HEALTHY Knicks vs nuggets

Americafkya · Post #1 » by **Americafkya** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 3:18 pm

With the lightning fast start the Knicks got out to , it seemed like the melo trade arguments had been out to rest . Now, not so . Now that we have seen pretty much what each team is all about , we are much better able to answer the question of which team we think is better . Lets barre injuries , since it should be viewed in a vacuum when deals are made for healthy players .

Felton/Kidd. Prig , white, Kmart
Shump/jr
Melo/cope land
Amare/Novak/Thomas
Tyson/camby

Ty/Andre miller
Iggy/brewer
Gallo / chandler
Faried/Randolph
McGee/kofous

The other thread I made was basically turning into this anyway

Cujo · Post #2 » by **Cujo** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 3:24 pm

Why are we doing this again? I would say that both teams got what they wanted and seem to be doing just fine. Both sides are happy and Denver is still owed a first rounder plus the right to swap in 2016. I haven't seen anybody from either side complain so I would say this was a win win.

NYK_89 · Post #3 » by **NYK_89** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 3:37 pm

Been talked about a million times, the Knicks have improved far more since the trade but the Nuggets HAD to trade him and through other moves have built a team that was better then before unlike all these other teams that just went straight for the #1 pick.

torotoe · Post #4 » by **torotoe** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:19 pm

Americafkya wrote:With the slow start the Nuggets got out to , it seemed like the melo trade arguments had been out to rest . Now, not so . Now that we have seen pretty much what each team is all about , we are much better able to answer the question of which team we think is better . Lets barre injuries , since it should be viewed in a vacuum when deals are made for healthy players .

Felton/Kidd. Prig , white, Kmart
Shump/jr
Melo/cope land
Amare/Novak/Thomas
Tyson/camby

Ty/Andre miller/Stone
Iggy/brewer/Fournier
Gallo / chandler/Hamilton
Faried/Randolph/Miller
McGee/kofous

The other thread I made was basically turning into this anyway

Fixed.

The Nuggets are better and much younger.

rayofsunshine · Post #5 » by **rayofsunshine** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:38 pm

In what world is a team of Chandler, Melo and Amare not better than one with iggy, miller and whoever?

The team with the superstar wins every time.

DarkXaero · Post #6 » by **DarkXaero** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:43 pm

rayofsunshine wrote:In what world is a team of Chandler, Melo and Amare not better than one with iggy, miller and whoever?

The team with the superstar wins every time.

Records indicate otherwise.

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Hyral · Post #7 » by **Hyral** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:44 pm

I would argue that same team with iggy, miller, and "whoever" is in the same world where they are also better than the Lakers with Kobe, Dwight, and Nash, so yeah I'd be careful when saying things like that...

Durant Durant · Post #8 » by **Durant Durant** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:45 pm

speculative thread with a built-in excuse incl. lol

rayofsunshine · Post #9 » by **rayofsunshine** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:51 pm

Hyral wrote:I would argue that same team with iggy, miller, and "whoever" is in the same world where they are also better than the Lakers with Kobe, Dwight, and Nash, so yeah I'd be careful when saying things like that...

put your money where your mouth is. regular season means nothing.

Green Backpack · Post #10 » by **Green Backpack** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 5:12 pm

Melo has had a huge impact on the Knicks, but the Nuggets are the better overall team still I think. But who cares, I doubt they meet in the finals.

NYK_89 · Post #11 » by **NYK_89** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 5:20 pm

Green Backpack wrote:Melo has had a huge impact on the Knicks, but the Nuggets are the better overall team still I think. But who cares, I doubt they meet in the finals.

Yeah Nuggets may be a better team (Not really convinced on them having PS success yet) but they were 1 year removed from the WCF the Knicks hadn't made the playoffs in 8 years and were fighting for an 8th seed at the time of the trade and now sit in the #2 spot in the east.

Why aren't any of you taking into account how much better the Nuggets were in the first place. The Melo Nuggets would sweep the Gallo Knicks, its like trading Lebron to Charlotte for MKG then going wow holy **** Miami won the trade when the Bobcats are sneaking in as the 7th seed and the Heat are still the 1 seed, absolutely absurd the logic does not follow.

We are comparing Melo to Gallo/Chandler/Miller/Mozgov right now. The choice is CLEAR, the Nuggets would be better with Melo+fillers, however that was not an option and the nuggets recovered quickly so its hard to say it was not a good trade for them.

mademan · Post #12 » by **mademan** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 5:49 pm

rayofsunshine wrote:
Hyral wrote:I would argue that same team with iggy, miller, and "whoever" is in the same world where they are also better than the Lakers with Kobe, Dwight, and Nash, so yeah I'd be careful when saying things like that...

put your money where your mouth is. regular season means nothing.

LOL. The Nuggets would destroy the Lakers in the playoffs.

To the thread, Nuggets are quasi-contenders. If they were in the East, they would be second seed and a near lock to make the ECF. The Knicks might lose in the first round if they get matched up with the Celtics.

torotoe · Post #13 » by **torotoe** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 5:50 pm

NYK_89 wrote:We are comparing Melo to Gallo/Chandler/Miller/Mozgov right now. The choice is CLEAR, the Nuggets would be better with Melo+fillers, however that was not an option and the nuggets recovered quickly so its hard to say it was not a good trade for them.

You bring up a good point.
What would the nuggets be without the trade? I assume they could still pick Faried, considering the nuggets were on pace to win less games with the Melo/Chauncey team than Lawson/Gallo/JR/Kmart/Nene.

Lawson
Afflalo/JR/Fournier
Melo
Faried/Harington
Nene/Anderson

Or

Lawson
Iggy/Fournier
Melo
Faried/Randolph
Koufos/McGee

Those are really good teams, however, I'm not sure how good they would actually be. Lawson was holding back his own development by deferring to other players. I don't think Lawson would have developed into the player he is today without the melo trade, but he would still be good. I'd take either of those teams over the current Knicks.

NYK_89 · Post #14 » by **NYK_89** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 6:33 pm

torotoe wrote:
NYK_89 wrote:We are comparing Melo to Gallo/Chandler/Miller/Mozgov right now. The choice is CLEAR, the Nuggets would be better with Melo+fillers, however that was not an option and the nuggets recovered quickly so its hard to say it was not a good trade for them.

You bring up a good point.
What would the nuggets be without the trade? I assume they could still pick Faried, considering the nuggets were on pace to win less games with the Melo/Chauncey team than Lawson/Gallo/JR/Kmart/Nene.

Lawson
Afflalo/JR/Fournier
Melo
Faried/Harington
Nene/Anderson

Or

Lawson
Iggy/Fournier
Melo
Faried/Randolph
Koufos/McGee

Those are really good teams, however, I'm not sure how good they would actually be. Lawson was holding back his own development by deferring to other players. I don't think Lawson would have developed into the player he is today without the melo trade, but he would still be good. I'd take either of those teams over the current Knicks.

Wasn't Billups still starting at the time, i feel moving him out was the biggest improvement to his game rather then Melo and his numbers basically reflect the notion of having a larger starting role with increased minutes. Nene trade would still have to be made for salary reasons and the Iggy trade is a total no brainer from Denver's point of view.

But anyways that is exactly my point, the nuggets were stacked with talent and what turned out to be future trade pieces and good picks. The Knicks gutted an already mediocre team and built it back up Comparing the records and the rosters is worthless, not to even mention had the Knicks not gotten Melo or CP3 they would be build around a stoudemire that is starting to be off the court more then off. Anyone that thinks this trade didnt save the Knicks is a total idiot I'm sorry but it is the truth

ardee · Post #15 » by **ardee** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 7:54 pm

Depends if the three is falling for NYK... If it is, forget about it, they were flat out unbeatable when it was through the 2012 part of the season.

berserker · Post #16 » by **berserker** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:38 pm

Lol the next knicks excuse for a first round exit - well, we had to face miami..

Look - knicks got what they wanted, and arent nearly the team they thought they would be.

Nuggets got a lot of value and are exceeding expectations.

That is all that needs to be said. I wont count the ass whipping last night because chandler banged his knee and melos vagina hurt.

Manimal · Post #17 » by **Manimal** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:09 pm

torotoe wrote:Lawson was holding back his own development by deferring to other players. I don't think Lawson would have developed into the player he is today without the melo trade, but he would still be good.

This is how I always feel when people try to say the current Nuggets would be better with Melo instead of Gallo/Chandler, etc. The entire reason the Nuggets are so good right now in the first place is because they no longer play selfish, isolation basketball. Letting Lawson control the ball and create, moving it around and getting open looks off dribble penetration, players hustling/rebounding/defending. THAT is why the Nuggets are as good as they are. Add a high usage player who holds the ball, plays lazy, and doesn't defend into the mix and I don't think they'd be better. I think it'd completely destroy everything that this team is.

It's not like the Nuggets didn't have similar talent/type of players when Melo was in Denver. They were just never able to play this style of basketball because it's just not something you can do with a player like Carmelo on your team. It remains to be seen whether this style of basketball will truly work in the postseason, but so far it's definitely done better than the first few years Melo was in Denver...and they're only getting better.

Post #18 » by **rrravenred** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 10:33 pm

Similar take on this subject here...

JordansBulls · Post #19 » by **JordansBulls** » Sat Mar 16, 2013 8:02 pm

I would still take the Knicks because they have arguably the 3 best players on the floor.

Jase · Post #20 » by **Jase** » Sun Mar 17, 2013 1:38 am

rayofsunshine wrote:
Hyral wrote:I would argue that same team with iggy, miller, and "whoever" is in the same world where they are also better than the Lakers with Kobe, Dwight, and Nash, so yeah I'd be careful when saying things like that...

put your money where your mouth is. regular season means nothing.

Here we go.....

It means something if it stops your team from even making the postseason.

And the team with the superstar clearly does not "win every time."