The Draft Thread: Ayton Vs Doncic 1

[Stix]

Watch on YouTube

I would recommend this, every made FG from Luka in ACB (this season)..

What about all the ones he missed?

[BobbieL]

So if the pick is Doncic - would that make Smart the better candidate for his defense ability as the offguard as wouldn't need a playmaker but more defender Marcus Smart is one tough SOB - and I mean that in a good way. Granted, would love Rozier but that's not happening.

[Don7]

Watch on YouTube

I would recommend this, every made FG from Luka in ACB (this season)..

What about all the ones he missed?

I am not sure that official site of the league he won the MVP will make one but if they do , il make sure to post it

[TheLogician]

Doncic is about as slow and plodding as Gilgeous-Alexander but he lacks the quick burst in driving to the hoop. He doesn't have the strength to finish through contact, either. His craftiness will help make up some of the difference but most of his scoring will come from improved shooting. Trae Young is a much better offensive prospect despite his size, imho.

Ah! Our first disagreement. Trae is dynamic and a favorite of mine regardless of his height, however, Doncic can do what Trae does, also Doncic can do what Trae can’t; create space using his size, score in the post, pass over shorter defenders, navigate in traffic while facing intense ball pressure. Doncic size and strength gives him a huge offensive advantage including ORB.

Trae is much better at finding his shot on the perimeter and navigating in traffic. The ball has a shorter distance to travel from the ground back up to his hand, and he can also hide behind screens and use his quickness to get to the rim. He finishes very well and gets tons of and 1s. Doncic averaged .9 ORB in 25 minutes this season, so I wouldn't count on that being a huge part of his game.

[TheLogician]

And the great thing about Trae is he does create space but doesn't need much to get a shot off, similar to Curry.

[Bob8]

Doncic is about as slow and plodding as Gilgeous-Alexander but he lacks the quick burst in driving to the hoop. He doesn't have the strength to finish through contact, either. His craftiness will help make up some of the difference but most of his scoring will come from improved shooting. Trae Young is a much better offensive prospect despite his size, imho.

When you people will see him in person and realizied how big he is, this stupid comparison about his quickness will stop.

Your Gm on his physicality,

https://www.eurohoops.net/en/nba-news/683804/suns-gm-on-doncic-i-dont-have-any-concerns-with-him-physically/

but big is not necessary a good thing, is he thick because he is big boned or is it because he is simply chabby because he likes snacks too much, like Chriss in the summer league last year? like Star Lord Doncic is a sandwich from being fat, his arms have no tone and definition. you know who Doncic's body reminds me of? Brian Cardinal.

near 6’9”, 230 guard/point forward is for sure bad thing.

[SuperSunsFan]

When you people will see him in person and realizied how big he is, this stupid comparison about his quickness will stop.

Your Gm on his physicality,

https://www.eurohoops.net/en/nba-news/683804/suns-gm-on-doncic-i-dont-have-any-concerns-with-him-physically/

but big is not necessary a good thing, is he thick because he is big boned or is it because he is simply chabby because he likes snacks too much, like Chriss in the summer league last year? like Star Lord Doncic is a sandwich from being fat, his arms have no tone and definition. you know who Doncic's body reminds me of? Brian Cardinal.

near 6’9”, 230 guard/point forward is for sure bad thing.

not if he is expected to play point guard and has Brian Cardinal's athleticism. The people who want us to draft Doncic, another wing on top of the 4 we already have (Booker, Warren, JJ, Bender) are those who said we should not draft Tatum because he was too similar to Warren or we should not draft Murray or Buddy Hield because they played the same position as Booker. Why are we stacking wings again like we stacked undersized Point guards a few year back? Have we even asked JJ and Booker if they like the idea of sharing the ball with another initiator like we asked Bledsoe and Goran if they wanted another PG to take the ball out of their hand. Suns fans never learn, long jam hurts chemistry because everyone is unhappy with situation.

When you have two equally talented prospects one plays the position you need and one plays the position you are stacked you pick the one you need. pick need over talent is bad if you are reaching to pick a less talented player over more talented ones based on need, not when they are rated equally talent wise and arguably most experts believe Ayton is the more talented safer pick. Those who are hyping up Doncic like the next Lebron are the exact same people who said Bender would be the greatest can't miss transcendent generational multiple dimensional international star greater than Dirk based on some star trek level metric and statistic system developed by aliens far more advanced than human.

The whole point about playing three wings is advantageous because defensive versatility of the the lineup could be a good counter measure to limit mismatching against switching in the modern era makes no sense to me. When Doncic is such a bad defender he will be a bad defender no matter who he gets switched to defensively. Doncic can't guard players his size because his lack of lateral quickness, and he still can't guard guards smaller than him because of his lack of speed.

[sunsbg]

but big is not necessary a good thing, is he thick because he is big boned or is it because he is simply chabby because he likes snacks too much, like Chriss in the summer league last year? like Star Lord Doncic is a sandwich from being fat, his arms have no tone and definition. you know who Doncic's body reminds me of? Brian Cardinal.

near 6’9”, 230 guard/point forward is for sure bad thing.

not if he is expected to play point guard and has Brian Cardinal's athleticism. The people who want us to draft Doncic, another wing on top of the 4 we already have (Booker, Warren, JJ, Bender) are those who said we should not draft Tatum because he was too similar to Warren or we should not draft Murray or Buddy Hield because they played the same position as Booker. Why are we stacking wings again like we stacked undersized Point guards a few year back? Have we even asked JJ and Booker if they like the idea of sharing the ball with another initiator like we asked Bledsoe and Goran if they wanted another PG to take the ball out of their hand. Suns fans never learn, long jam hurts chemistry because everyone is unhappy with situation.

When you have two equally talented prospects one plays the position you need and one plays the position you are stacked you pick the one you need. pick need over talent is bad if you are reaching to pick a less talented player over more talented ones based on need, not when they are rated equally talent wise and arguably most experts believe Ayton is the more talented safer pick. Those who are hyping up Doncic like the next Lebron are the exact same people who said Bender would be the greatest can't miss transcendent generational multiple dimensional international star greater than Dirk based on some star trek level metric and statistic system developed by aliens far more advanced than human.

The whole point about playing three wings is advantageous because defensive versatility of the the lineup could be a good counter measure to limit mismatching against switching in the modern era makes no sense to me. When Doncic is such a bad defender he will be a bad defender no matter who he gets switched to defensively. Doncic can't guard players his size because his lack of lateral quickness, and he still can't guard guards smaller than him because of his lack of speed.

In addition the argument that wings win you the title is less and less valid, just look at the conference finals. The Rockets are leading with less talented wings than the Warriors, who are playing a small ball lineup.

[jcsunsfan]

Watch on YouTube

I would recommend this, every made FG from Luka in ACB (this season)..

What about all the ones he missed?

This is what I hate about highlight reels. You can get a sense of athleticism and skill set. But you do not get a sense of consistency, shot choice, and other flaws.

It's something though.

[sunsbg]

Watch on YouTube

I would recommend this, every made FG from Luka in ACB (this season)..

What about all the ones he missed?

This is what I hate about highlight reels. You can get a sense of athleticism and skill set. But you do not get a sense of consistency, shot choice, and other flaws.

It's something though.

So true, I would still get Ayton based on highlight videos, despite I'm not that impressed when watching his misses in the full coverage videos.

[SuperSunsFan]

near 6’9”, 230 guard/point forward is for sure bad thing.

not if he is expected to play point guard and has Brian Cardinal's athleticism. The people who want us to draft Doncic, another wing on top of the 4 we already have (Booker, Warren, JJ, Bender) are those who said we should not draft Tatum because he was too similar to Warren or we should not draft Murray or Buddy Hield because they played the same position as Booker. Why are we stacking wings again like we stacked undersized Point guards a few year back? Have we even asked JJ and Booker if they like the idea of sharing the ball with another initiator like we asked Bledsoe and Goran if they wanted another PG to take the ball out of their hand. Suns fans never learn, long jam hurts chemistry because everyone is unhappy with situation.

When you have two equally talented prospects one plays the position you need and one plays the position you are stacked you pick the one you need. pick need over talent is bad if you are reaching to pick a less talented player over more talented ones based on need, not when they are rated equally talent wise and arguably most experts believe Ayton is the more talented safer pick. Those who are hyping up Doncic like the next Lebron are the exact same people who said Bender would be the greatest can't miss transcendent generational multiple dimensional international star greater than Dirk based on some star trek level metric and statistic system developed by aliens far more advanced than human.

The whole point about playing three wings is advantageous because defensive versatility of the the lineup could be a good counter measure to limit mismatching against switching in the modern era makes no sense to me. When Doncic is such a bad defender he will be a bad defender no matter who he gets switched to defensively. Doncic can't guard players his size because his lack of lateral quickness, and he still can't guard guards smaller than him because of his lack of speed.

In addition the argument that wings win you the title is less and less valid, just look at the conference finals. The Rockets are leading with less talented wings than the Warriors, who are playing a small ball lineup.

anyone else also noticed the hypocrisy about Doncic's fanatics that they keep dissing Ayton by claiming in the modern era height is no longer a factor quickness is everything but continues to promote Doncic's height advantage over other guards and downplay Doncic's lack of quickness. if the playoffs show us anything quickness in the key for successful regardless of size with perimeter players, but then Doncic fanatics continue to urge us to pick a slow big guard who will have problems keeping up with anyone defensively. Doncic is 6'9, Ayton is 7'1. Ayton is merely 4 inch taller but a world faster than Doncic, why do his supporters think Doncic can guard 1s but Ayton can't?

[Bob8]

but big is not necessary a good thing, is he thick because he is big boned or is it because he is simply chabby because he likes snacks too much, like Chriss in the summer league last year? like Star Lord Doncic is a sandwich from being fat, his arms have no tone and definition. you know who Doncic's body reminds me of? Brian Cardinal.

near 6’9”, 230 guard/point forward is for sure bad thing.

not if he is expected to play point guard and has Brian Cardinal's athleticism. The people who want us to draft Doncic, another wing on top of the 4 we already have (Booker, Warren, JJ, Bender) are those who said we should not draft Tatum because he was too similar to Warren or we should not draft Murray or Buddy Hield because they played the same position as Booker. Why are we stacking wings again like we stacked undersized Point guards a few year back? Have we even asked JJ and Booker if they like the idea of sharing the ball with another initiator like we asked Bledsoe and Goran if they wanted another PG to take the ball out of their hand. Suns fans never learn, long jam hurts chemistry because everyone is unhappy with situation.

When you have two equally talented prospects one plays the position you need and one plays the position you are stacked you pick the one you need. pick need over talent is bad if you are reaching to pick a less talented player over more talented ones based on need, not when they are rated equally talent wise and arguably most experts believe Ayton is the more talented safer pick. Those who are hyping up Doncic like the next Lebron are the exact same people who said Bender would be the greatest can't miss transcendent generational multiple dimensional international star greater than Dirk based on some star trek level metric and statistic system developed by aliens far more advanced than human.

The whole point about playing three wings is advantageous because defensive versatility of the the lineup could be a good counter measure to limit mismatching against switching in the modern era makes no sense to me. When Doncic is such a bad defender he will be a bad defender no matter who he gets switched to defensively. Doncic can't guard players his size because his lack of lateral quickness, and he still can't guard guards smaller than him because of his lack of speed.

Doncic can guard Pfs. But please tell me how small guards will guard one of Booker, JJ, Doncic?

And just stop with 2/1 Bender. He was bust in Europe, they had even have to put him in B team.

Anyway it will be interesting to watch Doncic and Ayton in next years. I have a feeling some people will be very surprised.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

I don't understand why posters feel the **** all over their non-preferred prospect. In most drafts, IMO, all of Ayton/Doncic/Bagley/Jackson/Bamba/Young would be in consideration for the #1 pick. This draft is just that good.

Personally, I'm convinced we'll select Ayton. I think if Doncic slips to 4, and the Grizzlies aren't in love, we will have a very strong offer prepared for them. The big concern there - as we've discussed - would be having to hand out two max contracts in the same summer to Ayton and Doncic.

... After considering what it would likely cost to move up for Doncic, I'm not sure I would go through with it. We're going to need depth, and we're going to need financial flexibility. I'd be worried about our ability to not only retain a Big 4 of Booker/Jackson/Doncic/Ayton, but also our ability to surround them with the supporting talent necessary to make it work. I look at the Warriors' struggles with Houston - their problem isn't talent, but depth. I'm not sure I want to put the pedal to the floor in creating the same unsustainable situation for ourselves.

[Midnight_Suns]

Don7 and Bob8 are obviously the same person.

[SuperSunsFan]

I don't understand why posters feel the **** all over their non-preferred prospect. In most drafts, IMO, all of Ayton/Doncic/Bagley/Jackson/Bamba/Young would be in consideration for the #1 pick. This draft is just that good.

Personally, I'm convinced we'll select Ayton. I think if Doncic slips to 4, and the Grizzlies aren't in love, we will have a very strong offer prepared for them. The big concern there - as we've discussed - would be having to hand out two max contracts in the same summer to Ayton and Doncic. But if it works, that's rings, fellas.

because no matte how good a draft is a darko milicic will always be lurking in the dark waiting to prey on a unfortunate team and no team wants to be the Pistons. I am passionate about it because I feel like Doncic is the Darko this year. Many Doncic fanatics want to convince you Ayton is Sam Bowie but Ayton is more likely to be Olajuwon. I accept that there is a chance Ayton will be a bust, there is a chance for every talent prospect to become a bust for many unforeseeable reasons including injuries, what I don't like is how Doncic fanatics think Doncic is this can't miss impossible to bust super talent next lebron who likes to nitpick every problem Ayton has but downplay Doncic's world of shortcomings that give him as much chance to bust as everyone else. They try to convince us How perfect Doncic is with some highlight reels with him schooling some third rate European players, if we judge a player by his highlight reels only Cedi Osman would be just as great as Doncic is since there are tons of video of him playing like Simmons as well.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

I don't understand why posters feel the **** all over their non-preferred prospect. In most drafts, IMO, all of Ayton/Doncic/Bagley/Jackson/Bamba/Young would be in consideration for the #1 pick. This draft is just that good.

Personally, I'm convinced we'll select Ayton. I think if Doncic slips to 4, and the Grizzlies aren't in love, we will have a very strong offer prepared for them. The big concern there - as we've discussed - would be having to hand out two max contracts in the same summer to Ayton and Doncic. But if it works, that's rings, fellas.

because no matte how good a draft is a darko milicic will always be lurking in the dark waiting to prey on a unfortunate team and no team wants to be the Pistons.

at the notion that Doncic could possibly be a Darko Milicic.

[sunsbg]

near 6’9”, 230 guard/point forward is for sure bad thing.

not if he is expected to play point guard and has Brian Cardinal's athleticism. The people who want us to draft Doncic, another wing on top of the 4 we already have (Booker, Warren, JJ, Bender) are those who said we should not draft Tatum because he was too similar to Warren or we should not draft Murray or Buddy Hield because they played the same position as Booker. Why are we stacking wings again like we stacked undersized Point guards a few year back? Have we even asked JJ and Booker if they like the idea of sharing the ball with another initiator like we asked Bledsoe and Goran if they wanted another PG to take the ball out of their hand. Suns fans never learn, long jam hurts chemistry because everyone is unhappy with situation.

When you have two equally talented prospects one plays the position you need and one plays the position you are stacked you pick the one you need. pick need over talent is bad if you are reaching to pick a less talented player over more talented ones based on need, not when they are rated equally talent wise and arguably most experts believe Ayton is the more talented safer pick. Those who are hyping up Doncic like the next Lebron are the exact same people who said Bender would be the greatest can't miss transcendent generational multiple dimensional international star greater than Dirk based on some star trek level metric and statistic system developed by aliens far more advanced than human.

The whole point about playing three wings is advantageous because defensive versatility of the the lineup could be a good counter measure to limit mismatching against switching in the modern era makes no sense to me. When Doncic is such a bad defender he will be a bad defender no matter who he gets switched to defensively. Doncic can't guard players his size because his lack of lateral quickness, and he still can't guard guards smaller than him because of his lack of speed.

Doncic can guard Pfs. But please tell me how small guards will guard one of Booker, JJ, Doncic?

And just stop with 2/1 Bender. He was bust in Europe, they had even have to put him in B team.

Anyway it will be interesting to watch Doncic and Ayton in next years. I have a feeling some people will be very surprised.

You sure about that ??? Yeah, some people expecting him to be the next Simmons will be veeeery surprised

[J_T]

Watch on YouTube

I would recommend this, every made FG from Luka in ACB (this season)..

What about all the ones he missed?

You can make that video. Post the link.

[Don7]

Don7 and Bob8 are obviously the same person.

Yeah , we both like Luka , must be the same person.And not once did i mention Ayton or say anything negative about him , because i like him as prospect.Obviously not as much like Luka , but no reason to put DeAndre down.

ACB posted new video about Luka , i posted it and next question was "where are the misses?" like ****..People are unfair to both of them.Ten years ago i cant imagine what would people write about Harden and his 3/18 FG flamout in NCAA tournament.

Seems to me that everybody is mentally prepare for Ayton because he seems to be a choice (i am pretty sure) so its easier to nitpick Doncic.I guess if ther was indication that he was the preferred choice , Ayton would get the same treatment.

[Kerrsed]

Don7 and Bob8 are obviously the same person.

I can assure you that they are not, and live in completely different countries.