Woj pod with Ian Begley. Bashing the Knicks for 40mins.

[kane2021]

Was there an injury update in any of this investigative reporting briefing?


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[TankCommander17]

I don't get why people get mad when reporters point out the obvious. We suck. We are ran horribly. We make terrible mistakes like overpaying THjr. We should be made fun of.

Until this thing gets straightened out in hopefully a few years we are the laughing stock of the nba and rightfully so.

[Fat Kat]

KP still loves his fame and big city. Thats why he really wanted LA or NY to draft him.

Knicks have to screw up really bad for him to ask for a trade.

He better fulfill his potential or we'll regret not trading him. Let's refrain from clutching our pearls about his possible trade demands until then.

[Tron Carter]

just confirms what we already knew: jackson was one of the worst executives ever

AND YET

Teams wanted 1st's from NY in trades. Phil said FOH.

he's the only president that actually did this, which is all I really cared about

because that's how low standards are for executives of this team. doesn't matter if you sign a 31 year old aging center to the worst contract in the league. or insist on shoving an antiquated basketball system down the coach's throat. or alienate your star by bashing him in the media. as long as you do the bare minimum of not trading first round picks, you're good in my book.

[Billy Goat]

Listening to the podcast. It's basically 2 guys with second hand knowledge talking as if they have first hand knowledge.

Woj has fallen off. He's terrible now. The free agents argument is always tired. Which free agents? Greg Monroe? Oh no, what will we do without him. This reads like a Melo puff piece.

[ozwizard8]

KP still loves his fame and big city. Thats why he really wanted LA or NY to draft him.

Knicks have to screw up really bad for him to ask for a trade.

For now..
KAT going to play in playoffs soon and KP going to lose attention on him. Embiid and Sixers going to draw interest too.
It wont be easy for him to watch others playing at high level when he is stuck in this toxic franchise.
Fans around the league wouldnt blame KP to demand trade.
***
Getting guys like M.Beasley, J.Jack, E.Kanter wont help his situation.
S.Perry didnt do anything to make me believe he is a good GM. What so good about him? He came from Magic-Kings.
Those 2 franchises are competing against Knicks for the worst spot.
Orlando's last 5 years was awful. Its one of the worst rebuilding job around the league.


Knicks doesnt have an identity or strategy. They talk about rebuilding but they dont have a plan.
Why would you get E.Kanter? His game doesnt fit the modern basketball. You basically block Willy's development with stealing his minutes.
What is the purpose of M.Beasley signing? He would only help to get couple unnecessary wins and teaching some bad habits to our young players.

KP isnt Vucevic. He wont stay for years of 30 win seasons.

[vallen]

Listening to the podcast. It's basically 2 guys with second hand knowledge talking as if they have first hand knowledge.

Woj has fallen off. He's terrible now. The free agents argument is always tired. Which free agents? Greg Monroe? Oh no, what will we do without him. This reads like a Melo puff piece.

well to be fair, all journalists are hacks argument is pretty old too, we have been the laughing stock of franchises everywhere, and make it pretty easy for them.

[Billy Goat]

Listening to the podcast. It's basically 2 guys with second hand knowledge talking as if they have first hand knowledge.

Woj has fallen off. He's terrible now. The free agents argument is always tired. Which free agents? Greg Monroe? Oh no, what will we do without him. This reads like a Melo puff piece.

well to be fair, all journalists are hacks argument is pretty old too, we have been the laughing stock of franchises everywhere, and make it pretty easy for them.

Dont disagree. But these stupid arguments about what offense you're running in 2017 when everyone is basically interchangeable or not being able to sign **** free agents when we have zero draft picks is rubbish. Not signing free agents was/is a good thing with the current state of the franchise. Giving Hardaway money, in fact, was bad.

[dakomish23]

I doubt it. Pretty much everyone said the demand was too high. And if someone did offer 4 first round picks, then Dolan is dumb to veto that.

I don't trust PJax trade assesment skills, so I would not doubt him being amenable to a less than amazing trade.

Dolan cares about having a draw to sell tickets IMO. He won't move KP unless he's going to have another big name to market.

Whether you trust Phil or not, is irrelevant because every report said he was asking for a King's ransom that no one was willing to pay.

If you put your anti Phil bias aside for a moment, you'd probably come to the realization that the Melo trade to Houston was most likely the one vetoed, since the parameters of the deal were in place, and even Melo thought it was done.

Whether I trust PJax or not is relevant, because you brought up the possibility of Dolan turning down 4 1st round picks. I'm saying PJax wouldn't of even held out for that based on his track record.

Dolan said no to Ryan Anderson but was ok with Kanter? What does this imaginary anti Phil bias have to do with that logic?

I give credit to PJax for the few things he did right. I hold him accountable for the avalanche of things he did wrong. There's no bias either way.

[Sark]

The Knicks don’t play hardball.
We bend over.

if a player wants out bad enough, usually the team trades him. that goes for any team.

Is that why Philadelphia traded Noel (before the end of the contract) and Okafor?

When's the last time a team had what they thought was a franchise player and traded him because he asked out?

[god shammgod]

The Knicks don’t play hardball.
We bend over.

if a player wants out bad enough, usually the team trades him. that goes for any team.

Is that why Philadelphia traded Noel (before the end of the contract) and Okafor?

When's the last time a team had what they thought was a franchise player and traded him because he asked out?

noel they traded because they didn't want to pay him. okafor is not someone who anyone really wants. also, do you really think those guys are comparable in status to kp ? it's very rare that a guy gets drafted by a team and wants out right away. do i think kp will ask out before his contract ? no. but teams don't usually keep guys who are unhappy because it's bad for the team. it creates a bad environment. kyrie irving wanted out and got his wish with 3 years left on his deal.

[Tron Carter]

The Knicks don’t play hardball.
We bend over.

if a player wants out bad enough, usually the team trades him. that goes for any team.

Is that why Philadelphia traded Noel (before the end of the contract) and Okafor?

When's the last time a team had what they thought was a franchise player and traded him because he asked out?

[Sark]

if a player wants out bad enough, usually the team trades him. that goes for any team.

Is that why Philadelphia traded Noel (before the end of the contract) and Okafor?

When's the last time a team had what they thought was a franchise player and traded him because he asked out?

noel they traded because they didn't want to pay him. okafor is not someone who anyone really wants. also, do you really think those guys are comparable in status to kp ? it's very rare that a guy gets drafted by a team and wants out right away. do i think kp will ask out before his contract ? no. but teams don't usually keep guys who are unhappy because it's bad for the team. it creates a bad environment. kyrie irving wanted out and got his wish with 3 years left on his deal.

Kyrie had 2 years, and was way past his rookie deal. He would be an unrestricted free agent. KP is years away from unrestricted free agency, unless he does something insanely stupid and turn down boat loads of money. The first 7 years, the team has all the control, and the Knicks know that, and he just finished year 2. They have no reason give in to his demands.

And no, he is not signing the QO. Not after seeing Embiid and Wiggins sign $150m deals.

[Sark]

if a player wants out bad enough, usually the team trades him. that goes for any team.

Is that why Philadelphia traded Noel (before the end of the contract) and Okafor?

When's the last time a team had what they thought was a franchise player and traded him because he asked out?

Explained below. He was not on a rookie deal. Didn't realize I had to include that caveat, since it should have be assumed considering that KP is on his.

[Sark]

Here I'll make the bet with any of you. Ban bet, sig bet, money bet, whatever. You choose.

The Knicks do not trade KP, and he does not sign the QO, but rather signs an extension here. If any of those 2 things don't happen, you win.

Any takers?

[god shammgod]

Is that why Philadelphia traded Noel (before the end of the contract) and Okafor?

When's the last time a team had what they thought was a franchise player and traded him because he asked out?

noel they traded because they didn't want to pay him. okafor is not someone who anyone really wants. also, do you really think those guys are comparable in status to kp ? it's very rare that a guy gets drafted by a team and wants out right away. do i think kp will ask out before his contract ? no. but teams don't usually keep guys who are unhappy because it's bad for the team. it creates a bad environment. kyrie irving wanted out and got his wish with 3 years left on his deal.

Kyrie had 2 years, and was way past his rookie deal. He would be an unrestricted free agent. KP is years away from unrestricted free agency, unless he does something insanely stupid and turn down boat loads of money. The first 7 years, the team has all the control, and the Knicks know that, and he just finished year 2. They have no reason give in to his demands.

And no, he is not signing the QO. Not after seeing Embiid and Wiggins sign $150m deals.

he has 3 years left on his 5 year deal. the 5th year is an option.

i don't think kp takes the qo either. but if he told the knicks he wanted a trade and didn't back down from that, they would have to consider if it was worth it to sign and bring back an unhappy player. these guys have a lot of power. now i don't think he'll do that. but i wouldn't be surprised if he signed his deal and then asked out a year or two into it if the knicks are still terrible. he'll give them a couple more years to right the ship.

[Sark]

noel they traded because they didn't want to pay him. okafor is not someone who anyone really wants. also, do you really think those guys are comparable in status to kp ? it's very rare that a guy gets drafted by a team and wants out right away. do i think kp will ask out before his contract ? no. but teams don't usually keep guys who are unhappy because it's bad for the team. it creates a bad environment. kyrie irving wanted out and got his wish with 3 years left on his deal.

Kyrie had 2 years, and was way past his rookie deal. He would be an unrestricted free agent. KP is years away from unrestricted free agency, unless he does something insanely stupid and turn down boat loads of money. The first 7 years, the team has all the control, and the Knicks know that, and he just finished year 2. They have no reason give in to his demands.

And no, he is not signing the QO. Not after seeing Embiid and Wiggins sign $150m deals.

he has 3 years left on his 5 year deal. the 5th year is an option.

i don't think kp takes the qo either. but if he told the knicks he wanted a trade and didn't back down from that, they would have to consider if it was worth it to sign and bring back an unhappy player. these guys have a lot of power. now i don't think he'll do that. but i wouldn't be surprised if he signed his deal and then asked out a year or two into it if the knicks are still terrible. he'll give them a couple more years to right the ship.

You said teams usually give in. That is not true when a player is on a rookie deal, and the team has control. After the extension is signed, the clock starts till the player gets freedom. It's at the end of that deal when trades are made, because the team knows they can lose the player and get nothing.

Teams just don't trade young players on rookie deals that they want to keep. There is no reason for them to, and the new CBA gives more financial incentive for the player to stay with the team.

KP would have to desperately want out of NY to turn that money down. I really don't think he nor Jannis is that stupid to turn down the money, and risk an injury.


It's a different sport with different rules, but Odell Beckham was in a similar situation, and went out there and got hurt. He should have held out till he got a new deal from the Giants, and instead played and got hurt. Now I'm sure the Giants will give him an extension, but there is always a risk for a player, especially one that is young, to play with no new contract, and get hurt. Players of KP's height get hurt all the time. One torn ACL, and he would never see $150m again.

[stuporman]

So them two bumping uglies for 40mins is the most action they've gotten in their whole life...no clicks from me.

[Phish Tank]

There's a difference between Kyrie asking for a trade after already making money from his first extension and KP asking for a trade before his first major payday.

No sane person would leave millions of dollars like that. It's not sound business

[god shammgod]

Kyrie had 2 years, and was way past his rookie deal. He would be an unrestricted free agent. KP is years away from unrestricted free agency, unless he does something insanely stupid and turn down boat loads of money. The first 7 years, the team has all the control, and the Knicks know that, and he just finished year 2. They have no reason give in to his demands.

And no, he is not signing the QO. Not after seeing Embiid and Wiggins sign $150m deals.

he has 3 years left on his 5 year deal. the 5th year is an option.

i don't think kp takes the qo either. but if he told the knicks he wanted a trade and didn't back down from that, they would have to consider if it was worth it to sign and bring back an unhappy player. these guys have a lot of power. now i don't think he'll do that. but i wouldn't be surprised if he signed his deal and then asked out a year or two into it if the knicks are still terrible. he'll give them a couple more years to right the ship.

You said teams usually give in. That is not true when a player is on a rookie deal, and the team has control. After the extension is signed, the clock starts till the player gets freedom. It's at the end of that deal when trades are made, because the team knows they can lose the player and get nothing.

Teams just don't trade young players on rookie deals that they want to keep. There is no reason for them to, and the new CBA gives more financial incentive for the player to stay with the team.

KP would have to desperately want out of NY to turn that money down. I really don't think he nor Jannis is that stupid to turn down the money, and risk an injury.


It's a different sport with different rules, but Odell Beckham was in a similar situation, and went out there and got hurt. He should have held out till he got a new deal from the Giants, and instead played and got hurt. Now I'm sure the Giants will give him an extension, but there is always a risk for a player, especially one that is young, to play with no new contract, and get hurt. Players of KP's height get hurt all the time. One torn ACL, and he would never see $150m again.

i can't think of a high profile player on a rookie deal who ever asked out recently to test this theory either way. marbury did it but i don't remember what the rookie deals were like back then. if there even was a qo. but he demanded a trade out of minny and specifically to the ny area and got his wish. but as i keep saying i don't think kp is gonna do this. not this quick at least.