Official Raptors 2011 NBA Draft Thread, Part 7

[fredericklove]

If we don't get D-Will or Kanter, who else would we take? I've seen nothing special from Val and he is definitely a work in progress/long-term project. Kanter has his question marks with his knees and lack of length/athleticism to contest shots at the rim.

I don't know about Biyombo either,

Just throw in all 3 big men in the draft workout and whoever comes out on top is the winner

as the top 5. I think CLE would have a tough decision to make. Take D.Will and grab a PG at #8 like Knight or someone like Burks or take Irving and take Bioymbo/T.Jones/Val at 8. I seriously think they would go the D.Will route leaving Kyrie Irving as the Raptors choice.... just saying its just this weird feeling i have.

what would you rather have if your CLE

Some articles were talking about their situation too. I'm not surprised if they go with DWill first and choose a scoring guard second. It's basically adding two very capable scoring duo on a team, or choosing a potential all-star level floor general and a role player at SF.

[5DOM]

The bloody lottery can't come fast enough

Seriously. Why the **** is it so late?

[yayotube]

Quality is not great
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YyB1WeaSV6k[/youtube]

[darth_federer]

We are truly screwed. 2012 draft is stacked.

After Irving and Williams I would take Val only because hes a legit C. Hes an excellent rebounder (the skill that translates the most to the pros), a good help side defender but a weak one on one defender because he isnt strong enough yet. He also plays with a ton of passion like Biyombo and hes a competitor.

But, hes still raw. He hasnt really shot the ball at all (excellent free throw shooter) and he pretty much plays in the post.

[Raps in 4]

If we don't pick top-2 I say trade it.

[fredericklove]

Quality is not great
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YyB1WeaSV6k[/youtube]

DWill23 talks like a "running out of battery" type of robot lol. He sounds like a Mr. Nice Guy but he sure doesn't play like one.

[Truthrising]

his wingpsan is ridiculous, 7'7 (javale mcgees is 7'6). At only 6'9, his mobility is a thing of beauty too. just a freak of a prospect. plus, with a name like BISMACK BIYOMBO, how could you go wrong?

best case: Ben Wallace
worst case: Joel Anthony

Hassan Whiteside also has wingspan of 7'7 and is 6'10 and look how he turned out

Did Whiteside shatter Garnett's hoops sumitt record for blocks too?

Whiteside is 7ft 235lbs Bismack is 6"9ft and already 240lbs.

Man all I read of this guy is he has the potential to be a good defender and rebounder with no offensive skills whatsoever. This guy reeks of being a one dimensional player and if we're going that route we might as well resign Reggie Evans...

[Strategist1]

Man all I read of this guy is he has the potential to be a good defender and rebounder with no offensive skills whatsoever. This guy reeks of being a one dimensional player and if we're going that route we might as well resign Reggie Evans...

Depends on the makeup of your team.

If you have Bayless or Irving scoring 15 points a game
Derozan scoring 17-20 points a game
Ed Davis scoring 10-12 points a game
Small forward (James Johnson for now) scoring 8-10 points

Do we really need a centre who requires significant amount of touches on the offensive end?

I rather have a centre who can score 10-12 points on putbacks/dunks, who grabs 9-12 boards a game, blocks 2 shots a game, and can be a force defensively in the paint.

Out of Kanter, Val, Biyombo...I think all of them are just 10-15 ppg at best. The key is who has the most upside defensively, who has length to contest shots, and who can be best measure up to the speed and toughnesss of the NBA game.

[ty123]

Man all I read of this guy is he has the potential to be a good defender and rebounder with no offensive skills whatsoever. This guy reeks of being a one dimensional player and if we're going that route we might as well resign Reggie Evans...

Who else is intriguing around that #3 area? Kanter has great skills but he said he wants to play SF and he's not much of a great weakside defender. Valanciunas average 8.2 fouls per 40 min in Euroleague and I'm not sure if his weakside help defense will translate.
He has a great motor and his rebounding and shot blocking instincts are very good. If the Raps can get a defensive gamechanger, I don't care we take it and run. **** the offence.

[JYD]

Also, let's say we take a Biyombo, or Jonas V with the pick..probably going to take both a little time to develop..then we trade Bargs...perfect setup for next year's draft. We work on improving the interior C/overall defense, but will likely struggle to score somewhat even if the kids play well, then boom back with a top pick in the 2012 draft.

[Strategist1]

Also, let's say we take a Biyombo, or Jonas V with the pick..probably going to take both a little time to develop..then we trade Bargs...perfect setup for next year's draft. We work on improving the interior C/overall defense, but will likely struggle to score somewhat even if the kids play well, then boom back with a top pick in the 2012 draft.

Agreed... Anyways, there aren't really immediate impact guys in the draft besides Irving and Williams. BC should get a guy who fills a need and that can work well (compliment) the young core. Then add another piece in the 2012 draft.

[ATLTimekeeper]

Depends on the makeup of your team.

If you have Bayless or Irving scoring 15 points a game
Derozan scoring 17-20 points a game
Ed Davis scoring 10-12 points a game
Small forward (James Johnson for now) scoring 8-10 points

Do we really need a centre who requires significant amount of touches on the offensive end?

I rather have a centre who can score 10-12 points on putbacks/dunks, who grabs 9-12 boards a game, blocks 2 shots a game, and can be a force defensively in the paint.

Out of Kanter, Val, Biyombo...I think all of them are just 10-15 ppg at best. The key is who has the most upside defensively, who has length to contest shots, and who can be best measure up to the speed and toughnesss of the NBA game.

You need a star post and star perimeter threat to win the big games. This make-up doesn't really have either (unless Irving falls into our lap). You just can't divvy up ppg. DeRozan without a three or a competent distribution game isn't going to be able to carry the load. You take the best player, period, and worry about who will defend/score later. If it's Kanter. Take him and think of ways to bring in a defensive C. If it's Val, take him and find the big elsewhere.

[bboyskinnylegs]

^^ but don't things like athleticism, weight/length (for a given height), and shotblocking/defensive ability (all of which Biyombo appears to be the best of the 3 bigs, given the info we have at this point in time) figure into a BPA assessment? Or does the scoring ability trump that?

[Truthrising]

You guys are already making rash judgements on both Kanter and Biyombo and just because one player had one crazy game with a triple double how would you know that it could've been a fluke? If Biyombo had a mediocre game during the summit than i'd guaranteee you we wouldn't even be having this conversation and he woul;d've been projected to go in the late teens. We have another guy in Kanter who hasn't played all year so it's kind of hard to see how he'll fare as well, Instead we shoud at least wait and see how the workouts turnout to better gauge their overall value, hopefully have them workout against eachother.

[wegetitin08]

Kyrie or Die

[SDM]

Defense from a big >>>>>>>>>> offense from a big. Even then, it's almost impossible for a double-digit rebounder to NOT at least score 8, 9, 10, 12, 14 (or more) points. Unless there's a big in the draft that has 20/10 potential with the ability to be a positive defender (this guy would probably go #1), you absolutely must go with the best defensive player if looking to pick up a big, especially if all available bigs have question marks.

[Reignman]

A couple of things about Kanter:

All the measurements used when discussing Kanter are from age 16/17, it's not inconceivable that he's grown from his 6'10" height. He already has enough size to play the 5 but with a bit of growth over the last 2 years it might turn out that his measurements are actually quite good. I wouldn't be surprised if he's 6'11"+ with a wing span of 7'2"+.

Secondly, if he has improved his game at all over the course of not playing this year from where he was at age 17, then it's a wrap, he'll be the best big in this draft EASILY. He's also working with Grover and has quite a bit of time to polish up his game.

Lastly, out of all the bigs in the draft he's the one that could make an impact immediately. Biyombo is going to be a major project and the bust factor is strong with this one. I'm always weary of run/jump athletes that make such a huge impression in one game, reminds me of Joe Alexander. The guy really doesn't have any true skills right now. I'm alot higher on Val but even he is a major project and contract issues might restrict him from coming here for a year or 2. I'd rather players develop with us in their formative years rather than overseas.

Anyway, all-in-all, I don't think anyone can definitively say who will be the best of the 3 and the workouts will shed a tonne of light on that.

[5DOM]

You guys are already making rash judgements on both Kanter and Biyombo and just because one player had one crazy game with a triple double how would you know that it could've been a fluke?

It's really the same thing with Kanter who became really known after dominating Hoops Summit himself. People might say Kanter dominated the U18 Euro Championships, but what you have to remember is that when you are bigger and stronger than everyone like Kanter was, it raises questions. I've seen young players in basketball and other sports who were thought to become huge stars but failed when their main strengths of superior size and athleticism were no longer there. And it's not like Biyombo only had one good game. I've obviously seen him only once, but NBA scouts must have watched all his games in ACB by now.

All the measurements used when discussing Kanter are from age 16/17, it's not inconceivable that he's grown from his 6'10" height. He already has enough size to play the 5 but with a bit of growth over the last 2 years it might turn out that his measurements are actually quite good. I wouldn't be surprised if he's 6'11"+ with a wing span of 7'2"+.

Kanter didn't look 6'11"+ to me when he was standing next to Terrence Jones.

[Lucky26]

not trying to talk **** or anything, but dont you guys think anthony davis looks alittle odd? I mean hes probably a nice guy, but he looks...different

I don't care if his face looked like a deformed foot, I would take the kid on my team just because of his skills.

I know basketball players don't have to look like Calvin Klein models, but it isn't so hard to get some braces and trim that Kuni-brow right?

Some people in this world are comfortable in their own body, it's called self-confidence, something you may not have yet because you're prolly 15 years old.

[Strategist1]

I did mention, that the workouts will make a huge diference in my opinion. I'm sure in the upcoming weeks leading up to the draft, we'd probably get to see more of these guys.

I'm just saying, if a guy clearly has better rebounding/defence/blocking in the workouts and videos, Raptors should take that guy rather than taking a guy based on offensive ability.

Sometimes offensive ability in the NCAA and the Euroleague does not translate well in the NBA.