Raptors NBA Draft Thread: Jeremy Lamb (HOU)

[sanity]

He has the length, size and athleticism to defend (not dominate) against other inferior college-level 2s. Big deal (ex. overrated)

[Undefeated]

What's a dominant defender at the college level anyway? Don't even say MKG because he was lit up by Tyshawn Taylor near the end of the NCAA Championship game almost causing an upset. As for Lamb, his opponent shot 31% on spot-up jumpers and 29% off the dribble which are very underwhelming shooting percentages. How is that not good? I don't think anyone besides Anthony Davis and Fab Melo were dominant defenders. It's rare to see a wing dominate defensively either way.

[fatal9]

Since I usually only praise Lamb in this thread, I thought I'd share some of his weaknesses. IMO lot of you are off base with his weaknesses (for example, work ethic, range, shot creating ability are NOT his weaknesses, I've even read people calling him "selfish" on the court which makes no sense).

- has a tendency to pick up his dribble too early which is part of what keeps him from attacking more, gets rid of the ball too early.
- played very poorly against the zone but IMO that's because of how poorly the UConn zone offense was this year than Lamb specifically (lot of poor spacing and dead ball movement)
- his own lack of aggressiveness can put teammates in bad spots (passes off the ball to a teammate who is in no position to score when he is the one who should be attacking). there's a bit of "hesitation" in his game, doesn't just get the ball and GO.
- does have stretches where he might go 5 minutes without doing anything other than passively passing around the ball on offense. it's bizarre, he will move off the ball beautifully and shed defenders one game but then have moments where he can look like the worst off ball player ever. it's partly his fault and partly the offense he was in.
- he can be "intimidated" by defenders, I've seen guys take the challenge of guarding him and out muscle him into driving against them, either force him to pass the ball back out or settle for a 3.
- while he is frail, he still manages to convert pretty well around the rim, has nice body coordination to make shots when challenged. it does affect his driving ability though imo.

But regardless, how many SG prospects in the last decade have had Lamb's combo of size, athleticism, shooting ability and overall offensive skills/versatility in the draft? He checks out in every department talent/skills wise. This is not a pick that can "bust".

Even if all the concerns attached to him prove to be true, he still ends up being a good shooter who scores in the flow on the offense, sometimes creates his own shot...basically plays like he did as a sidekick for Kemba. That's an efficient 15-18 ppg guy in this league who can make plays on both ends, and that's his floor to me, which would kind of be like a SG version of Batum (I'm suprised this comparison hasn't popped up more often for Lamb. Lamb is more skilled scoring-wise but if you've seen Batum play in France/Euroleague, Batum too shows some awesome skills when he's the #1 option. But Batum is and will be an underachiever because of his mentality imo, still a good player though). So a guy who won't impose his will on the game but will score in the flow of the offense because he has skills which translate well to the NBA game. That's his floor to me, not something ridiculous like James Jones.

[Waylon Mercy]

Lamb's defensive potential is overrated. He didn't dominate on the defensive end in the Big East, why would that suddenly translate to the NBA---especially taking into consideration his lack of aggressiveness on either end of the floor? The potential *is* there, but its tough to justify him meeting it.

He's a passive-by-nature player who doesn't shoot well past the mid-range (where he is exceptional). Between having both him and DeRozan on the same team, I just don't see a recipe for success. He has the size, wingspan and athleticism everyone craves for at the 2, but you're asking a player to completely alter his approach to the game to meet a certain potential he's never came close to tapping at the college level. I'd take my chances elsewhere

Sounds like someone served you some bad lamb...Not every draft a guy of Lambs caliber
is available at 8. He has his ?'s like most players in our range but if you compare him to most
you'll notice he has fewer ones.

[bonjovi0308]

The only obvious thing that I don't like about Lamb (other than many so called 'doesn't care looks') is his low assists numbers. However, I think Lamb could be a better fit as SG for us than Derozan is. At least he can shoot and I think he has a higher ceiling in rebounds and defense.

[SkywalkerAC]

One has to think that stacking the shooting guard position has been a recipe for success since pretty much forever. 6th men have been, by and large, shooting guards, in the modern era at least. good teams need that guy that can come in and fill it up. the primary point guard is still in the game, one of your two wings picks up a couple fouls or needs a rest, and you fortify your frontline with defense. There's every reason to think that Lamb will be able to come in and score off the bench from the get go. The question would be how many minutes Lamb's defense would earn him as an NBA rookie.

[TheDrunkenOak]

See, you don't even have enough counter argument on my response, rather you're just coming back at me on questioning definitions of "dictionary". You keep believing what you think about the term "motor" and for some reason, you never heard of the word "intangibles". It's a very popular term to use in basketball. Well, if you don't believe me. Go post a thread on the board and ask what intangibles are and ask them where competitiveness and intensity belongs to, mark my word you'll end up being embarrassed about your lack of basketball knowledge especially in this case where you're not able to distinguish where competitiveness and intensity belongs to.

-I really didn't want to do this. But since you like to act like a jacka$$...

-Sure, i'll play your game and i'll mark your words. So let's see who who will be more embarrassed.

-We are not talking about intangibles, we are talking about "motor" and what the definition of "motor" is.

-I said "motor" is...

MOTOR = Intensity, Competitiveness, Hustle

-You said "motor" is...

Now what is motor? It means anything that makes you move, something having to do with muscular movement. In basketball wise, it means keeping your arms up, move your feet, do anything to keep yourself moving on the floor.

-So now that is laid out. I was going to post a video when Lamb was talking about his "motor", but since i doubt you'll be able to comprehend what he's elaborating, so instead here's a link to an interview, with both Perry Jones and Jeremy Lamb talking about their "motor". I'll walk you through it, step by step, i'll even dumb it down for you, so that you can understand. Ok? Below, i've highlighted the parts for you already. I'll post the link to the interview with Andy Katz at the bottom of my post.


"It's a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity," Jones said. "I wanted to show that it wasn't the same Perry Jones in college."

Who was that Perry Jones?

"Very modest and laid-back," Jones said of himself. "[He] didn't have a motor and got down on himself if he missed shots."
How about that? Jones said he didn't have a "motor" in college.

-Wow, Jones said it himself, he didn't have a motor. So by going with your definition of "motor" that means Jones didn't have any muscle movement when he was in college. Wow...he didn't even move at all!!! WOW!!! HOLY SHEET!!! I guess he only stood in one spot on the court for the whole game!!! Dam no wonder he's sliding down the draft.

-Now let's take a look at the next line.

Jones was clearly not as aggressive on every play like teammate Quincy Acy. The key for any team that will be investing millions of dollars in Jones will be to see if he has found his motor in the two months since the season ended.

-In this sentence, Katz is again talking about aggressiveness and referencing Jones' "motor" and comparing it to Quincy Acy's "motor" - hmmm... is aggressiveness countable or uncountable. Did he use the word "INTANGIBLES"??? Wow i didn't know you can count aggressiveness - 1 aggressives, 2 aggressives, 3 aggressives, 4...Oh my!!!

-Now let's take a look at Jeremy Lamb's interview...

Jeremy Lamb: Lamb didn't disguise his own shortcomings: the perception of his effort.

"I think sometimes I'm not as aggressive as I should [be]," said Lamb, the former UConn sophomore. "There were times when I would get going, and it gets competitive, and I'm against good players -- I think then I have a real good motor.

-Now here, Katz is referencing effort and aggressiveness with "MOTOR". Is he using the word "INTANGIBLES"??? Now, Lamb states his "motor" meaning 'effort', is good when it becomes competitive. Wow, i never knew you could count effort...here we go again!!! 1 efforts, 2 efforts 3 efforts...you get the drift.

-The next sentence from the interview...

"A lot of teams want to see my motor and see me compete, and it will depend on the workouts."

-So by your definition, teams want to see him run around, put his arms in the air, keep his feet moving. BWAHAHAHA!!!

Here's the link. Scroll down to the third interview.
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketb ... /katz_andy

-Here is my counter argument laid out very succinctly. So let's hear your argument, with facts of course. Which i doubt you will because you have nothing but your bloated incoherent pathetic posts. They say you should think before you speak, but in your case, think before you type.

-Now, I really didn't want to do any this. I figured you would just go ask someone to confirm before attacking me. But i am not surprised, FrederickLove, because you're a joke. Your posts are a pathetic joke. And nobody takes you seriously... You're like the r3tarded kid that everyone tolerates, but really, nobody wants around.

First of all, don't fool yourself into thinking a bit of name calling will get to me. It actually amuses me that you label me as a "jacka$s" but I say it is truly an honor to be entitled to the "jacka$s" label. No one takes me seriously? Well you seem to take me seriously, you're losing your cool and apparently you got offended by me for being a jacka$s and now the names calling, who's taking it seriously now I don't see how explaining things and feeding you basketball knowledge means I'm a jacka$s, haha oh boy, so much hate, my brother, why so seriously mad? Mr. Now let's see, I know its easy for a poster to lose his cool when he has to talk to someone like me, a jacka$s. Calling me dumb, a joke, a r3tarded kid, cmon now, keep it classy. Now let's take a deep breath and chill,  so I can explain again in a better way

You know what it is that you've done wrong. You made one huge mistake. What is it? Now, you keep throwing me the word "aggressiveness" constantly, is that the word that I claimed as not being part of motor? I never said anything about that word. Hey, stay focus, it is the word "intensity" that I was talking about that doesn't belong to the motor category. This is where you put intensity as part of motor definition and I highly disagree w/ it. So the whole time you keep throwing me facts/links on the word aggressiveness over and over again in the whole post so I'm like, you mistaken things and now u keep going at something that didn't even belong in our discussion. So who's being um, embarrassed now? Reread my previous post more carefully, please

Take a deep breath before you lose your cool again. Now, lets hear it. Intensity and aggressiveness are not the same thing. Let me thoroughly explain it in a better way. Intensity has to do w/ a player's mental focus. Its the inner drive that makes them plays the game the hardest way they can. E.g. Kevin Garnett, plays the game so hard because he's a very intense person. Now that intensity is part of intangible. One more thing, Intangibles also include things like work ethic and discipline. Just in case you don't know what it means again.

Now comes aggressiveness, it's part of motor of course. You play the game very physical, aggressive to the paint, aggressive on the board, aggressive on the defensive end, these are part of body movement so it's definitely a part of motor. So fellow poster, you have to focus on what I'm talking about, okay? So we can withdraw that PJ3/Acy case about aggressiveness, throw it aside because you made a mistake on thinking I didn't think aggressiveness is part of motor right? Moving on.

Now, for Lamb. What he said is basically is if he's able to be more aggressive (motor), then that will get his game going, which means getting him going mentally more focus and more discipline (intangible) so it will make things competitive. As I already said aggressiveness is part of motor, so your Lamb and PJ3 cases aren't really doing much in this argument unless you're talking about Lamb not being aggressive. Everyone agrees with that already. Also, intangible is not the word you throw out in interviews, its from scouting analysis that you put this word in place, that's why you see people say I'm competitive, I stay discipline, and I'm very intense, these are part of intangible factors.

Motor means getting yourself active, so why is it a problem when I say get your feet moving, instead of just standing there, or getting your arms up, bothering shots, bothering the defender, or getting your hands up and down, side to side, spread them out to disrupt the passing lane, or moving your feet, keep yourself active by moving around more, go around screens, instead of just standing there, get yourself active and by being active, such as going str8 to the basket, or going through screens to shake off your defender so you can get open shots opportunities, or rolling into the lane to get layups or dunks etc. My definition of motor in this case means "being consistently active".

You can argue Lamb doesn't have a high motor, but by no means he has a low motor, and he admits himself not getting it going all the time but when he does, he's often found on the floor moving his feet alot by constantly moving around going through screens offensively, and keeping hands up active to bother the passing lane defensively, getting his steals but footwork is one area he isn't really solid at because he doesn't always stay active on defense. It almost becomes a common habit for alot of good players because they tend to reserve their energy for offensive end so they often not go at it on defense. My definition of motor is one that keeps himself active, active, active, so these things I've just said, such as"hands up actively, moving your feet actively" are not being active? And not being part of what good motor is?

So anyways, I don't expect apologies from you for calling me all kinds of things because I don't know if these names calling are necessary from an adult. But hey, call me a jacka$s, r3tarded kid or a joke if it makes you happy. I'm not losing my cool. I'm just explaining things in the rightful manner, correcting the things in your post even though yea, I might sound sarcastic but I'm mature enough to not scoop to the names calling level. Calling someone petty names doesn't make you sound any smarter. So I'd encourage you to take a step up to the classy level, after all, we all discuss basketball here while remaining civilized with each other. I supposed sarcasm is allowed here right? You can be sarcastic if you want. I'm okay with that.

What the hell are you talking about???

I have no idea what you are trying to argue...

And you're right that there is one mistake i did make...and that is to believe that you are capable of understanding what i wrote.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Your reading comprehension - FAIL!!!

English vocabulary - DOUBLE FAIL!!!

[TheDrunkenOak]

^what in the world are you arguing about? If Lamb has an issue, it's that he presents as an absolute pothead baked off his ass.

I have no idea what Fredericklove is arguing about. He makes absolutely no sense.

All i did was to tell him his definition of "motor" was inaccurate. Then he decides to attack me. So i presented my argument. And he replied with delusional garbage.

[DG88]

^what in the world are you arguing about? If Lamb has an issue, it's that he presents as an absolute pothead baked off his ass.

I have no idea what Fredericklove is arguing about. He makes absolutely no sense.

All i did was to tell him his definition of "motor" was inaccurate. Then he decides to attack me. So i presented my argument. And he replied with delusional garbage.

Sorry you had to deal with the Lambulance. fredricklove protects Jeremy Lamb like he's some secret service agent.

[FluLikeSymptoms]

^what in the world are you arguing about? If Lamb has an issue, it's that he presents as an absolute pothead baked off his ass.

I have no idea what Fredericklove is arguing about. He makes absolutely no sense.

All i did was to tell him his definition of "motor" was inaccurate. Then he decides to attack me. So i presented my argument. And he replied with delusional garbage.

Sorry you had to deal with the Lambulance. fredricklove protects Jeremy Lamb like he's some secret service agent.

That's really good.

That kid used to be Barnes' Grizzly mama. Now he just reminds me to log in, despite Lamb being my clear choice.

[Garmfay]

Sorry you had to deal with the Lambulance. fredricklove protects Jeremy Lamb like he's some secret service agent.

People finding that out now?

[The Chucker]

dis guy wud throw a tantrum at me whenever i said barnes aint a triple threat plyaer lmaoooooooo. dawg need to chill out it all in the game.

[fredericklove]

^what in the world are you arguing about? If Lamb has an issue, it's that he presents as an absolute pothead baked off his ass.

I have no idea what Fredericklove is arguing about. He makes absolutely no sense.

All i did was to tell him his definition of "motor" was inaccurate. Then he decides to attack me. So i presented my argument. And he replied with delusional garbage.

Ha, look at the ranting/insulting reply again , I guess I will have to get used to you ranting, taunting and insulting me cos that's pretty much the only thing you can do to me, it gives you that verbal/emotional advantage over someone that's reluctant to use names calling technique, I'm surprised mods aren't doing anything about the jacka$s, r3tarded kid or you're a joke/delusional garbage replies. SMH I guess it's definitely my fault, try to be a teacher to a student but ends up getting taunted at by the student

[fredericklove]

Sorry you had to deal with the Lambulance. fredricklove protects Jeremy Lamb like he's some secret service agent.

Lambulance, Lillarescuer, they're all pretty much the same thing on this board. Just like last year w/ all these Walker/Bismack/Knight threads. Good old times, boys! Draft's next week! I can't wait to get this over with

[fredericklove]

dis guy wud throw a tantrum at me whenever i said barnes aint a triple threat plyaer lmaoooooooo. dawg need to chill out it all in the game.

And you're the one that runs away and never shows up even after my 3rd proven Barnes' triple threat evidences, hahahhaa off you go again I know I know

[fredericklove]

That's really good.

That kid used to be Barnes' Grizzly mama. Now he just reminds me to log in, despite Lamb being my clear choice.

Well, what am I supposed to do when there's biased Barnes hater

[Marlo Stanfield]

LEAVE FRED ALONE!

[lolwut]

Calm down guys. This is an 8th pick we're talking about.

[fredericklove]

LEAVE FRED ALONE!

I'm like being ganged up by these guys here all of the sudden

[The Chucker]

dis guy wud throw a tantrum at me whenever i said barnes aint a triple threat plyaer lmaoooooooo. dawg need to chill out it all in the game.

And you're the one that runs away and never shows up even after my 3rd proven Barnes' triple threat evidences, hahahhaa off you go again I know I know

naw bredj i aint running away. it aint worth my time replying to sum bull when i kno it aint true. barnes a triple threat player? dis guy dribbles on his feet man. glorified scrub to the MAX.