ECSF: P1 | (2) Boston Celtics vs Philadelphia 76ers (3) | BOS 1-0

[ajones9219]

This is one of the greatest Homer threads I've ever witnessed

[ITYSL]

The proposed trade was Saric/Fultz/#10 with Fultz being the most valuable asset of the 3. Would be a very short-sighted move considering Kawhi's current situation. And nobody is saying Saric is as good as Hayward last year; just arguing against the idea that Saric being "a little worse" is laughable. It's not.

Can't wait to read the rest of these posts when I get a minute. Quality on here does not disappoint. Curious what the barometer for "little worse" is nowadays. Yikes.

Funny how a 1 time All-Star in the heart of his prime is suddenly regarded as a transcendent talent.

[GeorgeMarcus]

Can't wait to read the rest of these posts when I get a minute. Quality on here does not disappoint. Curious what the barometer for "little worse" is nowadays. Yikes.

Funny how a 1 time All-Star in the heart of his prime is suddenly regarded as a transcendent talent.

Well, if Hayward isn't being overvalued here then Saric is being undervalued. Nobody is saying they are equally as good, but as CoreyGallagher pointed out Saric is further along in his development than Hayward was at this point in his career.

It seems Celtics fans would rather use the "you're a homer!" argument than to discuss facts.

[CoreyGallagher]

First Philly fans don't want to trade Saric for Kawhi, now Saric is as as good as Gordon Hayward?

What's going on here?

He's not as good as Hayward was last season. Regarding trading for Kawhi, it was suggested Saric, Fultz, and a first for Kawhi. Kawhi becomes an unrestricted FA after next season and there were a lot of red flags this season, there's also a realistic possibility of the 76ers signing PG13 or LBJ in the offseason. I'd want to see what unfolds.

It seems by comparing him to peak Hayward in this thread, the pendulum has swung too far the other way into underrating him as a sophomore. He is a valuable piece.

[eyeatoma]

Can we please stop overrating Dario Saric? Im a guy whos said he has all-star potential and that its possible that he could one day put up numbers similar to present day Blake Griffin in the right system as the top option.

But today? To call him a little worse than Hayward? Laughable take. Hes worlds behind Hayward as a player. Lets be serious now.

Why is he "world's behind Hayward"??

Hayward was the number one option and put up borderline all-star numbers...

He is a decent passer, and good rebounder for his position. Hayward is an excellent driver, but isn't particularly good finishing in traffic (he's he does dunk pretty well), but his body control is average. He is also a good 3 point shooter, but nothing spectacular.

Saric, is a feisty rebounder (better than Hawyard at the moment). He is definitely less athletic, and is plodding actually, He has a fantastic bball IQ, is a as good a defender as Hayward, and is an equal if not slighltly better 3 point shooter (see volume). He is an underrated passer. Passing was actually his calling card, and when the offense runs through him, he's good. The only think Hayward has on him, is more usage and minutes, and better athleticism. How is he world's better?

Saric was quite impressive for a rookie last year when Embiid went down.

[eyeatoma]

Can we please stop overrating Dario Saric? Im a guy whos said he has all-star potential and that its possible that he could one day put up numbers similar to present day Blake Griffin in the right system as the top option.

But today? To call him a little worse than Hayward? Laughable take. Hes worlds behind Hayward as a player. Lets be serious now.

Hayward was a fringe top 30 player pre-injury, let's not go overboard here.

Most on Espn, nba.com, cbs all had Hayward in their top 20. Some had him as high as 15 so yeah no he’s not top 30. Maybe to Sixers fans who think each player on the Celtics is top 30 or worse.

Most on ESPN, CBS, Nba.com had the sixers not making the playoffs this year. The media have no idea about the Sixers... Nice try...

[76thBearCub]

First Philly fans don't want to trade Saric for Kawhi, now Saric is as as good as Gordon Hayward?

What's going on here?

Your taking a small but vocal minority and applying it to a large population maybe?

[eyeatoma]

Can we please stop overrating Dario Saric? Im a guy whos said he has all-star potential and that its possible that he could one day put up numbers similar to present day Blake Griffin in the right system as the top option.

But today? To call him a little worse than Hayward? Laughable take. Hes worlds behind Hayward as a player. Lets be serious now.

Hayward was a fringe top 30 player pre-injury, let's not go overboard here.

And where do you rank Saric?

This year? Top 35-top 40... Again like I said, slightly worse than Hayward...I could see being a little worse at top 50

[eyeatoma]

And where do you rank Saric?

Probably in the 50-60 range, but the reality is the gap between 30 and 50 is much smaller than the gap between 30 and 10.

The reality is that Hayward was the 21st best player per all NBA votes last year. Saric wont come close to receiving any. Dismissing this is comical.

Again a popularity vote. And again, Hawyard was the lone offensive option on the Jazz. Two totally different situations.

[PierceFan4ever]

Hayward was a fringe top 30 player pre-injury, let's not go overboard here.

Most on Espn, nba.com, cbs all had Hayward in their top 20. Some had him as high as 15 so yeah no he’s not top 30. Maybe to Sixers fans who think each player on the Celtics is top 30 or worse.

Most on ESPN, CBS, Nba.com had the sixers not making the playoffs this year. The media have no idea about the Sisers... Nice try...

And that’s relevant how? He asked for links I gave him it. Yeah man nobody knows anything about the Sixers. Saric > Hayward Simmons = Magic Embiid = Kareem. We get it Sixers fans

[hookshot199]

Usually that is the case but teams like the pistons, warriors in 2015 and spurs have beaten superior talents. And Shaq and Kobe are so much better than billups and sheed. If you wanna say embiid and Simmons are better than kyrie and Hayward(which remains to be seen) it’s not by that margin and the rest is clearly better for the Celtics. Not to mention brown or Tatum could be one of our two best players going forward.

You still don't have a front court. Horford turns 32 in June and you got great play out of Baynes. You have a 2.9% chance to get a two or three pick in this year's draft. Not likely, but possible. More problematic, Horford's $30 mil doesn't come off the books until after the 2019-2020 season. If Embiid stays healthy, who defends him? Yes, Embiid turns the ball over more than he should, but he's a good passer and he makes more than 75% of his free throws - and he's a magnet for drawing fouls.

It’s all nonsense at this point. You don’t know what either Team will look like next year let alone 3 years from now. Maybe we will have a good big, maybe embiid will be hurt, maybe kyrie and Hayward never get healthy and play well, maybe LeBron goes to philly. This year sixers will win if the celts make it. Next year I’ll predict next year. Both have very bright futures and are set up to be good, we will see how many titles if any either of them win. Neither team is set as well as OKC was five years ago and look at them now.

What's with you? I'm not criticizing your players. I believe Horford is a very good player, but he's overpaid at $30 mil. Hayward is an excellent player. But is he worth $31 mil? Between the two of them, they eat up 55% of next year's cap.

But the bigger picture, you don't have a big. Horford is a savvy, extremely skilled stretch-4. He averages slightly more than seven rebounds per game and one block.

Your payroll's close to the cap at $107 mil. You're going to have to pay Baynes, who's an unrestricted free agent, $10 mil after the season he's had. Smart will get a similar payday to Robert Covington - $10-$15 mil/year. You'll have to match or lose him. And unless you get the Lakers pick - a 2.9% chance - you'll be drafting 27 this year. There are some good center prospects lower in the draft, but most of the better ones are in the top 10.

Next season will be a test. I have no doubt that you're loaded at two and three and have an all-star caliber point guard. But Ainge has rolled the dice and you'll have to play small ball. You're locked in. At least that's how I see it. Danny has done it before - pulled a rabbit out of the hat - and if anyone can win with a small lineup it's Brad Stevens.

If you play the Sixers, it's going to give a lot of insight into both teams' strengths and weaknesses. It will essentially be one of the best if not best small-ball teams against potentially the best tall-ball team.

Here's your payroll - your best seven players without a center:

Hayward: $31 mil
Horford: $30 mil
Kyrie: $20 mil
Three-player total: $81 mil

Tatum, Morris, Jaylen Brown & Rozier: $20 mil.

Seven-player total: $101 mil

The arithmetic is what it is.

[ITYSL]

Funny how a 1 time All-Star in the heart of his prime is suddenly regarded as a transcendent talent.

Well, if Hayward isn't being overvalued here then Saric is being undervalued. Nobody is saying they are equally as good, but as CoreyGallagher pointed out Saric is further along in his development than Hayward was at this point in his career.

It seems Celtics fans would rather use the "you're a homer!" argument than to discuss facts.

That has almost nothing to do with the fact that no Celtics fan said Hayward was a transcendent talent. A Celtics fan said he was top 15-20 last season and provided links. You ultimately replied with a strawman argument. Pretty simple.

I do think Saric is underrated fwiw

[GeorgeMarcus]

Most on Espn, nba.com, cbs all had Hayward in their top 20. Some had him as high as 15 so yeah no he’s not top 30. Maybe to Sixers fans who think each player on the Celtics is top 30 or worse.

Most on ESPN, CBS, Nba.com had the sixers not making the playoffs this year. The media have no idea about the Sisers... Nice try...

And that’s relevant how? He asked for links I gave him it. Yeah man nobody knows anything about the Sixers. Saric > Hayward Simmons = Magic Embiid = Kareem. We get it Sixers fans

Talk about a straw man argument.

[CoreyGallagher]

Simmons = Magic Embiid = Kareem. We get it Sixers fans

Eh, tbf, this is what the media's pushing. Which I will gladly accept.

[Rapaz]

Simmons = Michael Beasley with a broken shot

[CoreyGallagher]

Simmons = Michael Beasley with a broken shot

Simmons wishes.

[eyeatoma]

Most on Espn, nba.com, cbs all had Hayward in their top 20. Some had him as high as 15 so yeah no he’s not top 30. Maybe to Sixers fans who think each player on the Celtics is top 30 or worse.

Most on ESPN, CBS, Nba.com had the sixers not making the playoffs this year. The media have no idea about the Sisers... Nice try...

And that’s relevant how? He asked for links I gave him it. Yeah man nobody knows anything about the Sixers. Saric > Hayward Simmons = Magic Embiid = Kareem. We get it Sixers fans

Uhh what? Did I say that stuff about Simmons and Magic, and Embiid and Kareem. If you actually compare numbers, Simmons' are near identical to Magic's and his playoff numbers for the first round are just as good as a rookie. It remains to be seen if he'll have the same impact, but at the moment I wouldn't put it past him. He's that good Embiid = Kareem, is something that time will tell, but Embiid has that potential...

Back to relavancy, you're the one who brought it up. I was saying that the media stick their noses so far up the Cavs/Warriors/Lakers?Celtics asses, they don't have any knowledge of other teams. Us Sixers fans were saying that we would make the playoffs and some even had them winning 50 games. Most of the media thought, barely make playoffs, and a lot thought they would be in the lottery again. It is relavant because the media can barely figure out which is a good team with potential, let alone rank a player. DPOY, and the all-nba list is often a popularity contest. The more exposure you get on hot take shows like first take/undisputed/the herd the better chance you have in making one of those lists. Indy blogs/news sites have actual analysis, but 95% of mainstream media don't know **** about baskteball...

[GeorgeMarcus]

Well, if Hayward isn't being overvalued here then Saric is being undervalued. Nobody is saying they are equally as good, but as CoreyGallagher pointed out Saric is further along in his development than Hayward was at this point in his career.

It seems Celtics fans would rather use the "you're a homer!" argument than to discuss facts.

That has almost nothing to do with the fact that no Celtics fan said Hayward was a transcendent talent. A Celtics fan said he was top 15-20 last season and provided links. You ultimately replied with a strawman argument. Pretty simple.

I do think Saric is underrated fwiw

Not how the discussion went down. The overarching theme has been whether or not Saric being 'a little worse' than Hayward is a laughable statement. Based on the responses Hayward is either being overrated or Saric is being underrated.

[DROB27]

This is gonna be nuts if they play each other lol

Hopefully I’ll be able to get tickets

[SmartWentCrazy]

Can we please stop overrating Dario Saric? Im a guy whos said he has all-star potential and that its possible that he could one day put up numbers similar to present day Blake Griffin in the right system as the top option.

But today? To call him a little worse than Hayward? Laughable take. Hes worlds behind Hayward as a player. Lets be serious now.

Why is he "world's behind Hayward"...

Hayward was the number one option and put up borderline all-star numbers...

He is a decent passer, and good rebounder for his position. Hayward is an excellent driver, but isn't particularly good finishing in traffic (he's he does dunk pretty well), but his body control is average. He is also a good 3 point shooter, but nothing spectacular.

Saric, is a feisty rebounder (better than Hawyard at the moment). He is definitely less athletic, and is plodding actually, He has a fantastic bball IQ, is a as good a defender as Hayward, and is an equal if not slighltly better 3 point shooter (see volume). He is an underrated passer. Passing was actually his calling card, and when the offense runs through he, he's good. The only think Hayward has on him, is more usage and minutes, and better athleticism. How is he world's better?

Saric was quite impressive for a rookie last year when Embiid went down.

Hayward won a playoff series, largely by himself. He averaged 24-7-3 on 47/45/96 shooting. His per game averages dont do it justice, either, as theyre biased downward by a game where he got hurt and played 9 minutes.

Dont tell me Rudy Gobert led them to that victory, either. He missed 3 games and was hobbled for the 4 others, playing 107 minutes total.

Talk to me when Saric is capable of doing that— he may be one day but he certainly cannot now.