09-10 WizFans Official Draft Thread

[dobrojim]

I'm not ready to concede that Gil will be 'done' in 3-4 years.

It's possible but remember it's not age as much as minutes
that wears a player out. Gil's gotten plenty of 'rest' the
last few years. At age 32, he could still well be going strong.

[mzaretsk]

how bout trevor booker in the second round? he's not regarded highly by draft experts but i think that he will be a solid pro. http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Tre ... 305/stats/

long and fairly athletic, loves defense, ready to play right away. he will probably do well in workouts and slide up draft boards...but if he's there in the second, i'd pick him with little hesitation. i see him as another bass, craig smith, millsap type of player.

[Ruzious]

On the flipside, he won't be quadruple-teamed in the NBA....

Invalid response - beep. I like Cuz, but he had it far easier than most talented college bigunz - playing with 3 other potential lotto picks to keep the heat off of him and to create opportunities for him. It bears repeating; If he and Favors switched places in their frosh years, we likely would not be talking about Cousins as glowingly as we would about Favors.

Oh well then you're clearly smarter than Bob Huggins who said (post-game on ESPN radio) they gameplanned that 1-3-1 defense specifically because they had no match or answer for Cousins -- and that nobody in college ball really had an answer for him this year. Hug said he normally hates to have to resort to trickery to win a game, he normally likes a straight man defense, but in this case he had no choice (and well, as he gets older he starts resorting to trickery more often). Hug said he hated to do it because the drawback to fronting Cuz /collapsing on him in the post/ and clogging his passing lanes is that the squad is vulnerable to offensive rebounding and that's why they got the hell kicked out of them on the boards, especially in the first half. See: your argument on Patterson.

But feel free to reel back through post-game and pre-game articles and cataloged psot-game recap videos by UK opponents, a surprising majority mention a gameplan against Cousins-- not Patterson, Wall, Bledsoe. And the games I've seen he's been goaded swarmed shoved hacked triple teamed... all game long. Teams run with the rep he has of a bad-tempered brute and try to push the envelope against him since otherwise mostly they got nothing.

Favors is a talent, no doubt. He's had some trouble standing out next to Gani Lawal who occupied a similar position and similar role, but he adjusted late-season and in the tourney. Cousins benefited by sharing the frontcourt with Patterson who showed versatility and adjusted his game to allow for more space inside. I've been a fan of Patterson for a couple years, this year even more so since he showed that flexibility. And no doubt John Wall is the most talented PG in the draft, little argument to me that he's the #1 pick, where by contrast GTech often looked like they were trying to dribble and pass with prosthetic limbs, so no shxt Favors would look better catching oops from John Wall instead of deferring to Lawal (underrated) and waiting for a perimeter player to remember he plays on the same team.

But look while I'm still keeping Buddhist here, have given up internet serve and volley, I just want to catalog all your positions to keep them clear:

Ruzious sez:

1. Jimmer Fredette will be a better NBA player than Stef Curry.

Because once'pontime Jimmer Fredette! scored all hella points on Arizona (who quite frankly sucked anal leakage this year) -- even though Brigham Young never plays anybody of consequence and quite often JFret played mediocre against quick athletic defenders, and his signature move is to toss up a prayer of a diving lay-up in traffic while falling out of bounds. And for all his supposed Zeus-like strength, had nothing like even the _rebounding_ stats of the puny Stef Curry, as an underclassman. Ball-dominant small-school similarities aside.

(FWIW, I like JimFret, I just think he's just peaked in his success, unless he decides to return to college, then he may have another fine year. As a range shooter who passes pretty well he may find a role on a team, but defensively he's got athletic issues: lateral movement, short arms, not necessarily a quick read on the floor. He's sturdy, but that's not the same as real athleticism, Yeah, and this coming from a guy who likes GVasquez, mostly because, well, I like his attitude, not his physical assay. And as for Stef Curry, who nearly lead the NCAAs in scoring as a freshman, top 3 his whole career, and increased his output even after his top assist backcourtmate graduated, JImmer Fredettte is a different breed of cat, slightly more one-dimensional is all).

2. Ruz point too! -- Demarcus Cuddinz suxx and his squad carried him this year. Derrick Favors rulz!

Personally I've got a few question marks about big Cuddy, though he's shown pretty good poise despite opponent antics. How hard will he work once he has the money and accolades? Does he check out when the calls go against him? Does he foul to take himself out the game when he needs a rest? Will he put in effort to improve his conditioning, or does he frankly not care all that much?

But kid is bigger and stronger than any of the opponents he faced this year, has soft hands on the catch, good instincts on both sides of the ball. He doesn't have the silly athleticism of Favors, or say JaVale McGee, but for a largely groundbound player he's a fricken boulder to move out of position, and he makes good reads on where his position ought to be. All this before hitting a Big League training room-- the kid still carries some babyfat.

If you put Favors on UK, actually come to think of it, as passively as he played early and as unskilled as he was in terms of on-court IQ (early) I don't think you'd have anything like the same output as Cousins. I expect what would happen is that Daniel Orton would have had better stats playing as the starting center. And Patrick Patterson would have had a monster year. And Calipari would have brought Favors along more slowly in that back-up role, hoping to stow him in mothballs for a reload next year.

It's a testament to Cousins in large part that he was able to displace a senior leader with high stat output. But Favors, for much of the year, looked like he had no especial skill as a baller, just happened to be gifted with major talent and size. Cousins actually looked like he knows what he's doing out there, even if, in body language, it sometimes looked like he was giving half-ass effort. He was in the right place almost all the time. Check McGee-- often that's of far more value than the ability to jump all over the place.

Best Talent Available? Could be a wash. Better fit for the Wiz? Tell you what, we haven't had much of that 'Move Bxtch, Get Out the Way' low-post bulk for a while. If we need someone to set picks screens and clear space in the lanes for McGee or Blatche or Gil to drive in for the finish, I think we'd be alright taking Cousins early. Though, I still have questions, especially given Flip's questionable motivational style.

Well, that was an uncomfortable read. What's with the attitude, doc? Did I say something offensive?

You're taking about 1 game, and I don't presume to be smarter than anybody here - much less Huggins. I do have opinions, if that's okay. Huggins was probably so effective, because nobody else played KY that way, so they weren't prepared. I'd take Huggins easily over Calipari as a game coach.

I think it's obvious to most people that Cousins has had far easier circumstances than Favors. There's your documentation of my opinion. That and a buck fifty'll get you a hot cup of coffee sans cream and sugar at your local Dunkin Donuts.

[doclinkin]

Well, that was an uncomfortable read. What's with the attitude, doc? Did I say something offensive?

You're taking about 1 game, and I don't presume to be smarter than anybody here - much less Huggins. I do have opinions, if that's okay. Huggins was probably so effective, because nobody else played KY that way, so they weren't prepared. I'd take Huggins easily over Calipari as a game coach.

I think it's obvious to most people that Cousins has had far easier circumstances than Favors. There's your documentation of my opinion. That and a buck fifty'll get you a hot cup of coffee sans cream and sugar at your local Dunkin Donuts.

Nah, I was an all-purpose ass that day, on boards and off. 'pologies to everybody in my world. Not your fault.

They charge for sugar now?

[queridiculo]

Getting ahead with the draft pick here obviously, but Arenas/Turner/Howard/Blatche/Bosh looks like a terrific starting 5.

The only question then is, is this enough to put us into championship contention? We still won't have much of a bench, and with Blatche eyeing an extension and Howard not likely to play for a discount contract very long, this team really doesn't have much salary flexibility to get better after maxing Bosh.

[Hoopalotta]

Getting ahead with the draft pick here obviously, but Arenas/Turner/Howard/Blatche/Bosh looks like a terrific starting 5.

The only question then is, is this enough to put us into championship contention? We still won't have much of a bench, and with Blatche eyeing an extension and Howard not likely to play for a discount contract very long, this team really doesn't have much salary flexibility to get better after maxing Bosh.

Yeah, those are fair points and resonate with my concerns. I think the other question would be how many scorers do we really need and do we want to pay a guy like Bosh the Max for his ability to score the ball? Or rather, is Bosh n' Blatche really doing that much more to win us games than Blatche and Kendrick Perkins, signed next summer, PLUS whatever we could get with the difference in price between Bosh and Perkins? And even that's assuming that we're not looking at a big in this lottery, which seems unlikely.

In addition, I would go further than to say "this team really doesn't have much salary flexibility to get better" and put it more like "fiscally speaking, this team will be lucky to stay intact for three years".

I'm going to take the replies to Rafael and Pancakes to the Free Agency thread, lest I waylay our compartmentalization policy.....

[Ruzious]

Well, that was an uncomfortable read. What's with the attitude, doc? Did I say something offensive?

You're taking about 1 game, and I don't presume to be smarter than anybody here - much less Huggins. I do have opinions, if that's okay. Huggins was probably so effective, because nobody else played KY that way, so they weren't prepared. I'd take Huggins easily over Calipari as a game coach.

I think it's obvious to most people that Cousins has had far easier circumstances than Favors. There's your documentation of my opinion. That and a buck fifty'll get you a hot cup of coffee sans cream and sugar at your local Dunkin Donuts.

Nah, I was an all-purpose ass that day, on boards and off. 'pologies to everybody in my world. Not your fault.

They charge for sugar now?

Nah, they were all out today when I got there at 6 AM. Btw, is there anything better than running on Dunkin when the sun's just starting to wake up? ...other than the Wiz winning the lottery, of course.

[Ruzious]

how bout trevor booker in the second round? he's not regarded highly by draft experts but i think that he will be a solid pro. http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Tre ... 305/stats/

long and fairly athletic, loves defense, ready to play right away. he will probably do well in workouts and slide up draft boards...but if he's there in the second, i'd pick him with little hesitation. i see him as another bass, craig smith, millsap type of player.

You'll hear no complaints from me. He's such a great competitor that he'll find a way to adjust his game to the NBA.

[NbdyBeatsTheWiz]

i don't think bosh staying put is a given. he's shown a pretty poor attitude towards his team and probably wants to test the FA market. the thing is - Lebron, Wade, JJ, and maybe Amare are going to dominate the talks.

I don't agree with that assessment of Bosh's place in this year's FA class. IMO he's above Amare and Joe Johnson.

Tier 1
LeBron
Wade

Tier 2
Bosh
Amare

Tier 3
Johnson
Boozer

I might even put Amare in at Tier 2 1/2 because I think teams would rather have Bosh. I don't think the Wiz have a chance at getting Bosh. No chance at all.

Totally agree with putting Bosh right behind Bron and Wade as a max player, above Amare.

I'd give max money to a 26 yr old putting up 24/11/2.5 as the absolute anchor and heart of a team before a 28 yr old putting up 23/9/1 feeding off a playmaker like Nash.

Do I want Bosh? Not really. But if it was him or Amare for the max I'd take him, and that's not even getting into injury histories.

[doclinkin]

Btw, is there anything better than running on Dunkin when the sun's just starting to wake up?

Yeah, um, sleeping 'til 11AM instead?

how bout trevor booker in the second round? he's not regarded highly by draft experts but i think that he will be a solid pro. http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Tre ... 305/stats/

long and fairly athletic, loves defense, ready to play right away. he will probably do well in workouts and slide up draft boards...but if he's there in the second, i'd pick him with little hesitation. i see him as another bass, craig smith, millsap type of player.

You'll hear no complaints from me. He's such a great competitor that he'll find a way to adjust his game to the NBA.

I also like that he adjusted his game and become somewhat of a distributor this year, or at least not a liability handling and passing the ball. If he had a reliable outside shot he'd be an instant fit for a team, but if all he does is defend like a madman he'll be just fine.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

so many guys to address...
Surf
You'd prefer cousins over bosh? the fact that cousins may or may not develop into a 18/12 guy when Bosh is already 24/11 center in the league? I'm not a gun-ho "win now" fan, but when the opportunity presents itself, you have to pull the trigger instead of stockpile resources for tomorrow. We've got Arenas who's got about 3-4 good years left even if he does return to form, a cheap and really good PF locked up for 2 more seasons, and 3 picks in this year's draft. If we can't flip the picks into a 3rd piece, we're never going to have this opportunity again.

nate
Yeah. i recognize the fact that the incumbent teams have a leg up on us in terms of resigning. I think Durant is a lost cause as well as 'Melo since they both seem to really like their teams/teammates and the organization is committed to them. However, Bosh is a different story. He's not content, he calls out his teammates, he might just be plain sick of living in CANADA (especially for a kid born/raised in Texas and went to school in Atlanta). I think Bosh is obtainable, we'll just have to pay a hefty sum for him.

verbal
I don't see any scenario where blatche/derozen is a good deal. we've got 3 sf's to choose from for next season, and derozen isn't a good enough shooter to play sg in our offense. Plus blatche is just flat out more talented.

sfam
i don't think bosh staying put is a given. he's shown a pretty poor attitude towards his team and probably wants to test the FA market. the thing is - Lebron, Wade, JJ, and maybe Amare are going to dominate the talks. If we can get in early and often making it clear that we WANT bosh we can either sign him straight up, or if it looks like Toronto is going to match - go for a s&t.

hoopalotta
you could make the case for a ton of players that they don't deserve max contracts. pretty much anyone not named Kobe, Lebron, Wade, Howard, or Durant. However, they're going to get it, and if we want to win any significant amount of games, we need talent. Gil, Blatche, and a rookie isn't going to cut it. By the time that wall/turner/cousins become a viable talent, gil will be too old and blatche will be the one demanding a max contract. the timing is just off, so we have to MAKE our timing. Right now, when blatche, gil, and bosh are still at the top of their games. Yeah we're overpaying, but that's how you win in this league. you think Orlando's happy that they've got Rashard Lewis - the posterchild of the bloated contract - on their team? not especially, but they went to the finals so all is hunky dory.

I prefer Cousins over Bosh, too. Andray had 34/10/3/4/3 tonight. Bosh can't do much better at all than Andray. Cousins will defend at the rim. He'll impact the game at both ends. He's a superior passer. The guy weighs 280 and isn't even physically developed. He's MUCH STRONGER than Blatche or Bosh. Cousins is probably going to be second to Howard in terms of bigs in the league. I don't see a dire need to get Bosh now. He can certainly help, but Andray's not a C. Cousins is probably going to be a better C than PF.

Personally, I think the Wizards losing record this season and Flip Saunders are two reasons Bosh won't become a Wizard.

[pancakes3]

i think i typed too much. i'm not SUPER-adamant about having bosh come here. i'd be happy with cousins too. i just think drafting turner and overpaying for bosh would be a better move than drafting cousins and overpaying for JJ. i think both scenarios are preferable to not making a huge FA signing and just drafting someone, which would inevitably lead to another 40 win 1st round exit.

dc has enough hoop fans that if you have Gil and a winning seasons, they'll flock to the verizon center. pair Gil up with Bosh and you'll have one of the top attendances in the league.

also, for what it's worth, brendan was putting up almost 4bpg his last season with UNC.

[verbal8]

how bout trevor booker in the second round? he's not regarded highly by draft experts but i think that he will be a solid pro. http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Tre ... 305/stats/

long and fairly athletic, loves defense, ready to play right away. he will probably do well in workouts and slide up draft boards...but if he's there in the second, i'd pick him with little hesitation. i see him as another bass, craig smith, millsap type of player.

You'll hear no complaints from me. He's such a great competitor that he'll find a way to adjust his game to the NBA.

My first choice for the second pick would be Jarvis Varnado if he is still on the board. However Booker would be a good option if Varnado is off the board or even if the Wizards take Varnado with Cleveland's first. While Booker has an obvious question mark(his size for a PF) I think he is a more complete player than most of the prospects DX has in the early 2nd round.

[sfam]

i think i typed too much. i'm not SUPER-adamant about having bosh come here. i'd be happy with cousins too. i just think drafting turner and overpaying for bosh would be a better move than drafting cousins and overpaying for JJ. i think both scenarios are preferable to not making a huge FA signing and just drafting someone, which would inevitably lead to another 40 win 1st round exit.

dc has enough hoop fans that if you have Gil and a winning seasons, they'll flock to the verizon center. pair Gil up with Bosh and you'll have one of the top attendances in the league.

also, for what it's worth, brendan was putting up almost 4bpg his last season with UNC.

I agree with you that Bosh is at least a possibility. I think this hinges on us getting one of the top picks. If we can get, say, Cousins or Turner or Wall, this makes us lots more attractive for someone like Bosh. If we're sitting at #6, we have far less a chance of getting a top tier player.

[Hoopalotta]

Why we would want Bosh to come in if we get a top pick is beyond me.

1st Option - Gil
2nd Option - Bosh
3rd Option - Wall/Turner
4th Option - Blatche (playing out of position)

And Bosh after drafting Cousins? We'd have three scoring bigs, not even counting Javale.

How about we think about defensive players who can make an impact without freezing each other out?

I think both scenarios are preferable to not making a huge FA signing and just drafting someone, which would inevitably lead to another 40 win 1st round exit.

See, that's where we're way off, as I see no reason to believe that us 'standing pat' would see us with 40 wins and a 1st round exit. I think we'd be right around the worst in the east.

[Ruzious]

Why we would want Bosh to come in if we get a top pick is beyond me.

1st Option - Gil
2nd Option - Bosh
3rd Option - Wall/Turner
4th Option - Blatche (playing out of position)

And Bosh after drafting Cousins? We'd have three scoring bigs, not even counting Javale.

How about we think about defensive players who can make an impact without freezing each other out?

I think both scenarios are preferable to not making a huge FA signing and just drafting someone, which would inevitably lead to another 40 win 1st round exit.

See, that's where we're way off, as I see no reason to believe that us 'standing pat' would see us with 40 wins and a 1st round exit. I think we'd be right around the worst in the east.

Ironikly, the team would be better with Haywood than Blatche if we added Bosh or Amare.

[FAH1223]

Signing FAs just for the sake of signing FAs is all the rage on this board

All these guys... Amare... Bosh... Boozer... all are PFs

[Surfman]

Just Say No to Free Agents. Look at Portland and Ok. City and how they built their teams. Build through the draft. Do everything to stockpile more picks whenever possible. Sure would be nice to have Steph Curry and Blake or even Hill and Budinger signed on those rookie contracts rite now. I'm not saying that we should never sign a fre agent just only really cheap ones on short term contracts. Get three valuable players in this years draft. Tank again next year and grab two or three more good assets in the 2011 draft and we are on our way. I also think it may be wise to give Blache a new contract this summer. Maybe a 5 year 35 million, think he would go for that? Hope everyone is having a good day, the weather is awesome today.

[Surfman]

Just hit the draft simulater on ESPN and thing look good. Five tries and I like it.

2,1,3,2,3

Thats what I'm talking about. Wall, Cousins, or Turner in a Wiz uni next year.

[AceDegenerate]

The Wizards are destined to draft 5th, every year until they use the damn pick on their own franchise's future.