Discussing Other Teams' Moves

fishercob · Post #681 » by **fishercob** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:49 am

chadfordinsider Chad Ford
Sad the CP3 drama is over? Don't worry, the Eric Gordon won't sign an contract extension in NO drama is coming up next.

chadfordinsider Chad Ford
Barring an extension, Gordon will be a restricted FA on July 1st. If no deal with NO, he's an unrestricted FA in summer of 2013.

Crawford, Vesely, and Seraphin for Gordon!!!

Post #682 » by **penbeast0** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:50 am

Billups made his own bed, let him lie in it . . . I was sort of shocked not to see Mo and Bledsoe going along to New Orleans and Okafor coming back. It was like the original LA trade in that it leaves them with only one big and multiple PGs except that Mo (expiring) and Bledsoe have value unlike Blake and Fish.

Post #683 » by **LyricalRico** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:50 am

Huge "eff-you" to the Lakers by the league. They block their deal and turn around and send Paul to the team that shares their same arena. Stern needs to do himself a favor and just go away after this.

willbcocks · Post #684 » by **willbcocks** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:54 am

Penbeast: The clippers have more than one big: they have Deandre Jordan and Blake Griffin.

TGW · Post #685 » by **TGW** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:58 am

Love it for the Hornets. They have a legit stud in Gordon. A young, developing stud in Aminu. A guy they can flip for value in Kaman. Minnesota's unprotected pick that could end up the #1 pick in the draft.

Awesome trade for both teams.

Illuminaire · Post #686 » by **Illuminaire** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:05 am

fishercob wrote:Crawford, Vesely, and Seraphin for Gordon!!!

It would never happen, but YES PLEASE!

I'd do Crawford/Vesely/Top-10 protected pick if necessary. Gordon is really good, and really young.

willbcocks · Post #687 » by **willbcocks** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:11 am

Yeah, I would love that. Then you would hope Dwight would seriously consider us in FA, as we would have probably the best young team with cap space to surround him with.

Wall
Gordon
Dwight?

We could run 3 on 5 and still make the playoffs.

Dat2U · Post #688 » by **Dat2U** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 2:05 am

TGW wrote:Love it for the Hornets. They have a legit stud in Gordon. A young, developing stud in Aminu. A guy they can flip for value in Kaman. Minnesota's unprotected pick that could end up the #1 pick in the draft.

Awesome trade for both teams.

Good value for the Hornets. It's much much better than the Lakers package for a bunch of 30 yr olds. That 2012 pick could be a potential stud. Gordon is a top 6 SG. Aminu, well at least he's young. Kaman is trade bait.

The NBA handled it horribly and and it was a total PR nightmare, but the Hornets aremuch better for it now.

doclinkin · Post #689 » by **doclinkin** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 4:26 am

See Stern couldn't rig the lotto for the Whornets if they didn't land any picks in the trade. Now he's got the hole card for a toldja so.

Chocolate City Jordanaire · Post #690 » by **Chocolate City Jordanaire** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 6:39 am

The Clippers and Hornets have reached an agreement on Chris Paul.

Eric Gordon, Chris Kaman, Al-Farouq Aminu and Minnesota's first round pick in 2012 will be sent to the Hornets. The Clippers will also receive two future second round picks from the Hornets in addition to Paul.

Read more: http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/21 ... z1gaB1umEP

The deal New Orleans would have received from Houston and LAL was much better IMO.
Martin vs Gordon
Scola vs Kaman
Odom vs Aminu
1st round picks cancel out --> Minnesota replaced Rambis with HOF bound Adelman; added Derrick Williams and Ricky Rubio. The Timberwolves are going to win a LOT more games this season.
New Orleans GIVES 2nd round picks in this deal--whereas they RECEIVED 2nd round picks before.

The deal the league approved was better only for money reasons. Gordon IMO isn't even as good as Martin.

hands11 · Post #691 » by **hands11** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:32 am

MF23 wrote:Sucks to be Chauncy Billups. Williams and Paul on your same team. You know what, that's messed up. Clippers get a boo from me.

Looks like the Clips have themselves a team.

Sets up a nice LA vs LA battle. CP to Griff should be nasty. Plus they have CB and Billups. They have some quality vet experience now. Good for them. They have sucked long enough. Good to see you can be terrible and poorly run and them eventually turn things around.

I don't follow them much. Did they have any change in their front office in the last few years ?

Post #692 » by **Ruzious** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:34 am

doclinkin wrote:See Stern couldn't rig the lotto for the Whornets if they didn't land any picks in the trade. Now he's got the hole card for a toldja so.

Yeah, if the NBA still owns the Hornaze during the draft lotto - and have two of the high pix, there's going to be a real perception problem.

I hate to give Stern credit for his meddling ways, but it it twerent for him, this trade wouldn't have been made - and it's an excellent trade for both teams. The reason it's much better than the Lakers deal is because it's sets them up for the future. The Lakers deal would have made them better in the present - but still just a mediocre team with little future - and they'd probably would have ended up selling off the players they would have gotten.

Now, they have a star guard - who's probably going to score 25 points a game - and probably 2 high picks in an excellent draft. Aminu is no stud, but hopefully he develops into a decent starter. He just needs to play under control.

And maybe they can get something for Okafor or Kaman. Jarrett Jack is their only PG? Dyson might actually play and show I was right about him?

The Clips adding Caron is interesting. Can he be a team player there and fit in? I don't know. He's got to check his ego. Brian Cook is their top backup big - that's indicitive of a bit of a problem. They have about 5 PG's and no SG's. I guess Billups starts at the 2 - and he's another guy who's going to have to check his ego. I wouldn't be surprised if they eventually go with Bledsoe playing with Paul. They're tiny, but they're so fast, and they could take turns throwing lob passes to Griffin and Jordan.

hands11 · Post #693 » by **hands11** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:36 am

fishercob wrote:
chadfordinsider Chad Ford
Sad the CP3 drama is over? Don't worry, the Eric Gordon won't sign an contract extension in NO drama is coming up next.

chadfordinsider Chad Ford
Barring an extension, Gordon will be a restricted FA on July 1st. If no deal with NO, he's an unrestricted FA in summer of 2013.

Crawford, Vesely, and Seraphin for Gordon!!!

Can we see Vesely play for us before you go trading him ? How can you even value him properly without seeing him on the court in the NBA ?

hands11 · Post #694 » by **hands11** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:53 am

Ruzious wrote:
doclinkin wrote:See Stern couldn't rig the lotto for the Whornets if they didn't land any picks in the trade. Now he's got the hole card for a toldja so.

Yeah, if the NBA still owns the Hornaze during the draft lotto - and have two of the high pix, there's going to be a real perception problem.

I hate to give Stern credit for his meddling ways, but it it twerent for him, this trade wouldn't have been made - and it's an excellent trade for both teams. The reason it's much better than the Lakers deal is because it's sets them up for the future. The Lakers deal would have made them better in the present - but still just a mediocre team with little future - and they'd probably would have ended up selling off the players they would have gotten.

Now, they have a star guard - who's probably going to score 25 points a game - and probably 2 high picks in an excellent draft. Aminu is no stud, but hopefully he develops into a decent starter. He just needs to play under control.

And maybe they can get something for Okafor or Kaman. Jarrett Jack is their only PG? Dyson might actually play and show I was right about him?

The Clips adding Caron is interesting. Can he be a team player there and fit in? I don't know. He's got to check his ego. Brian Cook is their top backup big - that's indicitive of a bit of a problem. They have about 5 PG's and no SG's. I guess Billups starts at the 2 - and he's another guy who's going to have to check his ego. I wouldn't be surprised if they eventually go with Bledsoe playing with Paul. They're tiny, but they're so fast, and they could take turns throwing lob passes to Griffin and Jordan.

Do they have room to make a move on Nick. He is a LA kid. They would be nasty by adding someone like Nick at SG even if it is off the bench.

no D in Hibachi · Post #695 » by **no D in Hibachi** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:30 pm

I'm skeptical about how much success the clips will have with butler and billups being key pieces. I believe whole heartedly that the mavs wouldn't have won if butler was healthy and billups has such an enormous ego getting rid of him was the best thing denver did in the melo trade. Butlers skills were erroding in dc for two years and now he'll check his ego AND revert to 2008 form, dont see it at all.

dandridge 10 · Post #696 » by **dandridge 10** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:53 pm

Ruzious wrote:
doclinkin wrote:See Stern couldn't rig the lotto for the Whornets if they didn't land any picks in the trade. Now he's got the hole card for a toldja so.

Yeah, if the NBA still owns the Hornaze during the draft lotto - and have two of the high pix, there's going to be a real perception problem.

I hate to give Stern credit for his meddling ways, but it it twerent for him, this trade wouldn't have been made - and it's an excellent trade for both teams. The reason it's much better than the Lakers deal is because it's sets them up for the future. The Lakers deal would have made them better in the present - but still just a mediocre team with little future - and they'd probably would have ended up selling off the players they would have gotten.

Now, they have a star guard - who's probably going to score 25 points a game - and probably 2 high picks in an excellent draft. Aminu is no stud, but hopefully he develops into a decent starter. He just needs to play under control.

And maybe they can get something for Okafor or Kaman. Jarrett Jack is their only PG? Dyson might actually play and show I was right about him?

The Clips adding Caron is interesting. Can he be a team player there and fit in? I don't know. He's got to check his ego. Brian Cook is their top backup big - that's indicitive of a bit of a problem. They have about 5 PG's and no SG's. I guess Billups starts at the 2 - and he's another guy who's going to have to check his ego. I wouldn't be surprised if they eventually go with Bledsoe playing with Paul. They're tiny, but they're so fast, and they could take turns throwing lob passes to Griffin and Jordan.

This is one of the reasons why I did not understand all the hoopla on Stern rejecting the Lakers trade. As the owner of the Hornets, the NBA had every right to nix any deal they felt was not adequate for the Hornets. By nixing the Lakers deal and waiting until Clippers sweetened the pot, I think the NBA did a pretty good job for the Hornets franchise. Now, if people want to debate whether the NBA should own any franchise due to conflicts of interest issues, I think that is fair game. But, the bottom line is the NBA DID own the Hornets and had every right to reject any deals they did not think were good for the franchise.

Illuminaire · Post #697 » by **Illuminaire** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:58 pm

hands11 wrote:Can we see Vesely play for us before you go trading him ? How can you even value him properly without seeing him on the court in the NBA ?

Usually I would agree, but if we could somehow trade Vesely and Craw for a young stud like Gordon, that's a no brainer. There's no reason to hold on to Ves hoping he can become a top starter at his position if we can move him to get someone who already IS that good.

Benjammin · Post #698 » by **Benjammin** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 6:01 pm

I imagine some of us are concerned that once people actually see Vesely play that his trade value will only diminish.

Illuminaire · Post #699 » by **Illuminaire** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 6:05 pm

dandridge 10 wrote:This is one of the reasons why I did not understand all the hoopla on Stern rejecting the Lakers trade. As the owner of the Hornets, the NBA had every right to nix any deal they felt was not adequate for the Hornets. By nixing the Lakers deal and waiting until Clippers sweetened the pot, I think the NBA did a pretty good job for the Hornets franchise. Now, if people want to debate whether the NBA should own any franchise due to conflicts of interest issues, I think that is fair game. But, the bottom line is the NBA DID own the Hornets and had every right to reject any deals they did not think were good for the franchise.

The issue, Dandridge, is that the NBA had set up Demps as an essentially independent operator of the team. They did this for several important reasons, primarily to prevent the suspicion of collusion, which would have potential legal consequences on top of *(&#(^!^ the crap out of other "real" owners.

The NBA league office is supposed to be an impartial facilitator of the game. Team owners are supposed to be competitive and self-interested entities who strive to make their teams better than other owners. The powers and responsibilities of each party are simply not compatible, which is why the NBA attempted to create some distance between itself and the Hornet's decision makers.

However, the league office then violated that spacing and began pulling all the strings directly. That's a problem. The league knows things individual teams do not. The league can communicate in ways individual teams cannot. Stern, basically, has far more power as an owner than any other owner has, or should have. It's like if you're in Vegas and the owner of the casino sat down at the high stakes table and started crushing the big spenders; he may have the right to raise and call because he's a "player", but that's not the issue. He should never have been at the table to begin with.

Post #700 » by **montestewart** » Thu Dec 15, 2011 6:29 pm

no D in Hibachi wrote:I'm skeptical about how much success the clips will have with butler and billups being key pieces. I believe whole heartedly that the mavs wouldn't have won if butler was healthy and billups has such an enormous ego getting rid of him was the best thing denver did in the melo trade. Butlers skills were erroding in dc for two years and now he'll check his ego AND revert to 2008 form, dont see it at all.

Billups probably won't be around for long, not with two other vet PGs. All else aside, Paul and Griffin give them a chance a real success. Comparisons to Stockton and Malone will be coming soon. Whether such a comparison is appropriate, the skill levels aren't too far apart.