Official Speculation Thread (Pt XIV, Mods Close))

arkknight1988 · Post #1301 » by **arkknight1988** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 4:27 pm

does anyone think we can move baby before the deadline? that 4 year deal will scare some teams away

cedric76 · Post #1302 » by **cedric76** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 4:35 pm

i m pretty sure Martin told that Otis is gone if he decides to stay.

I think D12 wont opt out

InFlames · Post #1303 » by **InFlames** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 4:35 pm

BelgianMagic wrote:Probably been discussed before; I just read that WT article about Martins ..

"Sources say Martins has played a role in rejecting a deal Otis Smith would have completed with the Nets in January"

Was that the Brook Lopez/Gerald Wallace trade where POR got 4 1st round picks? .. If so, thank god for Alex Martins

I still don't believe that's real. Has anyone in the Magic confirmed it? I mean Por would have gotten 5 1st rounders for Wallace. There is just no way.

If this was a real deal Otis is the worst GM of all time.

Post #1304 » by **eyriq** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 4:36 pm

arkknight1988 wrote:does anyone think we can move baby before the deadline? that 4 year deal will scare some teams away

Good question. What exactly is his value? 8.1 MPG during Boston's '08 playoff run, so really you can't say he was a rotation player for a champion. His subsequent playoff contributions where much more substantial, but even then his production doesn't jump out at you outside of '09 when he played 36.4 MPG and 16-6-2 on 49-0-71 shooting. To me the bulk of his work is the mark of a border line rotation player that can earn his keep by playing with energy and bringing defense, as his pedestrian regular season PER demonstrates. Probably over paid but also probably still moveable for a team that lacks a big and could value the intangibles he brings to the table.

KingRobb02 · Post #1305 » by **KingRobb02** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 4:45 pm

eyriq wrote:
arkknight1988 wrote:does anyone think we can move baby before the deadline? that 4 year deal will scare some teams away

Good question. What exactly is his value? 8.1 MPG during Boston's '08 playoff run, so really you can't say he was a rotation player for a champion. His subsequent playoff contributions where much more substantial, but even then his production doesn't jump out at you outside of '09 when he played 36.4 MPG and 16-6-2 on 49-0-71 shooting. To me the bulk of his work is the mark of a border line rotation player that can earn his keep by playing with energy and bringing defense, as his pedestrian regular season PER demonstrates. Probably over paid but also probably still moveable for a team that lacks a big and could value the intangibles he brings to the table.

He's a jump shooting PF who can't jump or shoot. He's like a savant with knowing where to be on defense, but once he's there he isn't particularly athletic enough to do anything besides put a body on a guy or take a charge. You tell me where his value is?

ZeusIsLoose · Post #1306 » by **ZeusIsLoose** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 4:53 pm

The most logical thing i can think of that Martins is trying or has tried is to sell Dwight on opting in for one more year. Once 2013 offseason begins, they will be able to sign a few solid FA's like his buddy Josh Smith or Monta.

KingRobb02 · Post #1307 » by **KingRobb02** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 4:57 pm

eyriq wrote:
KingRobb02 wrote:http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=7opqx88
Does adding a couple of picks pick get that move done?

They take on roughly $6.6 million dollars and the longest contract in the deal, not to mention they give up a proven starter in Ariza and proven rotation player in Jack. Now granted they are in full rebuild mode so their core of today is really irrelevant to their long-term plans. A chance at a lottery pick would be worth the exchange I think, as $6.6 over 4 years isn't going to kill cap room and the trade won't actually change the calculus of their rebuild I'd imagine. Though given the nature of Orlando's situation I'm not sure it wouldn't take multiple picks with limited protection, or thereabouts. What are your thoughts?

My thoughts are Jarrett is already 28, and they have been making noise about liking him with the second unit which is coach speak for "we want to see what Vasquez can do."
Ariza is a rotation player that Hornets fans think is overpaid, and they are clamoring for Aminu to play more minutes but he can't as long as Ariza is there.
I picked Davis and Duhon, mainly to make the salaries match and because I am sure they could talk themselves into two local guy having a good influence during the rebuild (both players are from Louisiana). It would be like us getting Parsons, Calathes, and Mbah a Moute to attract fans.
I guess we could exchange Solomon Jones for Ayon since injuries have ravaged their big men and Ayon is one of the few who can actually play. That makes Earl our full time backup PF (foul machine). Not sure if that situation is better.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=6mbqvzw

magicman123 · Post #1308 » by **magicman123** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 5:04 pm

jack is averaging 14.5pts, 6.1ast, 4reb. ariza is averaging 11.6pts, 3.4ast, 5.8reb..i doubt the hornets take our trash for 2 of their better players..landry, smith and gustavo are playing better than davis, greivis is better than duhon...doesnt make sense for the hornets unless they value the picks so much, or they think harper will be a stud

arsenal6106 · Post #1309 » by **arsenal6106** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 5:06 pm

Greg Anthony and Adrian Woj Discuss: Could Dwight Howard Stay In Orlando?

http://sports.yahoo.com/video/player/nb ... A/28532025

It's a yahoo video.

KingRobb02 · Post #1310 » by **KingRobb02** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 5:07 pm

magicman123 wrote:jack is averaging 14.5pts, 6.1ast, 4reb. ariza is averaging 11.6pts, 3.4ast, 5.8reb..i doubt the hornets take our trash for 2 of their better players..landry, smith and gustavo are playing better than davis, greivis is better than duhon...doesnt make sense for the hornets unless they value the picks so much, or they think harper will be a stud

Jack is averaging good numbers but they are already making noise about benching him.
They think Ariza is overpaid.
Landry, Okafor, and Smith are all hurt so they are giving big minutes to Lance Thomas. Baby can at least help there.
Just like a Dwight trade, it wouldn't be about the players received but about the youth and draft picks.

jezzer45 · Post #1311 » by **jezzer45** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 5:11 pm

jack and ariza would would be better than anything orlando has available, which means hornets wont do it because they have the better players.

magicman123 · Post #1312 » by **magicman123** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 5:17 pm

KingRobb02 wrote:
magicman123 wrote:jack is averaging 14.5pts, 6.1ast, 4reb. ariza is averaging 11.6pts, 3.4ast, 5.8reb..i doubt the hornets take our trash for 2 of their better players..landry, smith and gustavo are playing better than davis, greivis is better than duhon...doesnt make sense for the hornets unless they value the picks so much, or they think harper will be a stud

Jack is averaging good numbers but they are already making noise about benching him.
They think Ariza is overpaid.
Landry, Okafor, and Smith are all hurt so they are giving big minutes to Lance Thomas. Baby can at least help there.
Just like a Dwight trade, it wouldn't be about the players received but about the youth and draft picks.

so they replace jack with duhon and his contract, major negative
they replace ariza with harper, advantage us
they replace jones with orton, advantage us
they take on davis and his dumb contract, advantage us
you can see why we get +7 wins in that trade, advantage us
that 1st round pick better work out for them

i would love that trade, but i doubt the hornets will

jernigan · Post #1313 » by **jernigan** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 5:23 pm

Just checking on our trade progress

KingRobb02 · Post #1314 » by **KingRobb02** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 5:26 pm

magicman123 wrote:
KingRobb02 wrote:
magicman123 wrote:jack is averaging 14.5pts, 6.1ast, 4reb. ariza is averaging 11.6pts, 3.4ast, 5.8reb..i doubt the hornets take our trash for 2 of their better players..landry, smith and gustavo are playing better than davis, greivis is better than duhon...doesnt make sense for the hornets unless they value the picks so much, or they think harper will be a stud

Jack is averaging good numbers but they are already making noise about benching him.
They think Ariza is overpaid.
Landry, Okafor, and Smith are all hurt so they are giving big minutes to Lance Thomas. Baby can at least help there.
Just like a Dwight trade, it wouldn't be about the players received but about the youth and draft picks.

so they replace jack with duhon and his contract, major negative
they replace ariza with harper, advantage us
they replace jones with orton, advantage us
they take on davis and his dumb contract, advantage us
you can see why we get +7 wins in that trade, advantage us
that 1st round pick better work out for them

i would love that trade, but i doubt the hornets will

It's more of them taking a chance on us sucking for a while and them having our pick + the clippers/minnesota pick and their own. In their eyes maybe the thought of our 2012 pick is worth paying duhon 3 mil instead of paying jack 5. Then maybe our 2014 pick is worth getting rid of Ariza's huge contract. They would be admitting to losing by forcing us to give up two first rounders.

They traded Chris effing Paul for Eric "injury risk" Gordon and picks. How is going from Ariza and Jack to Baby and Duhon more of a drop?

Visirale · Post #1315 » by **Visirale** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 5:37 pm

Just finished watching Peyton Manning's press conference about being released from the Colts. True professionals are so rare these days. I really do respect guys like Tim Duncan, David Robinson, and even Kobe Bryant for sticking with one team through thick and thin to get things done. I've been really disappointed with what I've seen from Dwight over the past few months. I really thought he might be different, but so far that is obviously not the case. This current generation of NBA stars is so entitled. Getting pretty sick of it.

BadMofoPimp · Post #1316 » by **BadMofoPimp** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 5:40 pm

KingRobb02 wrote:
They traded Chris effing Paul for Eric "injury risk" Gordon and picks. How is going from Ariza and Jack to Baby and Duhon more of a drop?

First: Gordon is not that big of an injury risk.

Second: Ariza is a quality starting SF in this league that can play Defense. Jack can start on many teams in this league. Baby and Duhon are nothing but Backups in this league. Baby has as bad of a contract as Ariza, but neither players contract is truly horrible while both of them have tradeable contracts. Duhon is not in the same league as Jack.

MoMM · Post #1317 » by **MoMM** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 5:44 pm

I dont think NO will trade anyone before getting sold.

arkknight1988 · Post #1318 » by **arkknight1988** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 5:47 pm

this is how a successful franchise is ran.

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/6450/kawhi-leonard

“If you’re going to get something good,” Popovich says, “you’re going to have to give up something good. It was tough, but we did it … We were fortunate enough to get him.”

KingRobb02 · Post #1319 » by **KingRobb02** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 5:47 pm

BadMofoPimp wrote:
KingRobb02 wrote:
They traded Chris effing Paul for Eric "injury risk" Gordon and picks. How is going from Ariza and Jack to Baby and Duhon more of a drop?

First: Gordon is not that big of an injury risk.

Second: Ariza is a quality starting SF in this league that can play Defense. Jack can start on many teams in this league. Baby and Duhon are nothing but Backups in this league. Baby has as bad of a contract as Ariza, but neither players contract is truly horrible while both of them have tradeable contracts. Duhon is not in the same league as Jack.

Since his rookie year he has missed at least 20 games due to injury every season. That is an injury risk.
It's not meant to be a player for player trade. It's meant to be a "we'll take the guys you don't want if you give us draft picks and youth" trade. They happen.

magicman123 · Post #1320 » by **magicman123** » Wed Mar 7, 2012 5:51 pm

KingRobb02 wrote:It's more of them taking a chance on us sucking for a while and them having our pick + the clippers/minnesota pick and their own. In their eyes maybe the thought of our 2012 pick is worth paying duhon 3 mil instead of paying jack 5. Then maybe our 2014 pick is worth getting rid of Ariza's huge contract. They would be admitting to losing by forcing us to give up two first rounders.

They traded Chris effing Paul for Eric "injury risk" Gordon and picks. How is going from Ariza and Jack to Baby and Duhon more of a drop?

they were forced to make a trade with cp3, gordon is a 23 year old shooting guard that can average 20+ points with 5+ assist, they got a big expiring respectable center in kaman, a decent prospect in aminu, and Minnesota first round pick, yes its hard to get value for a player like chris paul

ariza and jack for baby and duhon and your wondering about the drop? come on man

id rather pay jack $5.5mil for one year than one year of duhon for $3.6mil possibly 2 years

ok, if we give them 2 unprotected 1st round picks than that might be something they will seriously think about, but both teams take a huge gamble and one will get screwed, your selling me on the 2 1st round picks :lol: