Official 2013 Draft Thread - Part VII

[Rafael122]

No big difference here. The people that hated Bennett to begin with, hate him a little more with this Ford tweet. Color me surprised. Failure of discipline in the weight gain, but he isnt even remotely close to the first athlete to have weight issues following an injury. Not concerned about the issue. Still view him as a better prospect than Porter, period. Consider it unlikely that we'll take him, however, better guess is Porter or Len at #3 or trade down.

It does become tiresome to read some posters critiquing the players they don't want with both guns blazing then holster both when it comes to critiquing the player(s) they actually do like. Lets be a bit balanced here.

Agreed. This is clearly a concern that needs to be evaluated in terms of motivation, but I sort of agree with Chad Ford. The kid is an introvert, and is now doing something completely different that he has ever done right now with this tour around the country. And people here that consider anything about Bennett to be a big red flag being up in arms about this is silly. We've all pretty much staked out our positions - nobody is really objectively looking at this point.

I don't think anyone is staking a position here. We were not projected to pick in the top 3. At #8 or #9, I could be convinced to take Bennett. At 3? Different conversations, different set of players to choose from.

I just don't want to take this guy (at 3), then in December everyone is wondering why he's not playing. Wittman needs to go, etc, when all we have to do is go back and read these threads and find the answer.

[sfam]

Not that it will matter but Ford did a secret poll with a number of GMs and scouts from aroud the league, rating the prospects (not on a computer - hopefully someone can post the link). Bennett came out #4, ahead of Porter (top 3 were Oladipo, Noel and Mclemore), and includes the comment "...is seen by most as a very safe pick." He may be off of most boards here, but unless there is freak outs over the weight, he's still very much on the pros' radar.

Edit: Shabazz came out #21.

[Ruzious]

No big difference here. The people that hated Bennett to begin with, hate him a little more with this Ford tweet. Color me surprised. Failure of discipline in the weight gain, but he isnt even remotely close to the first athlete to have weight issues following an injury. Not concerned about the issue. Still view him as a better prospect than Porter, period. Consider it unlikely that we'll take him, however, better guess is Porter or Len at #3 or trade down.

It does become tiresome to read some posters critiquing the players they don't want with both guns blazing then holster both when it comes to critiquing the player(s) they actually do like. Lets be a bit balanced here.

Agreed. This is clearly a concern that needs to be evaluated in terms of motivation, but I sort of agree with Chad Ford. The kid is an introvert, and is now doing something completely different that he has ever done right now with this tour around the country. And people here that consider anything about Bennett to be a big red flag being up in arms about this is silly. We've all pretty much staked out our positions - nobody is really objectively looking at this point.

Gaining 18 lbs of flab is an objective concern - no matter how you look at him, no matter what his personality is, and no matter what other excuses you can think up.

[sfam]

I can understand why folks who were down on Bennett can point to the weight gain as further justification for concern. That makes sense. But for those on Team Bennett: an *18 lbs* fat gain causes no concern whatsoever? Really? For a guy that's already a little undersized and who will need to rely on explosiveness to compensate? Not even an arched eyebrow?

As I just said, its definitely a concern, and is worth a question or two, including whether he regularly balloons up over the summer. I just don't think the sky is falling.

[sfam]

No big difference here. The people that hated Bennett to begin with, hate him a little more with this Ford tweet. Color me surprised. Failure of discipline in the weight gain, but he isnt even remotely close to the first athlete to have weight issues following an injury. Not concerned about the issue. Still view him as a better prospect than Porter, period. Consider it unlikely that we'll take him, however, better guess is Porter or Len at #3 or trade down.

It does become tiresome to read some posters critiquing the players they don't want with both guns blazing then holster both when it comes to critiquing the player(s) they actually do like. Lets be a bit balanced here.

Agreed. This is clearly a concern that needs to be evaluated in terms of motivation, but I sort of agree with Chad Ford. The kid is an introvert, and is now doing something completely different that he has ever done right now with this tour around the country. And people here that consider anything about Bennett to be a big red flag being up in arms about this is silly. We've all pretty much staked out our positions - nobody is really objectively looking at this point.

I don't think anyone is staking a position here. We were not projected to pick in the top 3. At #8 or #9, I could be convinced to take Bennett. At 3? Different conversations, different set of players to choose from.

I just don't want to take this guy (at 3), then in December everyone is wondering why he's not playing. Wittman needs to go, etc, when all we have to do is go back and read these threads and find the answer.

Bennett's injury is supposed to be cleared by August. Why wouldn't he be playing in December?

[pancakes3]

Some very interesting if not outright great draft prospect breakdowns from a Jazz commentator:

Zeller:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zjcb6ENUIys[/youtube]

CJM:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CqxN2KL6VJI&list=PLdAyXyJDMMnXYletG1XCDbVOjXgY7hB4k[/youtube]

There are also videos for Shane Larkin, Michael Carter-Kidd, and Dennis Schroeder. I guess Utah's looking for a pg.


Here's an just a workout video of Plumlee. Looks Spencer Hawesian.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=McZEfQf_GYk[/youtube]

[Severn Hoos]

Ford came out early and promoted Bennett as the better prospect, higher upside, etc. He's trying to cover his tracks now, so he won't sell the kid up the river, he wants to say just enough that he can point to the "red flags" and "warning signs" if Bennett does go the Hot Plate route - or just disappoints in general. But then he can also claim to have stood by his projections of "upside" if Bennett does in fact make an impact in the NBA. Unless Ford comes right out and says the kid isn't worthy of a top 10 pick, nothing he says at this point will have any grounding in reality.

Me, I wouldn't touch him. Much prefer the boring, safe pick of Porter.

[Dark Faze]

Honestly, for as much as Bennett supporters want to get defensive about guys slinging mud on him regularly there seems to be a real cognitive dissonance going on in regards to the truth and reality of the guys positive and negatives.

Literally dismissing objective facts like ridiculous weight gain and having a terrible defensive reputation and then getting salty when Wiz fans continue to pound those facts into arguments.

Bennett 18 pounds over weight: This whole thing is new to him and he's traveling around the country.

Bennett with a terribad defensive reputation: Did the coach even ask him to try on defense though?

I mean look, we all get that Porter isn't the second coming of LeBron James, but we're not dismissing the facts about the negative aspects of his game either.

[pancakes3]

No big difference here. The people that hated Bennett to begin with, hate him a little more with this Ford tweet. Color me surprised. Failure of discipline in the weight gain, but he isnt even remotely close to the first athlete to have weight issues following an injury. Not concerned about the issue. Still view him as a better prospect than Porter, period. Consider it unlikely that we'll take him, however, better guess is Porter or Len at #3 or trade down.

It does become tiresome to read some posters critiquing the players they don't want with both guns blazing then holster both when it comes to critiquing the player(s) they actually do like. Lets be a bit balanced here.

Agreed. This is clearly a concern that needs to be evaluated in terms of motivation, but I sort of agree with Chad Ford. The kid is an introvert, and is now doing something completely different that he has ever done right now with this tour around the country. And people here that consider anything about Bennett to be a big red flag being up in arms about this is silly. We've all pretty much staked out our positions - nobody is really objectively looking at this point.

The kid is Canadian and played in 2 major basketball prep schools in the US as well as hit the AAU circuit pretty hard. I don't think going on this draft tour is anything he hasn't seen before.

[Rafael122]

Agreed. This is clearly a concern that needs to be evaluated in terms of motivation, but I sort of agree with Chad Ford. The kid is an introvert, and is now doing something completely different that he has ever done right now with this tour around the country. And people here that consider anything about Bennett to be a big red flag being up in arms about this is silly. We've all pretty much staked out our positions - nobody is really objectively looking at this point.

I don't think anyone is staking a position here. We were not projected to pick in the top 3. At #8 or #9, I could be convinced to take Bennett. At 3? Different conversations, different set of players to choose from.

I just don't want to take this guy (at 3), then in December everyone is wondering why he's not playing. Wittman needs to go, etc, when all we have to do is go back and read these threads and find the answer.

Bennett's injury is supposed to be cleared by August. Why wouldn't he be playing in December?

"Cleared by August" to me doesn't mean he's ready to play in August, and will be able to adapt and learn about the NBA by August. The weight gain on top of learning how to be a rookie in the NBA will stunt him a bit. Remember, it took Beal half the season to adjust, Bennett has to work extra harder b/c of an injury and being behind the depth chart.

[Rafael122]

Honestly, for as much as Bennett supporters want to get defensive about guys slinging mud on him regularly there seems to be a real cognitive dissonance going on in regards to the truth and reality of the guys positive and negatives.

Literally dismissing objective facts like ridiculous weight gain and having a terrible defensive reputation and then getting salty when Wiz fans continue to pound those facts into arguments.

Bennett 18 pounds over weight: This whole thing is new to him and he's traveling around the country.

Bennett with a terribad defensive reputation: Did the coach even ask him to try on defense though?

I mean look, we all get that Porter isn't the second coming of LeBron James, but we're not dismissing the facts about the negative aspects of his game either.

Traveling around the country, because his agent couldn't set him up with a nutritionist or a personal chef? If he knew he was hurt, his agent could have done something. Instead it sounds like Bennett didn't leave the house and sat on his couch all day. Then you look at a guy like Len who has a stress fracture yet he's working around that and developing his upper body, eating right, etc.

Bennett had surgery what...May 8th? And he's gained 18 pounds in 6 weeks?

[MDStar]

Speaking of safe, when I look at Kawhi Leonard, I see safe. And that's what I want on my team. So if Otto Porter, is a safe, all-around basketball player. I'll plug him in day 1 and watch him making plays that may not be flashy but will be winning basketball plays.

[stevemcqueen1]

I could understand a 5-10 pound weight gain, but 18-25 is ridiculous. He can still lift with his lower body and ride the bike. He can modify his calorie intake too. This is arguably the most important 3 months for him in determining his future as an NBA player and he can't even step back from the buffet table. That's a bad sign.

He's been traveling near constantly since the combine. You eat like **** when you travel and you lose your normal workout routine. Perhaps it's a maturity issue. But it's not a big enough issue to go running to the hills over. He's young, it takes some players a while to learn how to eat, especially when on the road. It's not like it's a major deficiency in his skill set.

If I were him, I'd hire a personal chef and work with a personal trainer every day to cook all of my meals and control my workouts right after I got drafted. Build a really solid routine and get comfortable in it. He'd see results in his body very quickly and I'm sure his conditioning would improve with better nutrition. Probably give him relief from his asthma.

Kawhi Leonard lives with his mother in San Antonio and she is basically his nutritionist and handles all of the nitty gritty for him and takes care of him. Not having to ever deal with his meals and the financial stuff, and having someone in his corner looking out for him that he can 100% trust is a great idea. It frees him up to live entirely for basketball and focus on honing his craft. He's a home body too. I'd like to see Bennett get someone like that to just constantly be around and helping him, someone to hold him accountable. It's a great idea for any young player IMO, really smooths the transition to a wildly different NBA lifestyle.

Maybe I'm in the minority but I actually think Bennett's 240 playing weight is very light for him. As barrell chested and broad shouldered as he is, and as explosive as he is, I think he could easily carry more of the right kind of weight. And in fact, I think he needs to get stronger, it's something he's specifically mentioned as a goal. He has the potential to grow into an overpowering player. Joe Johnson plays at 240. Metta World Peace plays in the 260s and is very comfortable at 250. MWP can carry a ton of muscle, but Bennett has a bigger frame than both of them. I think Bennett should set a goal of 250-255--good weight mind you. It won't be until late in his career that he'll need to trim up and cut weight down to that 235-240 range to feel good.

[sfam]

Honestly, for as much as Bennett supporters want to get defensive about guys slinging mud on him regularly there seems to be a real cognitive dissonance going on in regards to the truth and reality of the guys positive and negatives.

Literally dismissing objective facts like ridiculous weight gain and having a terrible defensive reputation and then getting salty when Wiz fans continue to pound those facts into arguments.

Bennett 18 pounds over weight: This whole thing is new to him and he's traveling around the country.

Bennett with a terribad defensive reputation: Did the coach even ask him to try on defense though?

I mean look, we all get that Porter isn't the second coming of LeBron James, but we're not dismissing the facts about the negative aspects of his game either.

Dude, I don't think I've ever seen a positive thought about Bennett in any of your posts, so its hardly surprising when you break out the "Big Red Flag" yet again. At this point it just comes off as replaying the "Bennett is a horrible pick" tape. If I was going to be persuaded by that viewpoint it would have happened long ago.

Clearly the weight is a concern, but that you list it as a deal killer isn't influencing those who don't think Bennett is the second coming of the sloth bear. As for me, I'm certainly concerned about it, but the things I loved about Bennett are still there. I'm willing to see how this story progresses a bit more before pressing the eject button on him.

[Dark Faze]

Lol @ the " Kawhi Leonards mom is there tho" angle.

Do you think Kawhi didn't travel constantly as a guy who could have went as high as 5 or as low as where he actually went?

[sfam]

I don't think anyone is staking a position here. We were not projected to pick in the top 3. At #8 or #9, I could be convinced to take Bennett. At 3? Different conversations, different set of players to choose from.

I just don't want to take this guy (at 3), then in December everyone is wondering why he's not playing. Wittman needs to go, etc, when all we have to do is go back and read these threads and find the answer.

Bennett's injury is supposed to be cleared by August. Why wouldn't he be playing in December?

"Cleared by August" to me doesn't mean he's ready to play in August, and will be able to adapt and learn about the NBA by August. The weight gain on top of learning how to be a rookie in the NBA will stunt him a bit. Remember, it took Beal half the season to adjust, Bennett has to work extra harder b/c of an injury and being behind the depth chart.

I don't get the Rose vibe from Bennett - then again, I didn't get the Rose vibe from Derrick Rose either.

[sfam]

No big difference here. The people that hated Bennett to begin with, hate him a little more with this Ford tweet. Color me surprised. Failure of discipline in the weight gain, but he isnt even remotely close to the first athlete to have weight issues following an injury. Not concerned about the issue. Still view him as a better prospect than Porter, period. Consider it unlikely that we'll take him, however, better guess is Porter or Len at #3 or trade down.

It does become tiresome to read some posters critiquing the players they don't want with both guns blazing then holster both when it comes to critiquing the player(s) they actually do like. Lets be a bit balanced here.

Agreed. This is clearly a concern that needs to be evaluated in terms of motivation, but I sort of agree with Chad Ford. The kid is an introvert, and is now doing something completely different that he has ever done right now with this tour around the country. And people here that consider anything about Bennett to be a big red flag being up in arms about this is silly. We've all pretty much staked out our positions - nobody is really objectively looking at this point.

The kid is Canadian and played in 2 major basketball prep schools in the US as well as hit the AAU circuit pretty hard. I don't think going on this draft tour is anything he hasn't seen before.

He was healthy for those. But again, the question I would pusue here is what's Bennett's pattern with injuries? Does he do each time, and if so, how log does he take to get the weight off? Based on those answers I would either be more or less concerned.

[The Consiglieri]

No big difference here. The people that hated Bennett to begin with, hate him a little more with this Ford tweet. Color me surprised. Failure of discipline in the weight gain, but he isnt even remotely close to the first athlete to have weight issues following an injury. Not concerned about the issue. Still view him as a better prospect than Porter, period. Consider it unlikely that we'll take him, however, better guess is Porter or Len at #3 or trade down.

It does become tiresome to read some posters critiquing the players they don't want with both guns blazing then holster both when it comes to critiquing the player(s) they actually do like. Lets be a bit balanced here.

Agreed. This is clearly a concern that needs to be evaluated in terms of motivation, but I sort of agree with Chad Ford. The kid is an introvert, and is now doing something completely different that he has ever done right now with this tour around the country. And people here that consider anything about Bennett to be a big red flag being up in arms about this is silly. We've all pretty much staked out our positions - nobody is really objectively looking at this point.

I think that's why draft talk has slowed down the last few weeks instead of picked up. Everybody knows who everybody likes best, and few have entertained the idea of changing their mind. Although I have seen the Bennett boosters show a lot more flexibility (some of us, changing who we liked best, others admitting the flaws, compared to Porters-other than Dat, i can't think of any actually exploring the issues that may limit Porter at the next level like we do with Bennett. Seen the same paucity of criticism with Zeller fans not discussing why he fell so far in esteem, why his athleticism numbers never appeared in games, why he gets a million shots blocked inside, and not just against Syracuse etc).

It's difficult, we've moved from high chance of outright bust or simple rotational player at slot 8 (any of the big men, Muhammad, etc), to flawed players with upside (Bennett, Noel, Len) or high floors (Porter), or guys we think may be great but don't play a position of need (Oladipo, McCollum), or guys that have tantalizing skills/assets but major issues at the next level (Zeller, Olynyk, Adams).

So in the end, the interests are more related to what we consider more important to the team going forward, rather than the players themselves.

[Dat2U]

Agreed. This is clearly a concern that needs to be evaluated in terms of motivation, but I sort of agree with Chad Ford. The kid is an introvert, and is now doing something completely different that he has ever done right now with this tour around the country. And people here that consider anything about Bennett to be a big red flag being up in arms about this is silly. We've all pretty much staked out our positions - nobody is really objectively looking at this point.

The kid is Canadian and played in 2 major basketball prep schools in the US as well as hit the AAU circuit pretty hard. I don't think going on this draft tour is anything he hasn't seen before.

He was healthy for those. But again, the question I would pusue here is what's Bennett's pattern with injuries? Does he do each time, and if so, how log does he take to get the weight off? Based on those answers I would either be more or less concerned.

I see your in mid-season form. Your defending Bennett like he's is already wearing a Wizards jersey.

I think the argument regarding Bennett is rather simple. Do the positives outweigh the negatives? In your case, they do. In many other viewpoints, they don't. I personally have a literal laundry list of concerns I have.

Am I being unfairly biased in my analysis of him??? I don't think so. What I know for certain is that I had no preconceived notions about Bennett until watching him play, seeing footage of him youtube & consistently reading about him.

The same reason why I fell in love with Kelly Olynyk (who I knew nothing about before this past season) as an underrated prospect is the same reason I wasn't crazy about Anthony Bennett. I did the thorough research, analyzed the information and came to a conclusion.

[Jay81]

It sickens me that this is the most important week in Wizards history in some time and there are so many options on the table and we still have the worst GM in the planet still running the show. Ernie should not be doing whatever he is going to be doing this week. How does this man with the poorest results known to mankind still running a pro sports franchise?