Rodney Stuckey 14 Assist Game vs. TOR... closer look?

[313 Professor]

I know this is a little old, but I was hella busy and couldn't watch the TOR game live when Stuckey had 14 assists so I had to DVR it. After reading through the game thread, I was interested to see exactly what happened because everyone was talking about how he'd run the point well, and never played at such a high level. Yesterday when I had a little free time, I logged the game, and paid specific attention to all of Stuckey's assists. These were the results:

BTW, I only do this because I plan on pursuing a career in sports.

Assist 1 - Inbounds play to Greg Monroe (standstill)
Accurate pass... Good agility displayed by Monroe... Terrible interior defense to allow a easy lay-in off of an inbounds play. Rather easy assist.
Assist 2 - Rip Off-Ball Score (standstill)
Accurate pass.... Rip getting open off the ball as usual. Easy assist.
Assist 3 - Pick & Roll w/Monroe
Bargnani & Evans = terrible agility as team defenders... Monroe = good agility to get a step and get to the hole. Good decision... Accurate pass... Decent assist.
Assist 4 - CV Oop (standstill)
Accurate pass... CV spin to hoop. Terrible awareness on D. Still a great look displaying instinct and timing.
Assist 5 - Elementary penetrate and kick to BG
Accurate pass... Lazy defense by Barbosa… Pretty Lackluster Drive… 6 Foot pass to BG in the corner... Rather easy assist.
Assist 6 – Play breakdown drop off to Monroe
Loose ball Stuckey beats Barbosa to the ball… Easy access to lane w/Barbosa at halfcourt…. Drives right at Reggie Evans (who is laterally incapable)… easy drop off to Monroe. Rather easy assist.
Assist 7 – Inbounds play to Rip jumper (standstill)
Rip beats his man off the ball on inbounds play… Rodney passes him the ball. Easy assist.
Assist 8 – Transition Pass to Rip Drive and Score
Stuckey gets Rip the ball in transition after the TOR miss… Barbosa is on him. Rip takes 3 dribbles and takes it all the way to the hoop… Terrible D by Barbosa to let Rip drive-by… Questionable as to why that would even be considered an assist.
Assist 9 – Transition quick dish to Rip for jumper
Stuckey pushes ball in transition… TOR doesn’t get back… Stuckey passes to Rip for a open jumper. Rather easy assist.
Assist 10 – Penetrate and drop off to Monroe
Good pick… drives straight at Bargnani who is in no man’s land… drops off to Monroe for the finish… Terrible D by Bargnani... Still a decent assist.
Assist 11 – Transition drop-off to streaking Daye
Stuckey pushes… TOR doesn’t get back… Daye runs the floor… Stuckey passes to him for the easy lay-in. Rather easy assist.
Assist 12 – Get it to CV in mismatch
Stuckey drives at Bayless… Bayless passes Stuckey off to the big… Stuckey passes to CV with Bayless on him… CV takes one power dribble and scores over-the-top of Bayless… Rather easy assist but a good decision.
Assist 13 – Transition drive to BG for a corner 3
Stuckey pushes…. BG drifts… Defense isn’t close enough… Ben bags the 3. Rather easy assist.
Assist 14 – vs. Zone, TOR loses Rip for jumper (standstill)
Rip moves off-the-ball… TOR loses him in their zone rotation… Stuckey passes to Rip for the open jumper. Accurate pass… Rather easy assist.

Translation
OK first off, Toronto is truly one of the worst defensive teams in the league. Bargnani and Evans are almost inept at defending the paint, and Barbosa is a pretty bad perimeter defender as well. With that being said Rodney is still a very accurate passer. When his feet are set, when he has space in transition, and when he isn’t under duress, he can get the ball to the open man and get it there quickly.

But, against a team who actually cares to get back, with players that have some understanding of how to rotate, Rodney’s game wouldn’t have been nearly as impressive statistically. He didn’t create opportunities for anybody for the most part. The pass to CV showed nice timing and instinct, but every starting PG in the league and a great deal of the backups could’ve made the rest of these plays.

Yes, Stuckey is better when the guys can shoot and are willing to run and play fullcourt basketball, but what PG isn’t better going the other way with numbers and shooters all around him?? It wasn’t impressive. It actually made me want a PG even more so I could see how good our offense would be playing with all of these shooters, and a PG who can help create NOT ONLY in fullcourt situations, but in halfcourt ones as well. In the 4th quarter when games are decided, teams HAVE TO be able to execute from the halfcourt. You might catch a team off guard early in the game when everybody is more relaxed trying to play that up-tempo fullcourt basketball, but no team is stupid enough to NOT get back when the game is on the line, and it is impossible to assemble a group of players fast enough, and good enough in the fullcourt game to overcome this common sense adjustment. Just look at Miami. They have arguably the two best fullcourt players in the NBA, but even they have to get the majority of their offense in halfcourt situations.

Bottom Line
If we’re not gonna re-sign Stuck to come off the bench, he should go elsewhere.

BTW, I apologize to all who are tired of the Stuckey arguments, but I just felt it was necessary to take a closer look at this game in particular.

[ComboGuardCity]

You just hate him. It's really that simple.

[2tough]

You could just translate this thread to: Discredit every good thing Stuckey does well, magnify any little mistake. Well, yeah he got an assist to a guy streaking towards the basket, but the assist was TOO EASY so it doesn't "really" count. Were people discrediting Billups, when he got the same routine "easy" assists to Hamilton? (hitting a guy in stride and on time off of screens is actually not as easy as it looks). Why does Stuckey get no credit for getting guys like Monroe easy shots at the basket? Oh right, the pass wasn't "difficult" enough for you. The lane was congested enough, there weren't two 7 footers blocking his view, etc. Gotcha.

You're a joke dude, a board laughingstock. Everyone here can see through your transparent agenda.

[313 Professor]

You just hate him. It's really that simple.

LMAO. I just speak the truth. It just happens that a lot of people don't see the truth about Stuckey so I post it. If for some reason people were calling Monroe a bust, and were hating on his potential, I would post in defense of him in the same manner.

[2tough]

The day I stopped taking this guy seriously is the day he said we should build our future team around Richard Hamilton. In fact, that might have been the first post he ever made here.

[313 Professor]

The day I stopped taking this guy seriously is the day he said we should build our future team around Richard Hamilton. In fact, that might have been the first post he ever made here.

You don't have to take me seriously, but you're going to have to take the truth about Stuckey seriously if the Pistons re-sign this guy as one of our starting guards of the future. I'm just saying.

And I don't know why you bring up Rip everytime I say something, like me believing that Rip, Jerebko, and Monroe are the only starting caliber players on our team is something that I should be ashamed of. You've never made a legtimate basketball point against that. All you really do is find a couple stats, without understanding and considering the full picture of the situation.

This thread isn't about Rip or Jerebko though.

[ajaX82]

I actually don't mind this, as it is a fairly detailed look at the game. Is it unbiased? Of course not. Does that mean its total bull? Of course not.

This was an interesting read. I'll take it with a grain of salt, but interesting

[2tough]

The day I stopped taking this guy seriously is the day he said we should build our future team around Richard Hamilton. In fact, that might have been the first post he ever made here.

You don't have to take me seriously, but you're going to have to take the truth about Stuckey seriously if the Pistons re-sign this guy as one of our starting guards of the future. I'm just saying.

And I don't know why you bring up Rip everytime I say something, like me believing that Rip, Jerebko, and Monroe are the only starting caliber players on our team is something that I should be ashamed of. You've never made a legtimate basketball point against that. All you really do is find a couple stats, without understanding and considering the full picture of the situation.

This thread isn't about Rip or Jerebko though.

The truth about Stuckey isn't what you post, so get off your high horse already. As I've said before, you act like your supposed 'unbiased analysis' is the freaking gospel, and you are quick to dismiss anyone who doesn't agree with you. You have a clear agenda in every post you've made about him (Stuckey), and this is clear to anyone that's read your posts before.

I don't need to make a case against Hamilton as a starting player going forward. His production the last two years makes the case for me.

[313 Professor]

You could just translate this thread to: Discredit every good thing Stuckey does well, magnify any little mistake. Well, yeah he got an assist to a guy streaking towards the basket, but the assist was TOO EASY so it doesn't "really" count. Were people discrediting Billups, when he got the same routine "easy" assists to Hamilton? (hitting a guy in stride and on time off of screens is actually not as easy as it looks). Why does Stuckey get no credit for getting guys like Monroe easy shots at the basket? Oh right, the pass wasn't "difficult" enough for you. The lane was congested enough, there weren't two 7 footers blocking his view, etc. Gotcha.

You're a joke dude, a board laughingstock. Everyone here can see through your transparent agenda.

I'm not going to give Stuckey credit for doing something that EVERY other starting PG in the NBA can do, and a vast majority of the backups.

When guys like Hamilton and Monroe shake their man and are WIDE OPEN, the person passing them the ball doesn't get the credit... they do. When a person with a stroke runs the floor and is wide-open in transition for 3, they get the credit for being knockdown shooters... not the person who passed them the ball. Passing the ball to wide-open players is not an accomplishment for an NBA PG, and assists that are a product of another man's skill shouldn't be used to overrate them. What is so wrong and biased about that?

My only agenda is for the truth about our team and players to be recognized by the fans on this board.

[2tough]

You could just translate this thread to: Discredit every good thing Stuckey does well, magnify any little mistake. Well, yeah he got an assist to a guy streaking towards the basket, but the assist was TOO EASY so it doesn't "really" count. Were people discrediting Billups, when he got the same routine "easy" assists to Hamilton? (hitting a guy in stride and on time off of screens is actually not as easy as it looks). Why does Stuckey get no credit for getting guys like Monroe easy shots at the basket? Oh right, the pass wasn't "difficult" enough for you. The lane was congested enough, there weren't two 7 footers blocking his view, etc. Gotcha.

You're a joke dude, a board laughingstock. Everyone here can see through your transparent agenda.

I'm not going to give Stuckey credit for doing something that EVERY other starting PG in the NBA can do, and a vast majority of the backups.

When guys like Hamilton and Monroe shake their man and are WIDE OPEN, the person passing them the ball doesn't get the credit... they do. When a person with a stroke runs the floor and is wide-open in transition for 3, they get the credit for being knockdown shooters... not the person who passed them the ball. Passing the ball to wide-open players is not an accomplishment for an NBA PG, and assists that are a product of another man's skill shouldn't be used to overrate them. What is so wrong and biased about that?

My only agenda is for the truth about our team and players to be recognized by the fans on this board.

Hamilton is rarely ever "wide open". He'll get a step or two on his defender, but his defender is almost always trailing him by just a step. If the ball isn't accurately placed, the defender will be in position to knock it away or disrupt the play at the very minimum. Those aren't as easy as you make them out to be, and like I said, there was never anyone critiquing Billups for getting easy assists off of Hamilton.

The reason guys like Monroe are able to get open in the first place is because Stuckey has been driving, drawing the defense in and dishing it off when the defense is committed to him. It's not like he's bringing the ball up the court and boom, there's two or three players wide open. Stuckey IS the reason players get open, using his dribble penetration as a decoy. To act like Stuckey doesn't play a big role in the players getting open in the first place (and then making the right decision with the ball) is laughable.

When Stuckey has been allowed to play the point and play with the younger players on the roster (and not the old selfish vets who take the ball out of his hands), he has flourished of late. He's done everything anyone would ask of a point guard. Well, I guess besides you. You won't be satisfied till Stuckey is facing and beating the toughest defenses every night, on every single play. And even then... you'd still critique him and find (i.e. make up) faults. Whatever.

[<3AmirJohnson<3]

I underline words to compensate for my inadequacies

douche

[313 Professor]

I've always thought Chauncey was more of a product of being put in the right situation at the right time than he was a superstar player. The situation in DET was perfect for him to be overrated, and replacing arguably the worst teammate in NBA history in Allen Iverson put him in the perfect position to be overrated as well. He's a very good player and one of my favorites, but he has indeed been overrated, and getting cheap assists playing with Rip is just one example of it. I started to address that point, but didn't wan't to change the subject (and still don't).

Of course the pass isn't "easy." Everything that NBA athletes make look easy really isn't, and that is an example. But... how many NBA PG's/NBA players overall CAN'T hit Rip off of a screen when he has a step or two on a defender? Seriously? It's an easy NBA pass.

And did you even read the post in its entirety? Or did you just skim it with the "Damn... 313 is STILL hating on my boy Stuckey" mindset, and find the first seemingly legitimate excuse you could make for him?

And btw, I could've sworn I read you say in the Cav game thread that you were done with Stuck.

[<3AmirJohnson<3]

Your sig is a quote of yourself. Wow. You're a joke.

Also get a life! You watched a recorded basketball game from two lottery teams from a couple days ago and judged the assists made by a player you dislike, then went on the internet to make a point and prove your knowledge about basketball. You are so tight, brah.

Who does that?

[313 Professor]

Your sig is a quote of yourself. Wow. You're a joke.

Also get a life! You watched a recorded basketball game from two lottery teams from a couple days ago and judged the assists made by a player you dislike, then went on the internet to make a point and prove your knowledge about basketball. You are so tight, brah.

Who does that?

Tell me I'm wrong though, brah. That's what the forum is for. And your underlining words post doesn't even make sense. I underlined it because at that point of a long post, I know that I personally am likely to skim over the last parts unless something draws my attention to it.

Because I knew some immature cat would come on here and say "get a life", I addressed this in the post:

BTW, I only do this because I plan on pursuing a career in sports.

And... What's going on in your life that's so great where you think you can log-in and talk down to me like you're relevant to the rest of the world in any way?

[<3AmirJohnson<3]

Well, I don't really post here, and having some time open today I decided to catch up on what Pistons fans are thinking about the team at the moment.

And yeah, you're obnoxiously opposed to Rodney Stuckey. I don't care if the Pistons keep him or not, I'm not a big enough fan of him or the Pistons to care anymore, but your post was really annoying. Multiple people called you out for it, so just accept that it was a douchey thing to do.

To get back to basketball, how do Legitimate Non-Rodney-SUCKey (see what I did there?) point guards get assists that aren't passing to open shooters, or passing to people next to the basket for easy buckets?

Yeah, but you're still a douche

[Cowology]

<3AmirJohnson<3, you just made 2 or 3 posts in a row that could all earn you a warning for flaming. Knock it off. Whether you agree with somebody or not, calling them a douche and otherwise belittling and insulting them isn't going to be tolerated.

We may disagree on some things, but we're all Piston fans. Let's show a lil respect and common courtesy, please.

[effjay]

I was beginning to wonder where the mods were. Thanks for posting Cow. No need for personal insults, jeez.

[bballnmike]

I will say that quoting yourself, underlining things (even if its meant to be helpful) and saying stuff like "I just speak the truth" comes off as being a bit full of yourself (I wouldn't go so far as to call you a douche lol), and it might be distracting from an otherwise very in depth analysis.

I found it to be an interesting read, even if I disagree that all of Stuckey's assists were "rather easy", "decent" or just a product of playing against a poor defense. thats your opinion and you definitely had reason to support it, but I think most good passes are results of at least some lapse in defense. Good rotations and good on the ball defense = difficult passing lanes or no passing lanes, which leaves room for only excellent passes. were any of Stuck's assists absolutely amazing? maybe not, but I don't fault someone for making the right decision in finding the open teammate, even if its rip curling off a screen or an easy dump into the post. stuck did that against toronto, that was his job, so kudos to him.

Also LOL at someone ever trying to criticize another person online for posting online. Thats what this is for, especially since you said you hope to make a career of it. This is a good outlet to practice that.

And TMac is out tonight, so Stuckey is getting the start, should be interesting

[Cowology]

Anyway, what I think is interesting is that I could draw a completely different conclusion from the exact same information.

You talk about easy or elementary plays being run, or how it was really the result of the other person doing the work like those are bad things. I think it's awesome. I don't care if we are playing the worst defensive team in the league, if you get 14 assists you're having a pretty damn good game.

Stuckey made the right, simple play on a consistent basis. He found the open man, and gave guys the ball in a position where they could create. He ran the offense. That is exactly what you want, but it seems like you intend this information as a means of discrediting him. I am confused by this.

My only complaint is that he doesn't play like this more often.

[JD43320]

Remember when Bynum had 20 assists in game last year? Or when Rip averaged 12 assists per game for a week the year before? Yeah. One big assist game (or even 3 in a row) means squat when it comes to actually being a point.