Iguodala - Our Kobe Bryant?

[SendEm]

-= original quote snipped =-



That was actually my point. 18.8 ppg on 39.7% shooting with nearly as many turnovers as assists is not a a good year, and he hasn't put together good play for "two solid years".

If you could point out where my facts were wrong, that would be swell. I mentioned the two years that surround his one legitimate good year because one of those two would have to be good to have done it for "two solid years". Neither of them were.

18 points in 33 minutes is good work and qualifies as what was stated, a "solid" season.

[dbodner]

If you discount every other statistical measure, sure.

To pull a shtick from someone elses MO (I can't recall who it is, maybe someone else can help me remember), I see that you have now become a fantasy basketball talent evaluator. Come back when you want to talk real basketball.

[SendEm]

LMAO!!!!!!!!!!

[Sixercise]

Kobe wanting it from day 1, eh?



Let's take Iguodala's and Kobe's numbers of their first 4 years in the NBA:


Kobe Bryant

96-97: In 15.5 mins, averaged 7.6 pts, 1.9 rebs & 1.3 assists on .417% FG
97-98: In 26 mins, averaged 15.4pts, 3.1 rebs & 2.5 assists on .428% FG
98-99: In 37.9 mins, averaged 19.9 pts, 5.3 rebs & 3.8 assists on .465% FG
99-00: In 38.2 mins, averaged 22.5 pts, 6.3 rebs & 4.9 assists on .468% FG


Now for Iguodala:

04-05: In 32.8 mins, averaged 9 pts, 5.7 rebs & 3 assists on .493% FG
05-06: In 37.6 mins, averaged 12.3 pts, 5.9 rebs & 3.1 assists on .500% FG
06-07: In 40.3 mins, averaged 18.2 pts, 5.7 rebs & 5.7 assists on .447% FG
07-08 (in 71 games so far) In 39.2 mins, averaged 19.9 pts, 5.4 rebs & 4.6 assists on .455% FG


Considering that Kobe had Shaq and Iguodala having maybe Miller, the statistics aren't that much different between both Kobe & Iggy. I mean, just imagine if Iggy took the place of Kobe and played with the same level of intensity on that Lakers squad. Would anyone in their right mind say that Iggy wouldn't have 'wanted it from day 1??' I don't think so.

Point is, I feel that Iggy is going on the right track in developing his game. So what if he makes you people cringe with his 1-on-1 plays every now & then. Cut this guy some slack, he's only been in the league for four years. The way Iggy's playing right now suggests that the sky may still be the limit for him. Just imagine if he had a big man to complement his game....


Jeez, someone's got to stop smoking glass ****.....

[Sandalf42]

SendEm, sometimes I get the impression you HAVEN'T been drinking your Kool Aid....... but of course I'd be mistaken...... right?

Iggy is a major part of this team. To deny that is just plain stupid. From my understanding, your qualm with Iggy is he wants money...... don't we all?? I think it's just plain cynical to believe that he's having a good year JUST for the money.

However much money somebody is worth is irrelevant in the NBA.

Get used to it.

[SendEm]

One point that I never got across to all who read my Iggy posts is just who sickened I would be when Iggy is in the 3rd year of his contract making $13.7 million dollars while averaging 18ppg in 39 minutes on a 7 seed playoff team. I see Iggy being sorta similar to Jalen Rose when he was overpaid by the Pacers when he was putting up big time numbers for a championship caliber team with extraordinary talent. We don't have that sort of talent on this team but he wants that kind of Jalen Rose/Joe Johnson money. Joe Johnson is and was always a more skilled player than Iggy and he was overpaid to switch teams. We shouldn't overpay to keep this particular SG/SF...

I am a Sixers supporter FIRST. I drink more Sixers Kool Aid than anyone, but I don't want to be committed to a "mediocre star" for BIG money.

[SendEm]

Kobe wanting it from day 1, eh?



Let's take Iguodala's and Kobe's numbers of their first 4 years in the NBA:


Kobe Bryant

96-97: In 15.5 mins, averaged 7.6 pts, 1.9 rebs & 1.3 assists on .417% FG
97-98: In 26 mins, averaged 15.4pts, 3.1 rebs & 2.5 assists on .428% FG
98-99: In 37.9 mins, averaged 19.9 pts, 5.3 rebs & 3.8 assists on .465% FG
99-00: In 38.2 mins, averaged 22.5 pts, 6.3 rebs & 4.9 assists on .468% FG


Now for Iguodala:

04-05: In 32.8 mins, averaged 9 pts, 5.7 rebs & 3 assists on .493% FG
05-06: In 37.6 mins, averaged 12.3 pts, 5.9 rebs & 3.1 assists on .500% FG
06-07: In 40.3 mins, averaged 18.2 pts, 5.7 rebs & 5.7 assists on .447% FG
07-08 (in 71 games so far) In 39.2 mins, averaged 19.9 pts, 5.4 rebs & 4.6 assists on .455% FG


Considering that Kobe had Shaq and Iguodala having maybe Miller, the statistics aren't that much different between both Kobe & Iggy. I mean, just imagine if Iggy took the place of Kobe and played with the same level of intensity on that Lakers squad. Would anyone in their right mind say that Iggy wouldn't have 'wanted it from day 1??' I don't think so.

Point is, I feel that Iggy is going on the right track in developing his game. So what if he makes you people cringe with his 1-on-1 plays every now & then. Cut this guy some slack, he's only been in the league for four years. The way Iggy's playing right now suggests that the sky may still be the limit for him. Just imagine if he had a big man to complement his game....


Jeez, someone's got to stop smoking glass ****.....

Good thing most people here know basketball, ATLEAST regarding superstar player like Kobe. If they didn't, they might actually believe your usage of statistics to be supportive of your comparison.

[SendEm]

LOL When Kobe was 22 years of age he averaged 28.5ppg 5assists 5.9rebounds .853ft% .464fg%

at 22 years of age Iggy averaged 12.3ppg 3.1assists 5.9rebounds .754ft% .500fg%

yeah Kobe and Iggy have alot in common...

[tk76]

Yawn. This thread needs to be locked on counts of redundancy.

[STChaser]

jiggy08,
Great post. Thanks for dredging up those stats.

Sendem,
the difference that jiggy pointed out is that Kobe was surrounded by much better players and the most dominant big man happened to be one of those players - not to mention perhaps the best coach of all time. With the exception of Miller, Iguodala is playing with a bunch of youngsters. From an athletic standpoint, I'm not comparing Iguodala to Kobe. But from a "drive" standpoint, I think Iguodala has that competitive bug that will propel him to the next level. And that was what my initial post was all about. The "it" element that money cannot buy and scouts can't scout. When you find that type of player on your roster, you do everything possible to retain them.

Let me give you another perspective. Donovan McNabb is 100 times the athlete Jeff Garcia is. And yet even with all that athleticism, it was Garcia's fiery leadership that turned our season around, not McNabb. Garcia would get in his O-linemens' faces when they missed a block whereas McNabb never had real leadership skills. When things went badly for McNabb he'd put his head down or do that annoying chest thumping gesture. There was never any intensity with McNabb and his players (Westbrook excluded) adopted that same attitude in my opinion.

When this Sixer team gets down (when an opponent like Boston goes on a run) or they start missing assignments as in the case I referred to with Lou, Iguodala gives it to them and motivates them to dig deeper- the same way Kobe gives it to his teammates. But Iguodala also leads by example. So it's not like when AI was here and he was scolding his teammates for their defense while at the same time, playing none himself. Again, it's hard to buy leadership. You can't always put a price on it.

STChaser

[Johnny Broad-Street]

YAWN.....why does every thread end up sounding like this?

Can we have a "BORING A$$ STATS" sticky to throw a lasso around this garbage, and stop the deterioration of threads in this manner?

[dbodner]

jiggy: as much as I disagree with sendem, your stats aren't exactly a good comparison. You just tried to compare the stats of an 18 year old playing 15 minutes per game with a 20 year old playing 32.

[SendEm]

Kobe scored 81 points in a single game during a season that he averaged 35.4 ppg, all WITHOUT Shaq.

True scorers don't score more points when surrounded by all star players or even VERY capable players, they average less points, just look at Kobe, Iverson, and Carmelo's numbers, they dropped once hey began playing with REALLY talented players.

*End of thread*

[tk76]

*End of thread*

Is that a promise, or will this just be picked up in a later thread.

I'm actually interested in hearing your non-Iguodala related opinions for a while. Maybe we all should just call an Iguodala truce for a few days.

[76erinSJ]

We could be talking about what coach should be here after Mo and somehow Sendem will turn it into a Dala bashing thread. STchaser- I think we should go after JVG next year. He will be a good defensive coach for this young team. Sendem- JVG would never come here because he wouldnt want to coach a player like Dala who will be making 29.99 million dollars.

[Stanford]

Send, earlier this year I asked you WHY you believed Andre's level of play would decrease in the years following his contract, and you made a valid point. Not a point I bought into, but a point I wasn't going argue.

He was playing for a bad team, shooting a bad percentage and turning the ball over too often. Now, not only has he got his FG% up and TOs way down, we're actually a winning team.

You're really reaching with this Larry Hughes thing bro. You have no reason to compare the two.

[SendEm]

Want to hear more of my opinions? LOL

Lou Williams might turn into the story of the Summer for the Sixers. If he does anything at all in the playoffs, I'm talking ANYTHING at all, his value is going to be inflated astronomically especially since he is a 21 year old player entering free agency. I envision on the low end a unique full midlevel contract with player option year(s). But I believe that most teams in the league will extend that to him forcing the Sixers to pay more.

Jason Hart got paid $2.3 million, Marcus Banks $3.8, Smush Parker $2.2, Earl Watson $5.8.

Okay after reviewing those numbers he might get less than Marcus Banks and definitely less than Earl Watson, but his young age and potential could throw that all out of the window once the summer comes around and every free agent on the market value on the court gets inflated at the bargaining table.

[Sixersftw]

. But I believe that most teams in the league will extend that to him forcing the Sixers to pay more.

no, we use our right of first refusal and match that offer. we don't have to pay more.

[tk76]

I'm glad at least we won't have to be paying Lou starters money. I agree, its hard to know what he should be paid, and there will be a market for him.

If we see him playing 25-30MPG in the future, I am fine with a MLE type contract. He may end up underpaid or overpaid depending on whether his midrange and 3pt jumper become a more reliable weapon. If it does, he will be a great asset as a scorer/creator that can carry the load when back-up are on the floor (and provide clutch scoring at the end of games.) Sort of a cross between Gordon and Barbosa.

If his shot never becomes consistant he will likely end up not being worth the contract he will sign. Given we're not talking starters money, I think he's clearly worth the risk. If Memphis threw 8M at him I would have to change my tune.

[SendEm]

I think a team like Miami would be in the Market for Lou Williams. Lou is the type of PG that Riley likes when you throw Magic out the window. Miami is rebuilding so I believe his lack of offensive scoring efficiency could be overlooked. It doesn't hurt that his highlight of the year came against that team.

I think that his game would be ideal as the starting PG for the Timberwolves young team. A two man game involving him and Jefferson could be a problem for the league and would just about guarantee that he actually develops into a consistent impact player in the NBA.

Can't rule out a Clippers contract offer...