Only Redd trade to Cavs I'd do...
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- europa
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at L&H's new avatar. Outstanding.
As for the proposal, I still think it stinks that the best part of this trade for the Bucks is a low first in a so-so draft which is highly unlikely to be a player who will ever be as good as Redd. I'd take Rush there and I like him a lot, but I'm under no illusions he'll become as good as Redd. Cleveland really is bending the Bucks over and making them take it with virtually every trade offer they can put forth for Redd. But I suppose that if Gadz and Simmons were included at least they'd be willing to include some lube.
As for the proposal, I still think it stinks that the best part of this trade for the Bucks is a low first in a so-so draft which is highly unlikely to be a player who will ever be as good as Redd. I'd take Rush there and I like him a lot, but I'm under no illusions he'll become as good as Redd. Cleveland really is bending the Bucks over and making them take it with virtually every trade offer they can put forth for Redd. But I suppose that if Gadz and Simmons were included at least they'd be willing to include some lube.
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Smooth32 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
I understand it's not pretty and not something that I would probably like if I were a Bucks fan but stars that are on the block usually go for less than what us think on the board here... Just go back and look at past big trades and all those trades are driven on three things: expirings, picks and young talent... The Cavs give you two of those things (a good amount of both too) as well as taking on two bad contracts...
While the Cavs want him, they won't bend over backwards for him... It's not Redd or nothing... There are other options out there...
I probably wouldn't have any problem with Smith, but it's this years first and future firsts is where I get caught up on... You have to remember how youth deprived and pick deprived this team is and how important this draft is..
Irrelevant what you think stars will go for, there is zero chance the Cavs are getting Redd without the #19 pick and you guys giving us expirings while we give you garbage contracts.
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I have no problem with trading Redd to the Cavs. Good for the Cavs. They will have a 2 year window to get back to the finals. LeBron will be gone in 2010, and the cavs will be the 2007 Milwaukee Bucks--a team centered around Redd and a bunch of garbage because they leveraged their future for the present.
They HAVE to take on bad contracts, however. Only way to do this.
They HAVE to take on bad contracts, however. Only way to do this.
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PaBuck wrote:Hopefully, Hammond is viewing all options and is not going to do a Gasol with the Cavs.
That's an excellent analogy. In virtually every Redd to the Cavs trade proposal the Bucks are getting Gasol'd. The Cavs make out like bandits and the Bucks are left picking through scraps of garbage hoping to delude their fans into believing that all this cap space is going to turn the team's fortunes around when you may have made the process considerably more difficult by not getting proper value for your team's best player. That's why whenever I see another Redd to the Cavs trade proposal I keep thinking I haven't seen anybody get sodomized this badly since Ned Beatty was squealing like a pig in "Deliverance."
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Where is a mod when you need one?
There are 4 Redd to the Cavs trades on the front page.
Ridiculous
I can't wait until all of you are soooooo disappointed we didn't dump Redd for garbage.
Cause if we get back Wally or Joe Smith for Redd, I'm done with this team. But I'm supremely confident that will not happen.
There are 4 Redd to the Cavs trades on the front page.
Ridiculous
I can't wait until all of you are soooooo disappointed we didn't dump Redd for garbage.
Cause if we get back Wally or Joe Smith for Redd, I'm done with this team. But I'm supremely confident that will not happen.
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A trade that could clear out simmons AND gadz along with Redd is too good to be true.
Besides the fact that the expirings will greatly help the Bucks flexibility in resigning Bogut and adding salary in a trade, we'd also get two nice pieces to rebuild with in a very good backup F/C in Varejao and the 19th pick which could be used to add some athleticism on the wing.
Besides the fact that the expirings will greatly help the Bucks flexibility in resigning Bogut and adding salary in a trade, we'd also get two nice pieces to rebuild with in a very good backup F/C in Varejao and the 19th pick which could be used to add some athleticism on the wing.
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L&H_05 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
HUGE difference in getting a 26 year old Michael Redd than a 29 year old Michael Redd...
There's a lot more tread on everyone's tires since that time...
Not really. Redd didn't start getting big minutes until he was 24 years old. He's not an old 29 at all. Minutes played matters a ton more than age does.
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But it shortens the overall window when integrated within the team... Redd added in 05 would have been a much better scenario moving forward than adding him in 08..
Than again, I am of the belief we have a better overall team now, but nonetheless, I'm not exactly thrilled with the notion of adding a 29 year old shooter...
Just not...
Than again, I am of the belief we have a better overall team now, but nonetheless, I'm not exactly thrilled with the notion of adding a 29 year old shooter...
Just not...
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L&H_05 wrote:But it shortens the overall window when integrated within the team... Redd added in 05 would have been a much better scenario moving forward than adding him in 08..
Than again, I am of the belief we have a better overall team now, but nonetheless, I'm not exactly thrilled with the notion of adding a 29 year old shooter...
Just not...
Well, if any team is in win now mode, IMO it's Cleveland. They need to show LeBron how serious they are about winning, because every team that can will be loading up on cap space for the offseason he is a free agent. Redd has at least three good years left, his game isn't based of explosion/athleticism, more on strength and quick release.
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If I'm the Cavs I definitely pull the trigger on the Michael Redd deal proposed even if Simmons and Gadz are coming back.
They are so close to the Title as it is, and adding Redd is the push they need without really giving up any players of significance.
For the Bucks, I also think it is a slam dunk move because you can add a valuable third big, a top 20 pick, and salary cap flexibility to aid in the rebuilding process from dumping the garbage that is simmons and gadz.
They are so close to the Title as it is, and adding Redd is the push they need without really giving up any players of significance.
For the Bucks, I also think it is a slam dunk move because you can add a valuable third big, a top 20 pick, and salary cap flexibility to aid in the rebuilding process from dumping the garbage that is simmons and gadz.
Re: Only Redd trade to Cavs I'd do...
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Re: Only Redd trade to Cavs I'd do...
If this deal is done do we still trade Mo for Haslem or trade him and a pick for a Maggette or Howard or AK47 yet?htr wrote:Redd, Gadzuric, Simmons to Cleveland
Varaejo, Wally, Snow, Smith, 2008 #1 to Milwaukee
We rid ourselves of the garbage we all are seeking to remove from the roster. Varaejo and the #1 can be part of the future for us. Wally, Smith, and Snow will be in the last year of their deals and can give us big time cap room.
This trade works on trade checker. What do you think?
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Cavs could probably be compelled to take one garbage contract, but two? Gadzuric and Varejao's salaries match, so that'd be the one. Besides, they'll need some backup for Z and Big Ben, such as it would be with injury prone Joe Smith the other option.
The dollars work as is: Redd and Gadz for Wally and Varejao -- Bucks could demand the #19 and Boobie Gibson and it still works. It'd be good to get a player in the deal, and Gibson's the best candidate - he took Snow and Jones' jobs in 2006 playoffs. Much rather have him than either of their contracts.
The dollars work as is: Redd and Gadz for Wally and Varejao -- Bucks could demand the #19 and Boobie Gibson and it still works. It'd be good to get a player in the deal, and Gibson's the best candidate - he took Snow and Jones' jobs in 2006 playoffs. Much rather have him than either of their contracts.
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L&H_05 wrote:But it shortens the overall window when integrated within the team
If people believe LeBron could be gone after his contract expires (I'm not sold on that but plenty of other people are), then the window is short period. Chasing after something you hope will get the job done may not be as smart a move as getting something you know will get the job done. And you really do continue to sell Redd short. He's not just a shooter; he's a scorer. That may sound like the same thing but it's not. Plenty of guys can shoot and get points but not a lot of guys can score the way Redd can. He did have a down season by his standards this year but going to Cleveland and teaming with LeBron could be just what he needs to get his game back on track.
I wouldn't view this like the Celtics getting a Ray Allen whose game was in decline. Redd still has at least 2-3 more years in my opinion of producing at a high level. And that fits perfectly with the time frame the Cavs need to prove something to LeBron in terms of going out and getting the right type of players to team with him.
Just not...
And I'm not thrilled about the Bucks getting a** raped in a deal with the Cavs for Redd. Looks like a lose-lose for both of us.
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LUKE23 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
Well, if any team is in win now mode, IMO it's Cleveland. They need to show LeBron how serious they are about winning, because every team that can will be loading up on cap space for the offseason he is a free agent. Redd has at least three good years left, his game isn't based of explosion/athleticism, more on strength and quick release.
I agree with every word of this.
The problem for Cleveland is that I'm not sure they have enough future to mortgage to get the piece they need. In other words, they don't have young talent, or high draft picks, that would get anyone excited about swapping someone like a Redd to them.
I continue to believe that, despite the fact that Redd fits perfectly in Cleveland, that will not be where he ends up simply because the Bucks will be able to find a better deal elsewhere.
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Debit One wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
I continue to believe that, despite the fact that Redd fits perfectly in Cleveland, that will not be where he ends up simply because the Bucks will be able to find a better deal elsewhere.
It's my hope that if Hammond can't find a better deal for Redd than anything the Cavs can offer on their own that he just keeps him. I really don't like the idea of giving Redd away.
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The Cavs are not hurting on defense. Lebron has no help at all and is good enough to take a team to atleast the 2nd round in the playoffs by his self. They do not need Redd to play D. Lebron gets double or trippled teamed and Redd would light teams up and open it up for Lebron.
I see Redd scoring like 26+ ppg for the next 2-3 years with Lebron. Theres a reason why Redd is on team USA.
I see Redd scoring like 26+ ppg for the next 2-3 years with Lebron. Theres a reason why Redd is on team USA.
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Oh trust me, I understand completely that Redd is an elite level scorer.. I catch about 40+ Bucks games on league pass a year for the simple fact that Redd is one of my favorite players.. Even though I may portray a different front on this board.. He is indeed one of my favorite players to watch in the league..europa wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
If people believe LeBron could be gone after his contract expires (I'm not sold on that but plenty of other people are), then the window is short period. Chasing after something you hope will get the job done may not be as smart a move as getting something you know will get the job done. And you really do continue to sell Redd short. He's not just a shooter; he's a scorer. That may sound like the same thing but it's not. Plenty of guys can shoot and get points but not a lot of guys can score the way Redd can. He did have a down season by his standards this year but going to Cleveland and teaming with LeBron could be just what he needs to get his game back on track.
I wouldn't view this like the Celtics getting a Ray Allen whose game was in decline. Redd still has at least 2-3 more years in my opinion of producing at a high level. And that fits perfectly with the time frame the Cavs need to prove something to LeBron in terms of going out and getting the right type of players to team with him.
Ironically, my biggest concern is perhaps Redd's biggest and best attribute, which is indeed his scoring... It's in the context of how that would mesh here, and how his scoring would come about..
I'm afraid that by acquiring Redd, the Cavs will continue to go with LBJ at point-forward... I understand that on the surface that looks like a solid plan, and I agree that down the stretch of a game that is where the ball needs to be.. However, I want LBJ's offensive game to expand, and IMO, that can only be done by taking him off the ball, and getting him comfortable in finding scoring spots on the floor that he's able to dominate from...
Sure, they could perhaps do that all the while integrating Redd into the offense, but I believe that adding a better backcourt player that can contribute with the ball handling duties as well as initiating the offense duties would speed up that process and ultimately make for a better fit..I'm looking for a player that can dribble penetrate and finish as opposed to being able to score from the perimeter..
I guess, I would prefer a little more playmaking ability from a newly acquired player as opposed to scoring being the main attribute brought to the table... Especially since Redd tends to have scenarios in which he pounds the ball and it doesn't move when isolated..
Nor should you be.. Then again, I do believe he's vastly overrated in terms of most of the packages (them being better than Cavs packages) that are constantly being turned down by many of the fans...europa wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
And I'm not thrilled about the Bucks getting a** raped in a deal with the Cavs for Redd. Looks like a lose-lose for both of us.
He's only getting older, and his game is limited in some aspects... Regardless of what the Bucks get and from whom, I don't believe many fans are going to be thrilled with the package in return...Because I don't believe there's going to be a huge market for him due to the fact that I believe only contending teams are going to make a play... I can't see a younger team making a serious offer for Redd.. Including the Minnesota deals I see floating around... If you really look at the makeup of their team, the way they defend, and the fact that they play out West, I can't see any scenario in which Redd and his money plus dropping 5 spots back is that much of a difference maker for them...
If it doesn't give a team a chance to compete for a title, I don't see why they pull the trigger ???
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This is just wrong on so many levels...BucksRuleAll22 wrote:The Cavs are not hurting on defense. Lebron has no help at all and is good enough to take a team to atleast the 2nd round in the playoffs by his self. They do not need Redd to play D. Lebron gets double or trippled teamed and Redd would light teams up and open it up for Lebron.
I see Redd scoring like 26+ ppg for the next 2-3 years with Lebron. Theres a reason why Redd is on team USA.