Political Roundtable Pulsar of Annihilation part IV

[hands11]

High gasoline prices are good. We drive less. We use public transportation more. We bike more. We move closer to our jobs, we take less trips to the grocery store. We buy smaller, more fuel efficient cars. And, btw, cellulosic ethanol production becomes commercially viable at about $4.50/gallon, at current production costs as of 2001, and costs have probably gone down a lot since then.

Furthermore, all the advances in automobile technology over the last thirty years: fuel injection, turbocharging, etc.? It's all gone into making cars that accelerate faster, perform better. You could take that same technology and make cars more fuel efficient instead. Once demand for fuel efficient cars go up, automakers will start building them.

We are a bunch of spoiled jerks when it comes to gasoline prices. We do not need low gas prices to succeed as a nation. We just don't.

But suburban moms need a 400hp SUV with a HEMI in it. This is AMEERICA. Don't infringe on anyones personal freedoms damn it. And you damn sure anent telling me what kind of light bulb I should use.

So Mitt is cracking me up. He is going full speed with this.... he is all about the poor and middle income American.. lol.. This guy can say "anything" with a straight face and act like he cares about whatever he is saying at the time. What a creepy scumbag.

[montestewart]

Rising gas prices disproportionately impact lower income families, in the form of higher prices for food, transportation, and other basics.

[Induveca]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/arianna-huffington/second-debate-obama-romney_b_1970360.html

Found an article about a topic I recently posted about. These debates have to become more useful.

I do like the town hall format better then the first format but they need to make more progress.

On a side note, I listened to CPAN after and listened to the people that called in. Just amazing how little people understand basic economics and how little facts play a role in their views.

I wish the macro topics were communicated more. People are so today oriented. Lower my gas prices. Give me a high paying job.

Technology and a world economy has changed so much. The internet has removed tons of sales jobs and blown up many local markets. Self checkout and ATM have done the same. Software sales are getting tougher and tougher because of open source programs and free wear. Internet video are replacing training classes. Companies like Google are eating up everything. And the baby boom bubble has popped. That bubble of population created a bubble of demand and now that demand is leaving the workforce.

These things effect jobs and the economy. There is no changing that. ATMs are a good things. They create efficiency. But they also eliminate jobs. That is a dynamic that needs to get addressed.

One very important thing our government can do is to help seed growth industries that can produce things that there is a world demand for. You need to invest with a goal on the future markets. Public/Private partnerships are an important part of seeding future industries.

Also, more people need to understand the difference between money simply changing hands .. getting redistributed and what creates new wealth. Converting natural resources into useful resources is a good way to understand new wealth. Sand into Silicone ships is one example. Iron ore into steel. Farming. That are all easy examples for people to understand.

Hands, it's **** simple. "First" world service economies make people lazy, and want to exert zero physical force in anything they do.....it's why China has literally taken over the world.

Remember that 80s vibe when everything "MADE IN CHINA" was cheap and useless? It has mostly disappeared from the US, but it is alive and well EVERYWHERE else in the world.

End of the day, Americans would rather collect welfare/food stamps etc vs doing actual work in a factory. Even if they wanted to work in factories, they cost 4-8x more than factory workers overseas. Taxing the rich more WILL NOT change that FACT. I've lived all over the world, Portugal/Ireland/Greece/Spain are feeling this TODAY. Eventually this same socialist/government "approved" lazy vibe will reach the US. The only reason it hasn't is the relative lack of socialist policies.

Give these same undereducated the excuse of wide-ranging socialist policies, and they'll never work a day in their lives. I'm not just talking about my extended family in NYC, but EVERYONE (outside of major illness or handicap) living on welfare/unemployment/food stamps.

Provide factories for those unable/unwilling/incapable to thrive in a service economy. I'm currently working on that in a huge way. Will take me a few years, but sustainable manufacturing is on its way. Just can't begin in the US, or I will be crushed by lobbies/politicians/lawsuits. Has to go viral to save the US economy.

[fugop]

Hands, it's **** simple. "First" world service economies make people lazy, and want to exert zero physical force in anything they do.....it's why China has literally taken over the world.

Remember that 80s vibe when everything "MADE IN CHINA" was cheap and useless? It has mostly disappeared from the US, but it is alive and well EVERYWHERE else in the world.

End of the day, Americans would rather collect welfare/food stamps etc vs doing actual work in a factory. Even if they wanted to work in factories, they cost 4-8x more than factory workers overseas. Taxing the rich more WILL NOT change that FACT. I've lived all over the world, Portugal/Ireland/Greece/Spain are feeling this TODAY. Eventually this same socialist/government "approved" lazy vibe will reach the US. The only reason it hasn't is the relative lack of socialist policies.

Give these same undereducated the excuse of wide-ranging socialist policies, and they'll never work a day in their lives. I'm not just talking about my extended family in NYC, but EVERYONE (outside of major illness or handicap) living on welfare/unemployment/food stamps.

Provide factories for those unable/unwilling/incapable to thrive in a service economy. I'm currently working on that in a huge way. Will take me a few years, but sustainable manufacturing is on its way. Just can't begin in the US, or I will be crushed by lobbies/politicians/lawsuits. Has to go viral to save the US economy.

Do you know any working class people? This is ridiculous, "business school" tripe.

[hands11]

We do already have that to some extend in the US. Its called prison.

Hey, just curious. What is your schooling? How did you get into doing what you do ? You sound like your into stuff that the average person doesn't stumble into.

Someone mentor you ?

[hands11]

What is the Difference Between a Sociopath, a Compulsive, a Pathological, a Chronic, and a Habitual Liar?

So which best describe Mitt ?

http://www.truthaboutdeception.com/lyin ... liars.html

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_can_you_t ... gical_liar

Liars' Brains Wired Differently
http://www.usc.edu/uscnews/stories/11655.html


Regardling Mitt and him seeking women in his cabinet. Just another of Mitts Myths

http://www.massgap.org/

This is the group that approached Mitt and Shannon Obrien who he was running against. These womens group made both sign a pledge to hire more women. Mitt did not seek them out. He did not do this after review application that showed only qualified me. They groups approach both while they were running. Before he could appoint anyone.

This man has a serious problem with telling the truth.

On Taxes his bucket of deductions is a bucket of BS.

All the deduction total 2.5 Trillion. His 20% cut is 4 Trillion. So even if he removed all the deduction it doesn't add up. And we all know they are not removing all the deductions. There is no way his math adds up but Mitts say.. of course it will. No Mitt. There is no way it can. Or just look at it this way, he says he is cutting taxes for middle income people but not changing the amount that the top earner pay. That alone tells you it doesn't add up. More lies. More trickle down BS. Tax cuts are tax expenditures. That's a fact. If you want to argue they are stimulative, tax cuts are not the more efficient form of stimulus. And regardless of what you want to believe, they are wealth redistribution if they aren't paid for. Now Rs may have a problem with taxes cuts that are not paid for being expenditures because they live in their alternate reality news bubble, but facts are facts in the real world.

We already had 8 years of these Bush economic policies. Mitt offers the same failed policies.

Here is my problem. I actually like some of these ideas. I just the cap on deductions or removing them all together. I like savings account income not being taxed. Problems is, we can't do it right now because Bush blow a 1 Trillion dollar annual debt in the budget with two endless wars, his unpaid for taxes cuts and Medicaid D and a crashed economy that added 10 trillion to the accumulated debt.

[Zonkerbl]

Rising gas prices disproportionately impact lower income families, in the form of higher prices for food, transportation, and other basics.

Rising gas prices don't affect the very poor who can't afford cars.

High gas prices make corn prices high, whose prices have been held artificially low for decades due to U.S. ag subsidies. As a result, meat, chicken, egg, and milk prices have been artificially low (and milk has its own subsidy program), which has contributed to us eating too much protein and not enough fruits and vegetables (which are not subsidized and don't use subsidized inputs), which is part of the reason why we're so fat.

Relative prices mean NOTHING. If gas prices go up, USE SOMETHING ELSE. If steak prices go up, EAT SOMETHING ELSE. Don't take my word for it -- go to the Energy Information Administration's website and look at fuel consumption -- every year that fuel prices go up, fuel consumption goes down. We're not IDIOTS.

[nate33]

We do already have that to some extend in the US. Its called prison.

Hey, just curious. What is your schooling? How did you get into doing what you do ? You sound like your into stuff that the average person doesn't stumble into.

Someone mentor you ?

Yeah, Induveca. Because you didn't build that!

[nate33]

Rising gas prices disproportionately impact lower income families, in the form of higher prices for food, transportation, and other basics.

Rising gas prices don't affect the very poor who can't afford cars.

High gas prices make corn prices high, whose prices have been held artificially low for decades due to U.S. ag subsidies. As a result, meat, chicken, egg, and milk prices have been artificially low (and milk has its own subsidy program), which has contributed to us eating too much protein and not enough fruits and vegetables (which are not subsidized and don't use subsidized inputs), which is part of the reason why we're so fat.

Relative prices mean NOTHING. If gas prices go up, USE SOMETHING ELSE. If steak prices go up, EAT SOMETHING ELSE. Don't take my word for it -- go to the Energy Information Administration's website and look at fuel consumption -- every year that fuel prices go up, fuel consumption goes down. We're not IDIOTS.

Zonker, we are not fat from too much protein. We are fat from too much carbohydrates.

Though your greater point that farm subsidies cause the problem is true. The subsidies for corn and soybeans end up forcefeeding us way too many grains and not enough vegetables.

[montestewart]

We are a bunch of spoiled jerks when it comes to gasoline prices.

but thankfully

every year that fuel prices go up, fuel consumption goes down. We're not IDIOTS.

And something about farm subsidies, way over my head. I guess poor folk actually aren't impacted by rising gas prices at all. Except the ones with cars that eat steak. My mistake.

[Wizardspride]

Video included.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2012/10...hostage-video/

New Revelation At ’47%’ Dinner – Romney Was Hoping For Something Like Iran Hostage


It seems that for Romney, the “truths” told during that particular fundraiser are like any ghost worth his reputation, the haunting is relentless and this latest portion could be the most damaging of all. In the video, Romney is caught hoping for an Iran hostage type situation to help propel him into the White House. Is it any surprise that he has tried to make political hay out of the Benghazi terror attacks?

As you watch the video, notice the man (is that a British accent?) asking Romney how he can “duplicate” an Iran hostage type scenario. Instead of dismissing the question as going against American interests, Romney agrees that the strategy would be beneficial. The entire video is worth a listen but at the end, Romney says, “if something of that nature presents itself, I will work to take advantage of the opportunity.”

[Induveca]

Hands, it's **** simple. "First" world service economies make people lazy, and want to exert zero physical force in anything they do.....it's why China has literally taken over the world.

Remember that 80s vibe when everything "MADE IN CHINA" was cheap and useless? It has mostly disappeared from the US, but it is alive and well EVERYWHERE else in the world.

End of the day, Americans would rather collect welfare/food stamps etc vs doing actual work in a factory. Even if they wanted to work in factories, they cost 4-8x more than factory workers overseas. Taxing the rich more WILL NOT change that FACT. I've lived all over the world, Portugal/Ireland/Greece/Spain are feeling this TODAY. Eventually this same socialist/government "approved" lazy vibe will reach the US. The only reason it hasn't is the relative lack of socialist policies.

Give these same undereducated the excuse of wide-ranging socialist policies, and they'll never work a day in their lives. I'm not just talking about my extended family in NYC, but EVERYONE (outside of major illness or handicap) living on welfare/unemployment/food stamps.

Provide factories for those unable/unwilling/incapable to thrive in a service economy. I'm currently working on that in a huge way. Will take me a few years, but sustainable manufacturing is on its way. Just can't begin in the US, or I will be crushed by lobbies/politicians/lawsuits. Has to go viral to save the US economy.

Do you know any working class people? This is ridiculous, "business school" tripe.

[img]http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-yykNPH2XWNc/UHDrCDFDmkI/AAAAAAAAB_A/bK94wy2Y1vM/s1600/Mi+Comunidad+Joven+(Cristo+Rey,+Santo+Domingo)+-+Ministerio+de+la+Juventud+República+Dominicana+(14).JPG[/img]

That's the court across the street from my childhood home in Manganagua, Santo Domingo, Dominican Republic. I understand working class all too well.

My point was Americans avoid most physical labor in general, this generation grew up in a service economy. That designation of a "service economy" is a death knell for a society.

Latinos have flourished all over the US in my generation taking jobs Americans no longer wish to perform. China has swooped in to make goods at a cheaper price than unionized/slow/expensive American labor.

Everyone on this board over 30 has seen the above take place in their lifetime.

[Zonkerbl]

We are a bunch of spoiled jerks when it comes to gasoline prices.

but thankfully

every year that fuel prices go up, fuel consumption goes down. We're not IDIOTS.

And something about farm subsidies, way over my head. I guess poor folk actually aren't impacted by rising gas prices at all. Except the ones with cars that eat steak. My mistake.

Here, I wrote that half asleep. Let me clarify:

Americans are a bunch of fat whiny jerks, but not complete idiots. After whining and bitching and writing nasty letters to their politicians, they hold their breath, pout, and use less fuel. Cry me a river.

Poor people suck, especially the super poor ones who ride the bus and are not affected by gas prices at all, jerks.

They are affected by food prices, which is awesome because we've subsidized the buhjeezus out of crap food since WWII and gotten everybody into the habit of eating crap instead of healthy food. It's about time we got rid of those stupid subsidies and encourage people to eat less crap.

Better?

[Zonkerbl]

Rising gas prices disproportionately impact lower income families, in the form of higher prices for food, transportation, and other basics.

Rising gas prices don't affect the very poor who can't afford cars.

High gas prices make corn prices high, whose prices have been held artificially low for decades due to U.S. ag subsidies. As a result, meat, chicken, egg, and milk prices have been artificially low (and milk has its own subsidy program), which has contributed to us eating too much protein and not enough fruits and vegetables (which are not subsidized and don't use subsidized inputs), which is part of the reason why we're so fat.

Relative prices mean NOTHING. If gas prices go up, USE SOMETHING ELSE. If steak prices go up, EAT SOMETHING ELSE. Don't take my word for it -- go to the Energy Information Administration's website and look at fuel consumption -- every year that fuel prices go up, fuel consumption goes down. We're not IDIOTS.

Zonker, we are not fat from too much protein. We are fat from too much carbohydrates.

Though your greater point that farm subsidies cause the problem is true. The subsidies for corn and soybeans end up forcefeeding us way too many grains and not enough vegetables.

I don't know, Nate, we eat a CRAP TON of protein. 90% of the corn and soybeans we grow go into feeding cows and pigs, or get exported to China where they feed it to their pigs. Anyway, I only said it's part of the reason why we're so fat. How much is too much protein and how much is too much carbohydrates, I can't say. A lot of it is too much of everything, I imagine. I've heard poor people get fat from too much carbohydrates because it's cheaper.

I guess the point I was making is that the primary impact of high gas prices is on corn (because of ethanol), which affects primarily the cost of meat, which is rich people food. Mexico is the only nation I know of where corn is a subsistence staple. Maybe some of the other central american countries.

[montestewart]

Poor people suck

yeah, I got that part

[dobrojim]

That designation of a "FINANCIAL service economy" is a death knell for a society.

fixed

[closg00]

Video included.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2012/10...hostage-video/

New Revelation At ’47%’ Dinner – Romney Was Hoping For Something Like Iran Hostage


It seems that for Romney, the “truths” told during that particular fundraiser are like any ghost worth his reputation, the haunting is relentless and this latest portion could be the most damaging of all. In the video, Romney is caught hoping for an Iran hostage type situation to help propel him into the White House. Is it any surprise that he has tried to make political hay out of the Benghazi terror attacks?

As you watch the video, notice the man (is that a British accent?) asking Romney how he can “duplicate” an Iran hostage type scenario. Instead of dismissing the question as going against American interests, Romney agrees that the strategy would be beneficial. The entire video is worth a listen but at the end, Romney says, “if something of that nature presents itself, I will work to take advantage of the opportunity.”

Wow!!! I had not seen this anywhere, I am shocked the Obama people are not using this against Romney. Horrific!!

[Zonkerbl]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc- ... -redskins/

Go Pigskins!

[montestewart]

They could keep the name and just change the mascot:

[Wizardspride]

Unbelievable.......
http://thinkprogress.org/justice/201...-early-voting/

Despite Court Order, Ohio’s GOP Election Chief Is Still Cutting Back Early Voting


Two federal courts said that the Ohio Republican Party’s effort to reduce opportunities to vote early must not go into effect. And the Supreme Court rejected an attempt by Ohio Republican officials to reinstate a GOP-backed law taking away three days of early voting just this week.
Yet despite multiple court defeats, Ohio’s Republican Secretary of State Jon Husted is determined to restrict early voting as much as he can get away with. Indeed, Husted openly defied the first court order blocking the Republican restrictions on early voting, although he eventually backed down after a federal judge ordered him to appear in court personally to explain himself. Now, just two days after the conservative Roberts Court turned away Husted’s bid to reinstate the anti-voter law, he is still finding new ways to cut back early voting:

Ohio Secretary of State Jon Husted swiftly limited early voting hours on those crucial three days to 8 am–2 pm on Saturday, November 3; 1–5 pm on Sunday, November 4; and 8 am–2 pm on Monday, November 5. That means Ohio voters will have a total of only sixteen hours to cast a ballot during those three days. And before the weekend before the election, Ohio voters will still not be able to cast a ballot in-person on nights or weekends.

In 2008, the most populous counties in Ohio allowed more time for early voting—both in terms of days (thirty-five) and hours (on nights and weekends in many places). For the three days before the election, early voting locations were open for a total of twenty-four hours in Columbus’s Franklin County (8-5 on Saturday, 1-5 on Sunday and 8-7 on Monday) and 18 and a half hours in Cleveland’s Cuyahoga County (9-1 on Saturday, 1-5 on Sunday, 8:30-7 pm on Monday). During those final three pre-election days in 2008, 148,000 votes were cast and “wait times stretched 2 1/2 hours,” reported the Columbus Dispatch.