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Political Roundtable Part XXIII

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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#781 » by stilldropin20 » Fri Nov 2, 2018 1:02 pm

pancakes3 wrote:History lesson aside, I just question the actual motivation of moving away from birthright citizenship.

People immigrate based on economic incentives, not political ones.


odd way of glancing over that it is bad government policy steeped in bad politics that creates the economic incentives. both negatively in their own country. and positively here in our country.

And currently that policy is bad. Current policy pits the human resources of the unskilled labor emigrating here against the the existing american human resources unskilled labor.

1. immigrants compete for labor positions and over saturate the unskilled low skilled market.
2. further exacerbated by low skilled and medium skill labor becoming more and more automated.
3. creates stagnant/declining wages as employers have people competing for crumbs

^^all of which would be fine if all existing americans had good paying jobs and entitlement were minimal. But that is not the case. Many 4th, 5ht, 6th ,7th generation americans live near the poverty line or below it.

get our existing americans above poverty first!!!

Then open the door to immigration.

And anyone who cant get on board with that message doesn't care about the poor. and the poor are overwhelmingly black and brown by percentage population. Allowing too much immigration is kills their opportunities. Slow the rate of success and ascension that we typically see by the 3rd generation. (what we call the american dream is dying)

And millennials feel this most. They claim things like "real estate is dead." And want free college, and free medical. <--Simply because they can not afford it. They cant afford it because wages have not kept pace with inflation for unskilled and low skilled labor and even moderately skilled labor. While high skilled labor has almost outpaced inflation.

Because black and brown folks often end up in the un/low/moderately skilled labor forced in much higher percentages...allowing too much immigration should be considered racists policy. And existing black and brown americans should wake up and get ahead of this. Its been happening for 40 years.

What worse it the policy is also elitist. Highly skilled labor prefers less expensive lawn service, less expensive car washes, waitresses, bar tenders, maids, roofers, landscaping, and it goes further into many sectors as immigrants also work for large companies.

its weird...35 years ago i used to cut lawn for 10 per lawn. 35 years later, i pay $15 per lawn. Isn't that odd? And frankly, kids dont cut lawn anymore...grown men that dont speak english cut the lawn around all my buildings. I dont know them. I dont even know the owner of the company. I hired them 17 years ago and they just show up and cut and send me a bill each month.

Why is it our policy that our border is open? Why do politicians support that policy??

bringing immigrants in to do that work? and many other jobs like that instead of paying our teenagers more money to do the same job? Why not pay a kid down the street $25 for 1.5 hours of grass cutting?? You know...the whole village idea? Teach that american child the value of hard work, the value of earning money. The value of responsibility.

oh...and i should add that you are admitting that these people are seeking JOBS NOT ASYLUM!! But we all know that. ho hum.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#782 » by dckingsfan » Fri Nov 2, 2018 1:07 pm

Induveca wrote:
dckingsfan wrote:
Induveca wrote:But what caused the fluctuation? It wasn’t SUVs.....

So, getting past the politics and hysteria which you seem to be doing - we don't care.

What we do care is about maintaining our lifestyle and the human race.

Clearly, global warming won't help either of those two things. Mass migration out of Africa due to desertification can't be helpful, right? So, why not take a technology approach to this problem?

If you have 20 people manually entering forms - why not automate?

If you can reduce climate change by reducing greenhouse gases (regardless of the base cause of the fluctuation), you do it, right?


If you worked for me I’d fire you.

I’ve used this before.

“Tomorrow’s social problems don’t keep my business alive today. Find a middle ground that satisfies employee social concerns and the reality of competition. Or we’re all out of a job.”

If not, I’d fire you. You don’t plan a small business that lasts an average of 5 years off of 100 year models.

With respect, you are not reading (or thinking about this in the right context).

If you have a problem in a business that saves you money - you fix it so you CAN sell the business. You don't and your valuations drop - you know this if you have sold businesses. If I am on your board of your start-up and you didn't fix it - guess who gets fired?

If you are a government - who's first reason for existence is to keep its citizen's safe and there is a problem that can be fixed - you do it. That doesn't mean you cut defense to do it - but if there is a reasonable payback on that effort you do it. What you don't do is know that there is a problem and boot it down the road (oh, wait - that would be this group of knuckheads and their budget).

BTW, there are few large businesses that have business plans that reach out more than five years. And that makes sense given economics and change.

But there are some that absolutely must do that type of planning to survive. And guess what, the government is definitely one of those entities that needs to do long-term forecasting, otherwise you run into long-term debt obligations and unfunded liabilities that sink your boat (oh wait, we have a lot of those - they ran their government entities like startup businesses - ooops).
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#783 » by verbal8 » Fri Nov 2, 2018 1:11 pm

JWizmentality wrote:Don't drop the soap! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Does the video mention Burkman having his fly open?
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#784 » by dckingsfan » Fri Nov 2, 2018 1:18 pm

And getting back to the point on climate change - if we can move the needle in a reasonable fashion you do so...

If it is a super expensive issue - you table it for now and wait for better technology.

Keeping open coal burning plants when they could be switched over to natural gas is the epidemy of stupidity.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#785 » by stilldropin20 » Fri Nov 2, 2018 4:18 pm

dckingsfan wrote:And getting back to the point on climate change - if we can move the needle in a reasonable fashion you do so...

If it is a super expensive issue - you table it for now and wait for better technology.

Keeping open coal burning plants when they could be switched over to natural gas is the epidemy of stupidity.


wrong. Its called bringing jobs back to coal country...namely pennsylvania...a state that played a large part in giving trump the election and will be crucial in winning again in 2020.

If you want something from trump, support him! That simple. Politicians need to be smart as do their electorate.

Dems are running on nothing but resist trump and have had the most ridiculous negative media campaign against him for 2 straight years. So they get nothing from him. That's bad leadership from bad politicians. Dem leaders and liberal media has misinformed its base to the point where at least 2-3 posters on this site will need to go on suicide watch when mueller comes back with nothing.

i mean, you might not even get your blue wave next week...after the most negative media campaign ever seen.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#786 » by stilldropin20 » Fri Nov 2, 2018 5:44 pm

Read on Twitter
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#787 » by stilldropin20 » Fri Nov 2, 2018 5:48 pm

wages up 3%

Its working m'aphuckas! limit immigration...wages go up!!
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#788 » by Ruzious » Fri Nov 2, 2018 6:28 pm

dckingsfan wrote:And getting back to the point on climate change - if we can move the needle in a reasonable fashion you do so...

If it is a super expensive issue - you table it for now and wait for better technology.

Keeping open coal burning plants when they could be switched over to natural gas is the epidemy of stupidity.

Perhaps the saddest part is that you had to put it in terms of economic effect to even have a chance for them to recognize it as an issue. And even that didn't work.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#789 » by verbal8 » Fri Nov 2, 2018 6:43 pm

somecrazydude20 wrote:wrong. Its called bringing jobs back to coal country...namely pennsylvania...a state that played a large part in giving trump the election and will be crucial in winning again in 2020.

If you want something from trump, support him! That simple. Politicians need to be smart as do their electorate.

No wonder Trump loves Andrew Jackson so much - that is completely the 21 century version of the "Spoils System" of corruption that he was so notorious for in his presidency.

But generally other than lip service, the "underdogs" fueling Trump's support aren't getting much in return. Actually come to think of it, other than corrupt dictators not many people are getting much in return for supporting Trump.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#790 » by dckingsfan » Fri Nov 2, 2018 6:48 pm

Ruzious wrote:
dckingsfan wrote:And getting back to the point on climate change - if we can move the needle in a reasonable fashion you do so...

If it is a super expensive issue - you table it for now and wait for better technology.

Keeping open coal burning plants when they could be switched over to natural gas is the epidemy of stupidity.

Perhaps the saddest part is that you had to put it in terms of economic effect to even have a chance for them to recognize it as an issue. And even that didn't work.

Yep - logic is illusive to some :D

Coal jobs suck - Trump’s campaign pledge to bring back coal jobs is just a really “stupid” idea. It is a dinosaur of an idea. Installing solar panels, working on windmills, working in a gas field are much better jobs. But that isn't something that some can grasp.

Not sure why Trump didn't make a pledge to bring back buggy whip manufacturers.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#791 » by Ruzious » Fri Nov 2, 2018 6:52 pm

dckingsfan wrote:
Ruzious wrote:
dckingsfan wrote:And getting back to the point on climate change - if we can move the needle in a reasonable fashion you do so...

If it is a super expensive issue - you table it for now and wait for better technology.

Keeping open coal burning plants when they could be switched over to natural gas is the epidemy of stupidity.

Perhaps the saddest part is that you had to put it in terms of economic effect to even have a chance for them to recognize it as an issue. And even that didn't work.

Yep - logic is illusive to some :D

Coal jobs suck - Trump’s campaign pledge to bring back coal jobs is just a really “stupid” idea. It is a dinosaur of an idea. Installing solar panels, working on windmills, working in a gas field are much better jobs. But that isn't something that some can grasp.

Not sure why Trump didn't make a pledge to bring back buggy whip manufacturers.

Right, coal jobs are really the kind of jobs we want to save in exchange for the damage we're doing to the earth - when we have much better choices?
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#792 » by dckingsfan » Fri Nov 2, 2018 6:56 pm

Estimates for 2019 :nonono:

Code: Select all

Year    Deficit   Debt +    Deficit/GDP
2014    $485    $1,086      2.7%
2015    $438    $327        2.4%
2016    $585    $1,423      3.1%
2017    $665    $672        3.4%
2018    $833    $1,271      4.0%
2019    $984    $1,187      4.6%
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#793 » by gtn130 » Fri Nov 2, 2018 6:56 pm

Don't know about you guys but I've been dying to get back into the coal mines and living the coal miner dream
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#794 » by Ruzious » Fri Nov 2, 2018 7:04 pm

gtn130 wrote:Don't know about you guys but I've been dying to get back into the coal mines and living the coal miner dream

That "Rudy" movie had it all wrong. Probably made by some tree-hugging libruls.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#795 » by TGW » Fri Nov 2, 2018 7:21 pm

Read on Twitter
Some random troll wrote:Not to sound negative, but this team is owned by an arrogant cheapskate, managed by a moron and coached by an idiot. Recipe for disaster.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#796 » by Wizardspride » Fri Nov 2, 2018 7:42 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=19



Read on Twitter
?s=19

President Donald Trump referred to African countries, Haiti and El Salvador as "shithole" nations during a meeting Thursday and asked why the U.S. can't have more immigrants from Norway.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#797 » by Wizardspride » Fri Nov 2, 2018 7:59 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=19

President Donald Trump referred to African countries, Haiti and El Salvador as "shithole" nations during a meeting Thursday and asked why the U.S. can't have more immigrants from Norway.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#798 » by Induveca » Fri Nov 2, 2018 8:45 pm

dckingsfan wrote:And getting back to the point on climate change - if we can move the needle in a reasonable fashion you do so...

If it is a super expensive issue - you table it for now and wait for better technology.

Keeping open coal burning plants when they could be switched over to natural gas is the epidemy of stupidity.


Not being 100% rah-rah on climate change doesn’t mean I don’t see that natural gas is better for human health. I don’t even consider that a climate change issue, that’s purely a political and economic issue.

The fight to secure the contracts to 100% replace existing coal plants with gas would be a political, lobbying and corporate slug fest.

What governors are going to take the hit without a fight? Who lobbies quickest for which companies for the contracts? How do you compensate the companies running the 1300 coal plants currently? How long would the legal battles last?

By all means whoever can take that on, go for it. Sadly it’s complete gridlock in DC. And *both* sides of the aisle rely heavily on energy company jobs. Not an easy feat.

But yes in an utopian vacuum we should switch them over tomorrow. So should India and China (as they produce 1000x more coal pollutants), but they’re not going to slam the brakes on their economy.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#799 » by Pointgod » Fri Nov 2, 2018 9:39 pm

Wizardspride wrote:
Read on Twitter
?s=19



Read on Twitter
?s=19


Good. Voter suppression should be a criminal act.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XXIII 

Post#800 » by dckingsfan » Fri Nov 2, 2018 9:45 pm

Induveca wrote:
dckingsfan wrote:And getting back to the point on climate change - if we can move the needle in a reasonable fashion you do so...

If it is a super expensive issue - you table it for now and wait for better technology.

Keeping open coal burning plants when they could be switched over to natural gas is the epidemy of stupidity.


Not being 100% rah-rah on climate change doesn’t mean I don’t see that natural gas is better for human health. I don’t even consider that a climate change issue, that’s purely a political and economic issue.

The fight to secure the contracts to 100% replace existing coal plants with gas would be a political, lobbying and corporate slug fest.

What governors are going to take the hit without a fight? Who lobbies quickest for which companies for the contracts? How do you compensate the companies running the 1300 coal plants currently? How long would the legal battles last?

By all means whoever can take that on, go for it. Sadly it’s complete gridlock in DC. And *both* sides of the aisle rely heavily on energy company jobs. Not an easy feat.

But yes in an utopian vacuum we should switch them over tomorrow. So should India and China (as they produce 1000x more coal pollutants), but they’re not going to slam the brakes on their economy.

Moving from coal to gas is both environmental and economic - and it was well on its way to happening before this administration (stupidly) threw on the brakes.

Coal was already down to 39% of U.S. electricity in 2014, 32% in 2015, 29% in 2016 and then we had this administration :nonono:

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