Trade Thread 2017: Not Once, Not twice, But Thrice!

TheOGJabroni · Post #1721 » by **TheOGJabroni** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 2:59 pm

I just mentioned in another thread, we need to make the move for Noel. Whatever cap space he takes up is fine. Free agency is going to be a joke now. We're going to find ourselves with cap space but only role players available. Hayward is the only hang up on this but even then, we have Brown who I hope will be better than Hayward one day.

BakersDozen · Post #1722 » by **BakersDozen** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 3:11 pm

Sign me up on the Noel trade train.

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illmatic24 · Post #1723 » by **illmatic24** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 3:23 pm

I'm all aboard the Noel train but the issue is what will it cost to get him? I don't think you can move a Brooklyn pick for him. Something involving Bradley, I guess? Then you likely draft his replacement with the Brooklyn pick.

ddb · Post #1724 » by **ddb** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 3:31 pm

illmatic24 wrote:I'm all aboard the Noel train but the issue is what will it cost to get him? I don't think you can move a Brooklyn pick for him. Something involving Bradley, I guess? Then you likely draft his replacement with the Brooklyn pick.

I'm not. Philly's price tag will be too high.

After thinking about it carefully, I feel like our best bet for now AND moving forward is to see if Orlando will do the following deal:

Amir, Rozier, Mickey, 2017 Minny 2nd, 2018 Boston 1st, Clippers 2019 1st for Serge Ibaka & Jodie Meeks.

If Orlando would do this deal then it accomplishes multiple things for Boston.

#1- Improved front court. Better interior defense
#2- Adds more bench shooting/scoring
#3- Gives Boston outside shot at beating Cleveland
#4- We keep BK picks & maintain salary flexibility this offseason

Orlando does this if they feel like Ibaka isn't in their long-term plans and/or he will leave in free agency. At least they get a quality young talent in Rozier along with some picks.

Green89 · Post #1725 » by **Green89** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 3:34 pm

Meeks is out indefinitely after thumb surgery.

Post #1726 » by **darrendaye** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 3:36 pm

I like Noel, always have, but I'm not seeing the need to be desperate to trade for him now. Sign him to an offer sheet in the off-season and try to work a sign and trade then if Sixers match and both C's and Noel want it to happen. I'd wait on Bogut buy-out or work a trade for Nurkic. I was against Nurkic because I didn't want to compromise cap room for next year, but, I'm sure they can find a team that will have cap space and interest enough to deal him if need be. Personally, I'd try to swing a Kelly trade and a separate Nurkic trade if the Nuggets are indeed rolling back prices in looking to deal him and the C's want more than just a bandaid option like Bogut.

jbent87 · Post #1727 » by **jbent87** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 3:39 pm

illmatic24 wrote:I'm all aboard the Noel train but the issue is what will it cost to get him? I don't think you can move a Brooklyn pick for him. Something involving Bradley, I guess? Then you likely draft his replacement with the Brooklyn pick.

I gotta give credit to Bryan Colangelo for doubling down on not moving Nerlens a couple months ago when both he and JO value was terrible. I would've taken Terry Rozier for Nerlens then. But now he has just been such a contributor the last 10 games whereas Okafor has been glued to the bench there is no way BC just gives him away. I think Nerlens/AB has to be the framework in any conversation between the Sixers/Celtics.

ddb · Post #1728 » by **ddb** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 3:42 pm

Green89 wrote:Meeks is out indefinitely after thumb surgery.

I didn't see that. Nevermind

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fallguy · Post #1729 » by **fallguy** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 3:44 pm

Banks2Pierce wrote:
fallguy wrote:Andrew Bogut has played 22 games this season.

He has a 9.48 PER.

He is going to get injured again.

He is not going to fix anything.

He is done.

He rebounds, passes, blocks shots, and we'll only pull the trigger if the cost is right. Don't necessarily need a regular season iron man here. PER is useless. He would fix almost everything as far as our issues that don't have to do with getting a top 10 player. Is he done or not? I don't know. Probably too good last season to call it already. Based on his public comments, he's playing the whole thing safe based on his team situation and upcoming FA.

You can't fix problems if you can't stay on the court. He can't stay on the court.

I get that people want this C's team improved on the defense/rebounding front but if you're going to chase short term glory (like a couple of extra playoff wins) at least go after a guy you can rely on. That's not Bogut.

ddb · Post #1730 » by **ddb** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 4:15 pm

how about sending Marcus Smart to Philly for Noel.

Then send Zeller/Rozier/2 NON BK 1sts to NOP for Holiday (expiring)?

Then let Young/Green/Jackson hash it out for some spot minutes.

IT-AB-Crowder-Horford-Noel
Holiday-Green-Brown-KO-Amir
Jackson-Young-Jonas-Mickey w/ 1 open roster spot

This addresses 2 needs (rebounding/interior defense & reliable bench scoring). Holiday is also a big enough guard where he can play with IT. So you're essentially playing a 3-guard rotation of IT-AB-JH. plenty of minutes to go around

fallguy · Post #1731 » by **fallguy** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 4:23 pm

ddb wrote:how about sending Marcus Smart to Philly for Noel.

Then send Zeller/Rozier/2 NON BK 1sts to NOP for Holiday (expiring)?

Then let Young/Green/Jackson hash it out for some spot minutes.

IT-AB-Crowder-Horford-Noel
Holiday-Green-Brown-KO-Amir
Jackson-Young-Jonas-Mickey w/ 1 open roster spot

This addresses 2 needs (rebounding/interior defense & reliable bench scoring). Holiday is also a big enough guard where he can play with IT. So you're essentially playing a 3-guard rotation of IT-AB-JH. plenty of minutes to go around

You want to trade Rozier and two firsts for an expiring Holiday? Seriously?

Green89 · Post #1732 » by **Green89** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 5:00 pm

Bulls could really use a point guard and the '17 pick would be just how they'd get it. Danny has to figure out what else they want and get it done. Butler and then we deal Amir toward Chandler and we've got a contending team right now.

b3n · Post #1733 » by **b3n** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 5:04 pm

ddb wrote:Amir, Rozier, Mickey, 2017 Minny 2nd, 2018 Boston 1st, Clippers 2019 1st for Serge Ibaka & Jodie Meeks.

I like Ibaka on our roster, but if anything, I'd personally rather use assets on Noel. Age is a big influence on that. Likelihood of re-signing the player is a bigger one. This is totally unsubstantiated but I feel like Noel being a Malden native makes him the player more likely to re-up in Boston. I think your less likely to waste assets on a rental. That & I'd be more comfortable giving Noel a long term deal. With Ibaka, I'm not even sure I'd want to offer him more than 2 years (with only one guaranteed). For those in the 'wait for free agency & just sign Noel camp'; I think if you wait the likelihood of signing him decreases. My gut says Philly is matching most offers. So if he's a guy you want, I think you trade now.

TheOGJabroni · Post #1734 » by **TheOGJabroni** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 5:24 pm

jbent87 wrote:
illmatic24 wrote:I'm all aboard the Noel train but the issue is what will it cost to get him? I don't think you can move a Brooklyn pick for him. Something involving Bradley, I guess? Then you likely draft his replacement with the Brooklyn pick.

I gotta give credit to Bryan Colangelo for doubling down on not moving Nerlens a couple months ago when both he and JO value was terrible. I would've taken Terry Rozier for Nerlens then. But now he has just been such a contributor the last 10 games whereas Okafor has been glued to the bench there is no way BC just gives him away. I think Nerlens/AB has to be the framework in any conversation between the Sixers/Celtics.

Right but now you're limiting Okafor's trade value. This may be the lesser of two evils but still...

I think Smart for Noel makes sense in terms of value and age of your roster.

jirrit · Post #1735 » by **jirrit** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 5:32 pm

This thread's starting to get in desperation mode.

jrob23 · Post #1736 » by **jrob23** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 5:39 pm

ddb wrote:
illmatic24 wrote:I'm all aboard the Noel train but the issue is what will it cost to get him? I don't think you can move a Brooklyn pick for him. Something involving Bradley, I guess? Then you likely draft his replacement with the Brooklyn pick.

I'm not. Philly's price tag will be too high.

After thinking about it carefully, I feel like our best bet for now AND moving forward is to see if Orlando will do the following deal:

Amir, Rozier, Mickey, 2017 Minny 2nd, 2018 Boston 1st, Clippers 2019 1st for Serge Ibaka & Jodie Meeks.

If Orlando would do this deal then it accomplishes multiple things for Boston.

#1- Improved front court. Better interior defense
#2- Adds more bench shooting/scoring
#3- Gives Boston outside shot at beating Cleveland
#4- We keep BK picks & maintain salary flexibility this offseason

Orlando does this if they feel like Ibaka isn't in their long-term plans and/or he will leave in free agency. At least they get a quality young talent in Rozier along with some picks.

I see these types of posts a lot on here. Nobody wants our trash. While I think Rozier is miscast in this offense and is very talented, they haven't showcased him and he's not on anyone's radar. Mickey shouldn't be in the league and Amir is soundly a backup big at best. Our 1st in 2018 will be in late 20s as will the Clippers 2019 and I believe it's protected anyway. Nobody is handing Danny a viable starter for castoffs. It's a terrible offer. ORL would expect Brown and a BK pick for the (supposed) 27 y/o Ibaka. He is oft maligned but his numbers are actually pretty consistent and he's shooting .39% from three. He'd be a huge upgrade and the cost to get him would be substantial. If ORL deals him they'll be getting back more than they gave up to get him. That's where the talks start.

Post #1737 » by **Darth Celtic** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 5:54 pm

Again, the Celtics team is better than the sum of it's parts. It's great because when they all play, they are a top 6 team in the league without a true superstar. It's bad because if any of the main players are out, they don't function the same and are then as good as only the sum of it's parts. Around a .500 ish team.

We have to have these players to be that good team.
IT
Bradley
Smart
Horford
Crowder

The rest of the roster can be interchanged. That's who you can trade this year and not get worse. Trading Bradley for Noel just may make us better next year, but we will get worse this year.

As posted a trade around Amir and Rozier with non nets picks to get a better PF is the best bet for this year and next. The only one on that list is Ibaka. Sixers are asking more for Noel so we might as well stop talking about him.

Post #1738 » by **Darth Celtic** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 5:55 pm

jrob23 wrote:
ddb wrote:
illmatic24 wrote:I'm all aboard the Noel train but the issue is what will it cost to get him? I don't think you can move a Brooklyn pick for him. Something involving Bradley, I guess? Then you likely draft his replacement with the Brooklyn pick.

I'm not. Philly's price tag will be too high.

After thinking about it carefully, I feel like our best bet for now AND moving forward is to see if Orlando will do the following deal:

Amir, Rozier, Mickey, 2017 Minny 2nd, 2018 Boston 1st, Clippers 2019 1st for Serge Ibaka & Jodie Meeks.

If Orlando would do this deal then it accomplishes multiple things for Boston.

#1- Improved front court. Better interior defense
#2- Adds more bench shooting/scoring
#3- Gives Boston outside shot at beating Cleveland
#4- We keep BK picks & maintain salary flexibility this offseason

Orlando does this if they feel like Ibaka isn't in their long-term plans and/or he will leave in free agency. At least they get a quality young talent in Rozier along with some picks.

I see these types of posts a lot on here. Nobody wants our trash. While I think Rozier is miscast in this offense and is very talented, they haven't showcased him and he's not on anyone's radar. Mickey shouldn't be in the league and Amir is soundly a backup big at best. Our 1st in 2018 will be in late 20s as will the Clippers 2019 and I believe it's protected anyway. Nobody is handing Danny a viable starter for castoffs. It's a terrible offer. ORL would expect Brown and a BK pick for the (supposed) 27 y/o Ibaka. He is oft maligned but his numbers are actually pretty consistent and he's shooting .39% from three. He'd be a huge upgrade and the cost to get him would be substantial. If ORL deals him they'll be getting back more than they gave up to get him. That's where the talks start.

So, if nobody offers more than they gave for him, and he just leaves in the offseason for a playoff team, what does Orlando get then? Nothing.

Andrew McCeltic · Post #1739 » by **Andrew McCeltic** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 5:55 pm

CsBsSoxPhins wrote:
jbent87 wrote:
illmatic24 wrote:I'm all aboard the Noel train but the issue is what will it cost to get him? I don't think you can move a Brooklyn pick for him. Something involving Bradley, I guess? Then you likely draft his replacement with the Brooklyn pick.

I gotta give credit to Bryan Colangelo for doubling down on not moving Nerlens a couple months ago when both he and JO value was terrible. I would've taken Terry Rozier for Nerlens then. But now he has just been such a contributor the last 10 games whereas Okafor has been glued to the bench there is no way BC just gives him away. I think Nerlens/AB has to be the framework in any conversation between the Sixers/Celtics.

Right but now you're limiting Okafor's trade value. This may be the lesser of two evils but still...

I think Smart for Noel makes sense in terms of value and age of your roster.

They're limiting Okafor's value because if they can get something for Noel, then they make Jahlil the back-up and work him into form in order to trade him.

The problem with getting Noel is that it compromises our max cap space - we'd need to cut 11 million in guaranteed salary to absorb his cap hold. I think that's fine, and we can work sign and trade possibilities, or move on from Bradley and/or Crowder in the off-season if Gordon Hayward or Blake Griffin want to come here. But it's very likely that they don't, and that Noel (or Okafor, ffs) is going to be the best center prospect available to us for awhile, given ability, age and upside.

TheOGJabroni · Post #1740 » by **TheOGJabroni** » Wed Jan 25, 2017 5:59 pm

Andrew McCeltic wrote:
CsBsSoxPhins wrote:
jbent87 wrote:
I gotta give credit to Bryan Colangelo for doubling down on not moving Nerlens a couple months ago when both he and JO value was terrible. I would've taken Terry Rozier for Nerlens then. But now he has just been such a contributor the last 10 games whereas Okafor has been glued to the bench there is no way BC just gives him away. I think Nerlens/AB has to be the framework in any conversation between the Sixers/Celtics.

Right but now you're limiting Okafor's trade value. This may be the lesser of two evils but still...

I think Smart for Noel makes sense in terms of value and age of your roster.

They're limiting Okafor's value because if they can get something for Noel, then they make Jahlil the back-up and work him into form in order to trade him.

The problem with getting Noel is that it compromises our max cap space - we'd need to cut 11 million in guaranteed salary to absorb his cap hold. I think that's fine, and we can work sign and trade possibilities, or move on from Bradley and/or Crowder in the off-season if Gordon Hayward or Blake Griffin want to come here. But it's very likely that they don't, and that Noel (or Okafor, ffs) is going to be the best center prospect available to us for awhile, given ability, age and upside.

Yeah I've pretty much come to terms with the end of your post. The only real star player I see available to us will be Hayward, even that is far from a sure thing, and I don't think he's worth worrying about Noel's caphold. We have Brown who I hope will turn out to be a better player than Hayward is. Like you said, if we could get him, we could always move Bradley/Crowder if need be.