Grunwald depreciation day

[brigadierjerry]

if i remember correctly, isnt this kind of grunwald's mo?didnt he do the same thing in toronto trading away camby and getting oakley. also he got antonio davis as well and other parts such as childs to build around vince carter

[ORANGEandBLUE]

Biggest blunders were Felton and Novak's contracts. Nobody else was going to give them more than three years. It's no clear they'll even be rotation players by that point.

[Bravery]

if i remember correctly, isnt this kind of grunwald's mo?didnt he do the same thing in toronto trading away camby and getting oakley. also he got antonio davis as well and other parts such as childs to build around vince carter

He also acquired a 38 year old Hakeem (3 years, $17 million) with two draft picks.

[GONYK]

if i remember correctly, isnt this kind of grunwald's mo?didnt he do the same thing in toronto trading away camby and getting oakley. also he got antonio davis as well and other parts such as childs to build around vince carter

He also acquired a 38 year old Hakeem (3 years, $17 million) with two draft picks.

Forgot about that one

[R-DAWG]

if i remember correctly, isnt this kind of grunwald's mo?didnt he do the same thing in toronto trading away camby and getting oakley. also he got antonio davis as well and other parts such as childs to build around vince carter

in fairness, he needed some vet leadership around carter and the Oakley/Camby trade was a win for both franchises. And he traded an aging Mark Jackson for Chris Childs.

Grunwald has the job because he's a yes man and friend of Isiah.

[Dr. Detfink]

This is great.

Look, Grunwald had NO CHOICE. Woodson and Melo WANTED a veteran squad. You GOT IT. I don't remember every one up in arms when the Knicks were crushing opponents.

I predicted this from the BEGINNING. Injuries happen to vets. We experienced it with Chauncey Billups. Did we think guys OLDER than Billups were excluded?

So this IS your team...how you like it?

[R-DAWG]

This is great.

Look, Grunwald had NO CHOICE. Woodson and Melo WANTED a veteran squad. You GOT IT. I don't remember every one up in arms when the Knicks were crushing opponents.

I predicted this from the BEGINNING. Injuries happen to vets. We experienced it with Chauncey Billups. Did we think guys OLDER than Billups were excluded?

So this IS your team...how you like it?

he took the risk. it's all about the playoffs. Another 1st round loss would be an epic disaster.

[rl2011]

This thread is insane - if melo isn;t hurt this team would be fine. The Vet team isn't an issue - almost all of our core guys r under 30 - Melo / Tyson/ Felton / Shump / JR / Amare - thats 6 of lets say a 9 man rotation thats in their prime.

Problem right now is we r unlucky b/c our best player is hurt. Put KD on the rack w/ a bum knee and see how that goes - same w/ LAC or MIA even. Put their top guy down and see how it goes. HAS NOTHIGN TO DO WITH BEING OLD OR HAVING AN "UNATHLETIC ROSTER"

On a long term big picture basis the problem with us overcoming miami si we gave 100mm to amare stoudemire. IN a micro point of view the reason we might lose the Atlantic is b/c of Injuries to our 28 yr old star. which is flat out bad luck and could happen to anyone

[rl2011]

Also people that compliain about the cap blatantly do not understand how the nba works.

Once we sign Tyson + Melo + Amare to deals for a combined 50mm bucks - ur going to be over the cap and not able to sign anyone beyond LLE and MLE. Thereofre it does not matter if you are $1 or 100mm over the cap - unless ur the owner who has to cut the check. As long as the deals all expire at the same time. which ours do.

[Kooz]

Grunwald's biggest blunder was re-signing Woodson

[johnnywishbone]

Like I always say: "a fish rots from the head".

It's kind of like the Cowboys. As long as Jerry Jones keeps meddling with the team they will have problems. The Knicks need a top flight GM who has complete control over all personnel decisions like Pat Riley. Grunnie is a guy who is going to toe the line and do what Dolan and his advisors want. We will see what happens in the playoffs and if they can get everybody healthy by then. But it's not looking good right now that is for sure.

[Mr_Perfect]

How long have I been saying Grunwald is Dolan's puppet? That's the same thing for all his GM's except Walsh.

Here was Walsh giving daily interviews and letting everyone know his feelings on the team. Now Grunwald comes in and is treated like a caged animal by Dolan, only letting him out to utter a few words and then hurrying him back in his cage again. Dolan is an egomaniac who loves to control people. There is nothing more important to him than owning a basketball team that plays in Madison Square Garden. That's the ultimate power. He treats this team like his plaything rather than a professional basketball team. Walsh tried to come in, on Stern's heavy recommendation, and change the culture. He succeeded at first but Dolan could not handle having a respect GM run his team without his input. Walsh was shown the door for his trouble and replaced with yes man and Isiah BFF Grunwald who eventually hired another Isiah BFF in Woodson.

[GettinitDone]

The point is? Dolan is the problem.

Nuggets used to have this personal advisor (Bret Bearup) to owner Stan Kroenke. Everytime the GM (Warkentein) had a deal, he had to discuss it with both Stan and Bearup. Even if Stan liked the deal, if Bearup didn't, chances are it wouldn't go down. When Stan had to hand over Nuggets to his son Josh (because of ownership in other sports city), the first move Josh and new GM Masai Ujiri did was to fire Bearup. That way, they could run their own show. As new sole owner of Nuggets, Josh has 100% complete trust in Ujiri to run the show, everytime Ujiri has a deal, he doesn't have to go to Josh first to get approval.

Les Alexander (Rockets) is chilling in his New York residence, and lets Morey run the show. He trusts Morey with his family.

Thing is, you gotta let your employees do their job, have trust in them and it makes them feel appreciated. If your employees run the show and they screw up, and you don't like the result, just fire them. But as owner, you can't keep meddling in things you don't know/ are not very good at. You pay them for a reason.

I think his mere networth of $2B makes him insecure. Knicks ($1B and rising) are his VERY EXPENSIVE toy. He doesn't want Knicks to screw up and supervise everything but ironically, what he's doing is what makes Knicks screw up. We should really sign petition the Knicks be sold to superior billionaires in the city like Bloomberg ($27B) or the Koch brothers ($30+B each). They dwarf Dolan, even Trump ($3.5B) in networth. The Knicks would really be a toy they would not bother to meddle, they'd let a GM run the show. Bloomberg or the Koches would be instantly richest owner in the L (next richest is Paul Allen: $15B), which would be fitting to have richest team in richest city. We wouldn't see the owner giving up young talent for mere couple of millions of dollars and seemingly operate on basis of financial. By his networth and by the way he runs a team on basis of financial, Dolan should own least expensive teams like Bucks or Kings, not most valuable team in the L. The Knicks are too expensive a toy for him. It's like a person who earns $36,000 a year having a new Benz as his car, he washes his car every day because it's just so expensive... to him.

[Clyde_Style]

Everybody here chip in to buy the team. Then we can run the team by consensus from the message board.

[RutgersBJJ]

He's doing the best with what he has to work with. Amare was here before he got here. Our top 10 pick in 2009 was not here because we drafted a bust who's salary we needed off the books. Grunnie wasn't the one who wasted a first round pick on Toney Douglas. ALL of our young players were gone instead of just our 2008 1st round pick in exchange for Melo because we drafted Gallo over Gordon and Lopez. Grunnie wasn't the one who drafted Shumpert over Faried.

He's responsible for Chandler over Billups, for Kidd, Camby, JR, and K-Mart all on the cheap. While his blunders were the contracts he gave Felton and Novak which run way too long for the bench caliber players they are.

Most of the blame falls on Walsh for his inability to amass talent while purging the roster of contracts and for HIS decision to give Amare a max contract. Walsh is the one who had full control, who constructed this rebuild, and decided to put 20 million of a 58 million dollar cap into an extremely risky asset which has returns that aren't even that valuable when he is healthy.

He's basically doing what Alderson is doing right now for the Mets, except Alderson actually got young players with real talent while purging the roster of overpaid veterans. Walsh forgot the young players with high ceilings part.

[boomann21]

If Walsh would of drafted Brandon Jennings, Kenneth Farried, and Lance Stephenson we would be looking so pretty right now. Instead we got Landry "The Brick Layer" Fields, Jordan "Beat my Girl" HIll, and the artist formerly known as Iman Shumpert.

[Mr_Perfect]

He's doing the best with what he has to work with. Amare was here before he got here. Our top 10 pick in 2009 was not here because we drafted a bust who's salary we needed off the books. Grunnie wasn't the one who wasted a first round pick on Toney Douglas. ALL of our young players were gone instead of just our 2008 1st round pick in exchange for Melo because we drafted Gallo over Gordon and Lopez. Grunnie wasn't the one who drafted Shumpert over Faried.

He's responsible for Chandler over Billups, for Kidd, Camby, JR, and K-Mart all on the cheap. While his blunders were the contracts he gave Felton and Novak which run way too long for the bench caliber players they are.

Most of the blame falls on Walsh for his inability to amass talent while purging the roster of contracts and for HIS decision to give Amare a max contract. Walsh is the one who had full control, who constructed this rebuild, and decided to put 20 million of a 58 million dollar cap into an extremely risky asset which has returns that aren't even that valuable when he is healthy.

He's basically doing what Alderson is doing right now for the Mets, except Alderson actually got young players with real talent while purging the roster of overpaid veterans. Walsh forgot the young players with high ceilings part.

Yes, the man who saved the franchise from years more of laughingstock and failure ruined the team.

Not the owner who undermined his every move, but the only man who actually did something right here the last decade. Good post.

[Since89]

He put the most unathletic roster imaginable out there. Not that I am happy with Melo, but the role players as a group on this team can only play a low speed game. We can't get easy buckets because nobody can run. We can't keep up with athletes like last night. We are dead last in the league in assists per game because nobody moves without the ball.

You can put some of it on the coach and his brand of basketball, but the fact is we simply don't have many guys who can keep up with the young legs in this league.

So bravo Grunwald for creating a down the hill supporting cast with zero athleticism.

Edit: I officially miss Lin, Fields, and Jeffries. That says a lot...

What was the alternative though?

I know he could have stocked up on a lot of athletic misfits that have been cut around the league, but that comes at its own cost.

I don't understand why Sheed was chosen over Kmart and Birdman, but other than that I'm not sure how he could have gotten more value out of the nothing we had available to offer after we let Lin go.

How about starting with not letting Lin go?

Lol Lin isn't even good

12 and 6? Who cares

Felton, jr, shump, melo, chandler, and amare can all run a fast break offense

So ćan Kidd white and cope

Knicks jut have a bad basketball coach who loves half court iso ball

[boomann21]

Lol Lin isn't even good

12 and 6? Who cares

Felton, jr, shump, melo, chandler, and amare can all run a fast break offense

So ćan Kidd white and cope

Knicks jut have a bad basketball coach who loves half court iso ball

In what world is 55-27 bad? Especially considering the fact that he has $100 million dollar man who has missed the majority of those games because of knee injuries and fire extinguisher assaults. Now Mike D'antoni he was bad and was border line terrible. I don't think Woodson has had his full compliment of players for a extended period of time during his tenure. And yet we still 55-27 with him at the helm. Why is the hate bubbling with such ferocity when we see he's been coaching with a broken and battered squad.

[Rasho Brezec]

If Walsh would of drafted Brandon Jennings, Kenneth Farried, and Lance Stephenson we would be looking so pretty right now. Instead we got Landry "The Brick Layer" Fields, Jordan "Beat my Girl" HIll, and the artist formerly known as Iman Shumpert.

If Walsh drafted 1 good player and 2 bad players instead of 1 good player and 2 bad players we would look the same.