The Official Lin Net Thread

[Prokorov]

yormarket has a job to do i say do it

if lin fans fill the arena and make the building loud go for it

i will probably go to 2 or 3 early games then depending on if they are bearable to watch 5 late in the season

last season i have to say no matter how bad they were that team played hard till the last game of the season and tony brown deserves a lot of credit for that

you can make the argument that lins best chance to help us win isnt with his oncourt play, but his popularity helping sellout the building giving us a real homecourt advantage.

it didnt help last year when opposing fans were louder then net fans. or having NET fans cheer more for rubio then their own team

He's going to help the Nets out in both areas I hope.

I really hope you guys get good crowds at Barclays this year. I heard Howard Beck talking about the gloomy empty feeling at Barclays last year and it sounded like a real bummer.

It's depressing. last year at the wolves game it was like 1/2 full and the only fans there were going crazy over rubio. even when there are big net crowds they are silent, and usually leave early. it was almost as bad as the NJ crowds pre-vince.

[KM6]

If Lin is voted into the all star game then he is an all-star, if not then no. What's there to argue about?

If Lin has a great statistical year while helping the nets win 30-40 games, then maybe we can then compare him to Harden, there might be some basis for comparison, but until then it's just comparing apples to oranges. One is a franchise player who has all the opportunities in the world handed to him to be successful, who can do whatever he wants, right or wrong, and not get blamed by the FO. Another is a career journeyman who never gets the opportunity to show case what he can do, and being underrated his entire career, playing out of position forever, inconsistent minutes and usage.

One full season, then let's talk. Right now anyone can make any arguments, and no one will convince the other party. Harden is harden, Lin is Lin, I am really tired of this stupid comparison. Please let's talk about how Lin can help the team win games or rebuild in a Lin thread, and how the team can improve and move forward in a general thread.

[Prokorov]

There may be something to cheer about. The Nets have now filled their PG and center positions. Isn't the common wisdom that the 1 and the 5 are the hardest positions to fill? Well, the Nets have done it. So probably 70% of the battle is already won. That should be something to be optimistic about.

I guess from an outsiders perspective this seems logical... the problem is brook has been here 8 seasons, and we know the ceiling with him. When he had dwill(the all-star 20/10 version) and Joe early on, we got to 49 wins. once dwill declined to being an average player we topped out at 38 wins. Lopez is a really good player. borderline all-star. but he only gets you so far. we need alot more talent around him to win. Lopez is better off as your 3rd best player or "2B" option if you plan to be a good solid playoff team. or you need an all-star stud PG, like what dwill was the second half of 2013.

the other issue is Lopez and Lin are both 28. at the end of their contract they will both be 31. i can see us not extending either and going with youth as we will have our picks back by then. so who knows if this is a long term option or a 3 year hold over.

Either way, Lin/Brook is a nice 1-5 combo... if you have talent 2 through 4. we have bench players 2 through 4. and no shooting.

but most of all, the nets lack 2 way players:

bogs doesnt defend
RHJ has no offense
booker has no offense
lopez himself is a mediocure defender who cant switch on to smalls and struggles with stamina
Kilpatrick doesnt defend

basically, Lin and CMC are our only 2 way players, and neither is great on either end. this killed us last year as itleaves you with a weak link(s) no matter if you are on offense or defense

Your gloom is unjustified as yet, because the team isn't a finished work this summer. The FA period has just started.

As I said, we already have good people at the 1 and 5, so we've already won like 70% of the battle.

We now have the capspace to max out somebody like Moe Harkless. And how many teams have enough talent at center and PG to make us pay for Brook's defensive problems and Lin's occasional lapses at D? Four, maybe five? Against the rest of the league, I can definitely see a Brook-Lin-Harkless combo doing serious damage.

Remember, we're just gunning for the playoffs next year; we're not dreaming (yet) of dominating the rest of the NBA. Relative to the more modest goal, I think we're justified in being somewhat optimistic.

thats some funky math. not sure how 2/5 of the starting lineup = 70%. last i checked that would make 40%. we had jack/brook last year and were terrible during that stretch. Lin upgrades Jack but we also lost thad. Mo Harkless doesnt really move the needle.

how many teams can make us pay? pretty much all of them. nearly every offense features the pick and roll, and lopez cant defed it.

i envy your optomism, but this projects as a 15-25 win team

[Prokorov]

i read that Brook is an effective PnR partner. Nash-Amare-Lite anybody?

Brook isnt great in the pick and roll, he wont get to the front of the rim.... he has what Ian eagle has labelled the "pick and push". its kind of somewhere between the pick and roll and the pick and pop.... he will set the pick and then get in the lane about 8-10 feet from the rim and throw this one handed floater/push shot. he has a real solid touch with it....

but i can probably count his career pick and roll dunks on one hand. he doesnt really leap well. and he isnt very athletic or quick. his screens need work as well. but he does slip well, is a huge target, and is pretty automatic on that 8-10 foot push shot.

only issue is the gaurd usually has trouble turning the corner, since they arent forced to switch or go over the screen. dwill and brook had great chemistry with it.... but dwill was more pull up jumper off the pick and roll and not go to the rim.

[Prokorov]

I think Lin will post big numbers because they're gonna have to run EVERYTHING through him and lopez.

I honestly don't think 20 and 8 is out of the questio. Realistically though 16 and 7 is probably pretty close to accurate.

I can't see any where they crack 30 wins though.

I'd be pretty surprised if the Nets don't end up with the worst record in the league. This team might not win 30 games with Harden and Lin being swapped

i think 17/8 is a safe bet... as you said, line will get a ton of volume and basically be the only offense creator kind of like jack was before he got hurt. if jack can post 14/7 lin should be able to get 17/8 or better

[Prokorov]

Even the craziest fan would never believe Leicester city would have won the Premier League title last year. But turnout Leicester City won it with good margin. Talent is important, but teamwork, chemistry and coaching also count.

Nets maybe looks worse on the talent side, but I believe most players in NBA can play or they won't be in the league. Some guys look like scrubs only because they are lacking chance, in the wrong system or even poorly coached, Lin, Whiteside, TJ are some of the examples. That said, Net's talent side can be better than what we think it is.

Guys might not know that Lin's Knicks without Carmelo was the best defensive team in the league. And only Tyson Chandler and Iman Shumpert are the proven talents among the group. Others are like Novak, Landry Fields, Bill Walker, Jare Jeffery, and Tony Douglas like players. Yet, these group of players played the best basketball, and was the best defensive team in that stretch.

I am not saying the team is going to win many games in the coming year, but there's chance the team being competitive when everyone is buying in and playing right basketball.

this isnt soccer, its basketball. and talent is the first, second, and third most important thing.

its not a coincidence that Lebron/curry made the last 2 finals. or that lebron has made it to 6 finals in a row. or that durant/westbrook were in the conference finals.

there is a reason we won 21 games last year and it wasnt chemistry. it was lack of talent.

See the success LBJ gets and the struggles Melo has been, you will know the difference.
Teamwork, chemistry and coaching is as important as talent, every great player mentioned that, every great coach and great team proved that. Or you think you know more than those great players and coaches, or you think you know more about basketball than Gregg Popovich.

Lebron is much better then carmello. lebron is a multi time MVP and a top 2 player. any team lebron goes to is an instant contender.

Gregg popovich has had tim duncan for 19 years. pop is a great coach but lets see how he does without one of the 10 best players of all time.

teamwork and chemistry go a long way, im not denying that. but they dont go as far as they do in soccer, where you have 11 guys on the team. in the Nba you have 5, one guy influences the game much more. talent goes much further.

teamwork wont turn a 20 win team into a good team. you need talent.

[Prokorov]

If Lin is voted into the all star game then he is an all-star, if not then no. What's there to argue about?

If Lin has a great statistical year while helping the nets win 30-40 games, then maybe we can then compare him to Harden, there might be some basis for comparison, but until then it's just comparing apples to oranges. One is a franchise player who has all the opportunities in the world handed to him to be successful, who can do whatever he wants, right or wrong, and not get blamed by the FO. Another is a career journeyman who never gets the opportunity to show case what he can do, and being underrated his entire career, playing out of position forever, inconsistent minutes and usage.

One full season, then let's talk. Right now anyone can make any arguments, and no one will convince the other party. Harden is harden, Lin is Lin, I am really tired of this stupid comparison. Please let's talk about how Lin can help the team win games or rebuild in a Lin thread, and how the team can improve and move forward in a general thread.

the difference between harden and lin is not "opportuntnity" or "getting to do whatever he wants"

the difference is one is one of the most efficienct and prolific scorers in NBA history and the other is an average NBA player.

I'm not saying you're wrong. the facts are proving it.

[KM6]

If Lin is voted into the all star game then he is an all-star, if not then no. What's there to argue about?

If Lin has a great statistical year while helping the nets win 30-40 games, then maybe we can then compare him to Harden, there might be some basis for comparison, but until then it's just comparing apples to oranges. One is a franchise player who has all the opportunities in the world handed to him to be successful, who can do whatever he wants, right or wrong, and not get blamed by the FO. Another is a career journeyman who never gets the opportunity to show case what he can do, and being underrated his entire career, playing out of position forever, inconsistent minutes and usage.

One full season, then let's talk. Right now anyone can make any arguments, and no one will convince the other party. Harden is harden, Lin is Lin, I am really tired of this stupid comparison. Please let's talk about how Lin can help the team win games or rebuild in a Lin thread, and how the team can improve and move forward in a general thread.

the difference between harden and lin is not "opportuntnity" or "getting to do whatever he wants"

the difference is one is one of the most efficienct and prolific scorers in NBA history and the other is an average NBA player.

I'm not saying you're wrong. the facts are proving it.

Average or not, we will see after one full season. You might be right about Lin or you might be wrong, time will tell.

[Manitoba]

I guess from an outsiders perspective this seems logical... the problem is brook has been here 8 seasons, and we know the ceiling with him. When he had dwill(the all-star 20/10 version) and Joe early on, we got to 49 wins. once dwill declined to being an average player we topped out at 38 wins. Lopez is a really good player. borderline all-star. but he only gets you so far. we need alot more talent around him to win. Lopez is better off as your 3rd best player or "2B" option if you plan to be a good solid playoff team. or you need an all-star stud PG, like what dwill was the second half of 2013.

the other issue is Lopez and Lin are both 28. at the end of their contract they will both be 31. i can see us not extending either and going with youth as we will have our picks back by then. so who knows if this is a long term option or a 3 year hold over.

Either way, Lin/Brook is a nice 1-5 combo... if you have talent 2 through 4. we have bench players 2 through 4. and no shooting.

but most of all, the nets lack 2 way players:

bogs doesnt defend
RHJ has no offense
booker has no offense
lopez himself is a mediocure defender who cant switch on to smalls and struggles with stamina
Kilpatrick doesnt defend

basically, Lin and CMC are our only 2 way players, and neither is great on either end. this killed us last year as itleaves you with a weak link(s) no matter if you are on offense or defense

Your gloom is unjustified as yet, because the team isn't a finished work this summer. The FA period has just started.

As I said, we already have good people at the 1 and 5, so we've already won like 70% of the battle.

We now have the capspace to max out somebody like Moe Harkless. And how many teams have enough talent at center and PG to make us pay for Brook's defensive problems and Lin's occasional lapses at D? Four, maybe five? Against the rest of the league, I can definitely see a Brook-Lin-Harkless combo doing serious damage.

Remember, we're just gunning for the playoffs next year; we're not dreaming (yet) of dominating the rest of the NBA. Relative to the more modest goal, I think we're justified in being somewhat optimistic.

thats some funky math. not sure how 2/5 of the starting lineup = 70%. last i checked that would make 40%.

You were checking in the wrong place, as usual. We have good people at the 1 and 5, the hardest positions to fill. Since we have indeed filled them, that's far more than half the job done right there.

we had jack/brook last year and were terrible during that stretch. Lin upgrades Jack but we also lost thad. Mo Harkless doesnt really move the needle.

Playmaking matters; Lin is far better than Jack at it. Also, the Brook/Jack combo didn't work well because Thad wasn't stretching the floor. We'll probably fix that, perhaps by getting Harkless, who shot 39% on 3s in his second year.

how many teams can make us pay? pretty much all of them. nearly every offense features the pick and roll, and lopez cant defed it.

Lin's defense was why I mentioned him. He'll protect Brook from a lot of penetration, and that will be a huge help.

i envy your optomism, but this projects as a 15-25 win team

Let's see what this team looks like at season start, shall we? I can think of lots ways to improve, so pretty good improvement seems likely to me. There are reasons for optimism.

[hood30]

They really don't need to market Lin, all they need is for Lin to score 30+ in couple of impressive wins and the fans will tune in.

I somewhat agree with that...It is almost in the Nets's best interest to try to put Lin in the best position to do Linsanity over again.

If Lin can somemwhat duplicate what he did 4 years ago with the Knicks, that would really bring in much more fans and greater profit.

So many Asians in Brooklyn could be a huge boon for the Nets if Lin were to start the season very well.

That is also why it makes sense financially to bring in players that could help Lin play like he played with the Knicks.

[gafun]

Lin's advanced stats were good as starter and were much better as true point guard. It was small sample because he did not play true pg much. The simple stats such as points, turnovers, assists would not truly show Lin's contributions and values because he usually focus more on passing than shootings. I would stop compare Lin to other star PGs until he play starting PG for a full season. It is going to be a tough season for Nets because we didn't get the players we thought we could have. It wouldn't be an exciting season for most of Lin fans if Lin wouldn't be able help Nets improve.

[gafun]

They really don't need to market Lin, all they need is for Lin to score 30+ in couple of impressive wins and the fans will tune in.

I somewhat agree with that...It is almost in the Nets's best interest to try to put Lin in the best position to do Linsanity over again.

If Lin can somemwhat duplicate what he did 4 years ago with the Knicks, that would really bring in much more fans and greater profit.

So many Asians in Brooklyn could be a huge boon for the Nets if Lin were to start the season very well.

That is also why it makes sense financially to bring in players that could help Lin play like he played with the Knicks.

It is bad idea to do marketing on Lin if he has not helped Nets much yet. I think Lin and Atkinson have passed the idea about Linsanity 2.0. Nets wants to bring good players to fit the new system so Lin or any ball handlers can make more effective plays for others and help the team improve or win.

[Paradise]

i read that Brook is an effective PnR partner. Nash-Amare-Lite anybody?

It's possible. Brook was 3rd in PnR as the Roll Man behind Towns and Davis but we don't have the level of shooting talent to compliment them right now.

[Mij]

I guess from an outsiders perspective this seems logical... the problem is brook has been here 8 seasons, and we know the ceiling with him. When he had dwill(the all-star 20/10 version) and Joe early on, we got to 49 wins. once dwill declined to being an average player we topped out at 38 wins. Lopez is a really good player. borderline all-star. but he only gets you so far. we need alot more talent around him to win. Lopez is better off as your 3rd best player or "2B" option if you plan to be a good solid playoff team. or you need an all-star stud PG, like what dwill was the second half of 2013.

the other issue is Lopez and Lin are both 28. at the end of their contract they will both be 31. i can see us not extending either and going with youth as we will have our picks back by then. so who knows if this is a long term option or a 3 year hold over.

Either way, Lin/Brook is a nice 1-5 combo... if you have talent 2 through 4. we have bench players 2 through 4. and no shooting.

but most of all, the nets lack 2 way players:

bogs doesnt defend
RHJ has no offense
booker has no offense
lopez himself is a mediocure defender who cant switch on to smalls and struggles with stamina
Kilpatrick doesnt defend

basically, Lin and CMC are our only 2 way players, and neither is great on either end. this killed us last year as itleaves you with a weak link(s) no matter if you are on offense or defense

Your gloom is unjustified as yet, because the team isn't a finished work this summer. The FA period has just started.

As I said, we already have good people at the 1 and 5, so we've already won like 70% of the battle.

We now have the capspace to max out somebody like Moe Harkless. And how many teams have enough talent at center and PG to make us pay for Brook's defensive problems and Lin's occasional lapses at D? Four, maybe five? Against the rest of the league, I can definitely see a Brook-Lin-Harkless combo doing serious damage.

Remember, we're just gunning for the playoffs next year; we're not dreaming (yet) of dominating the rest of the NBA. Relative to the more modest goal, I think we're justified in being somewhat optimistic.

thats some funky math. not sure how 2/5 of the starting lineup = 70%. last i checked that would make 40%. we had jack/brook last year and were terrible during that stretch. Lin upgrades Jack but we also lost thad. Mo Harkless doesnt really move the needle.

how many teams can make us pay? pretty much all of them. nearly every offense features the pick and roll, and lopez cant defed it.

i envy your optomism, but this projects as a 15-25 win team

25 wins? In that case, I hope they'll lose all the road games. I can live with 25 home wins or at least all the ones I will be attending on the weekends. Sucks even to be a 1/2 season holder. I am praying for Linsanity otherwise I don't know what to do with my tickets.

[gafun]

i read that Brook is an effective PnR partner. Nash-Amare-Lite anybody?

It's possible. Brook was 3rd in PnR as the Roll Man behind Towns and Davis but we don't have the level of shooting talent to compliment them right now.

I can see Booker do some Amare too.

[DartboardT]

Lin's advanced stats were good as starter and were much better as true point guard. It was small sample because he did not play true pg much. The simple stats such as points, turnovers, assists would not truly show Lin's contributions and values because he usually focus more on passing than shootings. I would stop compare Lin to other star PGs until he play starting PG for a full season. It is going to be a tough season for Nets because we did get the players we thought we could have. It wouldn't be an exciting season for most of Lin fans if Lin wouldn't be able help Nets improve.

Yup, I don't think judging Lin amongst his cohort of 29 fellow starting PGs (once preseason/reg season is underway) is so hard.

Wins over 21 for the upcoming season. Good ol' in-game footage (can the season start yet?). There'll be plenty of ways to assess him once we FINALLY get to tipoff.

[hood30]

i read that Brook is an effective PnR partner. Nash-Amare-Lite anybody?

Brook isnt great in the pick and roll, he wont get to the front of the rim.... he has what Ian eagle has labelled the "pick and push". its kind of somewhere between the pick and roll and the pick and pop.... he will set the pick and then get in the lane about 8-10 feet from the rim and throw this one handed floater/push shot. he has a real solid touch with it....

but i can probably count his career pick and roll dunks on one hand. he doesn't really leap well. and he isnt very athletic or quick. his screens need work as well. but he does slip well, is a huge target, and is pretty automatic on that 8-10 foot push shot.

only issue is the gaurd usually has trouble turning the corner, since they aren't forced to switch or go over the screen. dwill and brook had great chemistry with it.... but dwill was more pull up jumper off the pick and roll and not go to the rim.

I've been recently watching a lot of Brooks youtube highlights and my conclusion is he's going to really be great help to Lin as for bagging in assist.

While it is true Brook doesn't roll deeper into the hole, he is very effective with this push shot..so much so that I can actually see Lin get plenty of assist by simply dumping it to him...I can now envision Lin averaging 8 assist because I think Brook can be more effective than Chandler.

Brook may not be as athletic as chandler, but he has better offensive awareness and can flat out score once he receives the ball close to the basket

[fafan]

Lin starts. he was brought into and no competition anyhow.

Lin posts 20/6

Nets win 18-26 games without TJ/Crabbe

Nets win 20-26 games with TJ/Crabbe

Since you are so negative - would you mind a friendly bet - anywhere between USD 100 - 1000.
My call that Nets will win more than 26 games, regardless whomever they can get.

Glad to be witness, How about donate to Nets forum!

Marked again since the original post has been locked.

[cn0gd]

Since you are so negative - would you mind a friendly bet - anywhere between USD 100 - 1000.
My call that Nets will win more than 26 games, regardless whomever they can get.

Glad to be witness, How about donate to Nets forum!

Marked again since the original post has been locked.

ha this is interesting. worth marking

[Mosdefinition]

Your gloom is unjustified as yet, because the team isn't a finished work this summer. The FA period has just started.

As I said, we already have good people at the 1 and 5, so we've already won like 70% of the battle.

We now have the capspace to max out somebody like Moe Harkless. And how many teams have enough talent at center and PG to make us pay for Brook's defensive problems and Lin's occasional lapses at D? Four, maybe five? Against the rest of the league, I can definitely see a Brook-Lin-Harkless combo doing serious damage.

Remember, we're just gunning for the playoffs next year; we're not dreaming (yet) of dominating the rest of the NBA. Relative to the more modest goal, I think we're justified in being somewhat optimistic.

thats some funky math. not sure how 2/5 of the starting lineup = 70%. last i checked that would make 40%.

You were checking in the wrong place, as usual. We have good people at the 1 and 5, the hardest positions to fill. Since we have indeed filled them, that's far more than half the job done right there.

we had jack/brook last year and were terrible during that stretch. Lin upgrades Jack but we also lost thad. Mo Harkless doesnt really move the needle.

Playmaking matters; Lin is far better than Jack at it. Also, the Brook/Jack combo didn't work well because Thad wasn't stretching the floor. We'll probably fix that, perhaps by getting Harkless, who shot 39% on 3s in his second year.

how many teams can make us pay? pretty much all of them. nearly every offense features the pick and roll, and lopez cant defed it.

Lin's defense was why I mentioned him. He'll protect Brook from a lot of penetration, and that will be a huge help.

i envy your optomism, but this projects as a 15-25 win team

Let's see what this team looks like at season start, shall we? I can think of lots ways to improve, so pretty good improvement seems likely to me. There are reasons for optimism.

How can you say Lin is far better than jack at playmaking when all of the advanced analysis that people have been using say they are essential the exact same player