Wild Idea - Horrifying Dallas-Detriot trade

[Darren]

Dallas gets Walter Herrmann, Tayshaun Prince, Chauncey Billups, Rasheed Wallace,
Detriot gets DeSagana Diop, Josh Howard, Jason Kidd, Brandon Bass, and right to Rayshawn Terry

WHY FOR DALLAS?
Dallas gets veterans with huge playoff experience. Those are fierce competitor who never want a loss. They're the soldier of Carlisie a couple of years ago. The Mavs are at full contending mode. I expect them to get a C (Mutombo? Zo?) and a PG (Starbury? Tinsley? Livingston? Frenchise?). EJ's going to retire from playing.

They've got a more versatile starter five and players for running system. Those guys are over 30 now. But I like the chance to have them all together.

DALLAS MAVERICKS
C - Sheed - Damp / Mutombo?
PF - Dirk - Herrmann / Singleton
SF - Prince - George / Wright
SG - JET - Green / Stack
PG - Billups - Starbury? / JJB

WHY FOR DETRIOT?
Detriot enters the stage for semi-rebuilding mode. They've got a huge expiring in Kidd together with an all star in Howard (without TO at his final year) together with 2 playoff-tested young talent as well as a lesser Prince in RAT. Diop, Bass, and JoHo are under 27. Those guys are yet to hit their prime. Potential-wise, there's some gain.

This trades give them solid starters and hence playing time for young player like Afflalo and Stuckey. Kidd would be a very good mentor to Stuckey. His style is totally different from that of Billups. I expect Kidd to fit this role very well.

DETRIOT PISTONS
C - Diop - McDyess / Samb
PF - Bass - Amir / Brown / Sharpe
SF - JoHo - Maxiell
SG - Rip - Afflalo / RAT
PG - Stuckey - Kidd / Bynum

What do you think?

[Ray Allen Iverson]

Detroit has already signed a cheaper version of Diop in Brown. I think, that this deal heavily favors Dallas.

[gswhoops]

To echo what Ray Allen Iverson said, this deal is heavily slanted in favor of the Mavs. Right now Chauncey is a better PG then Kidd, Prince is at least equal to Howard in terms of trade value (because he doesn't like to run his mouth) and...Sheed for Bass? Not really interesting for a team that wants to contend now.

DALLAS MAVERICKS
C - Sheed - Damp / Mutombo?
PF - Dirk - Herrmann / Singleton
SF - Prince - George / Wright
SG - JET - Green / Stack
PG - Billups - Starbury? / JJB

That's an interesting lineup, but who defends the paint? Wallace and Dirk are both perimeter oriented PFs.

[Teddy KGB]

Didn't know Sheed had a problem defending the post...

Take the JHo for Tay part out, neither team wants it. Also, DET can dump a crappy contract on us if they want.

[JES12]

There are some teams that just don't make good trading partners....Dallas and Detroit are one of them.

BTW, this trade sucks for both teams.

Bass and Maxiell both in Detroit?
Wallace and Dirk both in Dallas?

Kwame in no way is a cheap version of Diop. He may be cheaper, but Brown's defense is not as good as Diop and Diop's offense is not as good as Browns. Regardless, if Detroit does not want that duo, I'm fine with takeing that part out.

As ss_maverick said, neither team wants that Howard for Prince swap.

Take all of those pieces out and this trade comes down to Herrmann & Billups for Kidd and R. Terry. I can guarantee that Cuban does not do that.


The worst part about of this trade is that Dallas' need is a SG and no where in this trade do we trade ours or get their SGs. A Detroit trade without Hamilton or Stucky is a complete waste of time typing.

[ecuhus1981]

Kidd was a mentor to Chris Paul and Deron Williams this summer, and started over them because of his veteran leadership with the international game.

Now, a whole 5 weeks later, he rides the bench behind Rodney Stuckey. Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight...

I don't like this trade for a number of reasons. It's just not fruitful for either team.

[gswhoops]

There are some teams that just don't make good trading partners....Dallas and Detroit are one of them.

BTW, this trade sucks for both teams.

Bass and Maxiell both in Detroit?
Wallace and Dirk both in Dallas?

Kwame in no way is a cheap version of Diop. He may be cheaper, but Brown's defense is not as good as Diop and Diop's offense is not as good as Browns. Regardless, if Detroit does not want that duo, I'm fine with takeing that part out.

As ss_maverick said, neither team wants that Howard for Prince swap.

Take all of those pieces out and this trade comes down to Herrmann & Billups for Kidd and R. Terry. I can guarantee that Cuban does not do that.


The worst part about of this trade is that Dallas' need is a SG and no where in this trade do we trade ours or get their SGs. A Detroit trade without Hamilton or Stucky is a complete waste of time typing.

What the hell is he doing, pushing his teammates out of bounds?

[old rem]

The big problem is that both teams do benefit somewhat from the "Team" thing, the stability you get from a core being togather 5+ years. Kidd didn't have a very good year for the Mavs because he's the midseason pickup who has to blend,rather than the hub things are built around. Sheed-Prince-Billups won't be the same on another team-and by the time they start to blend, the age factor kicks in.

it's sort of a lose-lose.

[RTM]

Agreed that it's a lose-lose deal, but the Pistons lose far worse.

You were right, this is horrifying.

[Teddy KGB]

Lose far worse? Ignoring the constant debate about Tay-Howard, how exactly do you lose "far worse"?

[NCHeels2008]

maybe im in the smaller camp but I consider Diops contract undesirable and having negative value. Bass and Kidd are no Billups and Sheed

[UNC's Diddy]

How exactly is Terry anything like Prince. I watched him play while we both were at UNC and he couldn't have cared less about defense. In fact one of my favorite Terry defensive moments was during the ACC tournament his Junior year. He makes an extremely athletic play on offense and starts to celebrate like he won another national championship. While he is celebrating his man runs right by him and hits a lay up to extend their league. Good Ole Roy almost had a heart attack and literally pulled Terry off the court. Not exactly Tayshaun Prince like.

[vege]

Didn't know Sheed had a problem defending the post...

Take the JHo for Tay part out, neither team wants it. Also, DET can dump a crappy contract on us if they want.

Detroit Don't have a crap contract.
I don't want Prince for Howard. Kidd for Billups is a joke. We have Maxiell so why we want Bass? We have a cheap Kwame so why we want Diop?

[Teddy KGB]

Yes, I said that you didn't want Tay for Howard, neither do we. We think JHo is better, you think Prince is better. Kidd for Billups ain't much of a joke unless you're the kind of guy that laughs at just about anything. Bass and Diop are positive assets and can be swung to a 3rd team for assets you would rather have.

[RTM]

Lose far worse? Ignoring the constant debate about Tay-Howard, how exactly do you lose "far worse"?

Well, for starters, we have to downgrade from Billups (who probably has 2-3 more good years in him) to Kidd (who you can stick a fork in at this point). Bass is a nice asset, but with all the PFs we have on this team (including Maxiell, who is very similar), he's really useless to us. Diop is a horrible contract - giving him the full MLE was a joke - and Joe D just got rid of essentially the same bad deal when he moved Nazr. We already have Kwame to fill whatever role Diop would have.

They way I'm looking at it, the Pistons trade 3 starters for 2, both of whom are less valuable and would render us less competitive to holding onto who we've got. The Herrmann for Diop, Bass part of the deal is good for us, but it's stupid to upgrade a bench (and at redundant positions) while the entire team is set back.

Besides, Billups and Sheed would work well in Dallas, so at least there's some semblance of optimism for Mavs fans in this deal.