Official Current Affairs & Politics thread

[shakendfries]

My whole thing is 8 years of Obama did absolutely nothing discernible to change the plight of minorities. In many ways, institutionalized instances of inequality have only gotten worse. As a result, the identity politics that the democratic side, as a whole, attempts to manipulate is grossly superficial to the point where their pandering is damn near offensive.

On top of all that, the leaks revealed that the DNC specifically advised HRC to ignore all and any policy suggestions from the protesters that were allegedly "on their side", in addition to implicating the DNC leadership engaging in a number of shady and illegal activities ranging from conspiring against other dems to even more foundation scandal.

Trump's rhetoric was awful and hurtful to a lot of people. There is no excuse for it to be involved in the highest position of office. And yet, it's difficult for me to agree with the notion that career politicians are the only ones fit to hold office in the country. They're so far removed from what life is like from their constituents and they generally have little to no professional experiences outside of capitol hill. You mean to tell me we should hire the people who were largely complicit in the way things are to this point and expect real meaningful changes to take place? I don't buy that 20 dubious years of scandalous political history automatically makes someone a better candidate than a tycoon who's rough around the edges. Saying "grab em by the pussy" is one thing, but actually making decisions to bomb people is another thing entirely

On the one hand, we have one party deliberately lying and making false promises to its primary audience to get votes while simultaneously likely to do nothing of significance for them, and on the other hand we have some dude who's been up front with his agenda that largely seeks to promote enterprise and national security. One party busy making calls for war, and another making calls for walls in a preventative National Security effort. One party in cahoots with mainstream news outlets to avoid acknowledging any of this, and another that's always cast as ignorant/uneducated by those dismissive outlets.

The wildest thing to me is how for an entire year all the major news said this dude had no chance. He wins, and their new message is that the country is rioting and descending into chaos. Yet you walk outside and nothing has changed for most people, even the ones who may be bummed but are relatively calm. Even when claims are made that hate crimes is up, a year ago the news was showing minorities getting hemmed up and shot by the cops every day, but since that story no longer the flavor of the month we hear nothing about it anymore. Journalists are claiming, "calling us fake news is a racial slur", and yet these were the same outlets that sold the American public on the Iraq War without any questions as it was happening. So there has never ever been fake news huh? The WMDs weren't fake news? The dominant media's whole steez is funny style, and they have an overblown sense of importance.

I'm not a stan for either side but I don't buy into identity/respectability politics, and that the supporters for one side are more virtuous than the other.

[shakendfries]

Check this out. King Joffrey has gone on a tirade this morning

Read on Twitter

This man is UNHINGED.

this is too funny

[MrDollarBills]

My whole thing is 8 years of Obama did absolutely nothing discernible to change the plight of minorities. In many ways, institutionalized instances of inequality have only gotten worse. As a result, the identity politics that the democratic side, as a whole, attempts to manipulate is grossly superficial to the point where their pandering is damn near offensive.

On top of all that, the leaks revealed that the DNC specifically advised HRC to ignore all and any policy suggestions from the protesters that were allegedly "on their side", in addition to implicating the DNC leadership engaging in a number of shady and illegal activities ranging from conspiring against other dems to even more foundation scandal.

Trump's rhetoric was awful and hurtful to a lot of people. There is no excuse for it to be involved in the highest position of office. And yet, it's difficult for me to agree with the notion that career politicians are the only ones fit to hold office in the country. They're so far removed from what life is like from their constituents and they generally have little to no professional experiences outside of capitol hill. You mean to tell me we should hire the people who were largely complicit in the way things are to this point and expect real meaningful changes to take place? I don't buy that 20 dubious years of scandalous political history automatically makes someone a better candidate than a tycoon who's rough around the edges. Saying "grab em by the pussy" is one thing, but actually making decisions to bomb people is another thing entirely

On the one hand, we have one party deliberately lying and making false promises to its primary audience to get votes while simultaneously likely to do nothing of significance for them, and on the other hand we have some dude who's been up front with his agenda that largely seeks to promote enterprise and national security. One party busy making calls for war, and another making calls for walls in a preventative National Security effort. One party in cahoots with mainstream news outlets to avoid acknowledging any of this, and another that's always cast as ignorant/uneducated by those dismissive outlets.

The wildest thing to me is how for an entire year all the major news said this dude had no chance. He wins, and their new message is that the country is rioting and descending into chaos. Yet you walk outside and nothing has changed for most people, even the ones who may be bummed but are relatively calm. Even when claims are made that hate crimes is up, a year ago the news was showing minorities getting hemmed up and shot by the cops every day, but since that story no longer the flavor of the month we hear nothing about it anymore. Journalists are claiming, "calling us fake news is a racial slur", and yet these were the same outlets that sold the American public on the Iraq War without any questions as it was happening. So there has never ever been fake news huh? The WMDs weren't fake news? The dominant media's whole steez is funny style, and they have an overblown sense of importance.

I'm not a stan for either side but I don't buy into identity/respectability politics, and that the supporters for one side are more virtuous than the other.

I agree with you for the most part. But

They're so far removed from what life is like from their constituents

How can you say this, when Trump is just the same? And also stocks his cabinet full of people who have no regard or experience dealing with the issues of "working class" Americans? That doesn't compute.

On the one hand, we have one party deliberately lying and making false promises to its primary audience to get votes while simultaneously likely to do nothing of significance for them, and on the other hand we have some dude who's been up front with his agenda that largely seeks to promote enterprise and national security. One party busy making calls for war, and another making calls for walls in a preventative National Security effort. One party in cahoots with mainstream news outlets to avoid acknowledging any of this, and another that's always cast as ignorant/uneducated by those dismissive outlets.

This is a gross oversimplification of the Republican party and their agenda. You do realize that before Republicans starting sucking Putin off, they called Obama soft on Russia's imperialistic actions? What suddenly changed? Besides the guy at the forefront clearly being compromised by Russian intelligence, of course.

Both of these parties suck to high hell. There's no sense in romanticizing one side versus another. You have one side that plays blatant identity politics to pander for minority votes, and another side that panders to racist conservatives by dog whistling, and neither side truly cares to make life better for their constituency.

Do you seriously think that having a white supremacist like Steve Bannon craft hastily written executive orders which cause global chaos, discriminate against Muslims and actually cause our legal residents to be refused re entry here to be for the good of national security? His rhetoric is alienating allies to the point where our reps have to go overseas and give assurances that Trump isn't going to go off of the rails. We can paint the MSM as having an agenda all day but this man's behavior should never, ever get a pass for this garbage.

If the media paints this dude in a horrible light, with 99% of if it being true, sorry but they're actually doing their jobs.

Look at his twitter feed this morning. You're really going to get behind this man? He's clearly disturbed and unfit.

[MrDollarBills]

Check this out. King Joffrey has gone on a tirade this morning

Read on Twitter

This man is UNHINGED.

this is too funny

Actually, it's not. It's disturbing in context of the rest of his tirade this morning. He's off his rocker.

If Obama carried on like this, I doubt you or the rest of his supporters be singing this tune or find it to be cute. Unbelievable....

[Ror1997]

The way Trump is trying to get people outraged over Schumer and Obama meeting with the Russian ambassador reminds me of when my Mom was yelling at me for something and I would say "But _____ mom let's him ______"

His excuses are so childish and its probably because he didn't live a normal childhood so he never learned how stupid those excuses sound and how the adults in your life won't buy those excuses.

Everyday he finds a new way to embarrass himself and in turn the county. I like to keep my political opinions to myself as I feel everyone should. But I can't comprehend how anybody could fall for this bs. That's one of the reasons I avoid this thread for the most point, because I dont want to judge somebody based on their political views. But how on earth can you support this moron.

^I can see why an ex coal miner(s) who believes (foolishly) that Trump would bring the jobs back to his neck of the woods would support him. I think they're naive, but if that goes into someone's reasoning and not the rhetoric about "making america white again", I'd be willing to listen to their concerns...even though there should be a push for tax dollars to be spent on retraining workers to work in clean energy going forward. But whatever...

Check this out. King Joffrey has gone on a tirade this morning

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

This man is UNHINGED.

He's a wreckless child. When he was elected, I was hoping he would prove me wrong and actually be a good president. But this is exactly what I expected, maybe worse because it literally gets worse with each passing day.

[shakendfries]

My whole thing is 8 years of Obama did absolutely nothing discernible to change the plight of minorities. In many ways, institutionalized instances of inequality have only gotten worse. As a result, the identity politics that the democratic side, as a whole, attempts to manipulate is grossly superficial to the point where their pandering is damn near offensive.

On top of all that, the leaks revealed that the DNC specifically advised HRC to ignore all and any policy suggestions from the protesters that were allegedly "on their side", in addition to implicating the DNC leadership engaging in a number of shady and illegal activities ranging from conspiring against other dems to even more foundation scandal.

Trump's rhetoric was awful and hurtful to a lot of people. There is no excuse for it to be involved in the highest position of office. And yet, it's difficult for me to agree with the notion that career politicians are the only ones fit to hold office in the country. They're so far removed from what life is like from their constituents and they generally have little to no professional experiences outside of capitol hill. You mean to tell me we should hire the people who were largely complicit in the way things are to this point and expect real meaningful changes to take place? I don't buy that 20 dubious years of scandalous political history automatically makes someone a better candidate than a tycoon who's rough around the edges. Saying "grab em by the pussy" is one thing, but actually making decisions to bomb people is another thing entirely

On the one hand, we have one party deliberately lying and making false promises to its primary audience to get votes while simultaneously likely to do nothing of significance for them, and on the other hand we have some dude who's been up front with his agenda that largely seeks to promote enterprise and national security. One party busy making calls for war, and another making calls for walls in a preventative National Security effort. One party in cahoots with mainstream news outlets to avoid acknowledging any of this, and another that's always cast as ignorant/uneducated by those dismissive outlets.

The wildest thing to me is how for an entire year all the major news said this dude had no chance. He wins, and their new message is that the country is rioting and descending into chaos. Yet you walk outside and nothing has changed for most people, even the ones who may be bummed but are relatively calm. Even when claims are made that hate crimes is up, a year ago the news was showing minorities getting hemmed up and shot by the cops every day, but since that story no longer the flavor of the month we hear nothing about it anymore. Journalists are claiming, "calling us fake news is a racial slur", and yet these were the same outlets that sold the American public on the Iraq War without any questions as it was happening. So there has never ever been fake news huh? The WMDs weren't fake news? The dominant media's whole steez is funny style, and they have an overblown sense of importance.

I'm not a stan for either side but I don't buy into identity/respectability politics, and that the supporters for one side are more virtuous than the other.

I agree with you for the most part. But

They're so far removed from what life is like from their constituents

How can you say this, when Trump is just the same? And also stocks his cabinet full of people who have no regard or experience dealing with the issues of "working class" Americans? That doesn't compute.

On the one hand, we have one party deliberately lying and making false promises to its primary audience to get votes while simultaneously likely to do nothing of significance for them, and on the other hand we have some dude who's been up front with his agenda that largely seeks to promote enterprise and national security. One party busy making calls for war, and another making calls for walls in a preventative National Security effort. One party in cahoots with mainstream news outlets to avoid acknowledging any of this, and another that's always cast as ignorant/uneducated by those dismissive outlets.

This is a gross oversimplification of the Republican party and their agenda. You do realize that before Republicans starting sucking Putin off, they called Obama soft on Russia's imperialistic actions? What suddenly changed? Besides the guy at the forefront clearly being compromised by Russian intelligence, of course.

Both of these parties suck to high hell. There's no sense in romanticizing one side versus another. You have one side that plays blatant identity politics to pander for minority votes, and another side that panders to racist conservatives by dog whistling, and neither side truly cares to make life better for their constituency.

Do you seriously think that having a white supremacist like Steve Bannon craft hastily written executive orders which cause global chaos, discriminate against Muslims and actually cause our legal residents to be refused re entry here to be for the good of national security? His rhetoric is alienating allies to the point where our reps have to go overseas and give assurances that Trump isn't going to go off of the rails. We can paint the MSM as having an agenda all day but this man's behavior should never, ever get a pass for this garbage.

If the media paints this dude in a horrible light, with 99% of if it being true, sorry but they're actually doing their jobs.

Look at his twitter feed this morning. You're really going to get behind this man? He's clearly disturbed and unfit.

All fair points

[13th Man]

That's a matter of perception.

A lot of Trump's backlash was brought about again by a) his divisive rhetoric, b) the blatant pandering to an extremist element here in the United States that most Americans do not find acceptable, and this ranges from liberals to conservatives. How do you expect a person who alienates people in our society, surrounds himself with known white supremacists and racists, and behaves like a narcissist nutjob to be accepted at large? I certainly can't get down with any of that, for obvious reasons being a black american who comes from immigrants. While none of that is a deal breaker for you, it is for many others here in this country. I've come to rationalize a few reasons why people voted for this man, not all of them have to do with the bigotry or racism that we've seen from his alt right lunatic cult, but again...its not a deal breaker, and that is what really disturbs me about his support. How does a sitting president alienating and vilifying segments of our population not bother them? I guess each to his own though.

I agree that it's a matter of perception. Imo, I don't think he is as bad as what they make him out to be in terms of being racist. It's obvious that immigrants do not like him but if you're a law abiding immigrant who's in the country legitimately you shouldn't need to worry too much. His "muslim ban" was obviously too harsh but they are working on tweaking it so that immigrants with legit reasons to be in the country will not get blocked. In principle I don't have a big problem with this if implemented and executed properly.

Most of the protests are peaceful though, honestly. Also, despite incidents happening here and there, it doesn't take away from the fact that Americans have a right to object to leadership, and a right to peaceful assembly to demonstrate against it. Authoritarianism is not what we subscribe to here, despite what you may read in the echo chamber of the far right.

Now, if the violence you're talking about involves Trump supporting neo nazis getting punched in the face, sorry that's just the cost of doing business there is no civility or discourse when it comes to nazis. [/quote]

Not all protests are peaceful, it's the nature and spirt of the protests that I'm worried about, it's just filled with hate. Look at what just happened at Berkley today? Pro-Trump protestors were fought and pepper sprayed. The nature of these clashes are anything but peaceful. I'm willing to bet that these protests will go on for much longer than when Obama became President. Most of the republicans have eventually accepted Obama (of course there will be a small percentage that do not). From what I see, most of the dem voters aren't even close to accepting Trump as President, and many will never under any circumstance. I don't think it's comparable at all, the culture of the left is just different. To me it's like if they will "cry" incessantly if they don't get their way.

I don't trust the MSM either, a wise professor I had in college once told me to take everything that I see on the nightly news with a grain of salt. But...most of what gets reported can be corroborated with facts, which is why that they are still reliable. And frankly, this notion (not saying this about you) that everything that paints Trump in a negative light is "FAKE NEWS!!! FAKE NEWS!!" is so childish and moronic, I really don't want to get into it, especially when people are trying to use white nationalist dirtrags like Breitbart and Infowars are legitimate sources of news.

To me, the "Fake News" accusation is not really about delivering fake content but moreso how they selectively choose to report the news; i.e. accentuating items that would make Trump look bad while downplaying the positive things. The bias is there. This is countered by FOX news for the conservatives but the number of outlets supporting the left outnumber the right 10:1. Breitbart and Infowars aren't really mainstream as the various other left-wing outlets.

I'll gladly say that he's not my president. I'm not respecting the office of a man who's second in command is a white supremacist, or who panders to the worst segment of the american population. You may be fine with that. I'm not. And I'm not alone, despite what you may read on "non MSM" sources. I hated George W. Bush, but not once did he ever alienate non whites in this manner. Even when the wars popped off, he persisted in not alienating or attacking Muslim Americans or practitioners of Islam. He didn't divide the country in this manner, people hated him yeah, but it was nothing like this and this is all on Trump's own mouth which has given extremists an open invitation to terrorize Muslims, Jews, and PoC.

That's your right to not embrace him but the fact is that Trump won the election fair and square (not going to get into the Russians affecting the outcome thing). Not all of Trump supporters are degenerates of society as Hillary put it. I'm sure Trump has many supporters from all classes and races. I support him limiting the influx of immigrants into the country. Look at Sweden, people are accusing Trump of fake news when he incorrectly reported rioting the night before, but in reality there are lots of riots going on in Sweden right now from immigrants, just that the MSM do not cover it. Swedish citizins on Reddit and other forums have confirmed this to be true.

People on the fence rebelled against Hillary because she's a filthy lying piece of trash and an unelectable candidate, not because of some media slant in her favor. I hate that woman with a passion, the only reason I even held my nose and voted for her because I'm not standing in support of this narcissist lunatic alongside people who hate me just because I'm not white. This goes a lot deeper than just politics, we are talking about people supporting this man who subscribe to ethnic cleansing and call for genocide against people different than they are, or want to terrorize people because they are muslim, jewish, gay, etc. I refuse to align myself with that.

I don't see Trump or his team calling for genocide against anyone. I do see them trying to limit the number of immigrants from Obama handpicked countries from coming in though and also trying to deport scumbag illegals from the country. Again, I have no problem with this.

I take pride in doing the same man. I'm the same as you (well, I'm not an immigrant but my parents are). I also have no patience for criminals and religious extremists.

Here lies the difference...I don't have an issue with deporting undocumented immigrants who commit crimes. I do have an issue with rounding up people, ripping apart families especially when the children who suffer are my fellow citizens. There is always a better way to do things than instead of invoking draconian measures from this country's barbaric past, we should be better than this. Also, I do recognize and respect the fact that most immigrants, here legally or not, come here to work, are some of the hardest workers in our society, and they contribute to our society, not take away from it. It's just a question of getting proper status. I know people who are undocumented here. They just want to work, send money home, and do right. Unfortunately, becoming a citizen or a legal resident requires a lot, and may depend on resources that many do not have, I know for a fact that if my parents didn't have residents here sponsor them, they would have never been allowed to live here for 30+ years or become citizens. It's not easy, (as you may know), so while I would want for all immigrants to become documented, citizens, or legal residents, I don't want to condemn people just trying to make a better life for themselves...nevermind their contributions to our economy.

I'm not an immigration expert but I do agree that deporting law-abiding citizens isn't really fair. There are way too many illegal aliens living in the country for then to try to send them all back. If we're talking about sending back illegals with serious criminal offences (not misdemeanors), then I'm game.

Regarding extremists...outside of 9-11, more Americans have been mass killed by white terrorists than anyone else. Yet, Americans don't want to profile white males or view them as a threat, they only want to target, harass, and violate Muslims or people of color. That is unacceptable. Until white americans cut this hypocrisy out, and stop ignoring the growing threat in our backyard coming from the sickos who Trump and his ilk ignore, they don't have a leg to stand on by screaming about extremist terrorist when they constantly look the other way when it comes to guys that look like them. Within the last month white extremists have targeted and killed a Muslim and an Indian man in the US and Canada. Not a peep from these people about that. But they'll surely cheer on the harassment of a Muslim or a Sikh person just minding their own damn business.

Imo, limiting the number of muslim immigrants is not only for terrorist reasons but just problem people in general. Read somewhere that the rape % is something like 10x higher for the immigrants from muslim countries. Why would you want to let boatloads of Syrian refugees into your country that will become troublemakers? Look at the European countries that have accepted them, I'm sure many are regretting those measures.

I agree with you word for word. I will say that I think Obamacare needs to be fixed when it comes to lowering premiums and things of that nature, and things MUST be done about prescription drug costs and healthcare costs in general here in the US, but I also do think that it has helped a lot of people as well....and this is coming from someone who was very suspect of Obamacare, which I still view as a backdoor handout to the US insurance industry by mandating insurance.

It's cool man, we disagree on some things but I think disagreement is healthy and you can learn from others who have rational beliefs that necessarily don't vibe with yours. What I try to do though nowadays is gain some understanding from the folks that are what I'd consider "normal" conservatives, or folks who aren't alt right nutters. Like, I can rationalize why someone would support Trump, and not subscribe to that kind of stuff. What I can't rationalize is white supremacy, discrimination, ethnic cleansing, genocide, things of that nature.

I don't condone those things either but I think that those traits are being over-characterized for Trump. I don't think he is that bad, just think he's trying to limit the problem people from getting into the country. He's also trying to protect American jobs from cheap foreign labor as well, at least he's trying.

I agree and accept that we have diverse perspectives and opinions on politics based on our background, experience, exposure etc. I know that we still don't see eye to eye and it probably goes much deeper than what we're discussing here; especially on a racial level. Cheers.

[MrDollarBills]

One point about Europe versus here re: Syrian refugees, I...and someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that Europe's refugee process is markedly different from how we were vetting and bringing in Syrian refugees over here, no? From what I saw (and know), Europe basically had a free for all, whereas our vetting process is pretty stringent with an emphasis on families.

I agree with serious vetting and background checks before letting people come over, which is as far as I know what we've been doing and it has not led to the problems that you see in Germany and other countries.

[Rainyy]

whereas our vetting process is pretty stringent with an emphasis on families.

Can't speak to getting through customs or how we compare to Europe's asylum process, but I wouldn't call the asylum process stringent, provided a person hasn't committed any crimes (in which case they're denied). The standards are not too difficult to meet, although the practical obstacle is the massive backlog for interviews.

That said, from an emotional standpoint it is extremely demanding and borderline cruel because you're basically asking (a lot go the time) people to relive (and respond to probing questions about) their worst memories in front of a stranger (they have to recount the persecution they have received).

[tonman]

That's a matter of perception.

A lot of Trump's backlash was brought about again by a) his divisive rhetoric, b) the blatant pandering to an extremist element here in the United States that most Americans do not find acceptable, and this ranges from liberals to conservatives. How do you expect a person who alienates people in our society, surrounds himself with known white supremacists and racists, and behaves like a narcissist nutjob to be accepted at large? I certainly can't get down with any of that, for obvious reasons being a black american who comes from immigrants. While none of that is a deal breaker for you, it is for many others here in this country. I've come to rationalize a few reasons why people voted for this man, not all of them have to do with the bigotry or racism that we've seen from his alt right lunatic cult, but again...its not a deal breaker, and that is what really disturbs me about his support. How does a sitting president alienating and vilifying segments of our population not bother them? I guess each to his own though.

I agree that it's a matter of perception. Imo, I don't think he is as bad as what they make him out to be in terms of being racist. It's obvious that immigrants do not like him but if you're a law abiding immigrant who's in the country legitimately you shouldn't need to worry too much. His "muslim ban" was obviously too harsh but they are working on tweaking it so that immigrants with legit reasons to be in the country will not get blocked. In principle I don't have a big problem with this if implemented and executed properly.

Most of the protests are peaceful though, honestly. Also, despite incidents happening here and there, it doesn't take away from the fact that Americans have a right to object to leadership, and a right to peaceful assembly to demonstrate against it. Authoritarianism is not what we subscribe to here, despite what you may read in the echo chamber of the far right.

Now, if the violence you're talking about involves Trump supporting neo nazis getting punched in the face, sorry that's just the cost of doing business there is no civility or discourse when it comes to nazis.

Not all protests are peaceful, it's the nature and spirt of the protests that I'm worried about, it's just filled with hate. Look at what just happened at Berkley today? Pro-Trump protestors were fought and pepper sprayed. The nature of these clashes are anything but peaceful. I'm willing to bet that these protests will go on for much longer than when Obama became President. Most of the republicans have eventually accepted Obama (of course there will be a small percentage that do not). From what I see, most of the dem voters aren't even close to accepting Trump as President, and many will never under any circumstance. I don't think it's comparable at all, the culture of the left is just different. To me it's like if they will "cry" incessantly if they don't get their way.

I don't trust the MSM either, a wise professor I had in college once told me to take everything that I see on the nightly news with a grain of salt. But...most of what gets reported can be corroborated with facts, which is why that they are still reliable. And frankly, this notion (not saying this about you) that everything that paints Trump in a negative light is "FAKE NEWS!!! FAKE NEWS!!" is so childish and moronic, I really don't want to get into it, especially when people are trying to use white nationalist dirtrags like Breitbart and Infowars are legitimate sources of news.

To me, the "Fake News" accusation is not really about delivering fake content but moreso how they selectively choose to report the news; i.e. accentuating items that would make Trump look bad while downplaying the positive things. The bias is there. This is countered by FOX news for the conservatives but the number of outlets supporting the left outnumber the right 10:1. Breitbart and Infowars aren't really mainstream as the various other left-wing outlets.

I'll gladly say that he's not my president. I'm not respecting the office of a man who's second in command is a white supremacist, or who panders to the worst segment of the american population. You may be fine with that. I'm not. And I'm not alone, despite what you may read on "non MSM" sources. I hated George W. Bush, but not once did he ever alienate non whites in this manner. Even when the wars popped off, he persisted in not alienating or attacking Muslim Americans or practitioners of Islam. He didn't divide the country in this manner, people hated him yeah, but it was nothing like this and this is all on Trump's own mouth which has given extremists an open invitation to terrorize Muslims, Jews, and PoC.

That's your right to not embrace him but the fact is that Trump won the election fair and square (not going to get into the Russians affecting the outcome thing). Not all of Trump supporters are degenerates of society as Hillary put it. I'm sure Trump has many supporters from all classes and races. I support him limiting the influx of immigrants into the country. Look at Sweden, people are accusing Trump of fake news when he incorrectly reported rioting the night before, but in reality there are lots of riots going on in Sweden right now from immigrants, just that the MSM do not cover it. Swedish citizins on Reddit and other forums have confirmed this to be true.

People on the fence rebelled against Hillary because she's a filthy lying piece of trash and an unelectable candidate, not because of some media slant in her favor. I hate that woman with a passion, the only reason I even held my nose and voted for her because I'm not standing in support of this narcissist lunatic alongside people who hate me just because I'm not white. This goes a lot deeper than just politics, we are talking about people supporting this man who subscribe to ethnic cleansing and call for genocide against people different than they are, or want to terrorize people because they are muslim, jewish, gay, etc. I refuse to align myself with that.

I don't see Trump or his team calling for genocide against anyone. I do see them trying to limit the number of immigrants from Obama handpicked countries from coming in though and also trying to deport scumbag illegals from the country. Again, I have no problem with this.

I take pride in doing the same man. I'm the same as you (well, I'm not an immigrant but my parents are). I also have no patience for criminals and religious extremists.

Here lies the difference...I don't have an issue with deporting undocumented immigrants who commit crimes. I do have an issue with rounding up people, ripping apart families especially when the children who suffer are my fellow citizens. There is always a better way to do things than instead of invoking draconian measures from this country's barbaric past, we should be better than this. Also, I do recognize and respect the fact that most immigrants, here legally or not, come here to work, are some of the hardest workers in our society, and they contribute to our society, not take away from it. It's just a question of getting proper status. I know people who are undocumented here. They just want to work, send money home, and do right. Unfortunately, becoming a citizen or a legal resident requires a lot, and may depend on resources that many do not have, I know for a fact that if my parents didn't have residents here sponsor them, they would have never been allowed to live here for 30+ years or become citizens. It's not easy, (as you may know), so while I would want for all immigrants to become documented, citizens, or legal residents, I don't want to condemn people just trying to make a better life for themselves...nevermind their contributions to our economy.

I'm not an immigration expert but I do agree that deporting law-abiding citizens isn't really fair. There are way too many illegal aliens living in the country for then to try to send them all back. If we're talking about sending back illegals with serious criminal offences (not misdemeanors), then I'm game.

Regarding extremists...outside of 9-11, more Americans have been mass killed by white terrorists than anyone else. Yet, Americans don't want to profile white males or view them as a threat, they only want to target, harass, and violate Muslims or people of color. That is unacceptable. Until white americans cut this hypocrisy out, and stop ignoring the growing threat in our backyard coming from the sickos who Trump and his ilk ignore, they don't have a leg to stand on by screaming about extremist terrorist when they constantly look the other way when it comes to guys that look like them. Within the last month white extremists have targeted and killed a Muslim and an Indian man in the US and Canada. Not a peep from these people about that. But they'll surely cheer on the harassment of a Muslim or a Sikh person just minding their own damn business.

Imo, limiting the number of muslim immigrants is not only for terrorist reasons but just problem people in general. Read somewhere that the rape % is something like 10x higher for the immigrants from muslim countries. Why would you want to let boatloads of Syrian refugees into your country that will become troublemakers? Look at the European countries that have accepted them, I'm sure many are regretting those measures.

I agree with you word for word. I will say that I think Obamacare needs to be fixed when it comes to lowering premiums and things of that nature, and things MUST be done about prescription drug costs and healthcare costs in general here in the US, but I also do think that it has helped a lot of people as well....and this is coming from someone who was very suspect of Obamacare, which I still view as a backdoor handout to the US insurance industry by mandating insurance.

It's cool man, we disagree on some things but I think disagreement is healthy and you can learn from others who have rational beliefs that necessarily don't vibe with yours. What I try to do though nowadays is gain some understanding from the folks that are what I'd consider "normal" conservatives, or folks who aren't alt right nutters. Like, I can rationalize why someone would support Trump, and not subscribe to that kind of stuff. What I can't rationalize is white supremacy, discrimination, ethnic cleansing, genocide, things of that nature.

I don't condone those things either but I think that those traits are being over-characterized for Trump. I don't think he is that bad, just think he's trying to limit the problem people from getting into the country. He's also trying to protect American jobs from cheap foreign labor as well, at least he's trying.

I agree and accept that we have diverse perspectives and opinions on politics based on our background, experience, exposure etc. I know that we still don't see eye to eye and it probably goes much deeper than what we're discussing here; especially on a racial level. Cheers.[/quote]

A law biding legal immigrant was just killed last week by a person who though he was from Iran. Folks talk about media biases and then put out info as if it were factual. People posting on Reddit or where ever still does not paint a full picture. Folks point out how hillary lies yet the king of the falsehoods is our president. Trump just lied again this morning yet people still harp on hillary. If you're a Trump supporters, what he says is never going to be as bad as someone like hillary. You've made up your mind already. As for obamacare one reason why premiums are high was due to the negativity brought on by republicans over 8 years. If more people bought into Obamacare the premiums would be lower. That said, the republicans have wanted to repeal Obamacare for 8 years. But all that time they forgot one important thing, they never came up with a plan to replace it. Their only plan was to repeal and not do anything that would credit the Democrats with some thing positive, I guess people's health are second fiddle to politics. They still don't have a plan to replace Obamacare. That folks is our political system. Screw everyone until you control Congress the presidency and judicial branch. What does that make us ? A one party system, no wonder there's Russian love going around. Our saving grace is that we go through elections every 4 years.... unless some group decides to change things....

[MrDollarBills]

The more Trump lashes out on twitter, the more that he comes off as a man who is scared and paranoid that his dirt is about to catch up with him.

DEFLECT! DEFLECT!

[MrDollarBills]

So James Comey has come out and says that The Justice Dept needs to refute Trump's claims that Obama illegally ordered a wiretap of his campaign:

WASHINGTON — The F.B.I. director, James B. Comey, asked the Justice Department this weekend to publicly reject President Trump’s assertion that President Barack Obama ordered the tapping of Mr. Trump’s phones, senior American officials said on Sunday. Mr. Comey has argued that the highly charged claim is false and must be corrected, they said, but the department has not released any such statement.

Mr. Comey, who made the request on Saturday after Mr. Trump leveled his allegation on Twitter, has been working to get the Justice Department to knock down the claim because it falsely insinuates that the F.B.I. broke the law, the officials said.

A spokesman for the F.B.I. declined to comment. Sarah Isgur Flores, the spokeswoman for the Justice Department, also declined to comment.

Mr. Comey’s request is a remarkable rebuke of a sitting president, putting the nation’s top law enforcement official in the position of questioning Mr. Trump’s truthfulness.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/05/us/politics/trump-seeks-inquiry-into-allegations-that-obama-tapped-his-phones.html?action=Click&contentCollection=BreakingNews&contentID=64989981&pgtype=Homepage&smid=tw-nytimes&smtyp=cur&_r=0


This is why Trumptard's twitter rants are not cute, and are in fact, a bigger threat to this country's overall security than any Muslim or Mexican who doesn't have papers. When people realize this, it will be too late and frankly I hope the alphabet agents are pulling out all the stops to get so much dirt on this idiot that they'll ruin him because right now, every lie that he spouts to his cult is putting this country on a dangerous path.

Comey on the other hand, basically aided Trump with the whole Hillary email mess during the election and now is on the defensive now that Trump has lashed out at his agency. Funny part is, Trump's cult LOVED this dude 24 hours ago but now all over social media they want Trump to fire him. This is sick, and I really have a hard time comprehending what kind of person you have to be to subscribe to this madness

[shakendfries]

So James Comey has come out and says that The Justice Dept needs to refute Trump's claims that Obama illegally ordered a wiretap of his campaign:

WASHINGTON — The F.B.I. director, James B. Comey, asked the Justice Department this weekend to publicly reject President Trump’s assertion that President Barack Obama ordered the tapping of Mr. Trump’s phones, senior American officials said on Sunday. Mr. Comey has argued that the highly charged claim is false and must be corrected, they said, but the department has not released any such statement.

Mr. Comey, who made the request on Saturday after Mr. Trump leveled his allegation on Twitter, has been working to get the Justice Department to knock down the claim because it falsely insinuates that the F.B.I. broke the law, the officials said.

A spokesman for the F.B.I. declined to comment. Sarah Isgur Flores, the spokeswoman for the Justice Department, also declined to comment.

Mr. Comey’s request is a remarkable rebuke of a sitting president, putting the nation’s top law enforcement official in the position of questioning Mr. Trump’s truthfulness.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/05/us/politics/trump-seeks-inquiry-into-allegations-that-obama-tapped-his-phones.html?action=Click&contentCollection=BreakingNews&contentID=64989981&pgtype=Homepage&smid=tw-nytimes&smtyp=cur&_r=0


This is why Trumptard's twitter rants are not cute, and are in fact, a bigger threat to this country's overall security than any Muslim or Mexican who doesn't have papers. When people realize this, it will be too late and frankly I hope the alphabet agents are pulling out all the stops to get so much dirt on this idiot that they'll ruin him because right now, every lie that he spouts to his cult is putting this country on a dangerous path.

Comey on the other hand, basically aided Trump with the whole Hillary email mess during the election and now is on the defensive now that Trump has lashed out at his agency. Funny part is, Trump's cult LOVED this dude 24 hours ago but now all over social media they want Trump to fire him. This is sick, and I really have a hard time comprehending what kind of person you have to be to subscribe to this madness

It's funny that you use the term cult. If you're familiar with the 48 laws of power, creating enemies is an essential part of developing a cult-like following. Given the fact that Trump's tweets came 24 hours after reports of Obama making his return to politics, I'm not putting any stock into it. When you think about it, Trump essentially laid allegations that are both unverifiable and simultaneously emboldened his supporters. It seems more like a political machination to me than anything legitimate.

[MrDollarBills]

^^^you nailed it.

I use the term cult because I really think that's what a good bit (not all, just based off of the lunacy I see on social media) of his supporters are, it's like a personality cult. They didn't even bother to verify what he was saying, they just took it at face value and then everything you see from them is "LOCK OBAMA UP! FIRE COMEY!!". Nevermind the fact that if the feds did get a warrant to wire tap him, then there must be some serious stuff going on that hasn't been made public due to an ongoing investigation.

like there's literally no critical thinking at all.

[NyCeEvO]

^^^you nailed it.

I use the term cult because I really think that's what a good bit (not all, just based off of the lunacy I see on social media) of his supporters are, it's like a personality cult. They didn't even bother to verify what he was saying, they just took it at face value and then everything you see from them is "LOCK OBAMA UP! FIRE COMEY!!". Nevermind the fact that if the feds did get a warrant to wire tap him, then there must be some serious stuff going on that hasn't been made public due to an ongoing investigation.

like there's literally no critical thinking at all.

When someone's words are always gospel truth to people, you have a cult following.

[Hello Brooklyn]

My whole thing is 8 years of Obama did absolutely nothing discernible to change the plight of minorities. In many ways, institutionalized instances of inequality have only gotten worse. As a result, the identity politics that the democratic side, as a whole, attempts to manipulate is grossly superficial to the point where their pandering is damn near offensive.

On top of all that, the leaks revealed that the DNC specifically advised HRC to ignore all and any policy suggestions from the protesters that were allegedly "on their side", in addition to implicating the DNC leadership engaging in a number of shady and illegal activities ranging from conspiring against other dems to even more foundation scandal.

Trump's rhetoric was awful and hurtful to a lot of people. There is no excuse for it to be involved in the highest position of office. And yet, it's difficult for me to agree with the notion that career politicians are the only ones fit to hold office in the country. They're so far removed from what life is like from their constituents and they generally have little to no professional experiences outside of capitol hill. You mean to tell me we should hire the people who were largely complicit in the way things are to this point and expect real meaningful changes to take place? I don't buy that 20 dubious years of scandalous political history automatically makes someone a better candidate than a tycoon who's rough around the edges. Saying "grab em by the pussy" is one thing, but actually making decisions to bomb people is another thing entirely

On the one hand, we have one party deliberately lying and making false promises to its primary audience to get votes while simultaneously likely to do nothing of significance for them, and on the other hand we have some dude who's been up front with his agenda that largely seeks to promote enterprise and national security. One party busy making calls for war, and another making calls for walls in a preventative National Security effort. One party in cahoots with mainstream news outlets to avoid acknowledging any of this, and another that's always cast as ignorant/uneducated by those dismissive outlets.

The wildest thing to me is how for an entire year all the major news said this dude had no chance. He wins, and their new message is that the country is rioting and descending into chaos. Yet you walk outside and nothing has changed for most people, even the ones who may be bummed but are relatively calm. Even when claims are made that hate crimes is up, a year ago the news was showing minorities getting hemmed up and shot by the cops every day, but since that story no longer the flavor of the month we hear nothing about it anymore. Journalists are claiming, "calling us fake news is a racial slur", and yet these were the same outlets that sold the American public on the Iraq War without any questions as it was happening. So there has never ever been fake news huh? The WMDs weren't fake news? The dominant media's whole steez is funny style, and they have an overblown sense of importance.

I'm not a stan for either side but I don't buy into identity/respectability politics, and that the supporters for one side are more virtuous than the other.

I think the part about Obama is a fair point.

I think Obama being the first black President, he kind of went out of his way to avoid racial issues. Everytime anyone mentioned race, he feared losing his white voter base in the Mid West (which totally collapsed for Hillary in part because of how racialized the campaign became)

Obama did things to help the country as a whole, but he didn't do many specific things to combat racism.

As far as the HRC stuff, I mean she literally met with Bernie and changed several part of her platform to satisfy him.

As far as identity politics, I completely disagree. Racism and race need to be a part of our political discussion. Not talking about them doesn't make these things go away.

[Hello Brooklyn]

One point about Europe versus here re: Syrian refugees, I...and someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that Europe's refugee process is markedly different from how we were vetting and bringing in Syrian refugees over here, no? From what I saw (and know), Europe basically had a free for all, whereas our vetting process is pretty stringent with an emphasis on families.

I agree with serious vetting and background checks before letting people come over, which is as far as I know what we've been doing and it has not led to the problems that you see in Germany and other countries.

You are right about this.

Our process is way more complicated.

[MrDollarBills]

Read on Twitter

This is in reference to Ben Carson today saying that slaves brought over to this land during the trans Atlantic slave trade were "immigrants".

It amazes me how a man so intelligent can say things like this with a straight face. I really do have a lot of respect for Ben Carson, politics and religion aside but come on man

[bws94]

Read on Twitter

This is in reference to Ben Carson today saying that slaves brought over to this land during the trans Atlantic slave trade were "immigrants".

It amazes me how a man so intelligent can say things like this with a straight face. I really do have a lot of respect for Ben Carson, politics and religion aside but come on man

Maybe he's not so intelligent. Maybe he was just a brilliant surgeon.

[MrDollarBills]

Read on Twitter

This is in reference to Ben Carson today saying that slaves brought over to this land during the trans Atlantic slave trade were "immigrants".

It amazes me how a man so intelligent can say things like this with a straight face. I really do have a lot of respect for Ben Carson, politics and religion aside but come on man

Maybe he's not so intelligent. Maybe he was just a brilliant surgeon.

I would say that his career achievements require a good bit of intelligence...just not the kind that comes with making ignorant statements like that.