The Lebron Thread (2014-15 Pt. 2)

aboogie · Post #1941 » by **aboogie** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 3:11 am

rich316 wrote:Nice second half run, it looked like it was going to be a disappointing loss.

I can't help but worry that the turnovers are going to be the team's Achilles heel. At this point, it isn't a fluke or an aberration - there's something wrong with the team's offensive system, and Lebron's role in it, that keeps causing these problems. They may need another ball handler in the starting lineup. Irving isn't going to be that guy, because he is basically a shooting guard right now. Lebron is showing that he can't be the true point guard - his passing is elite at the point of attack, but he is hemorrhaging turnovers as the guy running the entire offense. They don't have an NBA caliber point guard on the roster, unfortunately - Delladova is pretty awful on offense, and Irving is just a really good scorer.

There is an alternative to changing personnel - changing offensive scheme, and replicating Miami's model of deliberate, slowed-down ball movement where the offense doesn't depend on a single guy initiating the plays. That would kill the high pace that has made the Cavs so good lately. Hopefully they find a real point guard next season, ideally a taller guard who can defend 2s. Guys like that who can also hit threes are rare, though.

shaun livingston fits the bill no?

SideshowBob · Post #1942 » by **SideshowBob** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 3:20 am

Lebron's Net On/Off was +136 tonight. Cavs got outscored by 18 in ~18 possessions with him off the floor (45 ORTG/146.8 DRTG) and he was a +27 in his time on the court (121 ORTG/86.1 DRTG). Seasonally he should be just under +19, within striking distance of his career best mark from 2009. On court net figure should be at +11 for the season, which is topped only by 09/10/13.

colts18 · Post #1943 » by **colts18** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 3:22 am

+27 in 39 minutes, -18 in 9 minutes. Wow. His plus/minus is going to great look great tomorrow. Maybe he can surpass his best plus/minus this season.

SideshowBob · Post #1944 » by **SideshowBob** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 3:34 am

Yeah his raw +/- has quite rapidly caught up with the league leaders. Prior to coming back from the two week break, he was at +106, 60th in the league.

+/- First 38 games

After tonight, he's 6th in the league at +385. I think the recent Chicago game is missing in that set, so really he's at +377, still good for 6th.

+/- 2015 Season

Since returning, he's by far the league leader at +279 (+271 if the Chicago game is missing) in just 18 games, which is just blowing away the pace Curry was at to start the season (in a similar 34 MPG as well). Cavs have been a net +23.1 with him on the floor, which is ridiculous. Not even his crazy 2013 stretches were this good (more in the +18 realm).

+/- Post-break

SideshowBob · Post #1945 » by **SideshowBob** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 3:48 am

JulesWinnfield wrote:Should we be concerned about the wrist at this point? We are nearly a month removed from the initial injury, and he still finds it necessary to wear that wrap. His perimeter shot has been off over this time... I hope there's not more going on there than we know. Right as I type this he took a shot from Drummond on a drive to the rack, looked like he got kicked right on the knee cap and came up holding his hip shortly after as well

Yeah we should be. Stayed hesitant with attacking following the 1st quarter so maybe he was shaken a little bit. Hopefully he's able to work through it all considering the crazy stretch they're about to have in the next few weeks. They're going to need his constant scoring pressure.

Joao Saraiva · Post #1946 » by **Joao Saraiva** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 3:49 am

+27 in 39 minutes with 9 TOs... that's just insane.

His defense was superb and his playmaking was too. Every single assist was for a dunk or a 3 pointer. His playmaking was superb!

He's also now the forward with most assists ever in the NBA. That is a hell of an accomplishment.

Bird had 5695 assists in his career in 34443 minutes. James surpassed him in 2013, got there much faster with much less minutes on the court. Something like 4000 minutes less.

Pippen had 6135 assists in over 41000 minutes in the NBA! LeBron already surpassed him with 35000 minutes on the court.

And some people want to say LeBron is not the best forward ever when it comes to playmaking...

This guy is a monster and won't stop here. We'll see him getting record after record.

Ursusamericanus · Post #1947 » by **Ursusamericanus** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 3:51 am

Cavs win! Raptors lose! Wizards lose!

Derrick Rose with a torn meniscus... :noway:

JulesWinnfield · Post #1948 » by **JulesWinnfield** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 3:57 am

These were the standings through January 13th

Since that time....

1. Cleveland 17-2
2. Atlanta 14-4
3. Milwaukee 11-6
4. Toronto 12-8
5. Chicago 10-8
.....
12. Washington 7-12 (Cavs have gained a full 10 games on them during this span)

MisterHibachi · Post #1949 » by **MisterHibachi** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 4:00 am

How likely is the first seed, you guys think? Is it even possible at this point?

Ursusamericanus · Post #1950 » by **Ursusamericanus** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 4:02 am

MisterHibachi wrote:How likely is the first seed, you guys think? Is it even possible at this point?

9 games out with 24 games to play. I don't think it'll happen but I could easily see the Cavs finishing within 5 games of the Hawks. Possibly closer.

The Bulls are bound to fall out of the race now with Rose's injury... AGAIN. Cavs really just need to catch the Raptors who are just 1.5 games ahead. Good lord, what a midseason turnaround.

MisterHibachi · Post #1951 » by **MisterHibachi** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 4:04 am

Hyaena wrote:
MisterHibachi wrote:How likely is the first seed, you guys think? Is it even possible at this point?

9 games out with 24 games to play. I don't think it'll happen but I could easily see the Cavs finishing within 5 games of the Hawks. Possibly closer.

The Bulls are bound to fall out of the race now with Rose's injury... AGAIN. Cavs really just need to catch the Raptors who are just 1.5 games ahead. Good lord, what a midseason turnaround.

The Cavs did gain 10 games on the Wizards in a 19 game stretch.

But I doubt it happens with the Hawks. Theoretically possible tho even now.

SideshowBob · Post #1952 » by **SideshowBob** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 4:32 am

Does anyone have any guesses as to what's wrong with the jumpshot? I would blame the wrist injury, but it was pretty mediocre prior to that too, huge dropoff from 13 and 14.

I thought he might have tweaked the form earlier in the season, but it doesn't look too different from last year. What other explanation would there even be? It's not like he doesn't have his legs under him, lift hasn't been an issue at all since December. Is it just adjusting to the lighter upper body mass? Seems kind of baffling, he's been streaky before but this is just a collapse.

Joao Saraiva · Post #1953 » by **Joao Saraiva** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 4:39 am

SideshowBob wrote:Does anyone have any guesses as to what's wrong with the jumpshot? I would blame the wrist injury, but it was pretty mediocre prior to that too, huge dropoff from 13 and 14.

I thought he might have tweaked the form earlier in the season, but it doesn't look too different from last year. What other explanation would there even be? It's not like he doesn't have his legs under him, lift hasn't been an issue at all since December. Is it just adjusting to the lighter upper body mass? Seems kind of baffling, he's been streaky before but this is just a collapse.

LeBron played a lot in the post from 12 to 14. He went for his jumpshot more when he felt he was hot. And scoring near the rim improved his confidence too.

Right now I feel like he's just in a slump, before the stop due to injuries I felt he was actually not shooting bad (even if not at the same level from years before, but wasn't that far).

Another thing might be that he's going for too many heat checks. (seems ironic, since he left the Heat). Not that he didn't do it, but right now it seems like every time he hits one 3 point shot he goes for a contested one right after, or a very long one.

These might be possible reasons, I'm not saying this is it, it's just food for thought.

EDIT: how about the blowout games? He starts foccused and scoring well in the 1st half and as soon as the game is out of reach for the other team he has shot really bad. A recent example I recall is the game against the Wizards, when he missed his last 3 shots on very difficult contested jumpers and even got 1 or 2 airballs there. I think he's had some games like that.

BBgun · Post #1954 » by **BBgun** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 4:43 am

LeBron, you know you're my favourite player; I got nothing but love for you and you've looked MUCH better in 2015 compared to the first two months of the season...but this turnover BS has to stop man...you're better than this.

That's what I would want to say to him but be too scared to if we were face to face.

Ursusamericanus · Post #1955 » by **Ursusamericanus** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 4:53 am

I feel like he needs to find a nice middle ground with his shot selection. During his time in Miami it seemed like he was too selective at times, if that's possible. But I've seen him take his fair share of dumb shots this season. I don't care if they're up by 25 and he does it, but I'm hoping he'll tighten up in close games and in the playoffs.

PCProductions · Post #1956 » by **PCProductions** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:23 am

I'm starting to think these turnovers are here to stay. I except at least 3-4 every night and it has mostly to do with him doing nearly all of the ballhandling. He's setting guys up, though, and some of those behind the back dishes like the one to Jones were spectacular. I still want him running the offense even in the face of those hideous turnover volumes.

RSCD3_ · Post #1957 » by **RSCD3_** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:29 am

I wonder how many turnovers LeBron has to get before people ask him about them.

10...11...12? Lol

makaveli_99 · Post #1958 » by **makaveli_99** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:32 am

RSCD3_ wrote:I wonder how many turnovers LeBron has to get before people ask him about them.

10...11...12? Lol

hey..they're winning so no one will. if they were losing it would be a diff story. Im sure he is aware of them anyway. He may have overtaken cousins as #1 in the NBA now.

JLei · Post #1959 » by **JLei** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:55 am

Lol you people need to calm down. They have been a godly offense since he's been back and especially with him on floor.

He's doing basically all the ball handling and facilitating for the team which allows them to have players who can't create/ are inefficient at creating (Shumpert, Smith, Dellavadova, Mozgov, Thompson) to literally just spot up, set screens and roll down the middle of the lane. Which they do so exceptionally. They are number 1 by far in eFG, 5th in FT rate and 1st OREB% while being 16th in turnover rate with him on the floor.

His teammates have been much more efficient at shooting than he has which is I think the first time that's happened. He's at 53% eFG while the team as a whole is at 57%.

He's going to absorb most of the turnovers which is fine to be honest, the fact that he has teammates worth passing too makes it very different from 11 Miami so of course he's going to have more turnovers than that situation. Hurts his PER given that it hates turnovers which sucks but impact wise because of the composition of his team that unless he makes a bad pass he's going to create a ridiculously high EV opportunity and if they miss, Tristan, Mozgov and Love will usually get them another chance.

Ursusamericanus · Post #1960 » by **Ursusamericanus** » Wed Feb 25, 2015 6:03 am

So the matchup we've all been waiting for is finally on the horizon. Cavs vs. Warriors on Thursday.