful to us, you're more than welcome here. To those that just come over here in an attempt to either rub Roy or the recent success of the Blazers in our faces, I impart the immortal words of Shooter McGavin:

"Go back to your shanties!"

[casey]

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EXCUSE ME FOR POINTING OUT SOMETHING GOOD ABOUT OUR TEAM THAT PORTLAND ISN'T GOOD AT RIGHT NOW.

Don't expect us not to defend and find positives for the Wolves when people from a opposing teams boards come in and start to cause trouble.

I expect people to be realistic. People are talking like Portland has no future because they saw a stat on TV that says Portland shoots a lot of jump shots, and are acting like we're in a better position because we score more points in the paint. Yes it's a good thing that the Wolves get a lot of points inside. If the comments were left to just that I wouldn't have had a problem.

--I disagree with you. Fundamentally portland is a jump shooting team that does not foul much, does not make many mistakes and is at .500 We are a team that controls the paint (points and offensive rebounds) and needs to develop/grow into something that does not make the mental mistakes (some say growth, some say different coaching) but the fundamental difference of jump shooting vs inside play will still exist. We do not have their shooters, they do not have Big Al.

Let me ask you this then, would you rather be in the Blazers situation or the Wolves situation?

Comparing Foye and Roy is silly also.

The comparison is silly because it's so lopsided. Roy is a superstar already. Near unanimous ROY last year despite missing 20 games, and an all-star this year. Foye is nothing but question marks.

[DmoneyH3]

I think we all need to realize that every fan base has their a-holes..there are a few on bbb.net Blazers board who I'd like to slap...haha. As for winning the lotto..I think trading down to 4-5 and picking up Mayo as well as other assets would be the best thing to do. Beasley..I just don't see it. he dominates inside because he is physically bigger than college kids. I just don't see him being able to do that at the 4 spot or the 3 spot against NBA defenders. I think he has some improvements on his perimeter game as well, which is why I liked Durant more as a prospect. Mayo is tailored for the NBA; he's big enough to play the and quick enough to handle the 1, allowing Foye to play along side him.

[horaceworthy]

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The comparison is silly because it's so lopsided. Roy is a superstar already. Near unanimous ROY last year despite missing 20 games, and an all-star this year. Foye is nothing but question marks.

I agree with everything you said in this post, aside from the bolded statement. I think Roy's a very good player, but I wouldn't put him in the superstar category at the moment. You may have a broader definition of superstar than I do, but when I hear that word thrown around I think of a top 10-15 or so player. I don't put Roy in that class right now.

[deeney0]

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I expect people to be realistic.

No you don't, there is no way you hold the people on this board up to that high a standard.

[revprodeji]

Being that I see us as earlier than the blazers I like where we are at. I would rather build around Al then Roy. But Portland has a better owner and coach and Gm.

But Al is something I really want to build around. I also like our philosophy better.

[theGreatRC]

Brandon Roy made the All-Star team his second season and was the best player for the West in the game. He has superstar written all over him and will be a perrenial All-Star. Foye is a long ways away from making the team period.

This discussion is funny to me. As far as LaMarcus goes-- he is averaging 18 and 7, along with a couple blocks a game in his second season. Try watching him play outside of games against Minny and looking at the box scores. He is really good defensively and eventually will become a player that will get 9 boards a game. Getting 21/9 and 2.5 blocks seems about right.

Look out the box scores for Al outside of Portland games and your eyes will be wider than what you see with Aldridge. Don't forget Al sees double and triple teams almost every night.

[farzi]

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Look out the box scores for Al outside of Portland games and your eyes will be wider than what you see with Aldridge. Don't forget Al sees double and triple teams almost every night.

Yeah, good stats on a bad team...We had a 20/10 PF and had the worst record in the NBA. Boxscores aren't everything

[4ho5ive]

Once again, if you would actually WATCH some of the games, you would realize that that argument is entirely false.

[shrink]

If he believed good stats on a bad team were truly worth less, he'd also be willing to give Roy's Rookie of the Year Award to Marcus Williams. POR was certainly a bad team in 2006-07, which got him plenty of minutes. Williams put up the same or better per-minute stats as Roy, and, of course, he got his stats on a contending Nets team.

BTW - any of you read the POR thread after the game? Lots of non-classy namecalling about the wolves posters.

[casey]

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No you don't, there is no way you hold the people on this board up to that high a standard.

I do, but you're right, that's a pretty high standard to hold these people too.

Being that I see us as earlier than the blazers I like where we are at. I would rather build around Al then Roy. But Portland has a better owner and coach and Gm.

But Al is something I really want to build around. I also like our philosophy better.

So you're saying that you would rather be in the Wolves' position?

[breaker91]

If he believed good stats on a bad team were truly worth less, he'd also be willing to give Roy's Rookie of the Year Award to Marcus Williams. POR was certainly a bad team in 2006-07, which got him plenty of minutes. Williams put up the same or better per-minute stats as Roy, and, of course, he got his stats on a contending Nets team.

BTW - any of you read the POR thread after the game? Lots of non-classy namecalling about the wolves posters.

You're going a little overboard here aren't you? A 6th seed in the east with a .500 record is a contending team? Also those per-minutes extrapolations are one, but should not be the only thing to compare players. I recall a few years ago that Madsen had one of the highest rebounding rates per 40 minutes in the league yet he was stuck behind Blount. That's because despite his piss poor attitude Blount's impact on the Wolves being competitive in games was much more than Madsen's.

How about looking at player efficiency as another metric to explain why guys have identical per minute numbers, but one plays twice as long? Roy had a much better FG%, 3 pt FG%, while Williams turned the ball over slightly more than Roy despite playing 19 mpg less.

Simply put, Roy got 36 mpg to William's 16 mpg because Roy contributed far more to helping his team stay competitive and win games.

BTW, which Blazer vs T-Wolf player should we obsess over tomorrow night? How about McCants vs Jack? Both have just as much of chance of putting up big points as turning the ball over 10 times.

[shrink]

If he believed good stats on a bad team were truly worth less, he'd also be willing to give Roy's Rookie of the Year Award to Marcus Williams. POR was certainly a bad team in 2006-07, which got him plenty of minutes. Williams put up the same or better per-minute stats as Roy, and, of course, he got his stats on a contending Nets team

You're going a little overboard here aren't you? A 6th seed in the east with a .500 record is a contending team?

Portland was 32-50 in 06-07 when Roy won the Rookie of the Year award, and tied for the sixth worst record in the NBA.

How about looking at player efficiency as another metric to explain why guys have identical per minute numbers, but one plays twice as long? Roy had a much better FG%, 3 pt FG%, while Williams turned the ball over slightly more than Roy despite playing 19 mpg less.

LOL. What an unbiased presentation!

Simply put, Roy got 36 mpg to William's 16 mpg because Roy contributed far more to helping his team stay competitive and win games.

Did he help them to the 50 losses too? Would you consider its possible Roy played more minutes than Marcus Williams because he didn't have Jason Kidd and Vince Carter in front of him? i.e. .. POR was a bad team?

Blazer fans want it both ways. They want to be able to knock other teams now with their "good stats on a bad team aren't worth as much argument" but if you point out that just last year, THEY were a bad team, they start squirming with "but look at the 3 PT%!"

[deeney0]

Re: The Al is doing what ZBo was doing on the Blazers argument (which I disagree with), lets expand on it for a minute. Say Al right now is comparable to Zach over the last couple of years - image what Zach could be if he had Al's good attitude, drive to improve himself, and passion for the game?

[the_bruce]

Re: The Al is doing what ZBo was doing on the Blazers argument (which I disagree with), lets expand on it for a minute. Say Al right now is comparable to Zach over the last couple of years - image what Zach could be if he had Al's good attitude, drive to improve himself, and passion for the game?

Zach - (Donuts + lazy + bad attiitude) = Al

[horaceworthy]

I recall a few years ago that Madsen had one of the highest rebounding rates per 40 minutes in the league yet he was stuck behind Blount. That's because despite his piss poor attitude Blount's impact on the Wolves being competitive in games was much more than Madsen's.

Madsen's never posted a rebound rate above 12.5 (which is fairly ordinary) while with the Wolves. Blount's efficiency stats bore out his greater impact as well. The only area Madsen had a leg up in was rebounding. Bad example.

Besides, I believe shrink was engaging in the activity of hyperbole, exaggerating for effect. I don't think it was meant to be taken literally.

[Andre 2999]

Big Al > LaMarcus
Roy > Foye

'Nuff said

[RD&KG2]

My beer is open. Here We go wolves!!!!! Round II.

[JeffJordan]

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Look out the box scores for Al outside of Portland games and your eyes will be wider than what you see with Aldridge. Don't forget Al sees double and triple teams almost every night.

As is VERY similar to Zach Randolph. I might be willing to give Al some more credit if the TWolves were any good.