Butler has requested a trade (Part II)

[urinesane]

I wish Taylor would have literally said he will be gone by Sunday.

I really hope you aren't in charge of negotiating anything of importance in your real life....

[AirP.]

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[ifrosty13]

You sound really defensive, I'm just applying history in past Riley trades. I have reiterated multiple times that if Minnesota finds a better deal, Riley will budge and throw in Richardson and the trade is done, but really don't think he has yet or we probably would have heard about an announcement a while back ago. All news outlet continue to say that Miami isn't offering Richardson and you're trying to attack me like I'm saying something blasphemous. Again, let me reiterate because it doesn't seem like I'm getting through to some here, I HAVE NO ISSUES WITH JRICH BEING ADDED TO THE DEAL, but also understand why Riley hasn't felt the need to offer him yet.

Not sure how that comes off as defensive, unless you are projecting something. It's just ya know...reality.

How is it reality that the deal doesn't get done without Richardson? Based on what? All I've read is there has been significant progress and at no point has Jrich or Bam been involved. Woj yesterday reported that Minnesota would prefer to have Jrich and Bam but at no point does it say that's part of the negotiation.

Deal is looking like what I thought it would - Winslow + Whiteside for Butler (and if we're taking Dieng then Timberwolves are taking Waiters unless a third team becomes part of it again).

[Macwolf527]

Josh Richardson is probably a great player who can play 3 positions at times...what I am trying to say isn't that he cannot do it, I am saying in the Western conference, if the Wolves hope to do anything, which opposing SF's can he nullify on playoff teams that dwarf him in size?

Not only the Western Conference, but being paired with Wiggins on the wing. Neither Richardson or Wiggins is a very good re-bounder from the SF position and both are very thin. Tobias Harris and Gallinari abused Wiggins last night. You have to have size in the post to help either one of them or the bigger SF's in the West would have a field day. Whiteside would have to be included in the deal to give you that size to protect the rim.

Another side note....I watched Wiggins last night kind of closely and dude looks lost on defense. He offered no weak side help to Towns, when Towns rotated over to help defensively and he was the constant victim of "give and go's" and his lackadaisical effort gave up to many easy lay ups. He's just not mentally sharp and plays with no fire whatsoever. I don't know if that is going to change, which is frightening for $144 million.

[AirP.]

More bits and pieces are being said.

Darren Wolfson of 1500 ESPN

The Wolves never wanted the trade request leaked. They were always willing to satisfy the trade request when it was made – what now? – two weeks ago today, two weeks ago in Los Angeles. But the Wolves had no intention of leaking said request. That was the Jimmy Butler side that leaked the request. The Wolves remain upset about that. So, I get a kick out of the Butler side – who’s been leaking everything, by the way. Well, I don’t want to say everything. But 98 percent of information you see out there is driven by the Butler side, OK. And they are upset a trade hasn’t been completed yet.

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[Worm Guts]

You sound really defensive, I'm just applying history in past Riley trades. I have reiterated multiple times that if Minnesota finds a better deal, Riley will budge and throw in Richardson and the trade is done, but really don't think he has yet or we probably would have heard about an announcement a while back ago. All news outlet continue to say that Miami isn't offering Richardson and you're trying to attack me like I'm saying something blasphemous. Again, let me reiterate because it doesn't seem like I'm getting through to some here, I HAVE NO ISSUES WITH JRICH BEING ADDED TO THE DEAL, but also understand why Riley hasn't felt the need to offer him yet.

Not sure how that comes off as defensive, unless you are projecting something. It's just ya know...reality.

How is it reality that the deal doesn't get done without Richardson? Based on what? All I've read is there has been significant progress and at no point has Jrich or Bam been involved. Woj yesterday reported that Minnesota would prefer to have Jrich and Bam but at no point does it say that's part of the negotiation.

Deal is looking like what I thought it would - Winslow + Whiteside for Butler (and if we're taking Dieng then Timberwolves are taking Waiters unless a third team becomes part of it again).

You have to offer something. The deal your suggesting seems incredibly unlikely unless includes draft picks.

[Dewey]

More bits and pieces are being said.

Darren Wolfson of 1500 ESPN

The Wolves never wanted the trade request leaked. They were always willing to satisfy the trade request when it was made – what now? – two weeks ago today, two weeks ago in Los Angeles. But the Wolves had no intention of leaking said request. That was the Jimmy Butler side that leaked the request. The Wolves remain upset about that. So, I get a kick out of the Butler side – who’s been leaking everything, by the way. Well, I don’t want to say everything. But 98 percent of information you see out there is driven by the Butler side, OK. And they are upset a trade hasn’t been completed yet.

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Agree with these comments as viable underlying issues ... Jimmy and his agent did not handle this well obviously, largely because I think they really believed that either teams would be knocking the door down with better offers or the Wolves would make a panic deal and settle quickly. Butler and his agent are both are looking like a couple "tools" right now.

[AirP.]

Agree with these comments as viable underlying issues ... Jimmy and his agent did not handle this well obviously, largely because I think they really believed that either teams would be knocking the door down with better offers or the Wolves would make a panic deal and settle quickly. Butler and his agent are both are looking like a couple "tools" right now.

Might be time for some different representation unless Butler told him to float that out there(which he may have).

Here's Bernie Lee's client list.
https://basketball.realgm.com/info/agent_clients/Bernie-Lee/209

Interesting, dead link(see our players in action) on the agent's website.
http://leebasket.com/

[ifrosty13]

Not sure how that comes off as defensive, unless you are projecting something. It's just ya know...reality.

How is it reality that the deal doesn't get done without Richardson? Based on what? All I've read is there has been significant progress and at no point has Jrich or Bam been involved. Woj yesterday reported that Minnesota would prefer to have Jrich and Bam but at no point does it say that's part of the negotiation.

Deal is looking like what I thought it would - Winslow + Whiteside for Butler (and if we're taking Dieng then Timberwolves are taking Waiters unless a third team becomes part of it again).

You have to offer something. The deal your suggesting seems incredibly unlikely unless includes draft picks.

It most likely will, I wouldn't be surprised if Riley throws 2 first rounders. Riley has never cared for draft picks.

[Slim Tubby]

You sound really defensive, I'm just applying history in past Riley trades. I have reiterated multiple times that if Minnesota finds a better deal, Riley will budge and throw in Richardson and the trade is done, but really don't think he has yet or we probably would have heard about an announcement a while back ago. All news outlet continue to say that Miami isn't offering Richardson and you're trying to attack me like I'm saying something blasphemous. Again, let me reiterate because it doesn't seem like I'm getting through to some here, I HAVE NO ISSUES WITH JRICH BEING ADDED TO THE DEAL, but also understand why Riley hasn't felt the need to offer him yet.

Not sure how that comes off as defensive, unless you are projecting something. It's just ya know...reality.

How is it reality that the deal doesn't get done without Richardson? Based on what? All I've read is there has been significant progress and at no point has Jrich or Bam been involved. Woj yesterday reported that Minnesota would prefer to have Jrich and Bam but at no point does it say that's part of the negotiation.

Deal is looking like what I thought it would - Winslow + Whiteside for Butler (and if we're taking Dieng then Timberwolves are taking Waiters unless a third team becomes part of it again).

This isn't meant to be disrespectful, frosty, but excluding your Rookie deals, you have just one valuable player based on performance, age, upside and contract and that player is obviously Richardson. The rest of your roster is a disaster with bloated contracts and players with crappy reputations (Whiteside & Waiters). You're asking us for the best player in the deal by far who has implied that he would re-sign with MIA and you also want to free up cap space by including terrible deals??? Riley made his bed with all these horrific contracts and I hope he's forced to sleep in it for another 2-3 years.

Richardson, Bam and Winslow/1st is the least I would accept from MIA but if I had my guess, Jimmy will be wearing a Wolves jersey at least to start the season. If Thibs takes back players like Whiteside and Waiters as key components in any deal, there will be about 12 people in the stands every night at Target Center and Taylor is at least smart enough to understand that.

[Nick K]

Part of me wonders if Flip's plan was to have Lavine to develop as a PG and slide Wiggins to the SG....

Yeah, but LaVine is one of the best catch and shoot players in the league...

Plus, Zach can shoot you back into a game in no time. I love that most about him.

[ifrosty13]

Not sure how that comes off as defensive, unless you are projecting something. It's just ya know...reality.

How is it reality that the deal doesn't get done without Richardson? Based on what? All I've read is there has been significant progress and at no point has Jrich or Bam been involved. Woj yesterday reported that Minnesota would prefer to have Jrich and Bam but at no point does it say that's part of the negotiation.

Deal is looking like what I thought it would - Winslow + Whiteside for Butler (and if we're taking Dieng then Timberwolves are taking Waiters unless a third team becomes part of it again).

This isn't meant to be disrespectful, frosty, but excluding your Rookie deals, you have just one valuable player based on performance, age, upside and contract and that player is obviously Richardson. The rest of your roster is a disaster with bloated contracts and players with crappy reputations (Whiteside & Waiters). You're asking us for the best player in the deal by far who has implied that he would re-sign with MIA and you also want to free up cap space by including terrible deals??? Riley made his bed with all these horrific contracts and I hope he's forced to sleep in it for another 2-3 years.

Richardson, Bam and Winslow/1st is the least I would accept from MIA but if I had my guess, Jimmy will be wearing a Wolves jersey at least to start the season. If Thibs takes back players like Whiteside and Waiters as key components in any deal, there will be about 12 people in the stands every night at Target Center and Taylor is at least smart enough to understand that.

The thing that you're not understanding is that I'm not here to compare what are the best assets or what would be the fair deal. I'm here to talk about what's being reported and make sense of it. I'm making hypothesis based on what has been put out while being logical and understanding that a lot of these reports need to be taken with a grain of salt as they are leaked for a reason by one side or the other. Here's what we know so far:

1. Jimmy Butler wants out of Minnesota
2. Thibodeau wants to try to fix it
3. Minnesota's front office has been reported as being unreasonable in their demands and are considered around the league to have little leverage.
4. Miami has been aggressive in their pursuit of a trade for Jimmy Butler.
5. Miami has made EVERYONE available to be talked about in trade conversation (that can currently be traded) with the exclusion of Josh Richardson and Bam Adebayo.
6. Minnesota prefers Bam and Josh involved in the trade talks.
7. No offers that have been made by Miami have included Josh or Bam.
8. Miami has made significant progress in a trade but recently hit a snag.

So if Miami hasn't made them available, and there has been significant progress and it has been reported by both sides that Minnesota is pretty much only having real talks with Miami (I'm assuming Stein sources came from Miami while Woj's came from Minnesota), why is it unreasonable to think that Minnesota is considering a trade that does not include Josh Richardson or Bam Adebayo? Why would they push to up their offer if no one is bidding against them?

In my opinion, Minnesota needs to find a team to offer something better to force Miami's hand, and it is my belief that only then Miami will feel forced to include Richardson in a deal, until then, I really can't see Riley get desperate -- they really want a backcourt involving both Butler and Jrich.

[urinesane]

You sound really defensive, I'm just applying history in past Riley trades. I have reiterated multiple times that if Minnesota finds a better deal, Riley will budge and throw in Richardson and the trade is done, but really don't think he has yet or we probably would have heard about an announcement a while back ago. All news outlet continue to say that Miami isn't offering Richardson and you're trying to attack me like I'm saying something blasphemous. Again, let me reiterate because it doesn't seem like I'm getting through to some here, I HAVE NO ISSUES WITH JRICH BEING ADDED TO THE DEAL, but also understand why Riley hasn't felt the need to offer him yet.

Not sure how that comes off as defensive, unless you are projecting something. It's just ya know...reality.

How is it reality that the deal doesn't get done without Richardson? Based on what? All I've read is there has been significant progress and at no point has Jrich or Bam been involved. Woj yesterday reported that Minnesota would prefer to have Jrich and Bam but at no point does it say that's part of the negotiation.

Deal is looking like what I thought it would - Winslow + Whiteside for Butler (and if we're taking Dieng then Timberwolves are taking Waiters unless a third team becomes part of it again).

Look I get it, I'm no rookie to these parts, you see weakness and want to exploit the situation as much as possible. The problem is you have a false sense of leverage that doesn't actually exist. Minnesota has something that Miami wants and it's something they can't just get by being patient and waiting. The Wolves (believe it or not) still have leverage because they don't HAVE to do sh*t, especially if it means shooting themselves in the dick to placate a 30 year old toddler having a temper tantrum in public.

Just because Jimmy says he WANTS to go to Miami doesn't really mean anything for the Wolves, because they are under no obligation to give a sh*t about what Jimmy wants. There's way more risk of opportunity lost on the side of Miami if they get too cheap and another team near the trade deadline has a better offer for the Wolves.

Don't forget, there's a lot of time before Jimmy's value becomes "nothing" to the Wolves (which considering just the cap space it would free up actually will never be the case since 20 mil IS SOMETHING).

Again, go outside (especially if you live in Florida) and get some sunshine, you are wasting your time trying to convince us that what you are saying should make sense (because it doesn't) when the reality is MIAMI NEEDS MINNESOTA MORE THAN MINNESOTA NEEDS MIAMI in this situation. Sit back, enjoy the sunshine, and get ready to have a great player (but an a$$hole) join your franchise... that is if Riley isn't a complete moron who isn't willing to throw in a decent prospect for a LEGIT All-NBA player.

Just because they are doing the dance doesn't mean it will change the outcome.

[Slim Tubby]

How is it reality that the deal doesn't get done without Richardson? Based on what? All I've read is there has been significant progress and at no point has Jrich or Bam been involved. Woj yesterday reported that Minnesota would prefer to have Jrich and Bam but at no point does it say that's part of the negotiation.

Deal is looking like what I thought it would - Winslow + Whiteside for Butler (and if we're taking Dieng then Timberwolves are taking Waiters unless a third team becomes part of it again).

This isn't meant to be disrespectful, frosty, but excluding your Rookie deals, you have just one valuable player based on performance, age, upside and contract and that player is obviously Richardson. The rest of your roster is a disaster with bloated contracts and players with crappy reputations (Whiteside & Waiters). You're asking us for the best player in the deal by far who has implied that he would re-sign with MIA and you also want to free up cap space by including terrible deals??? Riley made his bed with all these horrific contracts and I hope he's forced to sleep in it for another 2-3 years.

Richardson, Bam and Winslow/1st is the least I would accept from MIA but if I had my guess, Jimmy will be wearing a Wolves jersey at least to start the season. If Thibs takes back players like Whiteside and Waiters as key components in any deal, there will be about 12 people in the stands every night at Target Center and Taylor is at least smart enough to understand that.

The thing that you're not understanding is that I'm not here to compare what are the best assets or what would be the fair deal. I'm here to talk about what's being reported and make sense of it. I'm making hypothesis based on what has been put out while being logical and understanding that a lot of these reports need to be taken with a grain of salt as they are leaked for a reason by one side or the other. Here's what we know so far:

1. Jimmy Butler wants out of Minnesota
2. Thibodeau wants to try to fix it
3. Minnesota's front office has been reported as being unreasonable in their demands and are considered around the league to have little leverage.
4. Miami has been aggressive in their pursuit of a trade for Jimmy Butler.
5. Miami has made EVERYONE available to be talked about in trade conversation (that can currently be traded) with the exclusion of Josh Richardson and Bam Adebayo.
6. Minnesota prefers Bam and Josh involved in the trade talks.
7. No offers that have been made by Miami have included Josh or Bam.
8. Miami has made significant progress in a trade but recently hit a snag.

So if Miami hasn't made them available, and there has been significant progress and it has been reported by both sides that Minnesota is pretty much only having real talks with Miami (I'm assuming Stein sources came from Miami while Woj's came from Minnesota), why is it unreasonable to think that Minnesota is considering a trade that does not include Josh Richardson or Bam Adebayo? Why would they push to up their offer if no one is bidding against them?

In my opinion, Minnesota needs to find a team to offer something better to force Miami's hand, and it is my belief that only then Miami will feel forced to include Richardson in a deal, until then, I really can't see Riley get desperate -- they really want a backcourt involving both Butler and Jrich.

No....I get it. You do realize that all of these "credible" reports are being leaked by Riley and Butler's camp to pressure Thibs into making a crappy deal. At this point, there's nothing for you to make sense of because it's all fluff at this point. I appreciate your opinion and input on the subject, though....you grab the popcorn, I'll make the drinks and let's sit back and watch how this drama plays out!

[ifrosty13]

Not sure how that comes off as defensive, unless you are projecting something. It's just ya know...reality.

How is it reality that the deal doesn't get done without Richardson? Based on what? All I've read is there has been significant progress and at no point has Jrich or Bam been involved. Woj yesterday reported that Minnesota would prefer to have Jrich and Bam but at no point does it say that's part of the negotiation.

Deal is looking like what I thought it would - Winslow + Whiteside for Butler (and if we're taking Dieng then Timberwolves are taking Waiters unless a third team becomes part of it again).

Look I get it, I'm no rookie to these parts, you see weakness and want to exploit the situation as much as possible. The problem is you have a false sense of leverage that doesn't actually exist. Minnesota has something that Miami wants and it's something they can't just get by being patient and waiting. The Wolves (believe it or not) still have leverage because they don't HAVE to do sh*t, especially if it means shooting themselves in the dick to placate a 30 year old toddler having a temper tantrum in public.

Just because Jimmy says he WANTS to go to Miami doesn't really mean anything for the Wolves, because they are under no obligation to give a sh*t about what Jimmy wants. There's way more risk of opportunity lost on the side of Miami if they get too cheap and another team near the trade deadline has a better offer for the Wolves.

Don't forget, there's a lot of time before Jimmy's value becomes "nothing" to the Wolves (which considering just the cap space it would free up actually will never be the case since 20 mil IS SOMETHING).

Again, go outside (especially if you live in Florida) and get some sunshine, you are wasting your time trying to convince us that what you are saying should make sense (because it doesn't) when the reality is MIAMI NEEDS MINNESOTA MORE THAN MINNESOTA NEEDS MIAMI in this situation. Sit back, enjoy the sunshine, and get ready to have a great player (but an a$$hole) join your franchise... that is if Riley isn't a complete moron who isn't willing to throw in a decent prospect for a LEGIT All-NBA player.

Just because they are doing the dance doesn't mean it will change the outcome.

Hypothetically speaking, yeah, Minnesota can tell Butler to go screw himself, but how does that work out when trying to lure free agents here. How would agents respond to the timberwolves then, how about other players that may consider playing there? Woj talked about it in his podcast, forcing him to stay can probably make the franchise out to look like a bad one around the NBA. Not to mention you haven't even talked about the tension of trying to bring back in Butler into that locker room.

I do still think this trade gets done but I have serious doubts it includes Josh Richardson (and I agree, that you're not getting fair value out of it) just because no one is really bidding against Miami currently.

Gonna speak hypothetically right now and jump to some conclusions. I do think the parameter of this trade have been set which in my opinion are : Hassan + Winslow for Butler. The hold up is that Minnesota wants Miami to take Dieng too, and Miami probably wants them to take back Waiters, which for smart reasons, Minnesota wants nothing to do with it.

What I'm hoping for is that the Heat find a way to dump Waiters on Sacramento somehow.

[shrink]

Have you also heard the news that MIA wouldn’t budge, and MIN is keeping Butler?

[SO_MONEY]

The lack of reality some people possess, to think negitive assets that by themselves would require positive assets attached will land a top 10-15 player. Logically one should know that if you are better off not making a trade you won't make it. And that should end the nonsense and tell them they are wrong, but it doesn't.

I don't know what the deal is going to be, but I at least know it will be an offer we are better off taking than not and if we are talking MIA Richardson needs to be included, question is that enough to say yes or is more needed. I tend to think more is needed. Even if there is a swap of let's say Dieng for Whiteside. Will we settle for just a pick? Bam? Will it require both? Is Winslow and a pick enough? These are the conversations taking place, not ones where MN would even entertain negitive assets without reward. That is just the reality of it.

Sent from my LGMS428 using Tapatalk

[the_bruce]

The issue here is teams don't have much wiggle room after free agency. Jimmy should have made his intentions clear earlier.

From the wolves side anything not containing Richardson is likely a non-starter. MN needs a startable wing in return in any butler trade imo.

The other issue with miami is it's very difficult to match salaries without including some sort of whiteside or dragic swap. The issue there is whether those players are an upgrade for the wolves. Whiteside ends a year sooner, but Diengs been here and knows the system. I like dragic more, but Dragic and Teague are a wash for me.

Bam/Winslow do nothing for the team imo. Neither Johnson is a need.

I'm not sure Whiteside is a great fit for the team.

Whiteside + Richardson for Butler + Dieng seems like the most logical deal.

[urinesane]

How is it reality that the deal doesn't get done without Richardson? Based on what? All I've read is there has been significant progress and at no point has Jrich or Bam been involved. Woj yesterday reported that Minnesota would prefer to have Jrich and Bam but at no point does it say that's part of the negotiation.

Deal is looking like what I thought it would - Winslow + Whiteside for Butler (and if we're taking Dieng then Timberwolves are taking Waiters unless a third team becomes part of it again).

Look I get it, I'm no rookie to these parts, you see weakness and want to exploit the situation as much as possible. The problem is you have a false sense of leverage that doesn't actually exist. Minnesota has something that Miami wants and it's something they can't just get by being patient and waiting. The Wolves (believe it or not) still have leverage because they don't HAVE to do sh*t, especially if it means shooting themselves in the dick to placate a 30 year old toddler having a temper tantrum in public.

Just because Jimmy says he WANTS to go to Miami doesn't really mean anything for the Wolves, because they are under no obligation to give a sh*t about what Jimmy wants. There's way more risk of opportunity lost on the side of Miami if they get too cheap and another team near the trade deadline has a better offer for the Wolves.

Don't forget, there's a lot of time before Jimmy's value becomes "nothing" to the Wolves (which considering just the cap space it would free up actually will never be the case since 20 mil IS SOMETHING).

Again, go outside (especially if you live in Florida) and get some sunshine, you are wasting your time trying to convince us that what you are saying should make sense (because it doesn't) when the reality is MIAMI NEEDS MINNESOTA MORE THAN MINNESOTA NEEDS MIAMI in this situation. Sit back, enjoy the sunshine, and get ready to have a great player (but an a$$hole) join your franchise... that is if Riley isn't a complete moron who isn't willing to throw in a decent prospect for a LEGIT All-NBA player.

Just because they are doing the dance doesn't mean it will change the outcome.

Hypothetically speaking, yeah, Minnesota can tell Butler to go screw himself, but how does that work out when trying to lure free agents here. How would agents respond to the timberwolves then, how about other players that may consider playing there? Woj talked about it in his podcast, forcing him to stay can probably make the franchise out to look like a bad one around the NBA. Not to mention you haven't even talked about the tension of trying to bring back in Butler into that locker room.

I do still think this trade gets done but I have serious doubts it includes Josh Richardson (and I agree, that you're not getting fair value out of it) just because no one is really bidding against Miami currently.

Gonna speak hypothetically right now and jump to some conclusions. I do think the parameter of this trade have been set which in my opinion are : Hassan + Winslow for Butler. The hold up is that Minnesota wants Miami to take Dieng too, and Miami probably wants them to take back Waiters, which for smart reasons, Minnesota wants nothing to do with it.

What I'm hoping for is that the Heat find a way to dump Waiters on Sacramento somehow.

Dealing in "hypotheticals" is the same as making sh*t up... which I don't have time for. If you don't want to believe what I'm saying, cool. It doesn't mean I'm not speaking the truth though.

[mplsfonz23]

Hypothetically speaking, yeah, Minnesota can tell Butler to go screw himself, but how does that work out when trying to lure free agents here. How would agents respond to the timberwolves then, how about other players that may consider playing there? Woj talked about it in his podcast, forcing him to stay can probably make the franchise out to look like a bad one around the NBA. Not to mention you haven't even talked about the tension of trying to bring back in Butler into that locker room.

I do still think this trade gets done but I have serious doubts it includes Josh Richardson (and I agree, that you're not getting fair value out of it) just because no one is really bidding against Miami currently.

Gonna speak hypothetically right now and jump to some conclusions. I do think the parameter of this trade have been set which in my opinion are : Hassan + Winslow for Butler. The hold up is that Minnesota wants Miami to take Dieng too, and Miami probably wants them to take back Waiters, which for smart reasons, Minnesota wants nothing to do with it.

What I'm hoping for is that the Heat find a way to dump Waiters on Sacramento somehow.

Lure Free agents? They don't come here historically, so we aren't really concerned with that at this point. That's why we need assets who are young and under a good contract. How would it look around the NBA if we settled for Miami's garbage? Every GM in the league would be waiting for Towns or the next all star to want out. Riley had better stop playing the lowball game and risk losing him for another offer that could be less.
If I am Thibs/Taylor I tell Riley to gives us a better offer by (insert deadline) or we are done talking. Jimmy will show up to practice by deadline, and we will wait until mid season. Toxic locker room or not. IMO.
Whiteside and Winslow for a top 15 player. Beyond laughable. Taylor may as well sell the team as his attendance is already going to take a huge hit.