Carmelo Anthony Thread (Merging)

[Preludepunk27]

At this point, I couldn't give a crap if we end up with Melo or not. I'm just livid how this is going. I am so pissed that it feels like Melo (don't actually know because we haven't heard anything from him) and the Nuggets are holding us hostage right now. I just want the situation cleared up asap whether we land Melo or not. This is not healthy for our locker room. Thank god its just the beginning of the season. If this was the deadline, this garbage could break a teams back.

And the rumors about the Knicks deal? Christ that team would be Felton, Melo, Amare and NOBODY. They really want to be a poor man's Miami? Only all the decent free agents are already signed so they would still be a 6 seed at best and get swept in the 1st round of the playoffs.

I'm reading Denver wants to get more cap savings....well take on Kmart then. He's an expiring and if we're giving up Favors, I'd love a Murphy/Kmart combo. I don't know why this is so damn difficult.

Dammit I'm annoyed and confused right now. I just want it over with so we can focus on the season that the team we may or may not have.

p.s. Hi to everyone. I haven't been around in a while. Got another promotion at work and in my last year of grad school so I actually have barely even read the forum lately other than the wiretaps.

[enetric]

Watch Thorn build a super team in Philly!

If he can really get Melo for Iggy it's a no lose situation for him.
Philly has a chance to convince him to stay and if he bolts you rid yourself of Iggy's contract.

He could also try and string together a package for Chris Paul using Evan Turner as the centerpiece and then upgrade one of their big men using Jrue Holiday and one of their young guys that is left after the Melo and Paul deals.

It's complicated and a little far fetched, but if he can pull off the Melo for Iggy swap, skies the limit with all the other assets he still has, even with Brand's disgusting contract still stuck on the roster, as long as their owners are willing to spend to put together a contender.

Is it Iggy and Turner? Or is it just Iggy? I mean hell...we are offering Devin AND Favors right? Iggy is better than Devin...but value per dollar? Devin is a better pick up in a deal.

[enetric]

There's just as much risk, if not more, in hoping draft picks pan out. Let's take the guy who already panned out.

Not true. The best players in the NBA...the vast majority of the elite...were taken with top 5 picks. And those teams had a 4 year window of rook contracts. Paying those guys far below their talent value...which means also having cap space. Teams that overpay for ONE big name before they can support him? And give away the piece to get better later? They have a LOOOOOOOONG history of perfectly medicore.

We've exchanged posts on this before. The fact that most great players were top 5 picks does not = the typical top 5 pick is likely to be a great player. All roses are red does not = all red flowers are roses.

I forget the exact analysis I did before, but looking at the last 10 years of top 5 picks a pretty small number turned out to even be all-stars, much less superstars. And that's with the Carmelo-Wade-LeBron-Bosh (and Darko!) class inflating the numbers.

Sucking and trying to land a superstar in the draft is a gamble. Maybe it's a better gamble than getting Carmelo and hoping to luck into another star, but it's a gamble nonetheless. Also, bear in mind that we only have 2 more years of Brook at this contract before we have to pay through the nose to keep him - we only have a limited time to try to sign a superstar via free agency.

Again, not saying I'm definitely in favor of the trade - only time will tell. But we have a window closing, so there are some justifications for going into "try to win now" mode. As others have said, the key difference between this and the Knicks is that if it doesn't work out, we can dump Carmelo and try rebuilding again in a couple of years -- the Knicks, who were far over the cap with unloadable terrible contracts for mediocre players, never had that option.[/quote]


Of course it doesnt equal all top 5 picks will be locks! That is nonsense. But your angle was absolutely wrong. The point is...the best way to get the elite star...and the right time to have him? Thwt 5 yrear window when you DRAFT him. That point where his talent per dollar value is highest...and your cap is at its most flexible. Have a few of those guys...you have a core. And you have cap room to shop....Or you can trade a couple and keep a couple. Either way...yu have youyr best chance to build it the right way. We have a window in an era where a super team was just built and we only won 12 wins. To RACE to the middle with a capped out team,. short on assets, picks...getting lower picks when we do draft...makes no sense. Its just your impatience.

You didnt get it with Troy...and you were BEYOND wrong. And here is an article today that ABSOLUTELY proves my point. Either you will get it after reading this...that had we been sitting on 15 mil in cap space and Lee right now....we get to give Denver what they wanted most. And it gives us leverage NO ONE had in the east. It also spared Favors from the deal. Its SO SIMPLE and so obvious...but you are determined to be stubborn. Maybe...just maybe this will finally get a response of...gee...I guess maybe I was wrong. So read it....read it carefully. I just think you need a better understanding of this league works. I am guessing you are a bigger baseball or football fan? Anyway...READ IT...

Nuggets GM Fielding Other Offers, "Threatening Deal"
by Net Income on Sep 25, 2010 5:50 PM EDT


More photos » Ed Andrieski - AP
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Sam Amick of FanHouse reports late Saturday afternoon that Nuggets GM Masai Ujiri is fielding others from other teams in hopes of getting a better deal for Carmelo Anthony. The tactic is making his Net counterpart Billy King "impatient" and, reports Amick, "compromising the trade."

"No key figure is growing more impatient than Nets general manager Billy King, who is determined to get the deal done by Monday and unclear on why new Denver general manager Masai Ujiri is fielding calls from teams like Cleveland and Indiana that are attempting to get involved in the trade," writes Amick. "At this advanced stage of the talks however, it's a dangerous tactic." Adrian Wojnarowski writes Ujiri contacted the Bulls and Clippers as well.

Separately in a tweet, Amick adds, "Good will is fading fast between Denver and everyone else. NJ, Charlotte, Utah not thrilled with how it's being handled." Al Iannazzone confirms the issue in a tweet, reporting, "The Nets are having a harder time getting a commitment from the Denver Nuggets than they are Carmelo Anthony.

"Alan Hahn of Newsday similarly tweets the Nuggets, who have drastically cut salary and expenses in recent weeks, "want to come out of it with a payroll savings. Deal as is would mean adding" payroll.

To help solve that issue--and Charlotte's refusal to add D.J. Augustin--Iannazzone reports "Arron Afflalo has been added to the talks, sources said, while adding there could be more involved." Jarvis Hayes would not be part of a revised deal.

Cant make every move in front of you and be succesful building a team. Just ask Isiah Thomas.

[vincecarter4pres]

What up Lude?

I agree though, I can't wait for this whole saga to be over no matter where Melo lands.

[mikhailjordan]

A package centered around Andre Iguodala can not land Carmelo Anthony. I'm willing to bet vincecarter4pres' life on it.

[jerseyjac]

Let the kid play a friggin NBA game before you predict what direction his value is going to go...

No.

Unless he plays like Dwight from his 1st game (which will never happen) there is no possible way he can increase his value. His value is as high as it is BECAUSE he has not yet played a game. There is no sense to wait till he plays, his value can only stay where it is or go down.

...go shovel your prospect's trade value theory to some fanboy's Nets forum...

[jerseyjac]

Ehhhhh

I'd rather have Anthony Randolph.

WOW! 8 years....it took you to make me laugh? The orignal foe...the original cheerleader....showing a cynical humorous side in a RARE appearence????

Where the F is Rolly, Sharcm and Basketcase? Now I have seen it all...

Good to see you...

Life gets in the way, my friend (or foe?)

Grew a couple of gray hairs .. just a couple though. Haven't had time to contribute to the usual banter but I've always hovered around.

Don't worry, will definitely get back into it sooner than later.

For all the newcomers, I leave you with this quote which describes me and enetric: "i have the same tie as you, only the pattern is reversed."

very good to see you sir...

[jerseyjac]

The fact that there's a MASSIVE debate, both from New Jersey fans and non-Nets fans on whether this is a good trade for the Nets should tell you exactly what it is.

It speaks volumes when the fans of the team giving up the All-Star player is more thrilled about the deal than the fans of the team getting an All-Star.

yep...

[enetric]

Please don't ever compare Carmelo to the players the Knicks acquired ever again. I've been holding my tongue but at this point in time I am insulted by some of the posts in this thread.

Vacuum logic works in a vacuum but the real world is not a vacuum.

Its not the players...its the direction and the timing. Why does everything need to explained to you over and over????

Just because you get a better player...doesnt mean it not the same type of deal when it costs you much more in assets and TWICE the salary...or close to 40% of your cap...and you now have serious limits how to improve from there.

You have never held your tongue. And ANY kind of logic is better than your complete lack of it.

As long as we're clear that this same situation will arise next year if Carmelo is not traded. Whatever floats your boat Dyson. Also for the record I use real world logic. I just don't force my beliefs and opinions on others even when they're wrong... Unless of course they're an Allen Iverson fan because in that case they deserve to be punished.

Well, at least we can finally agree on something. Allen Chuckerson. Most overrated player of his time. Some other quick reactions? Padawan in one response...Dyson in another? What the...F???? You have a little Urkel in you dont ya?

And you are entitled to your opinions. But that logic part of it? Man...i think that is where you come up short. I mean Petro doesnt really understand much...and sticks to his guns...but at least he TRIES to back his comments up.

Its OK. I like you anyway. And any time you want to butter me up...just make Iverson cracks. They never get old for me. Now...if only I could get you to take off youe Kobe fan goggles... Or Koggles as their called in your case....we would in business. For a start? Take that picture down you have up of him over the bed. Might help you to see things more clearly.

[enetric]

You ignored a key part of my post. We are going to have to pay through the nose in two years to keep Brook. So if our goal is to keep Brook, find another stud in the draft, AND still have any cap flexibility to make necessary moves, we'll need to land that "superstar" in the next two years. That's a pretty big gamble.

If we didn't have Brook, and had a four or five year horizon where we could build through the draft without having to worry about losing cap space to re-sign one of our supposed building blocks, that would be an entirely different situation, and I would be 100% opposed to this trade (versus unsure about it, which is my current status). But you have to acknowledge that we have a window here, or you're being disingenuous.

This is completely backwards and false.
IF you want to extend that window of caproom to play with you keep the roster stocked with cheap young talent on rookie contracts, not trade for Moby Dick sized deals as fast as possible out of panic.

Yes Brook will have to be extended, but we can dump guys like Farmar, Petro and Outlaw and of course Devin over the course of coming seasons, reopening that cap space if needed, all while having a ton of young assets on rookie deals.

Add to this the strong possibility that we would be back in the playoffs in one or two more seasons, not 4 or 5, if our current young studs are worth their wait and the added one or two high lottery pick in the mix pan even half way out, so it's not even like we were going to be some Clippers/Grizzlies abomination for the next decade.

What we do with a Melo trade is create a window, not close an existing one that isn't even there to begin with, ESPECIALLY with the Miami cHeat and about 3 to 6 other very strong teams that either already are, or will become pretty legit contenders.

Please think the situation through before jumping the gun.

Petro...I just gave you credit while poking Mikky with a stick in the last post for trying as hard as you do. But...the thing is...you have very strong opinions and not a lot of understanding of the NBA and the cap structure. Not trying to belittle you...just feel the need at this point to say it bluntly. We welcome all comers. But you need to realize...there is a lot of info here for you to take in and become more knowledgeable. I have given you A LOT of my time to get you to see the full picture and why things that just sound logical to you...arent the reality of this sport.

I truly hope that start taking in some fo the feedback from some of the more seasoned posters. I want to see what you contributre over the log haul. Love your enthusiasm.

[enetric]

The fact that there's a MASSIVE debate, both from New Jersey fans and non-Nets fans on whether this is a good trade for the Nets should tell you exactly what it is.

It speaks volumes when the fans of the team giving up the All-Star player is more thrilled about the deal than the fans of the team getting an All-Star.

That's an EXCEPTIONAL way to put it. Typically BOTH fan boards are pissed or...one is clearly ecstatic. And most of the time...the happy side is the one landing the best player in the deal. Your point about the reaction should absolutely put things in its proper perspective.

For me..at this stage the only save is...should we land him....we have to pull the third star which will be really hard to do. Without that next deal...its a medicore team going no where.

[enetric]

The fact that there's a MASSIVE debate, both from New Jersey fans and non-Nets fans on whether this is a good trade for the Nets should tell you exactly what it is.

It speaks volumes when the fans of the team giving up the All-Star player is more thrilled about the deal than the fans of the team getting an All-Star.

I don't think it really says all that much. Nuggets fans are thrilled because Melo wants out and they are in a poor position if he just walks away from their team. (/they're playing with a guy who doesn't want to be there) The Nets will be in the same situation if he fails to embrace this team. So obviously whether or not the trade goes through is dependent on Melo.

So your saying...they are happy just to find out they are getting SOMETHING? OK then ask how they feel about Gallo/Curry the Knicks best offer. Or Taj/Deng the Bulls best offer should our desl fal through. Even if they get Randolph as well. Pretty sure....they wont be happy.

I am sorry...but I think you arent seeing the core of Speedy's point and the reality of reading the fan perception Jman.

[netsfanbq]

Hey there...I'm in that same boat of checking the boards but being too busy with school (rock chalk) and work to post often....some quick thoughts:

Would love to get Melo, but Favors, Harris and two #1s is way too much to give up. Not comfortable with Farmar as the starter (do we then flip TWill for a PG?) Not comfortable having to give up so much when historically superstars are traded for much less (LeBron, Gasol, Bosh, KG, Ray Allen), not comfortable with our odds of putting together a championship team (or even one that can compete with Miami/Lakers), very uncomfortable with Billy King's inability to look ahead. As many have said, we had more assets with Lee and cap space...nothing against Murphy, but we really were golden not having to match salaries, having Lee as a trade chip, and having so many #1s. Now we are pushing all of our chips to the center of the table for Melo...and we still need to build a team around Melo and Brook. Hard to do without Favors or Harris. Will be hoping for another deadline blockbuster salary dump where we pick up that third superstar for Hump + Murphy expirings and picks (plus maybe James or TWill). I just have a hard time seeing us plugging all of the holes...and all the solutions I can think of leave us with more holes.

Question: when Murphy comes off the books next year would we have significant cap space or no? Just wondering if we could still end up with Melo, Brook and decent cap space after hump and Murphy are gone next summer (or Murhpy coming back at a reduced rate).

[enetric]

Wow Ive been away for 3 days and this happens.....

Anyway here's my cup o tee.

*Its hard to see Devin go, I as apposed to everyone else here (damn what have you done for me lately fans) really really like this guy and was excited to see him go this year healthy and playing for Avery again.

*I dont really mind loosing Favors I honestly dont see this guy's best case scenario beeing better than Carmelo who is at least a top 10 player today in his prime, you cant pass up on a chance to get a player like.

*Imo the biggest thing this trade has going for it is honestly that sexy sexy sexy cap space, 15m in cap space to throw around at the end of the season and a couple of remaining assets might very well put us in position to build one of those super team's that every team dream's of assembling.

Our next core might very well be CP3/Melo/Lopez

The thing is...you cant evaluate NBA trades with who do I think is better. You ave to evaluate them with...who is more VALUABLE...and you have to ask that factoring in talent per dollar value. Because of the cap...you have to think of salary is a percentage. Factor in age as well.

I dont hate Devin. Sure...I think he is soft as tissue paper hurting almost everything on his body over the last two years and missing time for it. But..he is a top 10 PG in this league. No question. But the the thing is...once we signed Brook...we had to salary match. So no matter what one of the two have to go. Perhaps you think...we are better off Troy? OK make tha case.

But it isnt a choice of Devin OR Favors. If it were? Favors wins this conversation by a mile in terms if NBA trade value and fitting into the growth stag this franchise is at. You cant think year to year. You have to consdier over the course of time.

And on this cap space issue? Please dont fall into the KNicks fan trap. HEY WE GO AMARE! Yeah? Well it cost you Lee for 20mil less, more reliable, no major health concerns to get him...among a lot of other pieces.

We dealt C.Lee and the cap space to fill it with Troy. Then we give up our PF stud prospect of the futre with our top 10 NBA PG. Then...the plan is...let the the quality PF go to get the cap room to go after who? Replace the same position? Who out there is next summer is vastly better? Or...do you replace the gaping hole at PG?

Its a stars league. Must have them to win. But there is right both in the growht to add them. A right time to say...OK this is when ou pay ONE guy 40% of the team's payroll in a league with a cap.

Just dont be a Nixie. That is...excited to see the thing come back that you paid to have with big pieces in the first place is my point. One other thing...after raises, cap holds, the cost for Melo and the second player we get back...its more like 10mil..or a bit less than Troy. Conceivably...we could get WORSE not better if we waited until next summer following a Melo trade. We would be better off going for one mid season this year...or any time after December 15th. What I think we all end up hoping for should we make the Melo deal is...that the scum that is the Rose/Wes tandem...starts becoming OUR scum. I have said since the days of Tellem and the Kobiatch when the Nets got screwed on draft day...agents have to much freedom and power of franchises in this sport. But at some point? If you cant beat em join em. If doing this trade for Melo where we pay out the ass...got us a follow up Paul deal despite not having enough to offer them? THEN FINE. One deal pay too much...one too little...sure...that can sell me in a HEART beat on this.

I just hope that KIng knows what he is doing. Because as of now...he is really paying a fortune to get this deal done and it doesnt get us anywhere close to being a contender. Big chance this isnt the next step...but the last step of any consequence for a long time.

[enetric]

Basically my point is, is like Rich said, we're outbidding ourselves. We could put in an offer with much less value and still be good. The reason why that trade alone is better than the Knicks is because we can offer them draft picks. I'm not saying that James alone can get us Anthony, OK fair enough you might have to switch him for TWill, just to make sure our deal is better. But the fact that we have 10 draft picks for the next God-knows-how many years, we can offer them a CRAP load, if they want let them take 3 1sts and 2nds.

As for KG, that's what we're offering on a MUCH LESSER PLAYER. KG at the time was an MVP player, Melo isn't. Pure and simple. So, why should we overpay for a 2nd tier player who doesn't even want to be there? Look, we're not saying that we have leverage over Melo. But we have leverage over Denver, because of the fact that Melo could easily walk away and leave Denver with nothing, not just that, but we can also offer the best package for Melo without sacrificing too much and that will favor us in Denver's eyes. They don't have to trade him to the Nets, but the WANT to trade him to the Nets.

You know how i laugh at people that think Twitt is the next mini Lebron or whatever, well so does the rest of the league. He is far far from qualifying for the label "talented young player" like Al Jefferson id or Favors does. And so is James. Twitt or James is not the kind of talent that would make the Nets offer the best on the table. We're not outbidding ourselves, we are offering what needs to be offered.

Boston offered much more for KG then we are offering for Melo currently. I posted the trade details earlier, how can you say we are offering the same. They gave up 7 players KG (5 of which were legit NBA talent), how is that even remotely close to our offer? We are offering 5 (only 3 of which are legit) and are getting back Melo + a decent backup pg who is still young and has potential. Thats not a bad offer at all. A lot of it is in the details like i said before. For example if we dont Augustin the deal becomes worse, if we give up an extra pick it becomes worse. But the center package is just fine and at this point i just want Melo so i dont even care about the details anymore.

You think we are doing what we HAVE to give to get it done? OK...so then should it fall through...and he ends up on the Bulls or Knicks...you think they are going to have a package close in trade value? Deng or Curry doesnt scratch Devin's sack in terms of NBA value. And Favors as a trade chip ROCKS what they have to offer. Knicks have no picks and we giving up TWO projected lottery picks here.

[jeff1624]

I'm not quite sure why Demens keeps bringing up the KG trade. Carmelo isn't nor will he be as good as KG was the moment he was traded.

Let's analyze the trade:

Al Jefferson - was a year away from earning a double digit contract
Theo Ratliff - Was a huge expiring... which waasn't an expiring at all since the money that came off the books from his deal went directly towards Jeffersons contract
Sebastian Telfair.. GTFO.. dude was officialy declared a bust by the time of the trade
Ryan Gomes - 2nd round pick that had already reached his potential as a 7th/8th guy
Gerald Green - A lot of potential but dumb as rocks..
a couple of picks

They got back a top 3 player.. while having Paul Pierce and Ray Allen on the team

Devin Harris - A guy who had been named an all star just a year ago. A reasonable contract at 8 per.. and easily a top 10 PG when healthy
Derrick Favors - A recent top 3 pick
Golden State pick - Sure to be a lottery pick in 2012


While Boston did trade more players, only 2 were valueable at the time since Gomes was fodder and Telfair a monumental bust.. So yeah they traded away most of their assets except for Rondo and decided to go all in to try and compete now.. but they could only do that because they already had 2 top 20 guys on the Roster.

We're trading all of our assets for Carmelo Anthony a guy you could arguably say ISN'T a top 10 player.. to add to Lopez and... Murphy... WHAT?

[enetric]

You still arent getting it. First Melo is no KG. he will get paid like him...but not KG. Next...ITS TIMING. How was Minny with KG in his prime? Why was older KG on Boston a better team than Minny? Because Minny had no picks, no cap space and limitted trade assets which is what we will have post trade for Melo. For 7 years...Minny couldnt get any better than they were. KG was their saint and his contract and lack of assets were there curse. Perfectly MEDIOCRE.

First off I think it's debateable whether or not KG is better or worse then Carmelo. The most important thing KG brought to the Celts was his defensive mentality and leadership - no question he trumps Melo there. Offensively however I don't think there is any doubt that Carmelo can take over a game in a way that only a handful can. That is not only a positive to Carmelo but something KG hasn't been able to do at this stage in his career. In terms of results Carmelo has had his teams playing against championship level squads in the second round the same way KG did with his earlier teams - in fact Denver was an even tougher out. I'd take KG in his prime over Melo no doubt. With a 5 year age difference Id probably go with the younger guy.

KG year one in Boston...was the EXACT guy he was before. Passing, scoring, the works. But his minutes were lowered by Doc. His averages per minute were almost identical is my point. Sure...post knee injury...declining. But my point wasnt now, sorry if I was unclear....I didnt Melo to us...is what KG was to Minny,..good and bad. My point WAS about THEN and in the past. KG the guy who no doubt in his prime DESROYS Melo now...SAME CASH. SAME huge cap hit. And out goes two lottery picks. Out goes the all star PG. There are holes and few resources to fix them. That ws Minny's issue. That was the Cavs issue to some extent. The best they could ever do was trade expiring contracts for better, older players on LONGER deals. Guys being dumped. Why? Because they could get good draft picks. They didnt have good prospects to offer.

Your picks and prospects are what gets you in these deals. In 8 weeks...Lee, Devin, Favors, GSW pick, our pick. For Melo and Troy making 33 mil out of a 58 mil cap? And still...that team isnt a contender...but the low cost prospects and picks teams love are dwindling.

If were ready? If we were able to make the giant leap like Boston did? GREAT. But to do it now...you better steal that third guy...or this trade will bite us in the ass later.

Secondly you're missing my key point - Brook Lopez. When did KG ever have a player that good to play with in Minnesota? Wally? Tom Gugliata? Anthony Peeler? Sprewell? Cassell? We already have a massive building block in place making us different then the Wolves in the 2000's.

He didnt. You would have to go back to young Marbury. But Melo now isnt KG then....he isnt Kobe, Durant, Lebron or Wade now. And Brook while very good isnt Gasol. He isnt Bosh. And he isnt making up for the combination of several great playr on these teams. I havet gotten to Orlando. Or the fact the Melo is the best player on a team that is MUCH better than the team he is joining...and getting paid a lot less to do so...with a team that was able to build itself past the cap....way past it actually. We will have the chance to deal Troy....and then use MLE cash, and then try to keep they guys we have the next few years to follow.

That third guy is tough to get is the issue here. And I have said it. I think we are selling too many pieces of way in a desperpate attempt to move ourselves the dreaded NBA middle of the pack. I prefer to stay the couse if we can get him for the song the Knicks and Bulls are offering. Sure...slightly more is reasonable. But to go to hell and back for the right to pay him DOUBLE what for example Danny Granger makes? A guy who isnt as good...but who is a lot closer than HALF as good. Or about 35% more than Lebron? A guy who is VASTLY better? I dont hear Melo saying...I will come...take the extension...but lets make it 4 years 65...and back load it so you can go out and get us some big time teammates the way the Heat did do you? Just saying....

How do you get a Ray Allen? Do you know what Allen cost them? It cost them a #5 draft pick straight up. Where are we getting that? And you do realize we have to salary match.

Yes Ray Allen cost a #5 pick in a draft straight up. And a huge NON EXPIRING contract with Wally. You do realize our roster will still have 2 young lottery picks (Augustine and TWill), a guy who could have been a lottery pick last year (James), in addition to our own first round pick? Are any of those assets equal to a #5 pick? Not right now but any of them easily could be in the next few months with solid play. You never want to count on another team's stupidity but it goes without saying we have more to offer a team then Javaris Critteton. In season multiple first round picks = a top 10 chance in the lottery.

Look I said it all along. The only way this trade works out...is we have to get another superstar. And by paying FAR MORE than the market value for Melo...and then PAYING him far more than HIS value salary wise....it is going ot be BEYOND difficult. It is the Knicks...NOT Boston. Our BEST chance of doing all of this? Trade Troy+ before the trade deadline for some veteran being dumped.

Thats the best shot. Do that? And sure...we can have the pleasure of being the Heat's tune up series before they win the title...IF we get past Orlando, Atlanta and the Celtics for whatever time they have left. And that's of course until some other team in the EC lands that stud in the draft we took ourselves out of the running for. Say Wall is a stud...and for the next two years...they land a couple more? That window we have will look pretty weak.

Here's where we agree until we don't. If this roster can find a competent PG we are competitive with everyone in the East other then the Heat. Im just throwing this out there but I believe we'd have plenty of assets left to do something like this:

Augustine (2mil), Outlaw (7mil), Hump (3.5mil), NJ 1st round pick - for Tony Parker (expiring 13 mil)

In fact, I think that's probably an overpayment since there are a few other PG's who would fit the profile of what we're looking for (Andre Miller, even Billups).

Patience willing, that kind of trade still leaves us with enough assets to add a final piece (over 25 mil in expiring contracts, TWill, D James, Morrow). Plus no bad long term contracts.

Once again for me the most important reason to do this trade is Brook. If the organization believes he is good enough to become the best offensive center in the league (already close) while improving on the defensive side of the ball (no reason he can't) we might be putting an unnecessary cap on the potential of this twosome.

Outlaw got a 35mil 7 year contract. We overpaid for him....and took a leap of faith to get him. The only way anyone WANTS him...rather than TAKES HIM off our hands is if he gets the chance to have starter minutes and gets a chance to blow up. Do that? And his deal looks like a steal...he becmes a massive trade asset. But...say you add a shoot first guy who doesnt excel at anything else to play his natural position of SF. A guy who IS GOING TO GET HIS MINUTES...and FGA's. He isnt a 4...and he isnt a 2. He can slide over and pick up a few minutes...but he will be Melo's back up. A good role guy. At best a 6th man type. So there is a good bet...Outlaw doesnt become an asset...he officially becomes a bad signing if we get Melo...further complicating the issue of improving. Twill and Morrow are assets...but right now? Not anywhere near the level of Favors in terms of trade value. Not anywhere near Devin Harris. And if we didnt make that trade...have to figure we are getting a top 10 pick next year. You think you could trade Morrow for a top 10 pick? How about the GSW pick?

Its not a TON of assets. And its the type of assets...added to Troy's large expiring that doesnt get you Chris Paul...it gets you Antawn Jamison. Honesntly? Rather just keep Troy at that point.

As for Brook...its because of Brook, and Favors...having a two year window making peanuts...that I would be interested at passing on the deal. At...seeing OK...WHO ELSE can we get? Have a CORE of young talent like that. Imagine if you had a big three between 19-23 years of age making a combined 10-12 mil of your cap for next year? Could do a lot of things with that.

[enetric]

You know...it just occured to me. THis wont happen...so I am not saying it like hey yeah a hreat idea. Saying...IF it went down like this...how much more sense it woul have made...

Get these agents who have an impact on Chris Paul...and start stirring the pot there instead. Make the SAME deal. Give them Devin, Favors and two picks...for Paul...and I would be very happy.

You know why?

1- Paul is much better in my book than Melo.
2- Outlaw could actually establish EXCELLENT trade value with Paul as a starting SF.
3- Paul will make about 5 mil less than Melo next year.
4- Paul, and Farmar? No need to push for Augustin and his 3.2 for next season.

Now we have Paul, our wing players establish better trade value with him for a year than with Melo hogging the ball and taking away minutes from those guys, and there is closer to 18mil in cap space than 10mil post Melo trade. And who would be a free agent next summer? Why its...MELO!

Now...THAT would get me excited. Somehow...after we give this package for Melo though...I dont think Troy, Twill, James and lock of Sly's hair is going to get us Paul do you?

[SOUP]

For all you old timers, you know who you are, heres something to ease the pain of your menstrual cycle.

http://hangtime.blogs.nba.com/2010/09/2 ... ef:nbahpt1

With a new coaching staff and 13 new players in the gym, every practice is important. There’s a new offense, new defensive principles and new teammates to learn.

Johnson won’t discuss any rumors, so while his team was in the middle of Sunday’s morning session, Nets general manager Billy King answered questions from the media. Unable to talk about any specific players or teams, King didn’t have much to say.

“We’re exploring everything, but there is no deal,” King said.

Multiple reports in the last 24 hours have the reported four-way trade either on hold or falling apart. But King characterized all the news that is out there as “comical.”

“When you’re in the know of any situation and you read or hear, it’s comical where it all goes, and all the different directions,” he said.

Brook Lopez apparently isn’t checking twitter and the web for the latest.

“I, for one, have no idea what’s going on,” Lopez said.

I lol'ed so hard when I read that.

Do whatever you want to the roster, don't touch my Brook.

[mikhailjordan]

Paul isn't being traded until his contract is up. And yes I just looked into a crystal ball to bring you that information (e did that last line turn you on buddy? )