Official Trade Thread - Part XXX

[payitforward]

He is a ball stopper who doesn't play an ounce of defense. He does one thing well, shooting.. At the sacrifice of all other facets of basketball. There is a reason the differential always tanked when he stepped foot on the court.

Sorry, BS. I'm no Gary Neal fan, but you're being unfair to say the least. He's never been a good player, but he was above his career average for us, and he did not overshoot the ball either (i.e. "ball stopper"). He got some assists, he rebounded reasonably well, etc.

It's not true either that he "doesn't play an ounce of defense". He's not a *good* defender, no way. But I watched him, and he made an effort.

Not going to miss him, but there's no reason to beat on the kid.

He got "his" in that he scored efficiently... but I think a lot of his high efficiency this season was really good mid range shooting this season, In fact I believe he had his best season from 16 ft-3 pt. When he was on... he was really on... and when he was off... it was dreadful >.>

Part of his problem is he would pound the rock to no avail and then pass it out when nothing was developing leading to countless wasted possessions. He reminds me of the Enes Kanter of old, personally productive for his "role" but at the cost of his team's ability to win. His +/- on-off was really bad this season... I mean it was never this bad before... :/

Also, he can give all the effort in the world... but that doesn't absolve him of his inability to play defense. Trying to play defense doesn't mean you play defense. I looked it up a while ago, his player tracking defensive stats per NBA.com were abominably bad. His good shooting was severely hampered by how much of a travesty he is as a defender. It'd be fine playing him had we good defenders to pair with him... but when you play him with sessions, and our bench mob its hard to mask his defensive faults. So maybe you can blame roster construction wasting a good offensive shooting season for him.

If the argument is that he fills a "role" well (instant offense for example), make sure other roles are adequately filled to makeup for his inabilities, otherwise he ends up being the net negative that he is.

I don't make the "fills a role" argument -- that's not basketball. When a guy is on the court, you get everything he does -- and you *don't* get everything he *doesn't* do.

But +/- on-off means nothing, not even compared to other seasons. Who was he playing with? Who was he playing with those other seasons?

I was reacting to your tone and your words, not mounting a defense of Gary Neal, who is a below-par NBA guard.

[nuposse04]

I'm not the biggest +/- fan myself actually, but I do think it holds some value. Off the top of my head I believe he was on some equally mediocre teams as us like the wolves and I wanna say cha, and he was less a net negative those two seasons then he was this season. I don't know if his defense was better In years past, I just know he was a human waste land this season on defense.

I'm sure he is a decent guy, and I do have an abrasive tone to him, but I can't stand watching him on this team. I make no apologies detesting him as a professional basketball player.

[payitforward]

No worries -- it's really kind of a waste of time to debate Gary Neal. Especially if I have to be the one defending him!

[Dark Faze]

I wonder if Morris can stomach being a backup

[The Consiglieri]

Bennett = DONE

Worse than Kwame, who at least was able to have a decent career as a paint defender after flaming out here.

<tries to walk by this post with great subtlety, avoiding all notice>

[nate33]

Finally, Vlade Divac suspended DeMarcus Cousins.

Now, can the Kings’ general manager do the right thing and get him out of here?

Trade him, cut him, whatever. It would be a steal if the Kings could get 50 cents on the dollar, a bargain at 35 cents and a good deal at a quarter. Maybe even a nickel.

Sometimes in life, you add by subtraction, like when you have a corn on your toe. Removal can be absolute relief.

The time has come for the Kings to reach that conclusion about Cousins. They have never won with him, and there is no reason to believe they ever will, or that they will be able to put together a team in the holistic flow of the word until they make the difficult decision to move him, regardless of his undisputed and overvalued talent.

http://www.sacbee.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/andy-furillo/article65552227.html

Hmmm.

Gortat + Beal for Cousins? We save money, get younger, and form a talent base that could legitimately attract Durant despite this awful season. We'd have about $9M to spend on a Beal replacement at SG.

[thricethefun]

Finally, Vlade Divac suspended DeMarcus Cousins.

Now, can the Kings’ general manager do the right thing and get him out of here?

Trade him, cut him, whatever. It would be a steal if the Kings could get 50 cents on the dollar, a bargain at 35 cents and a good deal at a quarter. Maybe even a nickel.

Sometimes in life, you add by subtraction, like when you have a corn on your toe. Removal can be absolute relief.

The time has come for the Kings to reach that conclusion about Cousins. They have never won with him, and there is no reason to believe they ever will, or that they will be able to put together a team in the holistic flow of the word until they make the difficult decision to move him, regardless of his undisputed and overvalued talent.

http://www.sacbee.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/andy-furillo/article65552227.html

Hmmm.

Gortat + Beal for Cousins? We save money, get younger, and form a talent base that could legitimately attract Durant despite this awful season. We'd have about $9M to spend on a Beal replacement at SG.

Kings wouldn't do that. They could get much more for Cousins

[Illuminaire]

Probably, they could get more picks from someone. I'm not sure they could get a better replacement center. Agree that on the whole, it's an underpay.

If I was the Wiz front office I would float that to Vivek anyways. He doesn't make rational basketball decisions, so there's a chance he'd latch on to the idea and say yes.

[rl25g]

From Was : Beal (s&t), Gortat, Porter, Rights to Sato and 2018 1st
To Was: Cousins, Danny Green

From Sac: Cousins, Koufus, McLemore
To Sac: Beal, Porter, Gortat, Sato and 2018 1st

From Spurs: Danny Green
To Spurs: Koufus and McLemore

[nate33]

From Was : Beal (s&t), Gortat, Porter, Rights to Sato and 2018 1st
To Was: Cousins, Danny Green

From Sac: Cousins, Koufus, McLemore
To Sac: Beal, Porter, Gortat, Sato and 2018 1st

From Spurs: Danny Green
To Spurs: Koufus and McLemore

I don't understand why San Antonio is involved in this.

[TGW]

No interest in Cousins whatsoever. Let him continue to lose on another team.

[gambitx777]

I want to say that I still think that getting Morris was a solid Idea. But the trade itself was terrible. We owe the suns this pick till 2022........... I mean what the hell. EG is a terrible negotiator. You have to be willing to take nothing over a bad deal. The deal should have been a 2017 first and the rights to Tomas, Hump, Blair and Gooden for Morris and Leuer. This would have solved several issues. Gave us the depth we need at the 4, and it would not be an over pay. Thomas had not signed his extension yet and he would be appealing to them for several reasons. They still get a first, this time unprotected, (For use this is good). Because on our end we still have a good young player out of this draft, plus Morris and Leuer going into the off season. We will probably be better next year and the pick would be a one time pay out late first rounder. But now all we have is Morris. If this deal was negotiated better we would not be in this mess. Don't hate on Morris he was a decent pick up, it's not his fault that the deal was a bad deal made by an idiot GM.

[Mickstix]

Proposed Trade: Wittman and Grundfeld (to anyone who'll take em') for a rack of balls?

[queridiculo]

Don't hate on Morris he was a decent pick up, it's not his fault that the deal was a bad deal made by an idiot GM.

Decent by what measure exactly?

The bet on this deal seems to be that 2014/15, a season that looks pretty on the surface but whose numbers don't stand up to scrutiny, wasn't a statistical outlier.

It's conceivable that he can get back to that level with higher usage I suppose, but the idea that he'll achieve that level of production efficiently is highly questionable.

Morris is basically signed to a MLE deal so there's that, but a decent deal to me would be if he checked some of boxes of what we were looking for at the position and he very clearly doesn't.

He doesn't stretch the floor, he doesn't rebound effectively and he doesn't score efficiently.

Quite frankly I fail to see how he's an upgrade over Humphries even but somehow we lost the player that's on a better deal, more productive and gave up a first round pick (possibly lottery!!!) for the privilege.

It's almost funny at this point. The biggest fear around these parts was Ernie giving up our first rounder at the deadline and what does he do?

[gambitx777]

Hump is in no way better than Morris, Especially when hump can't seem to stay on the floor much anymore. Yes I understand people are up set over the trade, but it's not the kids fault. He is a decent NBA player. Is he perfect no, is he why we are loosing game absolutely not. He is not Great he is not good, he is not terrible he is not bad. He is decent. He is in a bit of a slump at the moment, but he does have range and he does stretch the floor, He he a sniper, not but he can knock down shots. Give the kid a break. Hes improving over when he got here. Over the last 6 games he is shooting 46% from the field, 40% from 3 80% at the line 6 boards and he is playing solid defense. His deal is good, he is a decent player, people are acting like we traded for anthony benneett. Yes it was a bad trade but it was not a bad trade because of the player we got, it was a bad trade because of our GM being a dumb ass.

[fishercob]

Finally, Vlade Divac suspended DeMarcus Cousins.

Now, can the Kings’ general manager do the right thing and get him out of here?

Trade him, cut him, whatever. It would be a steal if the Kings could get 50 cents on the dollar, a bargain at 35 cents and a good deal at a quarter. Maybe even a nickel.

Sometimes in life, you add by subtraction, like when you have a corn on your toe. Removal can be absolute relief.

The time has come for the Kings to reach that conclusion about Cousins. They have never won with him, and there is no reason to believe they ever will, or that they will be able to put together a team in the holistic flow of the word until they make the difficult decision to move him, regardless of his undisputed and overvalued talent.

http://www.sacbee.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/andy-furillo/article65552227.html

Hmmm.

Gortat + Beal for Cousins? We save money, get younger, and form a talent base that could legitimately attract Durant despite this awful season. We'd have about $9M to spend on a Beal replacement at SG.

Kings wouldn't do that. They could get much more for Cousins

Could they? How many teams are lining up to make COusins a centerpiece -- given how much of an assshole he seems to be? There are certainly teams who *could* put together offers, but I'm not convinced that they would.

Also keep in mind that Sacramento is about to move into a new arena. They are not going to go for a package of draft picks for COusins only to suck for 3 more years (that's inevitable anyway, but it's beside the point).

The issue is that if Beal signs an offer sheet elsewhere, the deal is dead. We'd then have to convince Sacto to wait until December 15 to make the same deal. But if we tell Beal's reps we're matching any offer and then trading him to a destination of *our* choosing in December, they may be interested in working together.

[Ruzious]

http://www.sacbee.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/andy-furillo/article65552227.html

Hmmm.

Gortat + Beal for Cousins? We save money, get younger, and form a talent base that could legitimately attract Durant despite this awful season. We'd have about $9M to spend on a Beal replacement at SG.

Kings wouldn't do that. They could get much more for Cousins

Could they? How many teams are lining up to make COusins a centerpiece -- given how much of an assshole he seems to be? There are certainly teams who *could* put together offers, but I'm not convinced that they would.

Also keep in mind that Sacramento is about to move into a new arena. They are not going to go for a package of draft picks for COusins only to suck for 3 more years (that's inevitable anyway, but it's beside the point).

The issue is that if Beal signs an offer sheet elsewhere, the deal is dead. We'd then have to convince Sacto to wait until December 15 to make the same deal. But if we tell Beal's reps we're matching any offer and then trading him to a destination of *our* choosing in December, they may be interested in working together.

Yeah, I could see Beal and Gortat being quick crowd favorites in Sacramento - after years of negativity. I think it's possible. And with all the negativity Cousins has accumulated (some fair but more unfair, imo), a lot of teams won't consider trading much for him unless they have someone to keep him under control - maybe like John Wall.

[payitforward]

I don't think Gortat & Beal for Cousins is a bargain trade for the Wizards. Not, at least, if Beal has significant trade value -- which I'd bet he does.

I'm not even sure Cousins is an upgrade over Gortat. No, let me say that differently: I don't think he is an upgrade. Not on the court, and certainly not off the court, given the risks he brings.

[fishercob]

I don't think Gortat & Beal for Cousins is a bargain trade for the Wizards. Not, at least, if Beal has significant trade value -- which I'd bet he does.

I'm not even sure Cousins is an upgrade over Gortat. No, let me say that differently: I don't think he is an upgrade. Not on the court, and certainly not off the court, given the risks he brings.

I'm not sure that COusins is an upgrade over Gortat, but I'm not sure he's not -- dig? Their respective ages (and that Cousins is signed long term) would seem to make it a worthwhile risk. Before long, Gortat is going to start to decline, right?

[Ruzious]

I don't think Gortat & Beal for Cousins is a bargain trade for the Wizards. Not, at least, if Beal has significant trade value -- which I'd bet he does.

I'm not even sure Cousins is an upgrade over Gortat. No, let me say that differently: I don't think he is an upgrade. Not on the court, and certainly not off the court, given the risks he brings.

I'm not sure that COusins is an upgrade over Gortat, but I'm not sure he's not -- dig? Their respective ages (and that Cousins is signed long term) would seem to make it a worthwhile risk. Before long, Gortat is going to start to decline, right?

Gortat's age and how much Beal will likely be overpaid are important factors as part of that trade.