Wiretap: Bulls Hope To Re-Sign Zach LaVine At $14M-$16M

[Hangtime84]

GarPax should sign him for 2 more years just to be a tank commander. Zach drags his teams down big time, and the Bulls need way more talent from the draft.

Are you a Wolves fan and just trolling us on LaVine/Dunn?

Timberbulls fan.

[Truebiscuit]

I just have to shake my head at how some fans here think LaVine is done growing as a player. My good God, he JUST turned 23 years old and has played under 3 different coaches/schemes in 4 seasons. Let him put down his roots in a system and grow. I like him as a 2 guard and at times, if we go 5-out offensively, I like him with the ball in his hands going one-on-one with any defender in the NBA. He is oozing potential; I watched him in person numerous times and the way he glides on the court with world-class athletes to me looks like he's playing on a whole different level. Let him and the team harness that before we say he's done growing as a player... simply ridiculous to think that at this point in his career, coming off a torn ACL and playing in only 24 games as a Chicago Bull.

The kid is athletic, super hardworking, and a team-first guy (based on reports from some of our beat writers). I hope he doesn't go anywhere and that after the All-Star break this season our team takes off. I can't **** wait.

[johnnyvann840]

My biggest issue with Lavine remains that I don't view him as a 1st option, and I worry with his mentality of icing out Lauri and trying to force himself into that role. We saw that happen last year too often. Maybe it was because Lauri was a rookie so he kind took a back seat because of that. Hopefully Lauri becomes more vocal and starts demanding the ball in certain situations.

Also, I think if Lavine remains off the ball more, you take away the likeliness of him taking bad shots away from him.

We are going to know right away when/if Lavine is retained how this is going to go. Lauri averaged 6 three pt attempts per game prior to Lavine coming on the scene. Once Zach came back, Lauri hardly saw the ball, he had 6 games where he didn't even attempt a single 3. SIX games. For a guy averaging 5.9 threes per game. This just CANNOT happen. The team started playing at a historically bad level again (of course we started the season off the same way even without Lavine). But Lauri did get frozen out of the offense with Lavine on the floor. Most of our players did. Nobody improved. Everybody got worse and out of rhythm.

Lavine had a usage rate of 30, which is almost the same as Lebron James and 5 pts higher than Jimmy Butler (Mr. iso). How are any of our young players going to develop with somebody dominating the ball like that? It would be one thing to have that usage and actually be LIKE Lebron James who distributes the ball all over the place. Draws attention and makes smart passes? But, Lavine has that usage and averages less than 3 assists. That will not fly. Fred needs to get a grasp on this early and nip it in the bud if it starts up again.

[TheSuzerain]

Bulls should try to sign Lavine for a contract commiserate with a 6th man. Longer the better. Ideally with a team option for the last year.

Contract should also be as front-loaded as possible.

[johnnyvann840]

I just have to shake my head at how some fans here think LaVine is done growing as a player..

Nobody has said this.

[Truebiscuit]

I just have to shake my head at how some fans here think LaVine is done growing as a player..

Nobody has said this.

Dude people here have said to let him walk for Sean Kilpatrick because they've put up similar numbers.

You have bagged on is bball-IQ, citing that it's innate and not something that can develop over time, etc.

[khufure]

I just have to shake my head at how some fans here think LaVine is done growing as a player. My good God, he JUST turned 23 years old and has played under 3 different coaches/schemes in 4 seasons. Let him put down his roots in a system and grow. I like him as a 2 guard and at times, if we go 5-out offensively, I like him with the ball in his hands going one-on-one with any defender in the NBA. He is oozing potential; I watched him in person numerous times and the way he glides on the court with world-class athletes to me looks like he's playing on a whole different level. Let him and the team harness that before we say he's done growing as a player... simply ridiculous to think that at this point in his career, coming off a torn ACL and playing in only 24 games as a Chicago Bull.

The kid is athletic, super hardworking, and a team-first guy (based on reports from some of our beat writers). I hope he doesn't go anywhere and that after the All-Star break this season our team takes off. I can't **** wait.

No denying he's been a net negative his entire career, though. He needs to grow in that area more than learn schemes or whatever.

[Truebiscuit]

I just have to shake my head at how some fans here think LaVine is done growing as a player. My good God, he JUST turned 23 years old and has played under 3 different coaches/schemes in 4 seasons. Let him put down his roots in a system and grow. I like him as a 2 guard and at times, if we go 5-out offensively, I like him with the ball in his hands going one-on-one with any defender in the NBA. He is oozing potential; I watched him in person numerous times and the way he glides on the court with world-class athletes to me looks like he's playing on a whole different level. Let him and the team harness that before we say he's done growing as a player... simply ridiculous to think that at this point in his career, coming off a torn ACL and playing in only 24 games as a Chicago Bull.

The kid is athletic, super hardworking, and a team-first guy (based on reports from some of our beat writers). I hope he doesn't go anywhere and that after the All-Star break this season our team takes off. I can't **** wait.

No denying he's been a net negative his entire career, though. He needs to grow in that area more than learn schemes or whatever.

That's 100% valid. Defense needs to improve by leaps and bounds.

[PrimzyBulls81]

The kid is athletic, super hardworking, and a team-first guy (based on reports from some of our beat writers). I hope he doesn't go anywhere and that after the All-Star break this season our team takes off. I can't **** wait.

Team first guy? Thats news for me

[Truebiscuit]

The kid is athletic, super hardworking, and a team-first guy (based on reports from some of our beat writers). I hope he doesn't go anywhere and that after the All-Star break this season our team takes off. I can't **** wait.

Team first guy? Thats news for me

Going off what beat writers have said about him, Markkanen and Dunn. Have you heard differently from people that are around these kids? I haven't heard any Jimmy Butler "no, that doesn't work for me" noise around him -- have you?

[Axolotl]

LaVine may be team first guy, but his game with the Bulls has not been.

I hope the tactics Hoiberg comes up with are along the lines of "pass or drive, do not pound. If you pound, you sit".

[Chi town]

I hope we get Lavine on a 4/60 deal. He will chill out and not try to earn his money having already signed.

[johnnyvann840]

I just have to shake my head at how some fans here think LaVine is done growing as a player..

Nobody has said this.

Dude people here have said to let him walk for Sean Kilpatrick because they've put up similar numbers.

You have bagged on is bball-IQ, citing that it's innate and not something that can develop over time, etc.

That is not what I said. I said Sean Kilpatrick actually put up better stats last season than Lavine. In pts per 36, in efficiency, 3 pt % and just about every advanced metric there is. Obviously, SK is several years older than Lavine and doesn't possess the athletic gifts. So, of course Lavine has greater upside. I said that based on the stats Kilpatrick can do what Lavine has done for a fraction of the cost.

I also never said Lavine cannot grow as a player. In fact, I said he MUST grow as a player or he isn't even worth the min. I meant it too. He would indeed be a rare bird and an outlier if he all of a sudden overcame four seasons of negative impact and became a net positive player all of a sudden.

Never did I say his basketball IQ cannot improve, I did say that it is one of the most inherent traits and the hardest to change. I meant that too.

---
Also, I think basketball IQ is one of the more inherent traits there is in the game. I agree it takes time for the game to slow down and for a player to be able to make good decisions but Zach is beyond that threshold. Should have been after his 2nd season. IMO, you kind of are born with it or you aren't. Instincts are the least changeable thing a player has. Instincts are instincts and after almost 7000 minutes in the league, you should have things figured out, at least to some degree greater than he has..........

Look, Lavine is a Bull and probably will be a Bull for at the near future. I am a Bulls fan. I hope he does get better. I hope he does figure things out and makes better decisions as a player. I hope he makes his teammates all better. I really do. I am just giving you my honest observations about what he's been and what I've seen. I'm not one to sugarcoat things. If Zach can prove me wrong and lead the Bulls to the promised land I will be the first to give him the credit and I will be the happiest person here about it. At least as happy as everyone else who is invested emotionally is this team.

I am skeptical that he can do a 180. I'll settle for gradual change and improvement. But if he comes out and tries to be a superstar when he's not and players like Lauri start disappearing in games because they never touch the ball and/or our young players and rookies are affected by his high usage and aren't getting a chance to develop, I will be here calling for his head, just the same.

[Truebiscuit]

Nobody has said this.

Dude people here have said to let him walk for Sean Kilpatrick because they've put up similar numbers.

You have bagged on is bball-IQ, citing that it's innate and not something that can develop over time, etc.

That is not what I said. I said Sean Kilpatrick actually put up better stats last season than Lavine. In pts per 36, in efficiency, 3 pt % and just about every advanced metric there is. Obviously, SK is several years older than Lavine and doesn't possess the athletic gifts. So, of course Lavine has greater upside. I said that based on the stats Kilpatrick can do what Lavine has done for a fraction of the cost.

I didn't say that you said we should let him walk for Kilpatrick -- that was a different poster and it was said.

I also never said Lavine cannot grow as a player. In fact, I said he MUST grow as a player or he isn't even worth the min. I meant it too. He would indeed be a rare bird and an outlier if he all of a sudden overcame four seasons of negative impact and became a net positive player all of a sudden.

Never did I say his basketball IQ cannot improve, I did say that it is one of the most inherent traits and the hardest to change. I meant that too.

We disagree here. I don't think understanding of basketball is inherent (do you mean innate?) necessarily -- I believe that, just like anything in life, the more experience you have in something the better you become at it; especially in sports.

Look, Lavine is a Bull and probably will be a Bull for at the near future. I am a Bulls fan. I hope he does get better. I hope he does figure things out and makes better decisions as a player. I hope he makes his teammates all better. I really do. I am just giving you my honest observations about what he's been and what I've seen. I'm not one to sugarcoat things. If Zach can prove me wrong and lead the Bulls to the promised land I will be the first to give him the credit and I will be the happiest person here about it. At least as happy as everyone else who is invested emotionally is this team.

Hey, I appreciate your honesty and your observations -- I really do. I just happen to disagree with you, which is fine and what makes talking about sports so much fun

I am skeptical that he can do a 180. I'll settle for gradual change and improvement. But if he comes out and tries to be a superstar when he's not and players like Lauri start disappearing in games because they never touch the ball and/or our young players and rookies are affected by his high usage and aren't getting a chance to develop, I will be here calling for his head, just the same.

I think once his contract gets signed and he gets to spend a full off-season/pre-season with us, we'll see a much more fluid Zach LaVine. He will look for his shot at times I'm sure, but I think if he's got his legs/wind about him Hoiberg will be running him around screens and getting him clean looks from 3 more than we'll see LaVine handling the ball.

[johnnyvann840]

inherent is what I said and what I meant... meaning it's something of nature or habit. Something that in you from the start. Something you are born with to some degree anyway.

Innate could be substituted I suppose in this connotation.

It's not that he cannot learn or his floor IQ cannot get better. I'm just saying that instincts are the hardest thing to change in a player and that is mostly what IQ consists of. It's mostly instincts. They can be developed. For instance, seeing the same defense over and over and learning to make the right read... it can certainly be done, but it's hard to learn and it is something that comes naturally to some players. You see it in kids all the time. They have it or they don't. They pick it up quickly, or they don't.

[ATRAIN53]

Simmons has mentioned this a few times and it's hard to disagree with the logic-

When a team says they will "match" any offers a RFA gets - then why would rival teams NOT offer max deals just to force the Bulls to match it and eat some of our cap.

I think the talent and his work ethic is there and would give him a huge 3 yr deal.
Zach, Tryrke and maybe Will Barton or Smart are the top SG options out there.
Zach has age and potential on all these guys. He'll get the biggest offer.

When does this have to be decided?
Who are we gonna look at at SG in SL as insurance in case he gets a massive offer from someone?
(We have Holiday but I don't think we get Zachs production out of Denzel or Nwaba)

I think Zach would sacrifice SOME $$$ to stay here. He was happy to get out of MN and if it's less than 10 million difference deciding between Chicago and a city like ATL, MEM or SAC over 4-5 years, I think he stays.

[blicka]

GarPax should sign him for 2 more years just to be a tank commander. Zach drags his teams down big time, and the Bulls need way more talent from the draft.

Enjoy the 1st round exits jimmy butler will lead you to , they will go no further than that.

Wiggins underachieving overrated ass 150 million dollar contract starts next season,towns is due for an extension this fall and jimmy has one year left on his contract and will be 30 when his new contract starts he'll get 25-30 million to miss his annual 15 games a year & lead them to 7-9 seeds if they can even keep him.Your team is f'd

[drosestruts]

Bulls should try to sign Lavine for a contract commiserate with a 6th man. Longer the better. Ideally with a team option for the last year.

Contract should also be as front-loaded as possible.

Right when Lou Williams signed that 3 year/$24m extension with the Clipper it, in my opinion, set LaVine's value. That's the going rate for a microwave scorer. Lou Will is about the win the 6th man of the year award, LaVine has a ways to go before he's even at Lou Will's level, no need to pay him like he's James Harden or something.

[the ultimates]

Simmons has mentioned this a few times and it's hard to disagree with the logic-

When a team says they will "match" any offers a RFA gets - then why would rival teams NOT offer max deals just to force the Bulls to match it and eat some of our cap.

I think the talent and his work ethic is there and would give him a huge 3 yr deal.
Zach, Tryrke and maybe Will Barton or Smart are the top SG options out there.
Zach has age and potential on all these guys. He'll get the biggest offer.

When does this have to be decided?
Who are we gonna look at at SG in SL as insurance in case he gets a massive offer from someone?
(We have Holiday but I don't think we get Zachs production out of Denzel or Nwaba)

I think Zach would sacrifice SOME $$$ to stay here. He was happy to get out of MN and if it's less than 10 million difference deciding between Chicago and a city like ATL, MEM or SAC over 4-5 years, I think he stays.

Opposing teams don't do that because at the end of the day the RFA team still has the ultimate say. You offer a player a max contract offer sheet, of course, they'll sign it. Now the player's current team can say that's too much money for us and not match. Now the offer sheet team has used up a chunk of its cap space trying to be slick.

[donaldtrump_00]

How good Lavine turns out to be is one of the biggest factors in whether or not this rebuild is going to be a success. If he does come back this year and gets back to being a guy who can average around 18 per game and shoot 3's at near 40%, and be somewhat efficient, and be at least decent on defense, it obviously will be huge in terms of filling the sg spot for the next 5 years or so.

If he either leaves in free agency, or comes back and doesn't perform any better than he did last year, it sets us back by one starter.

this is why i cant stand most bulls fans. these comments like this. first you say if he can avg around 18 ppg and near 40% threes. isnt that almost what he did coming off a serious injury feeling his body and game out. we know hes going to be better then that version. hes not rehabbing right now. hes busting his butt while your talking about him. this is pitiful these pro athletes have to hear or have people with little to know knowledge about sports try to dictate there career. no offense at all to you. just put yourself in his shoes.

you tore your acl and came back playing pretty good for a player off a bad injury. still explosive.just needs time to get his timing back and come back in shape. hes doing that now. like the other poster said. who really has more upside then him. if hes a athletic version of klay thompson im all for it. were in no shape to be letting players walk for free. who is the target if not lavine. some aging player who you or everyone else will be crying about next year. its embarassing sometimes to read some of these posts.

id go as far as saying that his cut off salary demands end right at 19 mill maybe 20. im not going above that. and if he does sign for that then it has to be a 3 year deal with the 3rd year team option. but i would get him back and i think that would do it. worst thing for him is that he averages 23 ppg and not being paid like it. he has a right to want more then 14 mill. players like wesley matthews got a 15 mill deal after coming off a injury hit season. do i need to bring up joakim noah. if he doesnt work out then trade him. hes claimed hes working on defense and we see the workouts. if hes not back in chi next year this whole front office including reinsdorf are complete frauds