[Camelo Thread]**UPDATE MELO PUSHING FOR KNICKS**- Part 4

[J0rdan4life42o]

dude, I know we're 16-9, but if we have an opportunity to get Melo, we should get him. the bottom line is, despite this recent streak we've been on, we're not a title contender yet- or really anything close to it.

getting another scorer might not be exactly what we need, but having 2 stars be the structure of your franchise for 5 years to come, that sets you up pretty nicely to contend for years. right now we're depending on amare for a lot. not that he won't continue to deliver, but if you have the opportunity to add someone like melo, you do it, even if it's not exactly filling our specific needs.

your logic is the same as the portland trail blazers' when they picked sam bowie and passed on mj. they needed a big. the fact of the matter is this lineup will change, players will get traded, we'll get injuries, we'll have losing streaks. but if you can get a foundation of 2 stars locked in for 5 years, then you've set yourself up pretty nicely to have a chance for success eventually.

you can't focus too much on the specifics of our team at the exact moment when the ultimate goal is winning a title, and we're no where near that.

What kind of reasoning is that? If we can get Melo, get him? If another scorer isn't exactly what we need, why go get him? Why use key players and cap space on an ingredient we don't exactly need? Because it would give us 2 superstars? Now, we don't know if Chandler can sustain being the type of scorer he's become over the course of an entire season. But he's been proving he can be. Fields and Gallo are proving they can be vital support players to Stoudemire and Felton. What all these guys are proving is that it's still necessary to have a strong team to win consistently. That's what Dallas, Boston and San Antonio are proving as well. None of those teams have 2 superstars. But they have great pieces that compliment their best players and they all buy into what their coaching staff preaches. Who are you to say this team can't develop into a title contender? You're telling a team that's won 13 of 14 games, riding an 8 game winning streak, leads the league in road wins, has an MVP caliber player dropping 30 a night on anybody he wants and just beat legit western conference playoff team that they can't reach those heights? I mean, really...what does a team have to do to prove to you they can develop into a contender, especially when you yourself are saying Anthony may not be exactly what we need?

[Iron Mantis]

Thankfully, regardless of how we feel, Walsh is going to go after Melo, for the right price. I understand chemistry and balance, but I really don't see how you can go wrong adding another top 10 NBA player to your squad. Melo will HAVE to adapt his game to feed off of Amar'e, and Amar'e will feed off of him. Lebron adapted his game to fit what Miami was trying to do, and I think Melo can do the same.

As far as defense goes, as long as we keep Chandler, I think we will be fine. If we get a defensive center, Chandler can backup 3 positions off the Bench, or continue to start at PF if not.

If we can keep Chandler, it's inexcusable to not get a top 10 player in his prime, who is available.

[J0rdan4life42o]

listen i love our team right now... but we DO have an easy early schedule

you know what my concern is? late in the game, who is our go to guy for a big shot? our win streak has disguised it, but we definitely need an elite perimeter player to go along with amar'es post dominance

melo is a star... he is the MAIN reason denver has made the playoffs for 7-8 years straight now. not nene, not JR smith (jeez), and not billups (yea he helped his 1st year there, but has declined alot quickly)

im hopeful, but i think the games on our slate coming up against elite teams will expose the exact things we need to fix.. the things melo can fix

and yes, melo is not the full answer to the championship puzzle. i think were gonna need another big body down low... but that will come down the line with another trade... especially if we do not give up to many assetts for MElo in the first palce...

Amar'e leads the league in 4th quarter points with over 8 per game. I think he had another 10 tonight. I know guys like Kobe, Wade, Pierce etc. have made it feel like go-to-guys down the stretch HAVE to be perimeter oriented players, but they really don't. In fact, I feel so much more comfortable having a 6'10 clutch PF who I know can get me big baskets in 4th quarters whether it's facing up, taking it to the rim, getting to the FT line, taking the 12-15 midrange jumper, cutting to the basket etc.- he can hurt you in so many ways, which is why he's been so productive in 4th quarters. And he's not the only guy...some of Gallo's biggest moments have come down the stretch of games, same with Felton. Chandler too. Our win streak has only opened our eyes to how clutch of a player Amar'e is and how some of our other guys get up for the big moments too. So I think we're fine in that regard.

Perimeter players take the game out of the Ref's hands. If you rely on the inside guy, the onus is on the ref to call the foul. Trust me, they will bang and bruise and hack your star PF or Center until they get called for the foul.

Well, then it's a good thing we don't have a conventional, back to the basket type PF who needs the refs to bail him out because all he can do is score in the paint...it's a good thing he's a multi-dimensional scorer who doesn't necessarily have to bang inside to get his points

[Iron Mantis]

It also doesn't hurt that Melo consistently gets superstar foul calls...which cripples the other team, as we saw today.

[Jose7]

Things are getting veryyyy interesting

[TommyNYK34]

dude, I know we're 16-9, but if we have an opportunity to get Melo, we should get him. the bottom line is, despite this recent streak we've been on, we're not a title contender yet- or really anything close to it.

getting another scorer might not be exactly what we need, but having 2 stars be the structure of your franchise for 5 years to come, that sets you up pretty nicely to contend for years. right now we're depending on amare for a lot. not that he won't continue to deliver, but if you have the opportunity to add someone like melo, you do it, even if it's not exactly filling our specific needs.

your logic is the same as the portland trail blazers' when they picked sam bowie and passed on mj. they needed a big. the fact of the matter is this lineup will change, players will get traded, we'll get injuries, we'll have losing streaks. but if you can get a foundation of 2 stars locked in for 5 years, then you've set yourself up pretty nicely to have a chance for success eventually.

you can't focus too much on the specifics of our team at the exact moment when the ultimate goal is winning a title, and we're no where near that.

What kind of reasoning is that? If we can get Melo, get him? If another scorer isn't exactly what we need, why go get him? Why use key players and cap space on an ingredient we don't exactly need? Because it would give us 2 superstars? Now, we don't know if Chandler can sustain being the type of scorer he's become over the course of an entire season. But he's been proving he can be. Fields and Gallo are proving they can be vital support players to Stoudemire and Felton. What all these guys are proving is that it's still necessary to have a strong team to win consistently. That's what Dallas, Boston and San Antonio are proving as well. None of those teams have 2 superstars. But they have great pieces that compliment their best players and they all buy into what their coaching staff preaches. Who are you to say this team can't develop into a title contender? You're telling a team that's won 13 of 14 games, riding an 8 game winning streak, leads the league in road wins, has an MVP caliber player dropping 30 a night on anybody he wants and just beat legit western conference playoff team that they can't reach those heights? I mean, really...what does a team have to do to prove to you they can develop into a contender, especially when you yourself are saying Anthony may not be exactly what we need?

Don't get me wrong, I'm excited as anyone else by what this team has done the past month. But we're not good enough yet to be so concerned about team chemistry that we'd pass on a chance to add a player with this much talent.

[DishAndSwish]

That's what Dallas, Boston and San Antonio are proving as well. None of those teams have 2 superstars

Dirk and Duncan maybe... but they have a pretty damn good supporting cast, which include Kidd, Parker, Manu, etc.). I'm scratching my head about Boston though. Arguably, they have 3 with an elite point guard, but I guess that depends on how you definte superstar.

[NikeFoamposites]

wrong.

this offense needs another star for an extended run in the playoffs. this current offensive team is not enough come playoff time.

[NYman15]

Incareted bob said melo was going to the nets so im not sure if he's right

[delvec19]

holy sh*t i HATE asshola

FisolaNYDN Frank Isola
Carmelo source tells News that Melo's first choice is still Knicks but he'd also consider deals with Chicago & NJ should Denver trade him

[NYKnick87]

Acquiring more defensive players isn't gonna improve our defense. Outside of Amare, all our players play good defense. The real answer to improving our defense would be to boot D'Antoni in favor of a coach who actually has some type of defensive philosophy. Under D'Antoni, we're gonna beat teams by running them out of the gym and forcing them to play at our pace. The more highly skilled offensive players we have, the better. Melo is one of those. His availability makes him a must.

[Falstaffxx]

It basically comes to down to: yes, we do need Carmelo, but we need to get him at the right price so that we still have a decent supporting cast for the Felton/Carmelo/Amar'e core.

[NBA Fan 1234]

Incareted bob said melo was going to the nets so im not sure if he's right

Here we go with this guy again...

Also, Isola (and his "sources") are (Please Use More Appropriate Word) if they think that Melo is going to go to NJ...Chi has no assets to get Melo also so I have no idea how that trade would happen. Isola is terrible.

[Knicker23]

wrong.

this offense needs another star for an extended run in the playoffs. this current offensive team is not enough come playoff time.

This. You are grossly mistaking if you think the fact that we throw up a lot of points means we have enough offensive fire power - grossly mistaking.

How you could conjure up so much on why we don't need one of the top players is beyond me. We need him, and Donnie will do what he needs to do to get him here, that much im sure

[kingOfqueens]

If you are getting 15 or more PPG from your other three starters, you don't need to gut the team to get 25 points from one guy who may ruin the game for the rest of the cast. It is illogical to assume Melo is going to become a player who makes everyone around him better when he has only marginally shown such a quality.
.

Sup guys first post here. Ive been on this site since the whole lebron fiasco started earlier this summer. Clyde I enjoy reading your posts, you're one of the more level headed individuals here. I do have to say tho I'm all for acquiring Melo as long as our core pieces remain in tact (maybe AR curry buike 2014 pick for melo) and then resign chandler using our bird rights this off season or sign and trade him for other pieces we need (center, pg etc). One thing i learned this offseason is that you cant just add and subtract statistics when it comes to acquiring players, especially star players. I thought the Stat signing for the max contract vs letting lee go for a lesser valued contract was a terrible move for us because i just looked at the numbers. Lee shooting 55% for 20ppg to go along with almost 12rebs and 4 assts vs amares 24 pts 8 rebs and 2 assts. Of course this is a completely different team than last yrs but still i dont think we'd be where we are now with lee instead of stat. Star players change the dynamics of a game past what the numbers will show you (forcing double teams, leadership, clutch plays etc etc). Carmelo has a rep for being a volume scorer, to some extent that is true but hes shooting 46% for his career which isn't terrible for a small forward (gallo's at 40% this season and 42% overall). Also melo shot 50% for the whole 07-08 season which shows you that if he wanted to he could be an efficient scorer (maybe playing along side an all star power forward would make things easier for melo, after all he's never played with a dominant big man before).
Defensively speaking Amare was never known for his defense in phoenix, but his attitude towards defense has seemed to change here in NY. He still isn't a great defender but he puts effort into it and gets timely stops. That's what i'd expect from Melo, he's never going to be an elite defender but if he truly wants to be here, he'll put in the work just like Amare has. And lets face it, with D'antoni as coach we're probably always gonna be in the bottom half of the league defensively, which is also why i think with him as coach we'll be lucky to even advance to the second round.
The league is all about talent and chemistry, if you put the boston starting 5 on separate teams they all would be (have been) been 20ppg scorers and all stars. Same can be said with the lakers- odom, artest, gasol, kobe all are or have been all stars, orlando with lewis howard nelson and carter and even the spurs with duncan ginobili and parker. Come playoff time you absolutely need that second star player to advance.
as far as chemistry goes, its unpredictable.. we didnt know coming into this season how felton, amare and the rest of the new comers would gel together, fortunately for us it worked out. You can try to analyze all you want but theres no way of predicting chemistry until they actually play together. As long as we dont give up too much theres no reason to not pull the trigger for melo, but fortunately for us Donnie's a smart GM and he'll make the right move.

Now let me STFU and GTFO

[Falstaffxx]

Incareted bob said melo was going to the nets so im not sure if he's right

Here we go with this guy again...

Also, Isola (and his "sources") are (Please Use More Appropriate Word) if they think that Melo is going to go to NJ...Chi has no assets to get Melo also so I have no idea how that trade would happen. Isola is terrible.

Yeah if his "source" says he'll extend with NJ, then it's not a legit source. There's no way he's extending with the 6-18 Nets where he'll be playing another whole year in Newark.

[Jstarks3]

the one thing i dont get is, why give up anything of value? melo says he wants new york. why are we giving up the farm for him? denver either gets nothing in return, or whatever we want to give them (curry, walker, maybe randolph, 2nd rounder, cash, whatever)

[NYMNYKFN10]

Isola's source is probably someone in the Denver F.O. trying to get the Knicks to panic and give up more than they need.

[knickabocker88]

Even though they have different skill sets, the overall sentiment is that there worth in Value to the team is roughly the same (Even though I think Gallinari's is a better fit), to me the differecne is the one extra year Gallo has on Chandler in terms of contract.

If Chandler commands a Contract thats over 7.5 Million, than he's the one that you let go, him and Carmelo are way to similar on offense to have 100 Million locked up between the 2, Defense wise look at our coach. His entire system is based on his team wearing out the other team and forcing them to take bad shots, thats the main reason our rotation is so small. No teams true second unit can go out and compete with the Knicks 8 man rotation.

Our Condition is way above the rest of the leagues, look at how well we do on B2B it is no coincidence.

I don't understand why people can't see how Gallinari just being on the Court opens things up for the rest of the team

[knicks742]

the one thing i dont get is, why give up anything of value? melo says he wants new york. why are we giving up the farm for him? denver either gets nothing in return, or whatever we want to give them (curry, walker, maybe randolph, 2nd rounder, cash, whatever)

What do you think is more valuable Curry, Walker and a second rounder or keeping Melo until the end of the year, getting some playoff revenue and then trading him for an exception and a second round pick?

Whatever Denver receives back has to be more valuable than a playoff run and a trade exemption and a second rounder. If the trade is Gallo, Curry and a first rounder it's still a great deal for a guy like Melo and it's more value than a TE and 2nd round pick so Denver is more likely to accept.