Trade Idea Thread II

[Neddy]

So I just watched the Hornets game on league pass. Jamal made me look pretty stupid with all the wide open guys he decided not to pass to.

look into the game thread. I nearly lost my mind on those plays. the bad thing is, because he gets hot time to time and actually makes them for a decent rate in few games, he keeps on chucking and missing a hell of a lot more in many other games.

Jamal is a great trade bait. we need to make this happen while his value is still hot. each passing year and more mileage on his body, his value will plummet like a S&P stock portfolio.

[LACtdom]

So I just watched the Hornets game on league pass. Jamal made me look pretty stupid with all the wide open guys he decided not to pass to.

look into the game thread. I nearly lost my mind on those plays. the bad thing is, because he gets hot time to time and actually makes them for a decent rate in few games, he keeps on chucking and missing a hell of a lot more in many other games.

Jamal is a great trade bait. we need to make this happen while his value is still hot. each passing year and more mileage on his body, his value will plummet like a S&P stock portfolio.

I keep changing my mind about Jamal. Why do we want him? Because he can create his own shot and sometimes shoots 3's at a high percentage. The main reason why I think we should get rid of him is because too often we rely on him to make miracle 3's. With him gone, it will force us to play better team ball otherwise we will lose games where he normally bails us out. Come playoff time, I think our team will be better for it.

[TucsonClip]

I don't think Jamal needs to go, rather he should be expendable if the opportunity presents itself to improve the SF position.

Rivers does rely on him at the end of games, but if Blake isn't in attack mode we need someone out there with CP3 that can put pressure on the defense. I actually love that Crawford had found a home here in LA, and that the organization has allowed him to be who he is as a player. Lest we forget, Crawford was a chucker that previous coaches could not figure out how to use, even when he won a 6th man award.

Trade him? Sure, if you can offer me a sensible deal in return. Dump him because he is a problem? Not even close.

[Neddy]

I don't think Jamal needs to go, rather he should be expendable if the opportunity presents itself to improve the SF position.

Rivers does rely on him at the end of games, but if Blake isn't in attack mode we need someone out there with CP3 that can put pressure on the defense. I actually love that Crawford had found a home here in LA, and that the organization has allowed him to be who he is as a player. Lest we forget, Crawford was a chucker that previous coaches could not figure out how to use, even when he won a 6th man award.

Trade him? Sure, if you can offer me a sensible deal in return. Dump him because he is a problem? Not even close.

hmmmm... not sure what you are implying. sitting him down in 4th or trade him for a SF is pretty much what everyone has said as far as i can remember.
even the post right before yours must be taken with the context of the previous discussion that's been going on. we are all saying pretty much what your counterargument is based on. trade him to improve the team, or sit him down when teamwork is more needed over lucky shots.

[Lindecision]

that's ok. however it makes you look, it's not nearly as bad as how the dumb GM's look when they sign or trade for him.

i can forgive a fan who sees him get hot and hit 30 footers all game. i can't forgive the idiot coach or gm who, by now, should clearly see all the negative things he brings to a team.

The reason I see Redick as more expendable is not just because of Jamal's 30 footers. Its because he can also break down defenses off the dribble and get you 5 assists. Redick is one-dimensional in comparison. If he's not shooting well he offers nothing else.

Jamal also gives us a hell of a lot more scoring. Like we saw tonight in Detroit. He has better averages across the board. He can play heavier minutes even though he's older. I'm just not confident we can do without that extra juice.

[Lindecision]

I don't think Jamal needs to go, rather he should be expendable if the opportunity presents itself to improve the SF position.

Rivers does rely on him at the end of games, but if Blake isn't in attack mode we need someone out there with CP3 that can put pressure on the defense. I actually love that Crawford had found a home here in LA, and that the organization has allowed him to be who he is as a player. Lest we forget, Crawford was a chucker that previous coaches could not figure out how to use, even when he won a 6th man award.

Trade him? Sure, if you can offer me a sensible deal in return. Dump him because he is a problem? Not even close.

IF the opprtunity presents itself. If it does then great, but its pretty unlikely that Redick or Jamal will be enough to get us Green or Chandler. Thanks to Doc's bad GM-ing and trading away our future 1sts, we no longer have any assets apart from DJ and Bullock. I can't believe some people are calling Bullock a bust by the way. He's a decent 3D prospect and this is only his 2nd year. You can't be a bust when you're drafted 25th. DJ is by far our best asset and I'm warming to the idea of exploring that option.

I'm not all that comfortable paying him the max to be honest. If you're being paid $16 million plus then you have to be able to do more than just rebound and block shots. Guys on that high a salary have to be capable of being a major option on offense. DJ will never be capable of that. The biggest reason why Blake can't do damage in the post consistently and has had to develop a jump shot is because of DJ. He has no offensive game to speak of. Defenses are completely ignoring DJ and collapsing on Blake with the double team. Good teams have completely figured out how to defend us now.

[Neddy]

that's ok. however it makes you look, it's not nearly as bad as how the dumb GM's look when they sign or trade for him.

i can forgive a fan who sees him get hot and hit 30 footers all game. i can't forgive the idiot coach or gm who, by now, should clearly see all the negative things he brings to a team.

The reason I see Redick as more expendable is not just because of Jamal's 30 footers. Its because he can also break down defenses off the dribble and get you 5 assists. Redick is one-dimensional in comparison. If he's not shooting well he offers nothing else.

Jamal also gives us a hell of a lot more scoring. Like we saw tonight in Detroit. He has better averages across the board. He can play heavier minutes even though he's older. I'm just not confident we can do without that extra juice.

I disagree. Jamal's defense is beyond repair, and as tonight once again showed, for every big shot he makes equally or more often a buffoonery, boneheaded plays he makes that puts you in the hole, a la a NetZero player. his fancy passes are illusion as he gives you just a taste of that flavor to make you believe he can, then takes your heart out with idiotic shot selections. some games he looks like michael jordan, but through out the season and especially in the playoffs, he will break you more often than not.

JJ seems he is only a shooter, for how this team is operating as of now, but you take away Jamal and we need another ball handler who can actually run an offense unlike no court vision Farmar, JJ has proven while with the Magic and the other pit stop that when asked, he can play the PG enough to back up CP the way Jamal does often. we simply have not asked him to do so.

JJ's biggest quality, which we are not utilizing at all, isn't simply his shooting but his endurance. he will run, not jog or walk, he will run around and through screens all game and wear out any opposing defender in 4 full quarters. it is a shame we are playing him only 2 at most and running a stationary one on one player like Jamal who gives plenty of rest for the defense to keep their legs fresh comes 4th Quarter.

if this was the 1986 through 1989 clippers or the 1997 to 2000 clipper team, hell yeah i would love to have Jamal just go nuts and see if he can lead the league in scoring. but this isn't those under 20 game winning clipper teams anymore. we need structure and discipline to win in the playoffs. Jamal is a part of our lackadaisical discipline culture we have, not a part of the solution for a well disciplined, high IQ, passing for better shot selection aka a winning franchise... to become a good decision making team such as the Spurs.

of course I am not saying to dump him for the sake of getting rid of him. we need to use him as a quality bait with some other pieces to make a great trade to enhance this team to the next level.

[QRich3]

The reason I see Redick as more expendable is not just because of Jamal's 30 footers. Its because he can also break down defenses off the dribble and get you 5 assists. Redick is one-dimensional in comparison. If he's not shooting well he offers nothing else.

Jamal also gives us a hell of a lot more scoring. Like we saw tonight in Detroit. He has better averages across the board. He can play heavier minutes even though he's older. I'm just not confident we can do without that extra juice.

Not to keep beating on a dead horse, but a point I failed to make before is that Jamal can rack assists but he's not a good playmaker at all. The vast majority of his assists are just exactly like the majority of his points, break his man in isolation, drive to the hoop and dish it it to the side or to the rim for a lob. That simple 1-on-1 game doesn't fly in the 4th quarter of a playoff game against a good defensive team, like we saw in game 5 against OKC last year. Not to use your words against your point, but I keep seeing Jamal as one dimensional as an NBA player can ever be. Redick hasn't done much ball handling for us, but he used to run the P&R in the 2nd unit with the Magic back when he was there, and he was very good at it. He can read the floor well, make the pass to the right man at the right time, or shoot it if the big man hedges on him. And the most important thing, he won't try to bite more than he can chew, so he won't give you frustrating shots or stupid turnovers.

The biggest reason why Blake can't do damage in the post consistently and has had to develop a jump shot is because of DJ. He has no offensive game to speak of. Defenses are completely ignoring DJ and collapsing on Blake with the double team. Good teams have completely figured out how to defend us now.

This I do agree with, for all the complaining about how many jump shots Blake is taking, most people don't pay attention to what other options does he have, if he has DJ's man waiting to double him as soon as he faces up. But other than that, DJ is a very good offensive player, having him as a threat for a lob anytime does wonders for spacing the Paul-Blake pick'n'roll, he drags a defender with him any time he gets close to the paint cause they'll know he'll just smash the ball on you if you don't body him up. When you have that, and Redick far in the corner waiting for a pass, Paul and Blake are left with a lot of room to operate on the high P&R and that helps a lot in making our offense as good as it is. Also, he is a GREAT screener and a big reason Redick is so open in all of those pin downs they run for him. He's a really good offensive player even though he's not very skilled with the ball. But yeah, he makes Blake not have that many space in the paint, and Blake is one the best players ever at scoring at the rim. If DJ managed to ever get to Gasol/Hibbert/Noah defensive level, I'd pay him the full max with no regrets though.

[nickhx2]

that's ok. however it makes you look, it's not nearly as bad as how the dumb GM's look when they sign or trade for him.

i can forgive a fan who sees him get hot and hit 30 footers all game. i can't forgive the idiot coach or gm who, by now, should clearly see all the negative things he brings to a team.

The reason I see Redick as more expendable is not just because of Jamal's 30 footers. Its because he can also break down defenses off the dribble and get you 5 assists. Redick is one-dimensional in comparison. If he's not shooting well he offers nothing else.

Jamal also gives us a hell of a lot more scoring. Like we saw tonight in Detroit. He has better averages across the board. He can play heavier minutes even though he's older. I'm just not confident we can do without that extra juice.

ok nevermind i don't forgive you anymore.

[LACtdom]

that's ok. however it makes you look, it's not nearly as bad as how the dumb GM's look when they sign or trade for him.

i can forgive a fan who sees him get hot and hit 30 footers all game. i can't forgive the idiot coach or gm who, by now, should clearly see all the negative things he brings to a team.

The reason I see Redick as more expendable is not just because of Jamal's 30 footers. Its because he can also break down defenses off the dribble and get you 5 assists. Redick is one-dimensional in comparison. If he's not shooting well he offers nothing else.

Jamal also gives us a hell of a lot more scoring. Like we saw tonight in Detroit. He has better averages across the board. He can play heavier minutes even though he's older. I'm just not confident we can do without that extra juice.

I disagree. Jamal's defense is beyond repair, and as tonight once again showed, for every big shot he makes equally or more often a buffoonery, boneheaded plays he makes that puts you in the hole, a la a NetZero player. his fancy passes are illusion as he gives you just a taste of that flavor to make you believe he can, then takes your heart out with idiotic shot selections. some games he looks like michael jordan, but through out the season and especially in the playoffs, he will break you more often than not.

JJ seems he is only a shooter, for how this team is operating as of now, but you take away Jamal and we need another ball handler who can actually run an offense unlike no court vision Farmar, JJ has proven while with the Magic and the other pit stop that when asked, he can play the PG enough to back up CP the way Jamal does often. we simply have not asked him to do so.

JJ's biggest quality, which we are not utilizing at all, isn't simply his shooting but his endurance. he will run, not jog or walk, he will run around and through screens all game and wear out any opposing defender in 4 full quarters. it is a shame we are playing him only 2 at most and running a stationary one on one player like Jamal who gives plenty of rest for the defense to keep their legs fresh comes 4th Quarter.

if this was the 1986 through 1989 clippers or the 1997 to 2000 clipper team, hell yeah i would love to have Jamal just go nuts and see if he can lead the league in scoring. but this isn't those under 20 game winning clipper teams anymore. we need structure and discipline to win in the playoffs. Jamal is a part of our lackadaisical discipline culture we have, not a part of the solution for a well disciplined, high IQ, passing for better shot selection aka a winning franchise... to become a good decision making team such as the Spurs.

of course I am not saying to dump him for the sake of getting rid of him. we need to use him as a quality bait with some other pieces to make a great trade to enhance this team to the next level.

Jamal is responsible for just as many points for the opposition as he is for the clippers. The problem is when he isn't scoring well, he is still letting in a lot of points. Granted JJ isn't a good defender but that's because of his size. He puts in 100% effort and energy and draws a lot more charges than anyone else on our team. I agree we have been using JJ for a spot up shooting but his passing and getting to the basket ability should not be forgotten. I think Jamal is great when he is a one-man show with our bench but I don't like him playing so many minutes with the starters as it kills the ball movement a lot of the time.

[Lindecision]

that's ok. however it makes you look, it's not nearly as bad as how the dumb GM's look when they sign or trade for him.

i can forgive a fan who sees him get hot and hit 30 footers all game. i can't forgive the idiot coach or gm who, by now, should clearly see all the negative things he brings to a team.

The reason I see Redick as more expendable is not just because of Jamal's 30 footers. Its because he can also break down defenses off the dribble and get you 5 assists. Redick is one-dimensional in comparison. If he's not shooting well he offers nothing else.

Jamal also gives us a hell of a lot more scoring. Like we saw tonight in Detroit. He has better averages across the board. He can play heavier minutes even though he's older. I'm just not confident we can do without that extra juice.

ok nevermind i don't forgive you anymore.

No problem man. Its a game of opinions.

Time for me to move on from the Jamal vs Redick debate anyway.

[Ranma]

Adrian Wojnarowski, Yahoo! Sports (12/29/14)

In checking on the availability of Brooklyn Nets forward Andrei Kirilenko, several contenders were left with the impression that the former All-Star’s desire to tend to a family matter in New York makes a trade impractical for the foreseeable future, league sources told Yahoo Sports.

The Cleveland Cavaliers and Los Angeles Clippers are two contenders with needs at small forward who’ll wait to see if Kirilenko, 33, becomes available closer to the NBA’s trade deadline in February, or after a contract buyout later in the season, league sources said.

Sources: Family Matter Clouds Andrei Kirilenko’s Trade Situation

[Neddy]

just what is AK47's family matter in New York? is he going through a divorce? he is way too young to have teenage child problems.

[Ranma]

just what is AK47's family matter in New York? is he going through a divorce? he is way too young to have teenage child problems.

I'm half-joking but maybe it's related to his yearly marital allowance. I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case given the advancing age of his wife possibly leading to an increase in her insecurities as well as the fact that Andrei Kirilenko himself is located in New York and familiar with a certain well-connected Russian, which could prove such a once-a-year indiscretion as being insufficient.

[LACtdom]

Out of curiosity, what would you guys be willing to part with in order to get AK47? He is a very talented player but obviously is high risk with some issues/injury concerns/etc.

[Ranma]

Out of curiosity, what would you guys be willing to part with in order to get AK47? He is a very talented player but obviously is high risk with some issues/injury concerns/etc.

Things have apparently escalated to a point of no return for AK47. I'm not really thrilled with Kirilenko at this point in his career but if we can get him after a buyout, he'd definitely be an intriguing option. Definitely a situation worth monitoring.

[QRich3]

I wouldn't really give anything up for Kirilenko at this point, I just see him as another washed up wing that was good a decade ago, the exact kind that Doc loves to add to our roster to get us disappointed with. He's probably worse than Barnes on both ends at this point.

[Lindecision]

So uh, DeRozan is out indefinitely with a torn something. Redick could now be an attractive option for them, with them sending Fields and a 1st to Boston and us getting Jeff Green.

[TucsonClip]

I don't think Jamal needs to go, rather he should be expendable if the opportunity presents itself to improve the SF position.

Rivers does rely on him at the end of games, but if Blake isn't in attack mode we need someone out there with CP3 that can put pressure on the defense. I actually love that Crawford had found a home here in LA, and that the organization has allowed him to be who he is as a player. Lest we forget, Crawford was a chucker that previous coaches could not figure out how to use, even when he won a 6th man award.

Trade him? Sure, if you can offer me a sensible deal in return. Dump him because he is a problem? Not even close.

hmmmm... not sure what you are implying. sitting him down in 4th or trade him for a SF is pretty much what everyone has said as far as i can remember.
even the post right before yours must be taken with the context of the previous discussion that's been going on. we are all saying pretty much what your counterargument is based on. trade him to improve the team, or sit him down when teamwork is more needed over lucky shots.

I am implying that sitting Crawford isnt a good option and neither is dumping him, because he takes bad shots.

As I said, if Blake isnt in attack mode, who else is going to create their own shots? That is the biggest asset Crawford brings. He can carry a bench unit, he can be lethal in iso situations. I think he has been pressing, because the team was struggling offensively. That isnt the case anymore, but you also have to remember that Doc is going to allow Crawford to play his own game. He needs to pass more, but allowing Crawford to be himself is why he has been so good for us.

[QRich3]

I don't think Jamal needs to go, rather he should be expendable if the opportunity presents itself to improve the SF position.

Rivers does rely on him at the end of games, but if Blake isn't in attack mode we need someone out there with CP3 that can put pressure on the defense. I actually love that Crawford had found a home here in LA, and that the organization has allowed him to be who he is as a player. Lest we forget, Crawford was a chucker that previous coaches could not figure out how to use, even when he won a 6th man award.

Trade him? Sure, if you can offer me a sensible deal in return. Dump him because he is a problem? Not even close.

hmmmm... not sure what you are implying. sitting him down in 4th or trade him for a SF is pretty much what everyone has said as far as i can remember.
even the post right before yours must be taken with the context of the previous discussion that's been going on. we are all saying pretty much what your counterargument is based on. trade him to improve the team, or sit him down when teamwork is more needed over lucky shots.

I am implying that sitting Crawford isnt a good option and neither is dumping him, because he takes bad shots.

As I said, if Blake isnt in attack mode, who else is going to create their own shots? That is the biggest asset Crawford brings. He can carry a bench unit, he can be lethal in iso situations. I think he has been pressing, because the team was struggling offensively. That isnt the case anymore, but you also have to remember that Doc is going to allow Crawford to play his own game. He needs to pass more, but allowing Crawford to be himself is why he has been so good for us.

This is a pet theory of mine and not something I'm completely sure, but I think our offense is better by getting system buckets coming from any pick and roll situation, whether it's Paul or Redick (or even Farmar in small stretches) handling the ball, or Blake creating from the post, or pick'n'pop action with Hawes, or whichever of Doc's favorite plays, than it is when Crawford is out there playing hero ball with the bench unit. It's not useful to have a great ball handler with the second unit if all those plays he's handling the ball end up with a low scoring average. At this point I want to see what the team can do without him, even if we don't add anything else in exchange. Not every offensive possession needs to start with a player aggressively attacking his man, and the ones that do are not necessarily better than well drawn plays executed by good role players.