Waiters has draft promise, cancels workouts| BC talks pg 15

[GRidge]

I know you're not suppose to pass judgment purely based on highlight tapes but this guy seems like he could be special. He's got silky moves. I really like his floaters. I can see the DWade comparisons. Not to mention he's got decent hops. I remember reading on here his interview saying he wants to demolish the other competition. I like a player who has some fire to him. If we can draft him at 8 we should hang on to him

[FluLikeSymptoms]

So the Sixers need guards, now? Good grief. They would go big, without question.

[Rhettmatic]

FWIW (and I posted this in another thread), Le Doug is at the combine in Chicago and mentions nothing about Waiters. The two names he's heard the Raptors are interested in? Lillard and Lamb.

http://thestar.blogs.com/raptors/

Anyway, it’s information gathering and a getting-to-know-them trip (first up was this piece on Andrew Nicholson) and I’m trying to figure out which guys on the Raptors list I should be speaking to.

Two of them – and I have it on very good they are at least on a list of possibilities – are Weber State guard Damian Lillard and Connecticut guard Jeremy Lamb.

An aside: There is no definitive list of possibilities for Toronto at No. 8, it is expanding and contracting almost daily, there is much work to do, they are barely closer to finalizing anything than they were a week ago; they don’t know who’ll be there, aren’t sure who they like best and all the speculation you’re reading is just that, rampant speculation.

Now, I’m not sure how much you can learn about kids in the group interview sessions we have but I will tell you this, I’m far more impressed with Lillard than I am Lamb and here’s why:

This is a time of keepaway in some ways, lots players – on advice of self-serving agents who don’t want their clients exposed – don’t like to play against anyone; they want to show their individual skills but games, sometimes even three-on-three, are verboten. Flaws are exposed, draft slots suffer, money is lost and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

So I’m talking to Lillard and he said he much prefers the group dynamic because it allows him to show what he’s got and when it’s pointed out to him that some of the other guys in the room shy away from that, he says this:

“I’m from Oakland. Gary Payton was that kind of person, really competitive. Jason Kidd, Brian Shaw. I feel I have to bring that same thing to the table as an Oakland point guard. I wand to compete and I feel I still have to prove myself playing against higher lever guys and I’m happy to have the opportunity.”

In the next session we get to speak to Lamb and it comes up that not only isn’t he going to compete at any level here, he’s not even going to do the skills drills. He might do some agility today but that’s likely it.

Why?

“Not sure, it’s my first time going through it. I was just told I don’t need to do that, (I) need to get ready for the interviews and things like that. I’m not sure on it.”

[JamesNaismith]

Phoenix is not the team. We have held zero workouts. None! I highly doubt we would make an offer like that to a player we didnt spend any real time with.

Well Spurs didnt have Leonard to work out for them. So it doesnt say anything.

Steve Kyler ‏@stevekylerNBA
Sources say Waiters was immediately on a flight home to Philadelphia and has indeed shut down workouts... sources peg Phoenix as the spot

Makes a lot more sense than it being us...although I really thought Rivers would be a shoe in for Phoenix as they'll badly need at least a faux franchise player and Austin would at least bring media attention and some small amount of excitement versus a player like Waiters who`s going to have to fight of every little bit of recognition he gets.

[duppyy]

FWIW (and I posted this in another thread), Le Doug is at the combine in Chicago and mentions nothing about Waiters. The two names he's heard the Raptors are interested in? Lillard and Lamb.

http://thestar.blogs.com/raptors/

Anyway, it’s information gathering and a getting-to-know-them trip (first up was this piece on Andrew Nicholson) and I’m trying to figure out which guys on the Raptors list I should be speaking to.

Two of them – and I have it on very good they are at least on a list of possibilities – are Weber State guard Damian Lillard and Connecticut guard Jeremy Lamb.

An aside: There is no definitive list of possibilities for Toronto at No. 8, it is expanding and contracting almost daily, there is much work to do, they are barely closer to finalizing anything than they were a week ago; they don’t know who’ll be there, aren’t sure who they like best and all the speculation you’re reading is just that, rampant speculation.

Now, I’m not sure how much you can learn about kids in the group interview sessions we have but I will tell you this, I’m far more impressed with Lillard than I am Lamb and here’s why:

This is a time of keepaway in some ways, lots players – on advice of self-serving agents who don’t want their clients exposed – don’t like to play against anyone; they want to show their individual skills but games, sometimes even three-on-three, are verboten. Flaws are exposed, draft slots suffer, money is lost and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

So I’m talking to Lillard and he said he much prefers the group dynamic because it allows him to show what he’s got and when it’s pointed out to him that some of the other guys in the room shy away from that, he says this:

“I’m from Oakland. Gary Payton was that kind of person, really competitive. Jason Kidd, Brian Shaw. I feel I have to bring that same thing to the table as an Oakland point guard. I wand to compete and I feel I still have to prove myself playing against higher lever guys and I’m happy to have the opportunity.”

In the next session we get to speak to Lamb and it comes up that not only isn’t he going to compete at any level here, he’s not even going to do the skills drills. He might do some agility today but that’s likely it.

Why?

“Not sure, it’s my first time going through it. I was just told I don’t need to do that, (I) need to get ready for the interviews and things like that. I’m not sure on it.”

Seem's like Lamb's agent is already causing problems lol.

[theonlyeastcoastrapsfan]

Could be a good marketing ploy by the agent, If' this is widely out, and you pick before the suns, and let's say your guy is gone, and you're not enamored with the remaining guys you've worked out, I wonder if some will be tempted to say, huh, I wonder what Phx thought was so special about this kid, and draft him. ,

He certainly got people talking about him. He's like forbidden fruit now. Also, as people speculate they say it was a Suns promise, well, now suns trade their pick, and you pick after the suns, since he was pegged to go earlier, is it now a "steal" becasue he was "pegged to go earlier" and "fell" into your lap.

Kinda like Ed, he only worked out for three teams, people thought he would go in that range. When he didn't we got a "steal". Fast forward to now, do we still feel we got a "steal" with Ed Davis at 13? Maybe. Not as confident in that as I was before, though.

[J-Roc]

FWIW (and I posted this in another thread), Le Doug is at the combine in Chicago and mentions nothing about Waiters. The two names he's heard the Raptors are interested in? Lillard and Lamb.

http://thestar.blogs.com/raptors/

Anyway, it’s information gathering and a getting-to-know-them trip (first up was this piece on Andrew Nicholson) and I’m trying to figure out which guys on the Raptors list I should be speaking to.

Two of them – and I have it on very good they are at least on a list of possibilities – are Weber State guard Damian Lillard and Connecticut guard Jeremy Lamb.

An aside: There is no definitive list of possibilities for Toronto at No. 8, it is expanding and contracting almost daily, there is much work to do, they are barely closer to finalizing anything than they were a week ago; they don’t know who’ll be there, aren’t sure who they like best and all the speculation you’re reading is just that, rampant speculation.

Now, I’m not sure how much you can learn about kids in the group interview sessions we have but I will tell you this, I’m far more impressed with Lillard than I am Lamb and here’s why:

This is a time of keepaway in some ways, lots players – on advice of self-serving agents who don’t want their clients exposed – don’t like to play against anyone; they want to show their individual skills but games, sometimes even three-on-three, are verboten. Flaws are exposed, draft slots suffer, money is lost and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

So I’m talking to Lillard and he said he much prefers the group dynamic because it allows him to show what he’s got and when it’s pointed out to him that some of the other guys in the room shy away from that, he says this:

“I’m from Oakland. Gary Payton was that kind of person, really competitive. Jason Kidd, Brian Shaw. I feel I have to bring that same thing to the table as an Oakland point guard. I wand to compete and I feel I still have to prove myself playing against higher lever guys and I’m happy to have the opportunity.”

In the next session we get to speak to Lamb and it comes up that not only isn’t he going to compete at any level here, he’s not even going to do the skills drills. He might do some agility today but that’s likely it.

Why?

“Not sure, it’s my first time going through it. I was just told I don’t need to do that, (I) need to get ready for the interviews and things like that. I’m not sure on it.”

You know, I'll give le doug some credit for good reporting there. He had his angle, but he let quotes tell the story and he didn't claim to not be surprised.

[FluLikeSymptoms]

Lillard has every reason to participate in every workout scenario. Lamb's agent might help him slip to us.

[Lawnmower Man]

Doesn't sound like a good plan. I mean, I remember when BC "promised" that Brandon Knight wouldn't drop passed 5th pick. Lo and behold, situations change and the Raps draft Jonas Valanciunas.

That's because JV is a far better prospect / player than Knight was. Waiters is likely the best of who will be available at #8

That's his point.

If the Raptors DID actually promise to take Waiters with the 8th pick, but suddenly a player like Barnes or Beal drops...do they back out on their promise? Of course.

But now, Waiters shot himself in the foot as the teams after Toronto haven't seen him in action and may rather prefer to draft guys like Rivers or PJIII (guys who they were intrigued with during the workouts) instead.

[team edward]

I think the Raptors gave Waiters a promise at #8. I believe they have a deal in place with Philly where Iggy will be going to Toronto in exchange for Waiters/Calderon/Davis. Philly will then amnesty Brand and rebuild with the #8 & #15.

so two lottery picks and a huge expiring contact (and a VERY good back-up PG for the 76ers) for a player that did next to nothing for Phila in the playoffs??

alrighty then.

Well you can't really call Davis a "lottery pick" like it means anything. He couldn't get minutes on one of the worst teams in the league and he's not in our plans.

Calderon being a good backup PG and expiring is why he's an asset for us to move. I can't think of one person on this board who would support looking off a deal for a proper starting 3 because of Calderon. In any case, moving Calderon also means we don't have to amnesty him to get Nash. For all we know, MLSE may not approve these deals if it will require being out of pocket $10million on Jose. If we can trade him, we'll be at something like $48.1m and can sign Nash outright. If we still need space we can amnesty Kleiza, but I think we keep him.

If you think Igoudala is not a good enough player to warrant the #8, well that's fine. But I don't the GM's for Toronto or Phillidelphia agree.

For all we know BC has two offers out there, one to each of Philly and Memphis, and has made it known that the first one to bite gets the bait. Little game theory to play them off against each other. That's good GM'ing (or it would be, if true) and if it takes Davis and Calderon to get it done, fine.

[ATLTimekeeper]

Where does BC say not TOR?

[Rhettmatic]

Where does BC say not TOR?

He told Steve Kyler that yesterday.

[lolwut]

FWIW (and I posted this in another thread), Le Doug is at the combine in Chicago and mentions nothing about Waiters. The two names he's heard the Raptors are interested in? Lillard and Lamb.

http://thestar.blogs.com/raptors/

Now we know who we're not drafting.

[ATLTimekeeper]

Where does BC say not TOR?

He told Steve Kyler that yesterday.

Thanks. Like I said it didn't make sense. You wouldn't promise to take anyone when you're shopping the pick around.

[JN]

Doesn't sound like a good plan. I mean, I remember when BC "promised" that Brandon Knight wouldn't drop passed 5th pick. Lo and behold, situations change and the Raps draft Jonas Valanciunas.

That's because JV is a far better prospect / player than Knight was. Waiters is likely the best of who will be available at #8

That's his point.

If the Raptors DID actually promise to take Waiters with the 8th pick, but suddenly a player like Barnes or Beal drops...do they back out on their promise? Of course.

But now, Waiters shot himself in the foot as the teams after Toronto haven't seen him in action and may rather prefer to draft guys like Rivers or PJIII (guys who they were intrigued with during the workouts) instead.

Brandon Knight was NOT a "promise"... it was a statement or opinion by BC. Waiters actually has a promise (although I suspect in a #8 trade or with another team). Major difference and I am not sure how someone can not see a difference. One actually entails a commitment to pick a player the other does not.

The fact that you call Waiters dumb for entering such an agreement is laughable given that you don't even realize what is going on. An NBA agent would not enter a "promise" if there was any real risk of it being broken.

Yes the team takes a risk -- it potentially misses out on a better player that dropped or liked later on. But it takes the risk but it increases their odds of getting Waiters. And to them its a wortwhile risk.

[Consequence]

Marc J. Spears ‏@SpearsNBAYahoo
One NBA team exec told Yahoo! Sports he believes Syracuse guard Dion Waiters got a draft day promise from the Raptors with the eighth pick.

[StMikes31]

I don't see any of the top 8 teams giving a promise to Waiters - too many solid prospects right now in that top 8.

This guy's agent is smart, there is so much hype on this guy right now that he backed out when his stock is the highest.

If Lilliard is there at 8, we snatch him up, if not I like Waiters.

[J-Roc]

Marc J. Spears ‏@SpearsNBAYahoo
One NBA team exec told Yahoo! Sports he believes Syracuse guard Dion Waiters got a draft day promise from the Raptors with the eighth pick.

[dagger]

Lillard has every reason to participate in every workout scenario. Lamb's agent might help him slip to us.

I see the other way around. Lillard has been super-impressive in mutli-team workouts. Teams love his skills, athleticism, attitude and work ethic. He's well-spoken with leadership potential. He's not going to fall below us now, and may well go as high as 6th, whereas Lamb is all over the board, and any time he opens his mouth he comes across as laid-back, even stoned, and dumber than a sack of hammers.

[J-Roc]

So we've made Waiters a promise, but the wiretap says Anthony Davis is not set in stone to go to NOH.